Feel like all the trust and respect has gone for me - can I find a way back?

[whiterose321]

Have been with husband a long time. 4 kids, 11 - 19. A decade ago I would have said we had quite a strong marriage - though he's always been quite crappy with his emotions (thanks, boarding school) and always had quite a quick temper. On the good side - loving and affectionate, does his fair share of the practical domestic stuff...

The past few years have not been easy. We've had to weather quite a lot of stress (one of our DC with a serious health issue, death of my mum - my dad died when I was young), and DH has made some really shit financial/career decisions that has made our future feel pretty uncertain. I had hoped the inheritance I got from my mum would be set aside to help each DC a modest amount through uni etc - but because of the bad choices DH has made, we've had to dip into this money constantly to support the family. There will probably be nothing left after the next few years - and I resent that.

It's really not where I expected to be in our early 50s, and not where I want to be. For richer and poorer and all that, but another problem is that he is so grumpy and irritable with it. He loses his temper constantly. Yes, he would probably argue that he feels under pressure to be the provider - but I look at my friend's marriages and see a lot of successful high earning men at the peak of their careers who provide for their family solely. I also work, but am freelance and my career took a big hit from 4 maternity leaves.

Ultimately I feel like I don't trust or respect him anymore. I am sick of him shouting at me whenever I express concern about future financial security - for both us and the kids.

Has anyone been through similar, and have you got through it? Before anyone suggests therapy, he refuses to go...

I think you need to sit down and have a calm conversation about this, if need be, with a counsellor to act as referee. He needs to be able to express his fear of being the main provider. You need to be able to express your frustration about his crap choices in the past, which is probably why he's getting so shirty when you mention you're worried about the future - it's an implied criticism of him. You both have some feelings to air and unless you both get them out and are then able to accept and move past them to both aim at fixing your financial stability, life will continue as it is now. Hopefully if you can do this, you can then have a conversation that involves making plans for an overall change, whether that be him getting ongoing counselling to deal with his anger or you moving to employed in order to increase the income and decrease his fear of being the main provider.
It's rough and I have a vaguely similar thing going on, but to a lesser extent. Good luck OP.

...but if he's unwilling to have any kind of outside help, this could be difficult.

"Ultimately I feel like I don't trust or respect him anymore. I am sick of him shouting at me whenever I express concern about future financial security - for both us and the kids".

If there is no trust, there is no relationship. The kids, particularly the eldest ones know something bad is up and besides which sound travels. Also his temper is a big ongoing red flag. I would think he does not treat his work colleagues or people in the outside world like that.

He seems incapable of having a calm discussion about the financials. This is who he is and he is not going to change; you can only change how you react to him. If he indeed refuses counselling go on your own; you need to be able to talk in both a calm and safe environment.

Agreed with@AttilaTheMeerkat. you can’t change him you can only try to figure out what you can change about yourself or for yourself to get the life you want.

@KnackeredBack - thank you and sorry you are going through similar. The problem is, he seems unable to have a calm conversation. We are at a stage where if question his choices or outlook he kicks off and starts shouting at me.

Example - he was made redundant in his last role and took another job with quite a significant pay cut. The new company wanted him, essentially created a role for him, but only had the budget to pay him for role that was slightly too junior for hi. He PROMISED ME this would be worth it and we wouldn't have to use savings to cover the shortfall for long. He was quite clear.

Now things are all uncertain, and he's not sure exactly when the income will improve blah blah blah. Apparently I 'misunderstood' (I didn't - I am going exactly on what he told me), and worse - if I dare to question this, he shouts and screams about how much pressure I put him under.

I feel like I can't live like this anymore.

@AttilaTheMeerkat and @pikkumyy77 - no of course he's not treating his own friends and colleagues like this. In fact until recently even my closest friends were quite surprised when I would tell them how angry and difficult he can be, because they'd never seen it.

Just lately, though, there have been a few occasions where he's snapped at me or been very grumpy towards me in company of mutual friends, and I can see people think he's being a dick, to be blunt.

It feels like so much of this is tied around financial pressure and my resentment that he's not providing 'enough', which feels like a horrible thing to admit in some ways. But the combination of promising me things will get better on that front, draining what I see as our children's money in the meantime, and then shouting at me and suggesting I'm stupid when I question it just feels so awful to me.

He shows one side of himself to outsiders (he's probably quite cheerful with them too) but quite another side to you people as the family unit. He treats you with disdain; this is precisely how abusers operate.

You have a choice re him; your children do not.

For whatever reason he is nit coping well with the financial reverses, the loss if status, the junior role. He tried to bluff his way through the shame by telling you it would be fine but its not and therefore he’s not.

Marriages, work, lives have their ups and downs. His he responds to this crisis tells you a lot about him. He can’t cope. Snd his way of handling his disappointment in himself is to lash out at you. The problem isn’t the really the loss of money and power but his inability to handle it.

@AttilaTheMeerkat - thanks, I know it's not great. Not sure I'd go so far as to call him abusive....but the temper is absolutely unacceptable I know.

I suppose what I am trying to get at is that BOTHme my resentment and his temper are both exacerbated by the same thing - feeling like he's not doing enough to support our family and preserve what we have in terms' of our kids' futures. I was wondering if anyone has been in the same position, and if it got better (or not)?

You can't change your DH. However, you can change your own situation.

Somewhere down the line, a choice was made that your DH would be the breadwinner. This leaves you (in fact any woman) in a highly vulnerable position. It also creates a perceived power/status imbalance.

Perhaps it's time for you to take back control of your own destiny. Go back to work. Concentrate on your career and creating your own financial stability. Stop relying on your DH to provide what he clearly cannot.

You cannot know what is going on in his mind. Nor can you force him to become something or someone he isn't.

If he refuses to go to counselling, then consider going on your own. It will help you to unpack your own feelings and decide on your way forward.

The longer you let this continue without taking action, the worse it will get.

This is YOUR life. And you get to decide what your future holds.

@pikkumyy77 - the thing is - he'd probably argue that it's me who can't cope with the loss of money and that it's just fine to use the inheritance to cover the lack of income. He accuses me of being 'pushy' and 'grabby' and says that is what makes him lose his temper. I am honestly not grabby - I am pretty much surrounded by friends who all lead far more affluent lifestyles than me. All I am thinking about is our kids and what the future holds.

You think he’s not doing the best he can or the best he can is not good enough for you? You compare him to the husbands of other people and find him wanting? It is you who have contempt for him. Thats a marriage killer. If its so easy to be ghe breadwinner snd make great financial decisions why don’t you do it?

The big danger here is that you're not working as a team. If you're not both on the same page about family finances and both taking responsibility, then trouble is bound to ensue.

I have seen a similar couple (who I was very good friends with) lose their house because the denial got completely out of hand.

Savings are not a bottomless pit and you have to live within your means and plan accordingly. Even if that means making compromises or downsizing.

At your ages, you very much need to be on the same page.

@Sicario - thank you. I do kick myself because when we were younger (pre kids) he was always the higher earner, then when the kids were little my career took a back seat - this seemed to make sense at the time.

I now work fulltime also and doing all I can to bring my income up. DH still earns more than me, but is quite a way off where we both expected him to be at this stage of our lives....and we currently keep draining the money DM left (that I just wanted to set aside for the kids) to cover the shortfall. I resent that, particularly when - if I try to communicate openly about outlook, or how this makes me feel, I get shouted down.

@pikkumyy77 - well, yeah, I do find him lacking in all honesty. I see a lot of my friends' husbands providing amazing security for their families. Obviously there will always be people richer/more successful than you. Believe me, I ask for very little - all I really want is to be able to remain in the house we're currently living in and to help out our kids a little with the money DM left. DH has made some crappy decisions that means all of this is at risk - so yes, that I find this annoying.

Yes, I had one like this, I got rid of him eventually, sorry, I’m much better ploughing my own furrow and so is he.

@whiterose321 - there is a saying, "comparison is the thief of joy" and you need to stop comparing your set-up with other couples who appear more successful.

There's no point in being angry and disappointed that your DH hasn't provided the money and lifestyle you wanted.

If you are overstretched and unable to afford the house you are living in then you have to face up to facts as quickly as possible. If the house needs to be sold then better that you do so than the bank steps in.

There is nothing stopping you from taking the responsibility to put all the cards on the table and work out a plan. Your DH probably can't face it.

And it's futile trying to plan to financially help your children at some point in the future when the priority should be about how you're both going to keep going until the kids are out of education and standing on their own two feet.

@Cantabulous - sorry to hear, but I would be interested to hear your story!

@Sicario - I know comparison is the thief of joy, and I try to avoid. I'm not eyeing bigger houses/holidays/new clothes and thinking 'I wish we could afford that' though. It's not really about disappointment as such - but that DH has made bad decisions, which in turn affects my view of him - it has eroded my respect for him.

This is exacerbated by the fact that we have to use money set aside for the kids to 'cover' DH's reduced income, when DH initially assured me that this wouldn't happen...so I feel I've been sold a lie, essentially. On top of that, and perhaps worst of all, he can't seem to communicate like an adult about this. I express my uncertainty and he loses his temper and starts shouting.

I do think you’re being harsh

you don’t respect him because he can’t provide the things that you see other families having. His bad decisions look to me like they’re just “being made redundant” and having to take a lower paid role. Something we all might have to do if it comes to it. It’s also not uncommon to take a role with the promise of promotion that never materialised. It can be soul destroying to be not valued at work, and also not valued at home.

Is there anything you can do to earn more money?

I think the options are either you try and earn more to contribute more to the finances, or you have to look at other options for reducing your outgoings and living to your means.

He may want to stay in his current role for reasons beyond money perhaps he is burnt out from previous roles?

Alternatively you can separate but then it will be on you to sort your own finances out I guess going forward.

It can be soul destroying to be not valued at work, and also not valued at home.

What is soul destroying and frustrating is the inability to have a grown up conversation with your partner without being shouted down and then becoming argumentative. Where does OP’s other half take on board her concerns and feelings?

But the thing is your husband might have 'promised' you wouldn't need your mum's inheritance to pay for daily life - but he couldn't know then how things would pan out. Unless he's deliberately sabotaging his own job, then it's not entirely his fault that he's not earning more and you're having to dip into savings. Perhaps it's more your expectation that the money would go down to your DC that's causing you problems? Can you reframe it so that your financial situation when YOU both pass will be your DCs inheritance rather than trying to sit on money passed down from the previous generation being earmarked for them?

What were the bad decisions and when were they?

Leaving aside poor past decisions, is there something you feel he could be doing now that he isn’t? He got made redundant, he has found a new job albeit not as well paid as you both might like - it doesn’t sound like he has done anything wrong in that regard even if it is disappointing. Unless he turned down higher paid jobs?

How does you “expressing concern” about future finances help? Do you have suggestions or are you just complaining?

It seems clear you are angry about your financial position, but it’s hard to know how much of that is actually your husband’s fault versus bad luck plus having 4 children.

Thanks all. To be clear, the redundancy followed by the lower paid role was the latest in a line of things. I don't want to give too much detail in case outing, but they include leaving a job without a new one to go to because he was 'bored', not getting proper legal advice on a business deal that resulted in a loss of money, forgoing contributions to a pension in lieu of equity that didn't materialise etc.

These are all over a long period of time - and some of these situations weren't entirely his fault, but still. It feels like I have been supportive to all of these professional ups and downs over the years, and now I am at the end of my rope and very resentful - particularly because he can't communicate about it calmly.

There are two issues as far as I can see. One is financial. You had 4 children and 4 maternity leaves and 4 expensive futures to find. Both of your choice and an expensive one. You expected his career to head upwards but lots of middle aged people's careers stagnate, through no real fault of their own. Sounds like his did and yours never picked up after either. Which means if you don't want to use your savings, you need to cut your cloth. Both of you.

The second is emotional. You blame and resent him, and he feels it. He shuts you up with anger, which is unacceptable.

To get a handle on the second, address the first. You say he told you things about your finances. Don't you have a budget, access to accounts, all the information to see your income and expenses? Look at it, see what is possible and not, suggest changes that are workable. Don't expect his income to go up, work with him on expenses. Don't blame. But have good boundaries about the shouting. If he shouts at you when the children aren't there, tell him in no uncertain terms that you will consider divorce if he continues to communicate in this way, and mean it. But you will need to address your communication style as well.

I agree what a previous person here said that you have a choice and your kids don't.
You and him are married with 4 kids between 11 - 19. Your kids are at expensive stage with food, clothes, money for activities and education costs.
Your husband has made bad financial and career decisions. You got an inheritance from your mother and you have been dipping into this to keep the family afloat. You wanted this money for you and to help the kids out at a later stage. I would not be willing to continue in this situation either.

When you try to talk about improving this situation he just gets verbally abusive with you.
You need to tell him at this stage that your no longer going to put up with his moods or verbal abuse when you try to discuss money. I would tell him that your no longer going to be using your inheritance to prop up the family.
Say unless you talk with me and we work together to improve this situation you will be getting a divorce. You need to be that blunt with him.

The reality is that he needs to change job rather than expecting you to use your inheritance to keep the family afloat. Why are you doing freelance work? This may have suited you when your kids were younger. In order to improve your own income you need to get paid employment with a salary of x amount a week or month. Your husband and kids can step up at home to enable you to do this.

You need to be working together to improve your financial situation. I look at Martin Lewis money website as it shows offer for changing bill providers, budgeting ect. I think that you can post for money advice on this website as well. Look on the money section here as well
You need to look at your current income and outgoings and see where savings can be made.

I would also encourage your children that are old enough to get a part time job so they can build up their own savings and pay for say clothes and runners ect. It helps them learn to manage their own money and it will bring down your costs also.
I know a lady with kids she says I will buy runners up to X cost. If you want the more expensive ones you can put some of your own money with them. She said its amazing how suddenly the cheaper item is fine.

Along with this you need to consider your own future and how to build up your own savings, own pension and you need to keep what left of your inheritance for this.