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Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

Original poster

To think this is a huge red flag

89 replies

369damnshesfine · 31/12/2023 11:12

A friend of mine recently had an affair and left their partner and 3 kids and moved in with their new fling, after only knowing them for a few weeks (obviously completely unacceptable).

We had a Xmas works do just before Xmas and they ended up staying out longer than they originally planned (not late).

When they got home their new partner had locked the door from the inside and refused to let them in.

A couple of hours later, where my friend was sat on the doorstep, they eventually let them in but was in an awful mood and refused to speak to them.

I think this is a huge red flag and I would end things immediately.

They are playing it down but I think it’s because they’ve left their marriage and kids and now will look silly if they admit they were wrong.

Would you encourage them to leave or just let them get on with it?

OP posts:
Grimpo · 31/12/2023 14:19

Why does your friend think there's any future in a relationship where his partner will do this to him?

Original poster
369damnshesfine · 31/12/2023 14:25

CanImakethisbetter · 31/12/2023 14:05

Except they would be admitting to their own controlling and manipulative behaviour.

This person is a proved liar. Why do you think they are above lying to you?

Show quote history

Yes which is why they don’t want to post on here, in case their new partner sees it.

And they have definitely lied to me and I know they’re playing it down which is why I thought they’d be better coming on here where they can be more honest.

I have been openly judgemental about their choices and so I know they will play things down.

OP posts:
Mehmeh22 · 31/12/2023 14:26

It's really hard to follow you when you talk about multiple people using they and them. Cam you not add some kind of identifier

Original poster
369damnshesfine · 31/12/2023 14:28

Mygosh · 31/12/2023 14:12

@369damnshesfine
All you can do is be there to help when the shit hits the fan. Try to direct your friend to the Freedom Programme.

Yes I suppose there’s not much else I can do but wait and then be there to support them.

The new partner is pushing for marriage and I can see them having a baby soon, as they thought there was a chance just before Xmas.

I guess I am concerned that the longer they’re in the relationship, the harder it’s going to be to get out of it.

Some people will think they deserve it but although I am against what they did, I would hate for them to be in a bad relationship they felt they couldn’t get out of.

OP posts:
Original poster
369damnshesfine · 31/12/2023 14:30

Mehmeh22 · 31/12/2023 14:26

It's really hard to follow you when you talk about multiple people using they and them. Cam you not add some kind of identifier

Sorry I know the new partner is on here and so I’m just trying to be as discreet as possible but I understand that it must be confusing.

From now on I will use:

Friend = F
New partner = NP
Ex = ex
They = F and NP

Hopefully that makes it clearer.

OP posts:
TheSunIsShiningAndTheSkyIsBlue · 31/12/2023 14:35

You seem very invested in this scenario.
I have known people to split up for whatever reason and get back together again, it's not that unusual.
It's early days for them maybe they will make ago of it, maybe they wont.
I would just focus on your own life and let them get on with theirs.

LakeTiticaca · 31/12/2023 14:39

Never has the saying "the grass isn't always greener" rang so true, as many people will quickly realise when they dump their family for some exciting sex.
They soon realise that now it's no longer "illicit" that the excitement dies off pretty quick, and there they are, surveying the wreckage left in their wake.
He should have kept his dick in his pants

MrsTerryPratchett · 31/12/2023 14:44

It really doesn't make it clearer. At all.

And sexes do matter. Being locked out of a home is different for a man than a woman. Leaving kids is really very very unusual for a woman but not sadly for a man. Physical risk is very different as well. Controlling abusive relationships kill women. Every day,

Original poster
369damnshesfine · 31/12/2023 14:44

TheSunIsShiningAndTheSkyIsBlue · 31/12/2023 14:35

You seem very invested in this scenario.
I have known people to split up for whatever reason and get back together again, it's not that unusual.
It's early days for them maybe they will make ago of it, maybe they wont.
I would just focus on your own life and let them get on with theirs.

Yes I am very invested because I’m concerned that my friend is in a controlling relationship.

If there are red flags so early on then I worry what will happen if they get married or have a baby.

Especially when so many people have the opinion of it’s your bed now lie in it and find it fitting if she were in a controlling relationship.

I assume most people would worry if their friend was in a similar situation.

OP posts:
Original poster
369damnshesfine · 31/12/2023 14:48

MrsTerryPratchett · 31/12/2023 14:44

It really doesn't make it clearer. At all.

And sexes do matter. Being locked out of a home is different for a man than a woman. Leaving kids is really very very unusual for a woman but not sadly for a man. Physical risk is very different as well. Controlling abusive relationships kill women. Every day,

I disagree.

Being locked out of your home is a red flag whether you’re male, female or a same sex relationship.

I don’t think a woman should get judged more harshly for leaving her kids, just because men do it all of the time.

And of course physical risk is different but many men are in physically abusive relationships too, so I don’t think in this scenario it makes a difference as no one wants their friend being in an abusive relationship regardless of sex.

People will judge my friend more harshly based on their sex and so I don’t want that bias.
I’m also aware the NP is on here too and some of the details are already quite identifiable.

OP posts:
MayThe4th · 31/12/2023 14:52

So you mentioned the fact she’d had an affair why exactly? So that people would judge and say that it serves her right?

If you’d said that your friend had recently moved in with someone and they’d locked her out after she was late home after a Christmas do the responses would have been unanimous that it was a red flag and you should encourage her to leave.

So she had an affair. So what? Do people really think that if someone has an affair then they deserve to end up in an abusive relationship? If this bloke had beaten the crap out of her when she got home would people still be saying that it was karma?
Affairs are rarely black and white. And I’d suggest that her moving out so soon after starting the affair is a good indication that there were issues in the marriage, not that that justifies the affair but she wouldn’t be the first to have an exit affair and she won’t be the last. But in the context of what happened here the affair is entirely irrelevant and didn’t even need mentioning.

CanImakethisbetter · 31/12/2023 14:52

You friend is in a mutually controlling and manipulative relationship.

But trying to make you think their partner is the only one acting poorly. And then is trying to back track.

Do you realise your friend villainising the affair partner really works in their favour?

For if they want to go back? To get friends to stay in contact as they feel sorry for them? Because it makes them feel better if the Affair partner is a terrible person and they just fell for the nice person persona. Or maybe you friend just enjoys the drama. Of a toxic relationship. Or maybe now it’s not an affair and it’s not so exciting so they are drumming up more drama.

I know 2 people who claimed their girlfriend locked them out. One had lost his own keys and the other got home and the door was just locked. He called his partner and she opened the door. Neither were locked out. But it sounds better when you want to go on one about how awful your partner is and how you should get sympathy.

and again, they then backtrack when it suits. The partner here maybe controlling. But so is your friend.

Your friend is managing to gain a lot telling you how awful their partner is. The same friend who wasn’t honest with the affair partner and managed to manipulate them into letting them move in.

Even now, you know your ‘friend’ is lying straight to you. So you actually have no clue whether what they ar saying. Is true or not. If you know someone is a liar why would you believe them?

The best thing to do would be to tell them they are so dishonest you have no idea what’s true and what’s not and suggest they get counselling.

Tartantatooes · 31/12/2023 14:57

@369damnshesfine

Your comment about people sharing a bed right up to the split is spot on . Very often end up in bed together after the split too behind the new partners back . Seen this over and over .

Original poster
369damnshesfine · 31/12/2023 14:58

MayThe4th · 31/12/2023 14:52

So you mentioned the fact she’d had an affair why exactly? So that people would judge and say that it serves her right?

If you’d said that your friend had recently moved in with someone and they’d locked her out after she was late home after a Christmas do the responses would have been unanimous that it was a red flag and you should encourage her to leave.

So she had an affair. So what? Do people really think that if someone has an affair then they deserve to end up in an abusive relationship? If this bloke had beaten the crap out of her when she got home would people still be saying that it was karma?
Affairs are rarely black and white. And I’d suggest that her moving out so soon after starting the affair is a good indication that there were issues in the marriage, not that that justifies the affair but she wouldn’t be the first to have an exit affair and she won’t be the last. But in the context of what happened here the affair is entirely irrelevant and didn’t even need mentioning.

Because that’s the entire point of my thread.

If my friend didn’t have an affair and met someone the normal way, then chances are they would see a red flag and run in the opposite direction.

My friend is ignoring these red flags, simply out of pride/to save face because they know they ruined a lot of people’s lives and caused a lot of pain but it was out of ‘love’ and they could justify it.

If they admit that they were wrong and their life isn’t as great as they thought it would be, then it’s admitting that they did all that for nothing.

My concern is exactly that.
That they’re staying in a relationship simply because they don’t want to admit they messed up.

They’re already living together and talking about marriage and babies and if my friend already thinks they can’t leave, then it’s going to be a lot worse when they’re married or have kids.

OP posts:
Chocolatecakewithsprinkles · 31/12/2023 14:59

If they have already walked out on 3 children why would having another trap them? Clearly not an issue walking away from them. Seems really strange to plan on instantly getting pregnant after abandoning your kids though.

AnneValentine · 31/12/2023 15:00

369damnshesfine · 31/12/2023 13:57

If this new partner kicks them out, they will have nowhere to go and I can see them asking their partner to take them back.

I can’t see it happening.
The first couple of weeks they begged for them back but I think now they’ve woken up and wouldn’t take them back.

They are selfish, there’s no denying it that but the deeper they get into this relationship the worse it’s going to get.
I worry if they end up having a baby and getting trapped.

Show quote history

The new partner is the one I would worry about!

Original poster
369damnshesfine · 31/12/2023 15:05

CanImakethisbetter · 31/12/2023 14:52

You friend is in a mutually controlling and manipulative relationship.

But trying to make you think their partner is the only one acting poorly. And then is trying to back track.

Do you realise your friend villainising the affair partner really works in their favour?

For if they want to go back? To get friends to stay in contact as they feel sorry for them? Because it makes them feel better if the Affair partner is a terrible person and they just fell for the nice person persona. Or maybe you friend just enjoys the drama. Of a toxic relationship. Or maybe now it’s not an affair and it’s not so exciting so they are drumming up more drama.

I know 2 people who claimed their girlfriend locked them out. One had lost his own keys and the other got home and the door was just locked. He called his partner and she opened the door. Neither were locked out. But it sounds better when you want to go on one about how awful your partner is and how you should get sympathy.

and again, they then backtrack when it suits. The partner here maybe controlling. But so is your friend.

Your friend is managing to gain a lot telling you how awful their partner is. The same friend who wasn’t honest with the affair partner and managed to manipulate them into letting them move in.

Even now, you know your ‘friend’ is lying straight to you. So you actually have no clue whether what they ar saying. Is true or not. If you know someone is a liar why would you believe them?

The best thing to do would be to tell them they are so dishonest you have no idea what’s true and what’s not and suggest they get counselling.

If they were slagging their new partner off then I would 100% agree with you, but they’re not, they’re trying to act like it’s all fine.

They rang me when they were locked out saying the NP is asleep and can’t hear them knocking or ringing them.

I said have you lost your keys and F said no but the doors locked from the inside, so I can’t get in.

I said why would NP lock the door from the inside, knowing that you’re out on a works do and my friend acted like they must have just forgot.
I then later found out they gave them the silent treatment the next day over it.

It’s actually the playing it down is what I find most concerning and why I wanted F to come one here and be more honest because the small snippets I’ve heard are already concerning.

OP posts:
MrJollyLivesNextDoor · 31/12/2023 15:05

Is the 'friend' you OP?

If so, yes you should leave your NP

Original poster
369damnshesfine · 31/12/2023 15:08

Chocolatecakewithsprinkles · 31/12/2023 14:59

If they have already walked out on 3 children why would having another trap them? Clearly not an issue walking away from them. Seems really strange to plan on instantly getting pregnant after abandoning your kids though.

Because their previous relationship wasn’t controlling at all.

Apparently the new partner believes in marriage straight away and there’s no such thing as dating.

Different culture so perhaps they do things differently but they aren’t concerned about getting pregnant out of wedlock, which I thought would be a big deal.
But tbh I don’t know enough about the culture to comment.

OP posts:
Original poster
369damnshesfine · 31/12/2023 15:09

MrJollyLivesNextDoor · 31/12/2023 15:05

Is the 'friend' you OP?

If so, yes you should leave your NP

No it’s definitely not me I promise!

I am single and happy.

I feel this is another reason why my friend is reluctant to give me the full story, as I think they’re someone who can’t be single and therefore it’s either the NP or they’re on their own.

OP posts:
pikkumyy77 · 31/12/2023 15:10

MrsTerryPratchett · 31/12/2023 14:44

It really doesn't make it clearer. At all.

And sexes do matter. Being locked out of a home is different for a man than a woman. Leaving kids is really very very unusual for a woman but not sadly for a man. Physical risk is very different as well. Controlling abusive relationships kill women. Every day,

Yes, exactly!

To me its obvious the “friend” is female and the “being locked out” pressured for marriage and op’s concern about the potential for a pregnancy reads as far, far, more dangerous because these things are more dangerous for women than for men.

MayThe4th · 31/12/2023 15:12

Well, nice to know that there are situations where abuse is apparently justified or where the abuse victim doesn’t deserve sympathy.

I wonder what justification people give to the victims on the relationships board who have escaped abusive relationships,

You do know that sometimes people end up having affairs because they’re in abusive relationships?

Ultimately your friend may need to feel that she needs to justify her decision, but did it occur to you that perhaps she was in an unhappy relationship and now she’s doubting whether the relationship was as unhappy as she thought it was?
Personally I would be telling her that people do stupid things sometimes, and leaving her husband and kids was stupid and selfish, but that that doesn’t mean that she should be forced to pay penance by being abused or that she deserves to be. That it’s ok to walk away from the affair partner, and that if she felt the need to leave her marriage for someone else, she can still leave, she doesn’t have to go back, because being on your own isn’t necessarily a bad thing. But that things will only get worse not better.

CanImakethisbetter · 31/12/2023 15:14

369damnshesfine · 31/12/2023 15:05

If they were slagging their new partner off then I would 100% agree with you, but they’re not, they’re trying to act like it’s all fine.

They rang me when they were locked out saying the NP is asleep and can’t hear them knocking or ringing them.

I said have you lost your keys and F said no but the doors locked from the inside, so I can’t get in.

I said why would NP lock the door from the inside, knowing that you’re out on a works do and my friend acted like they must have just forgot.
I then later found out they gave them the silent treatment the next day over it.

It’s actually the playing it down is what I find most concerning and why I wanted F to come one here and be more honest because the small snippets I’ve heard are already concerning.

Show quote history

Yes they called you looking they had been locked out.

Why, when you barely speak to them?

And now back tracking?

Do you really expect someone to leave their door unlocked all night because their partner forgot their keys?

The new partner would have locked their door because it’s safer to do so.

So all that happened is your friend forgot their keys, couldn’t get in for a short period, until their partner woke up and opened it.

Their partner then let them in and was pissed off that your friend went out, didn’t take their keys, ended up on the door step knocking until their partner got woken up and phoned someone they barely speak to complain they had been locked out.

Maybe they are playing it down because they made a ridiculous fuss over nothing. Not a chance would I leave my door unlocked over night for Dp. He takes his keys or knocks but will have to wait till I wake up.

Your friend has controlled and manipulated their partner and their spouse. Why would they not manipulate you?

Such a fuss over nothing.

CanImakethisbetter · 31/12/2023 15:17

MayThe4th · 31/12/2023 15:12

Well, nice to know that there are situations where abuse is apparently justified or where the abuse victim doesn’t deserve sympathy.

I wonder what justification people give to the victims on the relationships board who have escaped abusive relationships,

You do know that sometimes people end up having affairs because they’re in abusive relationships?

Ultimately your friend may need to feel that she needs to justify her decision, but did it occur to you that perhaps she was in an unhappy relationship and now she’s doubting whether the relationship was as unhappy as she thought it was?
Personally I would be telling her that people do stupid things sometimes, and leaving her husband and kids was stupid and selfish, but that that doesn’t mean that she should be forced to pay penance by being abused or that she deserves to be. That it’s ok to walk away from the affair partner, and that if she felt the need to leave her marriage for someone else, she can still leave, she doesn’t have to go back, because being on your own isn’t necessarily a bad thing. But that things will only get worse not better.

Where did op say her friend had an affair because she was abused?

The friend (let’s assume a woman) is manipulating her partner. So abusive.

The new partner isn’t abusing the friend. The friend didn’t take their key and had to knock at the door until the partner woke up and let them in.

And the sort we was pissed off. MN is has at least W threads a weekend where women are pissed off that their partner went out, woke them up when they got back and no one tells them being pissed off is abuse.

MrsElsa · 31/12/2023 15:26

It sounds utterly chaotic and trauma based. Leaving 3 DC, immediately moving in with AP and having unprotected sex resulting in pregnancy scare.

I don't think you're this person's friend at all OP, I think you're enabling this nonsense. MYOB.