What do I do? Leave him?

[Pleasehelpimexhausted]

I cannot stop arguing with DP. We have 2 children, age 4 and 9 months.

The main issues are lack of communication and a complete inability on his part to take on his fair share of the mental load.

He barely speaks to me, I can ask him a question (and he’s heard me) and actually be met with silence. He seems to think replying is optional. I’ll message him something and he won’t bother replying - he’ll just assume I take his silence as agreement even if it’s not ‘that’ kind of message. This has lead to a lot of incidents which could have been solved or prevented with basic communication. No conversation is ever finished, he just walks off as I’m mid sentence. I find it so dismissive and rude. I’m talking basic conversations about what the kids have on that day, or things we need to discuss (for example our house move).

The second issue is the mental load. He seems utterly incapable of doing anything without so much hand holding, planning and ‘directing’ from me. He isn’t lazy and will do anything I ask him, but I don’t want to have to ask. For once I want him to decide what we do with the kids at the weekend, or book a needed GP appointment without asking, or just go into the kitchen and start making their lunch. Today he was supposed to take both kids for the morning so I could declutter a room for the baby to move into. He needs so much help getting out the door, I have to constantly check if the kids have been fed and taken to the toilet, as he gets angry and more flustered. I had to think of somewhere for them to go, and remind him when to bring them back for the baby’s next feed.

It’s all so exhausting. It’s every day. The worst thing is he gets angry at himself and being called out when something else goes tits up, and ends up snapping at me or the children. I’ve tried talking to him about it. He apologises then goes back to how he was the next morning.

Any advice?

Please? 😢

This sounds very wearing OP, Re the comunication, has he always been a poor communicator or is it something new? His behaviour sounds incredibly rude, have you called him out on it and if so how can he explain walking away or not replying to you?
Re the mental load and his inability to participate or take charge, you will see many posts on here from women about the same thing. A lot of men seem incapable of managing everyday life skills or dealing with the needs of their own children. Only you know if its laziness, lack of confidence or reluctance to share the load.
I'm not sure what the answer is, you could try instigating daily planning, writing lists a shared diary etc but it won't necessarily change his attitude. Perhaps you should start with couples counselling focusing on your communication problems and go from there.

I found a book Why Women Talk and Men Walk very helpful. I gave it to read to a friend she also liked it. It's about a tenner from Amazon. It's written jointly by a male and female family therapists. I think it would provide some answers to your questions. I appreciate you probably have little time to read books with such young children. However January is a prime time to file for divorce. Christmas time is just so stressful for most families. I suggest you find the time to read it. I also suggest you massively downscale your Christmas plans. Do the bare minimum. Lots of men (including my husband) think that the majority of things women want are either completely unnecessary or could be done better their way. When the wife tries to argue her case an argument follows. I still remember a massive argument with my husband about 10 years ago when my sister in law was coming over for a visit, the house was a mess (in my opinion), I was under pressure at work and I asked my husband to clean our place top to bottom (which my husband thought was completely unnecessary). Why was I prioritising my sister's in law opinion over good relationship with my husband? This is just an example. These days I hardly ask for anything and allow my husband to do things on his terms and in his schedule. Important things will eventually get done, often not to my standards and the timescale but they will get done. The house unfortunately is a mess most of the time. However we are still married and I get flowers and other romantic gestures from my husband. I even got a card "The Ideal Wife " for my birthday. I was very surprised considering how little cooking and cleaning I do. I hope it helps

I totally get your point BUT why does his desire for a messy house trump your desire for a clean one? Why can he not accept that while something is not important to him, it is important to you? Why is he not willing to accept that his way is not always the right way sometimes too? This theory does just sound a bit like agree with the man and all is harmonious.

My ex absolutely detested cleaning with a passion. But in his words, it was important to me. So he did it.

I wish I had an answer to your question why a man wouldn't do something which is important to his wife. I think they just like feeling of being in control (or detest "being controlled" in my husband's word's). My husband used to be very much like OP's, either stonewalling or getting angry at what I thought were my very reasonable requests. I found through trial and error that the best way to get him to do anything is not ask at all. Order a piece of furniture and let it stand in the hall for a month until he finds time to build it. He knows very much I want it built however he has his own projects on the go and he appreciates me not getting HIS plans messed up. (The alternative is of course for me to pay someone to build it for me). So I wait. OP is asking for advice. My advice would be for her to drop off some of her load completely rather than trying to get her husband to share more. Like I said earlier men think a lot of women's workload is not necessary which leads to arguments. I would say the children would probably benefit more from the basic standards of cleanliness, basic food, basic Christmas decorations and harmonious family life than everything of the highest quality and hostile atmosphere or divorce. Same for the wider family. I stopped fretting about what to get for his family for birthdays and Christmas. He sorts it out himself. Ironically they all think highly of me as he tells everyone how wonderful I am. It's the same man I was at the brink of divorcing 10 years ago because we used to have endless arguments who does what. I wish men could be more like women. I don't think they can.

But that sound like you've just accepted your house is going to be a shithole and when there's anything you don't like about the relationship with your husband you simply shut up about it.

Which frankly I don't see a few flowers and gifts being sufficient compensation for.

How was he when you just had the 1 dc? Was he involved?

How long has this situation been going on for? Because I suspect this is how he is, he is unlikely to change whatever you say or do.

I would not do the thinking for him: he's a grown man for goodness sake!

If he doesn't know how to organise himself, then it's on him. I bet he's able to organise himself in a professional capacity at work though?

Equally I would start thinking the unthinkable: about how future might look like with and without him.

Time to take stock.

He's silent because he hates arguing.

You have to help him dress the kids because you have an opinion/veto on what they should wear.

You have to decide what to do that the weekend because you have an opinion/veto on what you should do and he can't guess what you want to do.

If you weren't there he'd just dress them in whatever he thought best and do whatever he thought best and it would be fine.

A partial solution is lists and labels so he knows what you want, where stuff needs to go and what he has to do without you hovering over his shoulder with "you'll need a warmer coat." Stuff you want him to do can go in jobs lists and you leave him to do it independently. Don't watch him and only pick him up on stuff that you really can't let go. Also don't verbally give him information he doesn't need.

If you can hold it together for a couple of years this stuff gets a lot easier - the kids will know what coats they need before long.

Good luck to both of you.

He does not need a list nor labels at work though does he?. He is a grown man. Why do women suggest lists and such like for men at all?

What is the situation re the finances and property?. I would start to formulate a plan to exit with due care and attention; this is really no model for your kids to potentially emulate either. What do you want to teach your children about relationships and what are they learning here?.

This is a really wise post.

One of our many friction issues was making beds. Which was either pointless or essential depending on which of us you asked.

We stopped making the beds or occasionally I spend 10 seconds throwing the duvet on in roughly the right place. Instant harmony and the sky hasn't fallen in yet.

Our house isn't a mess and the reason for that is labelled draws and storage. It turns out that if there's a drawer labelled 'tops' there's a universal law of nature that unites the top with the drawer. I resisted for a long time because I hate the way it looks but it made the house tide overnight.

He does not need a list nor labels at work though does he?. He is a grown man. Why do women suggest lists and such like for men at all?

Because it works and creates harmony. And yes, he will have lists and labels at work. Processes are documented and if you have drawers that are used by more than one person they are typically labelled and if they aren't you get chaos.

My nursery managed 30 children. Every draw was labelled, every peg was labeled per child. Without that you'd have to search thirty pegs to know where to put the right coat. It would take hours. There are labels and lists in the work place and when there are young children the home is a work place for the parents.

Every minute of every waking hour every one of us makes a choice. I choose to live in a harmonius family where we all like and respect each other (including 2 teenagers) over living in a spotless house. I do assure you we have standards. We aren't eating off the floor

The above is in reply to Category 12 post

If you're in this for the long haul then it's worth it to work together. My dh was similar when dc were young.
I booked all days out and day trips, I organised stuff so he could stay with the dc and I went out. I wrote lists of chores he needed to do.
The way I saw it was that he saw me as the 'manager' of home, probably because I was at home more than him. It's common issue.
So, treat it as youre his manager and he's an employee that needs to come up to Co-manager or something.
By the time the youngest dc was 4, dh booked me a surprise trip by myself to spend a week with my family abroad and he took care of everything at home.
The fact is you haven't got a dh who knows to do this stuff so work with what you've got.

Your issue is more that he ignores you and doesn't talk to you. That's pretty serious and you need to have a conversation about what the hell that's about.

Some odd replies.
The lone reason to have a boyfriend is that the relationship is meant to enhance your life and be fun. In OPs case they’re (the adults) also giving the blueprint example to their kids of what they’ll consider normal, a useless, incompetent male who palms off the drudge work to a woman and snaps at her is a shit example for them.
OP can decide if this is all she wants from life, or if life would be happier, more peaceful and smooth parenting without this man around, and if she can afford to house herself etc.

I totally get your point BUT why does his desire for a messy house trump your desire for a clean one?

I don't think you can distill what she said to "Just have a messy house".

The fact that the OPs husband is avoiding talking to her is a pretty clear indication that he feels he's getting too much communication of the wrong sort.

"Sharing" came up above. Sharing jobs is a recipe for disharmony it's inevitable both partners will have a different view on how it's best done. Much better to ring fence tasks and leave each other to get on with it. And yes, they'll be done differently.

Personally I don't think a messy house is essential to a happy marriage anyway. My kids are old enough now to join in and I just turnoff the router and say "We're picking up anything lying around and putting it where it lives. If you don't know where it lives leave it for someone who does." Four people doing that can return a house to order in no time and nobody argues.

Given your username and what you seem to have accepted, I really don't think this is the win you seem to think it is.

If the OP would prefer to split up than fix it then fine, but there are really easy fixes.

OP I feel your pain, I'm in a very similar situation. Some evenings my husband doesn't even acknowledge us when he gets home. Unfortunately I don't feel I could let him parent our children 50% of the time so I am stuck with him.

New mum110

Fifty percent is but a starting point.

Do you think that such a man would actually want to see his children even half the week when he cannot be even bothered to acknowledge you people as his family?. No, such men only care about their own self.

He seems to be wanting to hand over all responsibility to her. And if the man needs lists and labels given to him within the home then there are serious problems.

I don't think it should be a choice between harmony at home and being able to advocate for yourself. It just sounds like the "compromises" are all yours. @Tiredbehyondbelief

And why wait weeks/months for someone else to put furniture together? Sod that. Just put it together yourself. It's not hard.

@AttilaTheMeerkat I honestly think he would just to hurt me & then would be passing them around to all his family to mind. Trying to keep the peace before Christmas but have to do some serious thinking after that.

My username name is from the time we had builders in the house for 6 weeks. I simply haven't bothered to change it