Communication often goes wrong with DP and I just can't work out why

[Clara9283]

I'm at my wits end...DP is loving, very patient, doesn't have a bad temper etc and we recently got engaged (he proposed). We're also TTC. Everything is going well, we both agree that life is good right now. No stress at work either. But whenever we have a conversation that involves some sort of planning, he just gets very defensive and it ends in a fight. Latest example - wedding plans. I've asked him what his ideas are, like where we should get married, when, etc...I imagined this being a happy and positive conversation. But all he could see were issues. 'This won't work because of abc, that won't work because of xyz'. I'm really not difficult about the wedding, I'm open for any ideas, from a big wedding somewhere to eloping just the two of us, so I don't see why this conversation would cause him stress. In the end he told me that I should just make a plan.

So today, one week later, we had a lovely Sunday, walk in the park, and I mentioned a wedding venue to him...I said that this one is currently on my list of possibilities, and asked him what he thought of it. But he got defensive again, asked me why I ask him because I know that he would be happy to go along with whatever I plan.....(to add, he just looked very uncomfortable from the moment I brought up the topic wedding).

I just don't understand what the problem is. It's in my mind a low stake, happy conversation. We're not even in a rush to book a venue yet, it's just talking about ideas.
I asked him, of course, and he just keeps insisting that he is fine and not upset, and then he asks me why I am upset.

Considering that he proposed very recently, I don't think that he doesn't want to get married. I asked him if he wants to get married but doesn't want a wedding and suggested to do registry office only, but again he asked me why I think that he has a problem with a wedding.

It's not the first time this happened. Although we are TTC (again he was the driving force at the beginning, he always wanted children. I'm on board as well, of course) he doesn't want to talk about how we'd organise ourselves with childcare etc. He wouldn't object if I just told him what to do, but he gets defensive when I try to make plans as a team. Very similar to the wedding situation - I know that he'd happily go along with whatever venue and setting I choose, but he seems to be unable to have a conversation with me about it.

Can anyone help me shed some light on this behaviour? Is he genuinely struggling with talking about plans?

I'm like this as well, as is my DP.

We do a lot of communication on important things by email rather than expecting each other to have an opinion during a conversation.

Have you tried that OP?

It does sound like he could just be a twat who thinks wedding planning and childcare should only be done by people with a vagina though.

He is negative and uninterested, sorry.

I don’t think it’s helpful to say “men find wedding planning stressful”. OP is not asking her P to decide between 17 different shades of lilac for the bridesmaid’s knickers, she’s asking B-road questions like “how many people do you want us to invite?”.

OP, what is he like with other planning, holidays, money, etc. Because it does sound like he wants to be a passenger in a life that you are driving.

Please stop TTC until you sort it out. The last thing you want is to be unmarried and pregnant with a man who hasn’t committed to fully supporting you and that child through finances/childcare etc. It leaves you in a very vulnerable position.

B-road?? Broad

Dont marry this guy or have a child with him.

He is lazy and unrealistic. Wants to get married but doesn't want the slightest input into into wedding. Wants a baby but won't discuss child care. Wtf?

Only proceed if you're happy to carry the entire mental load and happy to have your every decision criticised into the bargain.

This is the potential dynamic between you for the rest of your lives.
You: There's some kind of issue between us (communication about planning/uneven split of family chores/whatever)
Him: No there isn't
You: On the internet trying to figure him out...

Basically, don't set up home with someone who denies there are issues because you have zero chance of resolving them! I can guarantee he isn't on a forum trying to understand things from your perspective. You'll tie yourself up in knots doing this for the next forty years.

Go to relationship counselling together now and address this dynamic before getting married.

@Clara9283 Regardless of any undiagnosed conditions - he needs to be able to articulate better at why he avoids decision making and planning conversations. What do they make him feel etc. How can you have them? Can he even help decide numbers and who he’d like invited. Or the budget?

what he’s like with holidays, house purchases etc?

Im wondering if this is a pattern of abandoning the mental load in a relationship and expecting you to just do it all and tell home what he needs to sign off on?

When you say defensive does that present as a bit irritated to be asked / not really understanding why you’re pushing the conversation / batting all of the decisions and work back to you?

If so I think that you might want to consider whether that is defensiveness or an underlying belief that wedding planning, childcare organising etc are your job and not his. I wonder if he’s telling the truth about not being cross - he just can’t really understand why you keep bringing it up with him.

In your position I would be asking some direct questions like “if we ever split up how would you see splitting child time working?”, “who do you think should take time off work if the child was poorly”, “do you think that your job will flex enough to allow you to do school drop offs and pickups”, “would you consider both dropping a day at work to be with the baby more” etc And ask how he sees your role with the baby too.

How many times do we read threads by women absolutely sick of bearing the mental load in their relationship whilst their DP does nothing?

This is your situation. He thinks it’s a woman’s job to sort it out. Sorting a wedding - your job. Caring for a baby/childcare - your job. He can’t be bothered with it. They dress it up as doing you a favour “I’ll be just happy to do whatever you want/what makes you happy” but fundamentally it’s laziness and a refusal to take responsibility.

As others have said, stop mentioning the wedding and certainly stop TTC. I doubt he’ll even mention them. If he does, that’s when you said that you’re supposed to be a partnership and all decisions are 50/50 and you are not going to be shouldering the responsibility for it all.

This is what my DH is like. I've never fully got to the bottom of it but it means I do all the planning, organising and decision making for the family. We now have two kids and he's never done a single thing towards organising nursery, schools, holidays, weekend day trips, kids clothes, household chores, birthdays, Christmas etc etc etc. We argue about it all the time as he twists round what should be low stakes enjoyable chatting about things like where we could go on our next holiday or what show to see at Christmas in exactly the way you describe. I'd get out now it's an exhausting way to live and the joy is taken out of all special occasions.

He’s not the one; you should have a team player not a passenger in your life. You don’t want to be the one making all the decisions; all the emotional labour and all the childcare.

We eloped, partly because I can't imagine anything worse than planning a wedding. I'd see the whole thing as a big, unnecessary chore. Maybe your DH is like me?
But that's just a party after all.
A major red flag for me would be your DH not being willing to discuss childcare arrangements. HOW many threads have there been on here from women who find themselves burdened up to the eyeballs and financially vulnerable because they didn't agree how childcare arrangements and family finances would work before getting pregnant. Don't do it OP!

My DH is the same. I do all the planning, holidays, schooling, childcare, food decisions. He will happily go along with anything if I present it as a done deal. If I ask his opinion he usually is non committal until I do it anyway.
Things won't change. If you are happy to make all the decisions fine...if not, think again.

What this screams to me is "I don't really want to marry you"

Did you, perchance, agree to TTC on the strength of the engagement?

If you have not yet done so, read up on the differences between marriage and cohabitation, and decide if you are OK with either scenario. I strongly recommend that you do not sleepwalk into financial dependency - it needs to be an active decision, and if you do not want that then take steps now to avoid it.

In your shoes, I'd suspend TTC until this is sorted out properly. If he really wants to marry you, then he wouldn't be actively sabotaging all your suggestions.

Also think about how well you'd put up, long term, with someone whose communication style includes this

My partner is like this or was until I realised he liked me to plan everything so he could moan and bitch when things go wrong. I hit early menopause and lost my people pleasing. I started calling him out for being a lazy bastard and the detrimental effect it had on my health.
In the past year he has planned two holidays for the first time in nearly twenty years. He got stressed when things went wrong on one of them but I don’t give a fuck anymore. Don’t be me, twenty years of doing everything and being accountable for everything is exhausting and I’m physically and mentally spent.

Thanks all. He's not lazy usually, he pulls his weight at home and if I ask him to do anything, he would do it. It's literally the planning and mentioning of different options that seems to make him struggle, no matter how carefully I approach it or how low stake the topic is. I looked into asd/adhd as some suggested because this behaviour just doesn't fit with the bigger picture of our relationship.

"if I ask him to do anything, he would do it."

But this is the point OP. What does he do WITHOUT being asked?

“If I ask…” 🚩🚩🚩🚩🚩that shit gets old very quickly when you have kids.

Never has the quote “you need a partner, not a project” been so apt.

Presumably he can make decisions at work??

My husband was/is like this. Planning anything seems to pain him. He says he likes to "be spontaneous" but the trouble is leaving things to the last moment cuts down on many options. I tend to decide and organise everything - wedding, house moves, holidays, childcare, social stuff, renovations, large household purchases. It works OK because he does more day to day stuff to compensate me for the mental load. I do resent it from time to time - sometimes I'd love to be swept off my feet with a lovely holiday all researched and booked - but on the other hand I do get to choose everything (he has the power of veto for any big decisions but really prefers me to make them). In the past he has done the thing other posters have said - moaning about the decision and blaming me if something goes wrong. But I've been quite firm about it - if you don't participate in planning you don't get to complain!

ha ! Wait till you have a small screaming baby and he says ‘just tell me what to do and I’ll do it …….’ !!!!

’what’s for tea?’ X 1 billion

‘oh is it an inset day today? Well bye darling’

Unless you have a very good coping strategy do not have kids with this man.

I think I need to face the fact that he won't change. On the plus side, I would get to organise everything the way I want and he also doesn't moan about any decisions I made or things I organised. But it is frustrating for me at times because I'd much prefer to talk through things as a team, discuss the options and then decide. Even if he doesn't has an issue with me calling all the shots, I don't want to feel like a dictator in our relationship.

How is he at organising though op. You say he does stuff that you ask him to do around the house that's easy but how is he at actually planning and organising things independently?

I’d put all the plans on hold until you know more about this. Most particularly, I’d stop TTC. They’re something deep going on here, and he may not be marriage or father material.

You will get sick to death of being the one to organise and do everything op. You will end up loosing respect for him overtime and see him as just a man child who needs prompting to do the simplest of things. Don't marry him.

What is he like about planning other things? Holidays, house renovation, what car to buy?

Is it just weddings and children he has an issue with? You