Can a partner learn to be more emotionally available or empathetic?

[SHAW82]

I have been with my partner for 13 years, 10 years married.

He shows very little empathy or compassion which has become increasingly difficult, particularly when we had children.

If I am feeling overwhelmed or stress he is quite dismissive, or jumps to looking for a 'fix'. He gets very frustrated at what he sees as my 'neediness' to talk about emotions.

If I want to talk something through that is challenging, for example how I am feeling about something or trying to explain the stress of life admin, he becomes incredibly defensive and will shut me down in a number of ways. He will deflect it onto me, look at his watch, tell me I am repeating myself too much or tell me he's listened for ages. He always looks like he wants to be somewhere else, when I need him to be present sometimes. All of these things make me feel so incredibly alone and that I can't go to my husband to talk anything through.

When he shuts me down it really triggers me and my self esteem and mental health have both really suffered over the years. The message I get is that I am not important, my feelings don't matter and it seems painful for him to listen to me. The walls he puts up are impenetrable.

I do love him, he is a good father and a good person but there is this huge hole in our marriage. I have spoken so many times about how I feel and that I need more connection in a relationship. My question is, can someone ever develop this, genuinely? He has tried counselling but the counsellor stopped his sessions with no explanation other than she couldn't continue them.

I have never experienced such a lack of appetite to emotionally connect in a relationship before, and I so desperately miss that. I have never been seen as a needy person with past boyfriends who have been keen to connect emotionally.

He is the most extravert person with other people, warm and chatty. Although never has been a good listener and doesn't seem to think about other people much or their needs. I think he has Autism and ADHD which may impact much of this, especially the lack of empathy. He also comes from a very stoic family, who never share vulnerabilities, so I know he sees it as weak. They don't show any empathy either, favouring people who keep their problems to themselves.

He says he wants to work things out but it's destroying me going round in circles. What more can I do to encourage emotional connection?

My ex was similar and at points in our relationship he did improve but he had to make a conscious effort to engage with me emotionally and consider his responses to perceived criticism rather than just flying off the handle aggressively. Have to say that whilst those times were nice, inevitably he couldn't sustain the effort and it would then go back to how it was, often worse. I don't know if it's necessarily the man's fault they're this way but ultimately I decided that it didn't work for me and wasn't enough for me.

I have raised my own needs a lot, gone to counselling, shared with I'm why I want that stuff - eg for connection and better sexual intimacy etc. I have tried to become much calmer when upset but that sadness and anger has to go somewhere. That's why my mental health has taken a dip, I feel so lonely and unheard. I feel so angry that he isn't leaving me with happy choices for our future. Stay and lack connection and intimacy, or leave and split up the family and lose the other good things about being together and as a family.

Glad you’ve got good mates (and here!)

it’s said that women need to feel close emotionally to want sex etc and with men it’s physical first so there does seem to be this disconnect. You’re not alone for sure

This sounds similar. He made an effort recently to be less defensive and he was for a while. It is back again now though. I ask a reasonable question and he feels criticised and responds negatively. It's exhausting.

I'm sorry it didn;t work for you, it;s not a nice situation. Well done for being brave and choosing a better path.

Yes they can but it's difficult. My DH is very sensitive and emotional but has been taught by society (and to some extent his parents) not to express it, especially negative emotions. As you can't actually completely suppress emotions, it tends to come out as passive aggressiveness, and resentment, as he automatically feels and assumes that his feelings won't be taken into account. He also assumes that he can only rely on himself and no one else can help him if he struggling emotionally.

I am gradually trying train this out of him 😂 and he's so much better than he used to he but it's taken a long long time, and lots of long difficult and deep discussions. I am a bit like a dig with a bone on things like this though and I'm not very good at letting things go so that "persistence" has "helped" though. He is also reasonably receptive to these discussions and to trying to make changes - you can't force someone to change they gave to want to and to see the benefit. It also helps that I am far from perfect and have my own stuff to work on, so it's not a one way street.

He often reverts back to old patterns (especially when tired) and has to he reminded that it's not helpful to him or to us, so it's a constant work in progress. Generally though I would say he's much much better at saying how he feels, he is much less passive aggressive and resentful, and we have far fewer arguments as a result. He now finds my emotional support helpful some of the time which is nice for both of us.

It does really wear you down. I put a huge amount of emotional effort into keeping the relationship going which mainly consisted of gaslighting myself into thinking it was my fault he was like that or that it wasn't that bad. Plus the endless trying to convey how I felt and be heard rather than abused. I'm much happier now I can put that effort into other areas of my life. Hope things get better for you, whatever you choose to do.

@ByCupidStunt

"Honestly I'm starting to think that adult males don't actually have any emotions at all."

Most men really, really do not see the need for emotional connection in the same way that women do. If their marriage isn't a total shit show, they're happy to just jog along. They're usually more receptive to practical solutions than listening for hours about their partner's mental health woes. They are, essentially, much more self absorbed than women.

I have taught my husband a lot of emotional literacy. He used to retaliate in the face of uncomfortable emotions / try to make it go away / avoid.
It was his upbringing.
But I was able to show him, by example largely, how to deal with things constructively so difficult emotions become useful indications of something that needs attention - not scary symptoms you need to switch off as quickly as possible.

But he respects me and was prepared to listen to an alternative point of view.
I still had to be very diplomatic though, it wasn't one chat and done, it was positive coaching and broaching subjects at his pace, not rushing him... Until he saw the light and got enough practice in for it to become normal for him.

Now if someone is upset, including the kids, he can hold the difficult emotions while waiting to see if listening or cuddles or jokes or solutions or apologies are what is needed.
He isn't freaked out by anything less than breezy and jovial anymore.

So, it's possible if personality permits for the possibility there might be another better way (helps if they see it in action)

Sounds like he needs do his own trauma and inner child work to really get through to his own empathy and compassion. He does have to see the value in this work though. Otherwise he won't engage properly.

I see a lot of men get emotionally stunted at age 9 - 14 and don't really progress beyond that. Society doesn't expect it in work we give excuses oh John's just like that or just grumpy or career driven when they are rude aggressive or stressed. Male friendships don't typically work the same as most female ones. They can return from the pub and not know how their friend is, didn't think to ask about their divorce or recent bereavement.

These are skills that it's expected women learn so we get good at them because we absolutely get pulled up for not displaying them and we see the value in them. Most men simply don't understand them haven't learn them and cannot stand being on the backfoot plus don't see the value.

I'd reccomend Stan tatkin in eachothers care.

Unfortunately what I mostly see is wives saying to their partners look if you don't do this work I'm going to leave the relationship. It isn't equal on usually numerous levels but certainly isn't equal in emotional intelligence. It really is the bare minimum we wouldn't have friends that done reciprocate emotionally to the relationship. We should absolutely expect that and deserve that in our relationships.

Have you ever heard of alexithymia? It’s a difficulty in identifying and then expressing the emotions you feel (not that you don’t have emotions). It sounds like your DH (mine too).

It’s amazing really that so many of us put the work into ‘retraining’ men - exhausting

Sorry no real advice OP💐. just to say thank you for posting and describing your experience with your DH so well. I know exactly how you feel. It is exactly the same same situation I had with my ex DH, and by the time we broke up my self-esteem and mental health was in the gutter.

I essentially felt like I was missing some secret female skill, I wasn't 'woman enough' to get him to feel and respond to me emotionally the way I saw other men respond to their partners/TV/Films etc (I know that sounds dumb bit it did make me feel 'lesser')

I really loved him, so a part of me has kept niggling...could I have tried harder/more intelligently to get him to respond to my emotions better? Is it just me that wasn't good enough? But I felt like I was bottling my feelings, and striving to constantly understand his viewpoint first, just so I could get a crumb of understanding of my emotions.

When we broke up he was very...'hard' and he initiated it. He said our communication was bad. He like your DH would get defensive for requesting more of a response. He aso said I would dismiss his opinion when in Mr Fix It mode. Anyway there was more and he was so horrible during the break up I just assumed 'bastard' but recently, we were thrown together for my DD's graduation and he out of the blue said he always felt deeply for me even though he couldn't always show it. Well I knew that he felt something, but love not sure. It's hard he struggles even to really say it. He acknowledged that his lack of emotional empathy had worsened my self-image and made me feel low sometimes.

He then said, he had serious issues with his mother growing up, he was the youngest of 5, she herself was quite aloof and was more of an authoritarian in her parenting style and had been an older woman when she had him, almost near menopause and was not really engaged with him growing up and lots of things clicked.

But I now realise it doesn't matter what the reason is/was. I really needed and need emotional connection. Empathy, listening, upbuilding words sometimes. I need comfort, emotional security and safety. I need to emotionally be soothed into sex sometimes. I mean yes I can just do it, but I want the emotional turn on too!

I think he's been hinting at a second chance, and I felt I wanted that too, but I realised I would actually date a man that's less attractive, and has less going for them , if I was offered those things. I think just being near to 50 with no more children to concentrate on, it seems they oddly matter more. Sex actually is less important to me than the emotional connection now.

This post has really helped put my exDH and relationship in perspective, I felt like a failure, but seeing its not so unusual or entirely my fault helps. I appreciate it x

This really does sound very similar. It's v hard. This particularly resonated:

"But I now realise it doesn't matter what the reason is/was. I really needed and need emotional connection. Empathy, listening, upbuilding words sometimes. I need comfort, emotional security and safety. I need to emotionally be soothed into sex sometimes. I mean yes I can just do it, but I want the emotional turn on too!"

I would choose emotional connection over sex too now. But I think when you find that, the sex is often a natural just part of it. You've described your needs so well, they are all trye of me too. I can't ignore it. Whatever the reason I need them, and whatever the reason he can't meet them. It almost doesn't matter.

That sounds like such a painful dynamic to be in. You must be so exhausted and emotionally burnt out!

Have a look at attachment theory. It sounds like you might be in a loop where you keep triggering each other. You reach out, he responds in a way where you feel emotionally abandoned, you then respond in a way that makes him feel criticised, he then withdraws. Rinse and repeat.

Emotionally Focused Therapy is supposedly good for this. It’s based on attachment theory, and was built to address loops like these.

I have also found Sue Johnson’s book “Hold Me Tight” and Julie Mennano’s book “Secure Love” useful. Both are therapists that practise(d) Emotionally Focused Therapy. Mennano has a podcast as well where she does therapy with an insecurely attached couple. Their dynamic sounds a lot like yours.

The key here is that both people in the relationship have to want to change the dynamic. If he’s not invested, you can’t do it alone.

I believe someone can learn, if they want to. My partner is diagnosed with EUPD, and was also told by his psych that he has under developed emotional intelligence, meaning he has the emotional intelligence and empathy of a pre teen....
It caused a lot of problems for us, especially when I was trying to communicate problems. He knew it was him who needed to change though, and more importantly, he wanted too. It's taken 5 years of hard work on his part, but we are now finally in a place where things are really good, and communication is no longer an issue.

I think this work is quite painful for a person when it's forced on them. If you haven't got the connection as a foundation you have to right back to building that as the foundation. That requires both parties understanding each others needs.

I don't know if you've ever done Myers Briggs but it sounds like you may have fundamentally different cognitive strengths. The reason you feel dismissed is the functions you are using just aren't prioritised by the other person. They don't see it as personal because they see the world in a fundamentally different way. The real test of it often comes down to the strength of what holds you together, your values and higher goals. Those things make it easier. I think having something like a weekly check in with a partner is also a good idea.

I could go on about myers briggs, socionics, enneagram etc. but fundamentally some people have a more defensive view of the world and are more in their heads. Some people are more in their bodies and are more big picture. Not better or worse just different.

@ByGreatDenimCat thank you. Donyou know the name of the podcast episode you mentioned?

He always says he wants to make things better, I just genuinely don't think he knows how to access that part of himself . Or perhaps it's laziness to really properly self reflect and do the challenging personal work.

This is very hopeful. What did you need from him to make that process work? How did you know he was ready?

The podcast is called “The Secure Love Podcast”. It’s new and only a few episodes have been uploaded at this point. I have been listening every week, it gets a little dull at points but it’s really interesting to hear the side of the avoidantly attached partner. I feel like I understand my own partner better now because of that.

You seem to be in a lot of pain which makes sense. Anybody would in your situation. It also makes sense why you’d go to the explanation that he is just refusing to try - you must have tried everything you can think of, and when there’s no change, it can get really demoralising. You are disappointed in him, and why wouldn’t you be. But it might be helpful to soften your approach because voicing needs in this way will likely be perceived as criticism.

From my understanding of attachment theory, it’s important for avoidantly attached partners to feel like they get things right. They want to feel like successful partners and feeling like they have failed you is really heavy for them. When my partner gets things right for me, I express how much it means to me and how good it feels. He then starts doing the thing a lot more often!

I know from personal experience how utterly lonely it is to have your emotional needs chronically unmet. It’s horrible, it really is. Sometimes it feels as urgent as physical hunger.

I do wonder if perhaps the dynamic between you two might be very entrenched and if you’d benefit from couples therapy. That’s what I’m trying next.

OP, I totally relate with your description of your spouse and your frustrations. After almost 40 years in a strikingly similar relationship I have finally come to accept it is impossible for dp to change. Even if he had wanted to . We are wired completely differently .
Your only hope is to accept him as he is with the qualities he does have. Grieve the relationship you didn't get. This helps with accepting your reality. And then seek emotional connection elsewhere through girlfriends, family, hobbies, etc.
When you realize that there is absolutely nothing you can do to change him you may despair and become depressed. But if you can be as honest as possible with yourself and see him as he is and accept him as he is you may eventually find peace.
And the deepest source of emotional connection that you will ever find is in yourself. Learn to love yourself and you will never be alone again.

My DH is also a solution-based person who immediately tries to fix things when I just need to talk. Over time, he’s realized that I just need empathy sometimes so he tries to just listen but unfortunately, he has no idea what to say so tends to nod silently and make sympathetic faces. 😂

I decided several years ago that it was better to talk to close friends when I needed emotional support as poor DH really has no idea. Like your DH, his family is stoic and solution-oriented, so he has no experience to draw on. My friends are much better listeners.

DS (15) needs a listening ear sometimes and he always talks to me as he’s also realized that Dad’s pretty hopeless at it! Not intentionally, of course. He can support DD and DS in other ways.

No one is a perfect partner and no one can be everything to another person.

Thank you. I'm.sorry this happened to you. It sounds like acceptance has been key for you.

There is going to be a lot of grief with that acceptance. I think it means giving up on some hope for myself in terms of the love i crave, but maybe that's ok? What I really struggle with is having an intimate relationship with a man who won't connect with me on a deeper level. He wants a sexual relationship and so do I but i need the emotional connection and he hasn't so far been able to access that in himself. So acceptance is saying goodbye to a lot.

Thank you, you are right on all points and give some really good advice. I hugely appreciate the spot on understanding and validation of how this makes me feel too. Nice to feel seen.

@SHAW82 Acceptance can be a good thing but you have to decide what is acceptable for you. I shared my story with you so you can reflect upon whether not having that emotional connection you crave is acceptable. We maintain hope as long as we think things can change. I'm telling you, from my experience they don't change! I found there was no hope left( for deep emotional connection). I decided to accept the good things we had and lower my expections for things that weren't going to happen.

But for you, maybe you should do things differently. You can leave and find someone who can love you as you deserve to be loved. That takes a lot of courage, self love and self- honesty. But luckily they can be learned.

dismissal or fixing

Bane of my life. Why DO they do this? Is it a childhood thing? A patriarchy thing?