Would you accept this in a relationship?

[Wouldyouaccept]

If you know your partner had suffered severe childhood abuse and trauma - would you accept aspects of their personality that were shaped due to this and are negative traits ?

Therapy is ongoing and there’s full awareness of everything and an huge effort is being made but it’s not ideal. Is this a case where the person who has been abused should not be in a relationship until they are ‘better’ (what if that never full happens ?)

The issues are :
Attachment issues / fear of abandonment (leading to jealousy)
control issues

Behaviour is a choice.

His frustration of not wanting to behave a certain way?

Behaviour is a choice. Feelings are not but behaviour is.

The frustration he experiences is at feeling the way he does. Which is perfectly understandable. I feel frustrated by my feelings at times - the hostility, anger, jealousy, fear, inadequacy, insecurity it raises. Its not my fault I feel like that. It's not a choice. And it's not bloody fair!

But it is absolutely my choice how I respond to that and how I behave.

I could choose to lash out verbally, to accuse, to place restrictions, set 'tests', to control. Firstly, because its quite cathartic to let it out and, secondly, it might stop the other person doing whatever it was that triggered me - they might feel compassion, fear, concern and want to minimise my distress and I would feel safe again.

But would that he fair on them? No, of course not.

So I put on my mask. I smile. I respond in ways I know I'm supposed to. In ways I'd want someone to respond to me and i deal with it myself.

He could choose to do similar. But he doesn't.

He can control his emotional abuse so it only affects you and not the children?
Do you see what you just wrote?

Are the children really fine op? They always see more than you think.

No way! The issue isn’t having the abandonment issues, it’s choosing to have them impact a partner negatively. I was abused as a child and am viscerally terrified of abandonment - but I do not take it out on my DH…I’ve channelled it in to processes that are not controlling. I walk a lot on my own, I know my DH accepts I can cry all of a sudden at any time and that I’m not looking for action from him if I do, I give him a massage (if he wants) when I need to feel us touching. I can feel very low and jealous if I’m feeling very unloveable and unclean, but I wouldn’t dream of controlling anyone because of what’s happened to me…it’s a deep dislike of mine when victims of abuse choose to become abusers themselves in any form. We know pain and anguish, fear and loathing, why on earth would we ever want to impact anyone let alone our loved ones like that!! Believe me, it IS a choice. You do not want your children believing this behaviour is acceptable.

I have a lot of thinking to do

Yes. You may not be recognising the damage to your children. Sorry, OP. They are very likely seeing and learning bad stuff.

More emotional harm will be caused by staying. Don’t put up with this

It might be worth considering why you're so invested in saving this man from himself , and are willing to sacrifice living a full life in order to do this.

@Wouldyouaccept I think relationship counselling could well be suitable for you as long as there is no domestic abuse and you need to be clear at the start the issues as you would benefit from an experienced counsellor. Many won’t work with abusive couples together, so you may find the counsellor wants some individual sessions to check things out. But I do think that if he is undergoing his own therapy then some couple work could help support and implement changes and help you safely explore the issues and how they impact you and the relationship too.

In lots of ways I understand some of what you’re going through. My exH was adopted and has massive attachment issues as a result. Yes we split, and I can see why so many people are suggesting you leave. But this too has a massive impact on kids- and it’s not as easy to just say “better to be brought up in a single household than an abusive one” as I know that despite being brought up in a loving household and seeing a loving and healthy relationship (I got remarried- to a wonderful kind and caring man who loves the bones of “our” children) my now adult children ARE and WERE impacted by our split (they were young primary age at the time). They have their own relationship issues and unresolved stuff as a result, no matter how much I tried to protect them. So splitting up isn’t an easy option and I really feel for you. I think if you tried counselling as a couple it could help you gain some clarity and perhaps also reassure you that if it doesn’t work out, you’ve tried everything?

OP, you should be in counselling for you. Not couples counselling. You are dealing with a LOT. Go for you.

Absolutely no violence at all, ever. The least violent person you could ever meet . It’s just the other issues I think it’s just started irritating me and I feel so guilty

I think that’s true I probably do need to have someone to talk to I just needn’t really felt the need before but I think it may help

I missed some posts when I was typing but others are giving the other side to what I said.

If he can control it around others, then it is abuse.

He is choosing not to control it around you.

There is also something else to consider.

The dynamic of yours ad his relationship is exactly that. The dynamic of yours and his relationship.

Not the dynamic of his relationship with anyone else, but with you.

It may well be that he has enough of a handle on his feelings through therapy to be able to create different dynamics with other people but the dynamic with you was established a long time ago. It's a pattern of behaviour, it's a habit, it's essentially the story of the relationship between you both.

Does that make sense?

It's very hard to change a long established dynamic of a relationship.

Think of a friendship. You have a friend with whom you always discuss politics and serious issues. You enjoy the friendship. You enjoy the debates. You enjoy the intellectual challenges. That is the dynamic of your friendship. How easy do you think it would be to change this dynamic to a light hearted funfilled one where you talk bollocks and ESewawwwlaugh at nothing?

You both have other friends with whom you have fun and belly laugh but, with this friend, you automatically fall into the dynamic of serious conversations.

It's very hard to change the dynamics of a long standing relationship because you each have an understood and accepted role into which you fall. It feels out of place, uncomfortable and just a bit strange to try and change it.

So, even if he were able to relax differently to other people, the dynamic between you and him will remain the same. You will fall into your role and he will fall into his.

The other thing to be aware of is that, within safeguarding, children are now regarded as being directly (rather than indirectly) impacted by abuse in the home whether emotional or physical because it is now recognised that they are aware of it and experience it no matter how well parents think they are protecting them from it. Amd the long term impact of that.

In short, there is a risk that your children will repeat the behaviours learnt from their parents - generational abuse.

You want to be kind to him but your priority is your children.

I haven't had contact with my abuser for 11 years in order to break the cycle for my own children.

It sounds like he is making a choice sorry

Fwiw my ex was like this (still is) the children have been affected by it and he still to this day tries to control me and them however they now refuse to engage with him so I guess its all on his new fiance

This might sound harsh but I have little sympathy for a grown adult with children still visiting their childhood trauma on their partner.

As another poster said, it is a choice.

I have a sibling who used to physically and emotionally abuse her children because "that's how we were brought up".

Well the rest of us were brought up the same, but chose not to repeat that with our own children. Watching her was horrifying.

She eventually got therapy which did help.

I'm sorry but once you're an adult only you are responsible for how you behave.

My ex had years of therapy and never healed, I couldn't tolerate all the excuses and abuse anymore and left.
If your partner is self aware enough to keep it from the children then it shows he can control himself but chooses not to.

You mentioned that he's letting it all out in his safe space, and from what you said it sounds like you are his safe space. But is that what you want? Is that the role you want to play in this relationship? It sounds like you don't want that any more. So you need to communicate with him, possibly through couples therapy, that you can't be that for him, and that he needs to find other ways to manage his feelings. And he needs to do the work to make that happen.

You clearly have a lot of guilt around getting into this with him, telling him you were prepared to take on his issues. You need to work through that with a therapist I think. try to get to the bottom of why you feel you needed to save him, keep saving him, putting yourself and your happiness second all the while.

Even so, I doubt you signed up to be his emotional punching bag forever more. He doesn't need to be magically fixed. He needs to find a way to manage his issues which doesn't make you the focus. He and you both need to respect you more, and rebalance your relationship in a way which reflects that respect for you.

Fundamentally, just because you went into the relationship knowing he has issues, doesn't give him free licence to take those issues out on you.

I did, and I regret it.
I would not again.

My ex was never loved by his mother. She had him as a teenager and always resented him. He never knew his father and his mother repeatedly told him age hated him, regretted having him etc. She was a drug addict and his home was full of, often dangerous, criminals. He grew up extremely traumatised and damaged by his childhood. This affected his behaviour in so many ways (all negative). He could be extremely cruel to me, he suffered debilitating depression and anxiety, he had zero self confidence despite being extraordinarily gifted. He was unable to hold down a job, maintain a friendship. He became an alcoholic. He lived (and still lives) a miserable and small life.
For many years I made excuses for him. Forgave him and supported him despite the fact he made my own life miserable. After years I realised that just because I loved him and felt give empathy for him didn't mean I actually had to BE with him. You can love someone from afar. You don't need to spend your entire life with them! I would have supported him better as a friend, been more objective. Staying with him was just damaging me. I deserved a life, a good life. Us splitting up was the best thing I've ever done and it was the day I started living my life.

If you believe that an ultimatum could motivate him to change - ask yourself why only the threat of ending the relationship would effect that change.

You are saying you believe change is possible, but that until it impacts HIS self-interest, he won't bother.

You're also kidding yourself about how much it affects your DC.
They are living in this dynamic, it's impossible to conceal, & you need to take serious note of @ComtesseDeSpair's insight:

If it’s really true that there’s self awareness of the behaviour and the behaviour can be 100% controlled so that the children are completely unaffected by and unaware of it, then that would make me even more determined to leave tbh. If this person can control their behaviour, reactions and moods, their behaviour towards their partner is simply abusive.

Oh OP.
Mairead's concise comment tells you everything you need to know.

Including the fact that you, yourself, acknowledge that he emotionally abuses you.

He CHOOSES his behaviour.
He is abusing you.
When your children grow & start to challenge him, as kids do, he will likely choose to turn the abuse onto them too.

You need to stop making his much-vaunted childhood trauma the excuse for you to be his perpetual victim. If I described my childhood to you, you'd lose your lunch. CSA, physical torture, gaslighting & coercive control a-go-go.
Nobody I love owes me payback for it. There is NO excuse domestic abuse. None.

Domestic abuse is NOT only about violence.

OP, you wrote this yourself - that he is emotionally abusive to you.
No discourtesy is meant to @SNWannabe, who obviously put a lot of thought & kindness into her post to you. But couples counselling is NOT recommended when one pf the parties is abusive. This is the stance taken by the profession - not my opinion. Not only is it not helpful, it is actively damaging & potentially dangerous to the abused party. The abuser will monopolise the sessions to his own advantage, manipulate the counsellor if he can get away with it, use any vulnerability you expose to control & punish you with out of earshot of the counsellor, all while portraying himself as the victim who you need to do more to accommodate.

Please, please go to counselling - SOLO.
You need support, & a wise head to help you unpick the dynamic of your relationship, & why you feel such guilt that you are prepared to sacrifice yourself & your happiness to prop up your abuser.

You remind me of me.
I think the fact you have started this thread means you know things are not ok.

You sound like you may need a higher authority to give you permission to leave this person who you feel such responsibility for.
Please read into co-dependence.

Go and get counselling on your own.
I think you know you should leave, go and find out how to do that in the healthiest way FOR YOU and the children.

Why were you so keen to start a relationship being fully aware of all the red flags?