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Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

Original poster

Social services

131 replies

wtfwolf · 21/07/2023 01:00

Are they just crap or got too much workload?

OP posts:
YellowBunnies · 22/07/2023 15:06

I'll be honest, almost every social worker I've encountered was been sun par. I think, OP, they both crap and overworked. In no other profession, have I encountered this.

And yes to this @WobbIy . I have a demanding profession. It's been gruelling at times. For many years I worked a minimum of 70 hours per week, 90-100 hours in busy periods.

Would me ignoring the law and statutory requirements governing my profession have been acceptable? No.

Would me ignored professional standard and codes of ethics have been acceptable? No.

Would me being rude and speaking inappropriately to clients or ignoring them entirely have been acceptable? No.

If I'd done any of the above, even once, I would have been sacked/ struck off/ ended up in court or prison or a combination of these.

So no, being "overworked" is not an excuse.

YellowBunnies · 22/07/2023 15:07

Many people are overworked but aren't crap at their jobs, irresponsible, rude, callous and think it is an excuse to continually break the law. So it is not just "overwork". It is being useless and incompetent as well.

YoSof · 22/07/2023 17:14

anonymousnotyourbusiness · 22/07/2023 11:29

Let's not call people "shit mums"/"shit parents", just because social services has been removed their children, you don't know the full story so don't judge

Show quote history

Social services don’t tend to remove children being brought up by good parents. In fact the threshold for being classed as an adequate parent is pretty low and threshold for removal very high.

And yes, I’ve worked in social care for many years - not as a SW but in a support role. The parents who WANT to do better grab the support with both hands usually. And then you get those who don’t. Those put their own needs first. Who abuse, or allow their children to be abused. Who neglect their children. Those who have a child removed, so they have another that is also removed, and then have another knowing full well that child will have a life in care and who do they blame? The social worker. Do they love their children? Some of them yes, in their own way.

Are they shit parents? Absolutely.

anonymousnotyourbusiness · 22/07/2023 17:19

YoSof · 22/07/2023 17:14

Social services don’t tend to remove children being brought up by good parents. In fact the threshold for being classed as an adequate parent is pretty low and threshold for removal very high.

And yes, I’ve worked in social care for many years - not as a SW but in a support role. The parents who WANT to do better grab the support with both hands usually. And then you get those who don’t. Those put their own needs first. Who abuse, or allow their children to be abused. Who neglect their children. Those who have a child removed, so they have another that is also removed, and then have another knowing full well that child will have a life in care and who do they blame? The social worker. Do they love their children? Some of them yes, in their own way.

Are they shit parents? Absolutely.

Show quote history

Some are not shit parents, some actually have fallen on hard times mentally and physically or ethier and like you mentoned some parents want to do better so you contradicted yourself in your statement in your pp.

YoSof · 22/07/2023 17:21

anonymousnotyourbusiness · 22/07/2023 17:19

Some are not shit parents, some actually have fallen on hard times mentally and physically or ethier and like you mentoned some parents want to do better so you contradicted yourself in your statement in your pp.

Show quote history

Did you even read my post? I said the ones who want to do better grab the support with both hands, and then you get the ones that don’t.

Its literally there in black and white.

YoSof · 22/07/2023 17:24

The parents who engage in support and make changes are unlikely to lose custody of their children. Like I said, the threshold for removal is high and SS are usually involved for a long time before that happens unless in extreme cases of abuse or neglect.

YellowBunnies · 22/07/2023 17:26

The parents who WANT to do better grab the support with both hands usually. And then you get those who don’t. Those put their own needs first. Who abuse, or allow their children to be abused. Who neglect their children. Those who have a child removed, so they have another that is also removed, and then have another knowing full well that child will have a life in care and who do they blame? The social worker. Do they love their children? Some of them yes, in their own way.

There is no support to "grab". Even when need is dire and it's a legal entitlement. There are plenty of resources to do unwarranted safeguarding assessments apparently, which unsurprisingly - given there were no safeguarding issues identified in the first place - find no safeguarding concerns and loved, well-provided for and well-parented children. There is money apparently to spend on fighting endless and inevitable complaints about not meeting your statutory duties because you are, you know, not meeting your statutory duties but want to spend what resources there are gaslighting parents and lying about the needs and the criteria for support. But apparently there are no resources to actually do anything useful: it's all spent on waste and finding excuses NOT to do what they are meant to be doing and attempting to justify the unjustifiable.

And no, parents who abuse and neglect their children do not "love them in their own way". That's not what love is. Love is putting someone else's needs above your own. Those parents are not capable of love and nobody should be making excuses for them.

YellowBunnies · 22/07/2023 17:27

YoSof · 22/07/2023 17:24

The parents who engage in support and make changes are unlikely to lose custody of their children. Like I said, the threshold for removal is high and SS are usually involved for a long time before that happens unless in extreme cases of abuse or neglect.

Engage in what support?

Where is it?

WobbIy · 22/07/2023 17:27

We have no idea if that poster even had their children removed. No need to call them a shit mum without knowing what's happened them and SS

anonymousnotyourbusiness · 22/07/2023 17:28

@YoSof
"You’re one of those shit mums who had their kids removed aren’t you".
This is what you stated previously before the your other comment

YoSof · 22/07/2023 17:31

YellowBunnies · 22/07/2023 17:27

Engage in what support?

Where is it?

Show quote history

@YellowBunnies this is clearly a very emotive subject for you and understandably so, so I’m not going to get into a debate with you. You have had your own experience with SS, I have had mine.

YellowBunnies · 22/07/2023 17:33

Some are not shit parents, some actually have fallen on hard times mentally and physically or ethier and like you mentoned some parents want to do better so you contradicted yourself in your statement in your pp.

No.

This is exactly the mentality that is wrong.

"Hard times" are NOT an excuse for neglect and abuse.

There is no excuse.

I have had more than my share of "hard times". I find it vile than anybody would attempt to use this as an excuse for mistreating children and failing to meet even their most basic needs.

These people are shit people. You have to be a shit person to neglect your child no matter how hard you life is/ has been. Let alone abuse them. Stop making excuses for monsters.

YoSof · 22/07/2023 17:33

anonymousnotyourbusiness · 22/07/2023 17:28

@YoSof
"You’re one of those shit mums who had their kids removed aren’t you".
This is what you stated previously before the your other comment

I’m not sure what your point is?

I responded that decent parents don’t usually get their children removed and wrote a whole post about that, and now you’ve circled back to another comment?

YoSof · 22/07/2023 17:34

YellowBunnies · 22/07/2023 17:33

Some are not shit parents, some actually have fallen on hard times mentally and physically or ethier and like you mentoned some parents want to do better so you contradicted yourself in your statement in your pp.

No.

This is exactly the mentality that is wrong.

"Hard times" are NOT an excuse for neglect and abuse.

There is no excuse.

I have had more than my share of "hard times". I find it vile than anybody would attempt to use this as an excuse for mistreating children and failing to meet even their most basic needs.

These people are shit people. You have to be a shit person to neglect your child no matter how hard you life is/ has been. Let alone abuse them. Stop making excuses for monsters.

This is exactly what I was saying!

anonymousnotyourbusiness · 22/07/2023 17:36

YellowBunnies · 22/07/2023 17:33

Some are not shit parents, some actually have fallen on hard times mentally and physically or ethier and like you mentoned some parents want to do better so you contradicted yourself in your statement in your pp.

No.

This is exactly the mentality that is wrong.

"Hard times" are NOT an excuse for neglect and abuse.

There is no excuse.

I have had more than my share of "hard times". I find it vile than anybody would attempt to use this as an excuse for mistreating children and failing to meet even their most basic needs.

These people are shit people. You have to be a shit person to neglect your child no matter how hard you life is/ has been. Let alone abuse them. Stop making excuses for monsters.

Just because that isn't your experience doesn't mean it isn't in others... Clearly you have some other issues with social services mentally you haven't healed. I'm not going to debate with you ethier just know I am a person who was brought up in the system (social services) up until 21 which is when they don't usually bother us unless you get yourself into shit that needs them invovled. Goodbye

anonymousnotyourbusiness · 22/07/2023 17:38

This reply has been deleted

Message deleted by MNHQ. Here's a link to our Talk Guidelines.

maybebalancing · 22/07/2023 17:39

YellowBunnies · 22/07/2023 15:07

Many people are overworked but aren't crap at their jobs, irresponsible, rude, callous and think it is an excuse to continually break the law. So it is not just "overwork". It is being useless and incompetent as well.

It isn't just about individuals being overworked it is about the whole system being chronically undervalued and underfunded for decades now.

This isn't an environment that encourages workers to stay. I worked for five years in frontline work at a time when there was more support and more resources than now. It was wasn't enough and retention rates were still too low.

Social workers can't refer to non existent services so gatekeeping becomes more extreme, people who want services become more dissatisfied.

Those people who are chasing very limited services are actually likely to be lower risk parents so the few resources there are are more likely to go to parents who don't want them. So both groups of parents are unhappy.

But social workers aren't actually responsible for most of this mess and it doesn't help anyone actually work effectively

YoSof · 22/07/2023 17:42

This reply has been deleted

We've removed this post as it quotes a deleted post.

anonymousnotyourbusiness · 22/07/2023 17:42

YoSof · 22/07/2023 17:33

I’m not sure what your point is?

I responded that decent parents don’t usually get their children removed and wrote a whole post about that, and now you’ve circled back to another comment?

Show quote history

Just seen this, that was the point of my first response in the first place

anonymousnotyourbusiness · 22/07/2023 17:44

This reply has been deleted

We've removed this post as it quotes a deleted post.

Don't try insult people which is actually a disability slurr you made you might want to remove this response

anonymousnotyourbusiness · 22/07/2023 17:46

WobbIy · 22/07/2023 17:27

We have no idea if that poster even had their children removed. No need to call them a shit mum without knowing what's happened them and SS

Exactly

eatdrinkandbemerry · 22/07/2023 17:51

They frustrate me no end (adult social care) but they are understaffed

YellowBunnies · 22/07/2023 18:04

I am sorry if I understood you, @YoSof

YellowBunnies · 22/07/2023 18:04

*misunderstood! 🤦🏻‍♀️

CatsSnore · 22/07/2023 18:08

YellowBunnies · 22/07/2023 10:07

Yes, school and nursery also made referrals. I asked them to and they did. Social services assigned a child protection social worker when that is not what we need. They did their safeguarding review. It concluded that I am an excellent parent and there are zero safeguarding concerns. On one page it said that the children have support needs, and on the next page that children's services would not provide any support. No explanation. The social worker doing this review behaved in a very inappropriate manner numerous times, making comments denying that my children have disabilities, and then comments about my house saying "why should we help you when you have a job?".

I made a stage one complaint. Ignored for months. The response when finally received did not answer the points raised in the complaint. I escalated it to stage two. Statutory deadline for their response came and went without them even appointing an investigator. A year later they still have no even begun their investigation.

In the meantime I referred us again to the children with disabilities team, who despite having reports from all of these other professionals stating the children's level of needs (both receive highest rate care DLA also) refuse to acknowledge this or perform the needs assessment that is a statutory duty to carry out upon request. They tried to tell me that they aren't entitled to be under CWD because they don't have learning disabilities. I sent them their own criteria demonstrating that this is not part of the criteria, and reiterating - with evidence from professionals - how each of the criteria are met and asking which one they dispute and why. And their own criteria that state that children with middle or highest rate care DLA automatically qualify for respite, so why are they still refusing this? Tumbleweed.

They need ongoing therapy for trauma caused by their father (who they have not had any contact with whatsoever since this was discovered, obviously. Not even a phone call). I funded a private psychologist for as long as I could but can't continue to do that as a lone parent. The psychologist's report states they need long-term therapy.

They need specialist childcare. They cannot go to group settings. If they are to stay in mainstream education then this is essential. I have been funding nannies to plug the gap. Again, I cannot continue to do this and why should I?

They need respite. They are automatically entitled to this and do not receive it.

They refuse to perform the statutory needs assessment so that they don't have to provide the required support package, and instead claim that ALL of these other professionals are wrong.

If they continue not to receive this support my health and financial situation will be pushed over the edge and rather than spending 10% of the tax I pay on the support my children are meant to have, my health will collapse and I will lose my job and the children will lose their home and stability and the loving parent who cares for them.

Not only callous but presumably it'll be much more expensive to provide them with a care place for the next decade plus.

They should be utterly ashamed of themselves.

Show quote history

Tbf even children in care don't get funded therapy and foster carers go through CAMHs until it's at a crisis point, and even then it can't always happen. There isn't any money. There are layers of managers up to the director of CS and it's within the management structures that funding decisions get approved or disapproved. Then the SW gets the shitty end of the stick telling the service users they can't have what they need. The whole system needs reforming but individual SWs get the blame.