Social services

[wtfwolf]

Are they just crap or got too much workload?

I'll be honest, almost every social worker I've encountered was been sun par. I think, OP, they both crap and overworked. In no other profession, have I encountered this.

Lacking in social skills, etiquette and basic professionalism. Unresponsive. Very poor quality reports. Overly harsh to some families yet overly permissive to others, where it's not appropriate. There seems to be deep issues in the culture and the fact that they're overstretched.

I know a very nice independent SW who left the profession and it was very interesting to hear her POV, too.

I think the criticism of SW that PP made isn't just about removals, but the pursuit of removals.

It's true though, that we never hear about what goes on in social care, either good or bad.

We don't hear of children they save, and we don't hear of other children who are inappropriately removed, either.

It's important to remember that disgruntled clients-whether justified or not-are free to say whatever they want wherever they want. Social workers are bound by confidentiality. This is always painfully clear in the high profile cases that hit the media- and applies also in day to day situations.

I'm no fan of Children's Services but I don't for one minute think they randomly and for the fun of it take children off people.

I understand (and correct me if I'm wrong SWs), they have to go to court with evidence of why the child needs to be removed and then it's the judges decision.

I'm sure parents are also bound by confidentiality? Family courts (or any courts) don't allow you to share documents. And the thing is, there almost is ground for some SW intervention, but it can still be inappropriate to seek a care order. It does happen. And the judge will deny the request so nothing comes of it long term.

They are suffocating under a work load that is inflated dealing with the fallout from petty squabbles between adults, meaning less time for actual safeguarding.

Also the government are failing to grasp the recruitment and training of new SW and this is now done in many LA's by private companies or even charities!!

You’re one of those shit mums who had their kids removed aren’t you 🙄

In my dealings with social workers (I adopted my child) I would say there are some who are very good but unfortunately there are more than a few who are shockingly incompetent. During court hearings they included information about a completely unrelated child, told blatant lies (luckily I had an email they sent that proved this) and lost sight of the children in their quest to prove their point.

I am a strong woman and they very nearly broke me simply because I had the audacity to disagree with their point of view.

What do you mean? That parents shouldn't be told about the negative impact of neglectful/dangerous parenting?
That it should be addressed in a way that doesn't point it out?

What I mean is that it would have been wonderful if when I was a child who was very obviously being neglected and abused social services had shown even the slightest concern about it and done anything to protect me. I recently requested my file, and it is shocking to say the least.

And nothing has changed. Now, decades later as the disabled lone parent of two disabled children I have actively tried to engage with them and ask them for help. Self-referred us. Asked for statutory assessments which they are still refusing to carry out. I have pointed out repeatedly that my children automatically qualify for respite per their own criteria. They ignore me. Then drag the complaints process out for years. They would rather shove what remains of my health over the precipice so that I can no longer provide for or care for my children than provide a tiny bit of help for my children. They claim that they have no needs, without assessing those needs, and in contradiction of the copious evidence they have received from paediatricians, GPs, qualified nannies, clinical psychologists, school, occupational therapists and SALT. Apparently all of those people are wrong.

What I mean is that they have shown no sign of thinking about the impact of their behaviour on children during any of the times in my life I've been unfortunate enough to have needed their help, which has never been forthcoming no matter how dire the circumstances and how much it is pleaded for.

We do, frequently. The aim is to take the least intrusive path overall.
That said just because parents are happy with how things are doesn’t mean their children are, or could be much happier if parents stopped drinking/ stopped hitting them/stopped taking drugs/gave them their medication/ took their own medication, stopped screaming arguments/stopped physical aggression and violence/ didn’t leave dog shit on the floor/cleaned the house so they could have access to the kitchen.
I could go on.

Yes. I'd very much have liked my parent to stop neglecting me, beating me up, emotionally abusing me, starving me, locking me outside and sexually abusing me. Sadly my social worker was not remotely interested in doing anything about it.

So yes I stand by what I said, I wish parents would consider how their kids really feel.

I can tell you. It's bad enough growing up in that environment, but when somebody else gets involved whose job it is to step in and protect you and you therefore have hope for the first time that you can remember that you may be saved and taken away and then the social worker does nothing and leaves you there to continue to be a punchbag, that is worse than them never having got involved at all. To give a child who has never had any hope some hope and then take it away again is beyond cruel.

I also can't imagine that my highly anxious disabled children are enjoying watching their only parent's health gradually collapse because social services deny them the support they are legally entitled to. Sometimes they cry at bedtime worrying who will look after them if I die.

So I stand by what I said: social workers need to think about the impact of their behaviour on children.

And if the social workers on this thread have so little empathy for what I've described that the best they can come up with is to coldly describe such complaints as "disgruntled clients" then that very much proves my point.

I’m sorry you were let down as a child @YellowBunnies your experiences sound horrific - I’d like to think that now days that wouldn’t happen, it wouldn’t in my team I’m confident there, but obviously I can’t speak for LA nationwide.

I’m sorry your children are being let down now. It’s not ok you are clearly struggling understandably. Do your LA have separate teams for CYPD and Safeguarding? What are their schools saying? Have they also made referrals? I know you’ve probably already done all of this, and I’m sorry you aren’t getting anywhere.
can I ask what support you feel your children need?

There are a lot of problems in social care. I agree with you @YellowBunnies. I get the impression that SW don't want to take on any more than their assigned workload, having been a vulnerable child and having had reported someone to them. I spoke to three people. One ignored my calls and texts. Two argued back with me about the physical/emotional abuse I saw (and had evidence of) the parents do, looking for reasons not to have to do a home visit. This is even before we consider children that end up on the news because it's too late.

On the other side, they can be extremely heavy-handed on parents who are reaching out for support. I've supported my sibling and their DP through a court case and it was very eye-opening. @Devastatedyetagain, I agree. I've even seen them disclose the name of unrelated child! Nuts.

That's not to say there isn't life-saving work that goes unrecognised. Social workers do save lives. It there are also shocking failures and inadequacies. I agree that those who are social workers themselves often to refuse to acknowledge this.

Yes, school and nursery also made referrals. I asked them to and they did. Social services assigned a child protection social worker when that is not what we need. They did their safeguarding review. It concluded that I am an excellent parent and there are zero safeguarding concerns. On one page it said that the children have support needs, and on the next page that children's services would not provide any support. No explanation. The social worker doing this review behaved in a very inappropriate manner numerous times, making comments denying that my children have disabilities, and then comments about my house saying "why should we help you when you have a job?".

I made a stage one complaint. Ignored for months. The response when finally received did not answer the points raised in the complaint. I escalated it to stage two. Statutory deadline for their response came and went without them even appointing an investigator. A year later they still have no even begun their investigation.

In the meantime I referred us again to the children with disabilities team, who despite having reports from all of these other professionals stating the children's level of needs (both receive highest rate care DLA also) refuse to acknowledge this or perform the needs assessment that is a statutory duty to carry out upon request. They tried to tell me that they aren't entitled to be under CWD because they don't have learning disabilities. I sent them their own criteria demonstrating that this is not part of the criteria, and reiterating - with evidence from professionals - how each of the criteria are met and asking which one they dispute and why. And their own criteria that state that children with middle or highest rate care DLA automatically qualify for respite, so why are they still refusing this? Tumbleweed.

They need ongoing therapy for trauma caused by their father (who they have not had any contact with whatsoever since this was discovered, obviously. Not even a phone call). I funded a private psychologist for as long as I could but can't continue to do that as a lone parent. The psychologist's report states they need long-term therapy.

They need specialist childcare. They cannot go to group settings. If they are to stay in mainstream education then this is essential. I have been funding nannies to plug the gap. Again, I cannot continue to do this and why should I?

They need respite. They are automatically entitled to this and do not receive it.

They refuse to perform the statutory needs assessment so that they don't have to provide the required support package, and instead claim that ALL of these other professionals are wrong.

If they continue not to receive this support my health and financial situation will be pushed over the edge and rather than spending 10% of the tax I pay on the support my children are meant to have, my health will collapse and I will lose my job and the children will lose their home and stability and the loving parent who cares for them.

Not only callous but presumably it'll be much more expensive to provide them with a care place for the next decade plus.

They should be utterly ashamed of themselves.

As for my own childhood, although I didn't understand this at the time, it was one of the most serious cases of neglect and abuse that I'm aware of, having read some books about what people consider to be extreme. Yet they did nothing at all. Nothing. Then when I was 16 and thrown out and homeless again they did nothing, and left me to fend for myself.

Despite all of that I've done everything possible to put that aside in the hope things had changed and it was no longer rotten to the core and engage with them for my own children.

Based on my experience nothing has changed at all in 25 years. Children who need help being completely ignored.

@YellowBunnies im sorry you had such an awful childhood. Its not acceptable. I can't and won't comment on that because i dont think it would be helpful to you having a stranger speak about something so traumatic and i wasn't there at the time and don't know you. I believe your experiences of social workers are true to you.

What i want to say to you as hard as it is for you to hear is that non of the decisions about your own children are the result of social workers. Yours don't get an assessment because demand is so high that there simply is no space left to assess some families. Social workers do not get a choice in who they assess. The decision is made from above. The thresholds are set by the people at the very top of local and national government. Mostly due to funding. It's not ok but there is absolutely nothing individual social workers can do about it.
There is no respite care. There is no foster care. Children who are at serious risk from parents often have no where to go. Its terrible but there is litrally no beds and no one to care for them. Your children are entitled to assessment and probably respite in the policies but if there is no one with space to assess and no respite care then unfortunately what can actually be done. There are hundreds of thousands of dc in similar positions. I hear you when you say you are at risk if your health declines and thats awful but there will be people that its already happening to so they have had to be prioritised. Its crisis management rather than prevention and that is seriously rubbish but its not the fault of sw, its a funding issue. Sw would give everyone the support and care they needed. If most sw had their way everyone who needed it would get respite. But they can't magic up funding or beds. They cant decide to assess off there own back that is not allowed.
Also unfortunately as awful as it sounds yes you are expected to fund your own support for your dc of its at all possible. Thats because ss simply cannot fund every child as the money does not exist. Im a parent carer myself so i completely empathise, i could do with respite for my dc. I wouldn't meet threshold either. But on the same tokan it was me who brought my dc into this world so it is me who is responsible to practically and financially do as much as i can to meet their needs. You say why should you pay for therapy and respite, these are your dc, there is no money left in the pot, you didn't choose to have dc with disabilities but the pot cannot fund every single family. People have to take responsibility for their own family wherever possible because that is what the government believes. Im not saying i agree with that but it appears the majority of this country do because they keep voting for the government who keep slashing funding and hold these views.

Your situation is shit. I hear you loud and clear. Same as me. It is not the fault of social workers.

@YellowBunnies You sound as if you have more than enough to deal with now and you've been let down badly in the past and I'm sorry and I hope things get better. Just want to say it was me who said "disgruntled clients." It was not intended to be cold. I just meant clients who do not feel they were served well. Some will be right. Some won't. No value judgement implied.

@Aloneinthevillage I appreciate that they are underfunded and overworked. However, that is not my problem. My job is to get my children the support that they need and are legally entitled to.

Social services need to comply with their statutory duties, their own published policies and their own professional standards.

I have disabilities and a chronic illness myself. The impact of this is significant: chronic pain to the extent that I am frequently housebound for a week or more. I have a blue badge but even with that am often too unwell to be able to get my children to school, for example. Despite this I am holding down a full time professional job. Paying a mortgage. Have got them diagnosed, funded an operation and therapy privately because the NHS and CAMHS may as well not exist.

I have always taken responsibility. I've raised these children alone since they were babies. But there is a limit to what one person can, or should be expected, to do. I have paid a great deal of tax for very many years so damn right I expect the services this is meant to fund to be available when we finally need them.

I have used all of my financial reserves to pay for private therapy, medical treatment and specialist childcare already. I had budgeted ti pay a mortgage, normal childcare etc, on my own with no help. I cannot - and should not be expected to - meet all of the additional costs of their disabilities as well. There is nothing left now. Are you saying nobody should have children unless they have budgeted sufficiently to be able to pay a mortgage, all living costs, private medical care for physical and mental health issues and specialist childcare themselves, even as a lone parent?

I have been working full time while chronically ill and caring for two disabled children without a break ever for over 6 years. And surviving on 3-4 hours of sleep on a good night. My health is now collapsing as a direct result of them being denied the support they are entitled to and that I've paid for many times over. My job is being put at risk as a result, and therefore the entire house if cards WILL come crashing down if nothing is done.

So the options are:
a) social services fulfil their statutory duties and provide the support required to make this situation sustainable. My health can stabilise and I can continue to provide the children with a loving, stable home and support us all financially as well, with them filling the gaps in funding needs directly resulting for the children's disabilities.
b) my health collapses, I lose my job, we lose our home, I can no longer work or care for the children, both have to go into care and suffer yet more trauma and the state will have to meet my living costs also. And no longer receive the tax I pay from working.

Even if they don't give a shit about my children's welfare (very apparent), from a callous financial point of view option b) is going to be far more expensive for them. And it's not going to be far off now if they don't start to meet their responsibilities.

The worst part of it all is forcing an exhausted, distressed and chronically ill parent to have these pseudo-arguments with them, draining yet more of the little time and energy I have and causing me yet more stress. Them pretending that the children have no needs to try to circumvent their responsibilities. They know that they do have needs they are supposed to be meeting. They know that I know this. I know that they know that I know this. And they know I know that. But they persist in wasting my time having a fake and endless argument about it when we all know exactly what is going on. It is a disgrace.

I also don't appreciate your comment about my childhood experiences being "true to me". I am talking about objective reality, facts. As I said I obtained my own file not long ago and it's all there in black and white.

Let's not call people "shit mums"/"shit parents", just because social services has been removed their children, you don't know the full story so don't judge

Thank you. I think the detached tone of it jarred because it is this kind of emotionless, dispassionate response which has made the refusal of help far worse in many ways. Although I can appreciate how it must be necessary in such a role to have a level of detachment in order to be able to cope yourself.

To be clear @Aloneinthevillage the children do get to school. But only because I have been funding specialist nannies to get them there and back. And to care for them after school and during school holidays etc.

It will be much cheaper for the state to meet some of that cost than me lose my job and them no longer receive the tax I pay each month that is meant to fund services when we actually need them.

But silly me, that before having children I'd mot anticipated that my ex-husband would be abusive and I'd be raising them alone, or that they'd both be disabled, or that I'd be disabled myself. I should have seen all of that coming clearly and refrained from having children until I could fund every possible eventuality and health cost myself privately. Or is that not the whole purpose of us paying taxes, to provide healthcare, social services etc?

Can't have it both ways. I'm happy if the state want to stop taxing me and then I could afford to pay for all needs by myself. Or, happy for them to take the tax which is more than enough to cover the support my children need plus some help for others. But no, I don't think it's acceptable to take the money then refuse to provide the services.

Children’s Services team meeting

Hey guys. Budget cuts. What should we do?

Hmmmm… tough one.

We could throw all the disabled children off a bridge?

Won’t their parents object though?

Maybe we could just pretend they’re not REALLY disabled and the parents will eventually get so tired they’ll go away and stop asking us for help?

Yes!! Great idea. That’ll make our work schedules so much easier as well as saving money.

But what if the really annoying ones, who really need help and are desperate for it, keep on hassling us?

I know! Let’s refuse to accept evidence from any other professionals that the children have any needs and say we will only accept evidence from our own assessments. And then tell them that they can’t have an assessment because they haven’t been able to demonstrate any needs through our assessment because it’s not been done, that way we’ll never have to do an assessment again or provide any support!

Absolute genius. Off to the pub then lads?

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It’s like “Yes, Minister” for social services crossed with a Monty Python sketch, and if I wasn’t the disabled lone parent of disabled children being completely abandoned without the help they are legally entitled to, I’d probably find it far more amusing.

@YellowBunnies. Im going to step away from this discussion because kindly it is clear you are not im a good place and have been unable to properly read and understand my replies. This is adding to your stress i wish you all the best.

@YellowBunnies I'm stepping away from this thread now too. But just to be clear. I'm not a social worker.

I understood perfectly well. I agree with your analysis of why they are behaving this way, per the little script I wrote for them below, for the pilot episode of "Yes, social worker". Understanding their motivations however, does not make it ok that they are failing to meet their statutory duties and are willing to shove a disabled lone parent and two disabled children over the cliff, rather than do their job.

I am not a therapist. Nor am I able to be in two places at once: providing respite while having respite 🤣, or providing childcare while working to pay the tax that funds social services and healthcare, supposedly. I am also just a single human who - even if I was in perfect health - cannot do a demanding full time professional job AND provide the care and additional support that two traumatised and disabled children require AND effectively take on a third full time job of arguing with health professionals, schools, CAMHS, social services etc to get the correct support in place. I sleep for 3-4 hours per night if I'm lucky. Clearly, that is not going to be sustainable. Many nights it is only 1 or two hours.

So no, I am not in a good place. My start in life was horrific. It would have been far better if social services had done their job. If they couldn't even remove a child in such an extreme case of abuse then what is their purpose? And yet I've overcome that, dragged myself up, supported myself since I was 16. Built a career and a good life. Then we are struck by tragedy and trauma and disability. And I make the call for help a second time, this time as an articulate adult, with a ton of professional evidence to back me up. And am met with the same response: "no, go away."

My children - unlike me as a child and unlike many children now I am sure - have me on their side to fight for them, and are still going to have their childhood destroyed by social services wilful inaction. God help the poor souls like me who don't have anybody on their side and are completely at social services' mercy. Like me, if those children survive to adulthood at all it will be by pure luck.