Bio father vs step father - AIBU?

[Wormworld7]

My daughter (16) has far from an ideal relationship with her biological father. He has always been on the extreme end of difficult to deal with adult to adult, always full of excuses, has constantly let her down, very rarely had an kind of consistent routine with her lasting nore than a few months. He has constantly had a multitude of personal problems, suffers with a lot of unresolved traumas, he has 2 other children with a his new ex partner, who he managed to have a slightly more consistent routine with, as he lived with them for many years, myself and him split when daughter was 18 months.

Over the years we have had many altercations, but for the past few years we seem to have reached a more amicable state. I think mostly due to age and my coming to accept the way things are and that is the best we will get - but also, following him losing his best friend to suicide and breaking up with his partner, I found some empathy for his struggles and tried my best to support him through tougher times, for the same of trying to keep the very threadbare relationship he and my daughter have in tact as much as possible.

The issue is, not my current partner, who i got back together with last year, after we split for a few years, has a huge problem with any contact i have with daughter dad. He thinks since she is now 16, we should not need to communicate at all and it should be between her and her dad. But if that were the case she would never hear from him. As for some reason he comes to me with all his excuses and I try my best to mediate between them, knowing she feels let down by him but doing my best to soften the blow and see him as a self destructive human. My partner is amazing with my daughter treats and loves her as his own, has been such a role model and a true father figure in her life. But it really upsets me that he says things like, he would erase the bio father out of our lives in a flash, he doesn't think I should refer to vio father as family and he wants bio father to have absolutely nothing to do with our life. I'm really hurt by this coldness. Bio father is a rubbish dad, and that may probably never change, but his presence jn my life (very little) really has no impact on me or us as a family.

Sorry, not sure if I've quite articulated myself thoroughly here, as it's quite a complex situation. In an ideal world, I'd love daughter and bio dad to have their own relationship and for me to need no involvement, but it simply isn't the case, but j don't understand why my.partner feels so threatened by my very little communication with bio father. Am j being unreasonable to ask my partner to just deal with it and accept it for what it is, as I have to?! Or is he right for wanting nothing to do with bio father?

I've never forced anythung, I've allowed him.to contact when he wants and occasional when she was younger I went no contact because it seemed less damaging than his lack of consistency. She is.older now and.able to.see for herself. When he had a family home she could stay at, she had a pretty good relationship with her siblings and step mum and so that was a very large factor in her still choosing to bother.

My partner is amazing with my daughter treats and loves her as his own, has been such a role model and a true father figure in her life.

IF he really loved her then he would recognise the reasons a child wants or needs some degree of identifying with her biological father. However imperfect that biodad is, he IS her genes, her origin.

If he really loved her he'd recognise that a 16 yr old is a young woman with opinions and choices of her own, which he should respect even if he can't agree.

He is not as bloody amazing as you imagine.

He's an imperfect parent figure .....JUST LIKE HER BIO DAD. ( and all other parents.).

Have not read past this post yet, but just for clarity...

You were with your current boyfriend for a couple of years, then you broke up for a while, then you got back together.

What was the nature of your relationship with BioDad during your time apart from your current boyfriend?

Exactly this!! I have been telling him this exactly. Loving a child unconditionally, means putting aside a lot of ego and pride out love for them. Exactly this.

Relationship with bio dad over past 6 years has taken several different forms and stages, as nothing has ever been consistent. There was maybe an entire year of anger and hostility, him.still being relatively unstable and dd going to visit only on occasion - during which time.he stopped paying maintenance too, which caused a lot of frustration. There was maybe 2 years of me going directly via his partner, (something I'd wished for many years nearer but she wasn't quite ready for) where dd finally got rather a consistent family life with them and was much more included giving her a chance to create rather a good bond with his two other children and his step daughter. And then we moved into a troubled territory again after that somehow fell apart, he lost his friend to suicide, his relationship broke down and we moved into a new era of communication shortly after that one filled with a bit more empathy on my part and patience.

I can see your partners point OP.

Your ex is never going to be the Dad your daughter needs so why prolong the torture.

You can't fix him so he's a decent Dad....its like flogging a dead horse.

Why is he continuing to come to you with his problems ?

your daughter is 16 now, so let her make the choice regards her so called Dad.

I can understand you trying to make him a better Dad but surely you can see it's never going to happen.

Let your daughter make her own boundaries with the bio Dad,unless you want her to end up with a similar man like her bio Dad ?

Are you one of lifes 'fixers' ?

I have not been trying to "fix" or enable his behaviour . It has been a complex journey and one that can't properly be articulated in one thread. He has had times and stages of being more consistent than others, and that has often been facilitated and made easier by my own responses and way of dealing with him and my expectations. My partner is largely referring continually to a time before we got together, where I was giving bio dad some support through some.serious issues. He is the type of person who will dump.a life story on you to excuse himself and I can be the type of person who finds it difficult to hang up in fear of being rude, insensitive or creating conflict. It's really difficult when somebody calls or texts to say they arent in a place to comtact dd as they are feeling suicidal etc, its hard not to respknd with empathy I just don't really know what the rules are in such complex scenario's.

Lol. No but I think it's good to try to understand where people are coming from.

I do, and am trying! I'd also like for him to understand where I'm coming from too, it's not the easiest task in the world to have had to navigate such a difficult man as a father for the best outcome for dd. I feel I've only ever tried my best for her and I've nothing else to gain from it.

you’re not doing your daughter any favours despite your good intentions. Their relationship is certainly going to fail,

Probably, but as she goes through life DD will encounter many relationships that fail. It's a fact of life. Being confident to survive them intact is what counts.

It's important for her to understand that although he failed to be a good father, and is a flawed human being, there were some redeeming features. So she need not be ashamed of who she is. She has known her father and can remember him. Perhaps if she ever chooses her own partner/ father for her children, she has a useful benchmark. And when she sees her father's dimple or chin or hands on her own child, or grandchild, she'll recognise that reminder of her own lineage.

@Wormworld7
I get it I really do.
You don't want him to kill himself,you want him to be a great Dad to your daughter.

You're a kind supportive person,I get that and it's so hard when people take advantage of that but certain people will and do.

Why aren't his friends or family supporting him ?
Why does he phone you with his suicide threats ?
Why ?

There are an awful lot of similarities in the situation here, and what I went through with my wife, my step daughter, and her biological father. A lot of similarities all the way down to the claims of suicide attempts and being in jail.

While yes, their relationship was not my business, my relationship with my wife was absolutely was my business. The emotional turmoil my wife went through was my responsibility to manage as her partner. The emotional turmoil she largely brought on herself by continually taking on the responsibility to manage her exes life, and his decisions while rationalizing it being for her daughter.

Two examples that still over a decade later really stand out to me.
One was where they were texting and he was telling her how he didn't have any money and couldn't even buy food, so she started regularly going to food banks, or the grocery store, and then over to his house to bring him food.
Nice and empathetic and all, but how in the world was that even remotely her responsibility? Shared 16 year old daughter or otherwise?

The other example was how he got arrested yet again with drug related charges, and she was the one he went to to arrange bail, and the one who provided the shoulder for his woe is me, and everybody out to get him, and all that crap.

Those are just two examples in a pattern of her involvement with her ex. She was certainly free to make her own choices as to how involved she remained with her ex, but to me, despite her denials, she was still heavily emotionally invested in her ex beyond just a coparenting relationship. That is practically the definition of being emotionally unavailable. She wasn't his wife any more, and she really needed to stop acting like it.

Again, while it was not my business what she did, her choices to entertain her ex in the way she did became my business when I was the one who had to pick up her emotional pieces.

He is diagnosed as "ADHD" and so plays into that. He is constantly on the phone to people. He has a lot of pub friends who aren't the best choice of people to be around. His mum is ridiculous in that she facilitates his bad behaviour and always has done, she would excuse him based on his diagnoses and almost reward his bad behaviour time and time again.

The suicide thing started when I got a very out the blue text from him during a time that had been no contact for quite a while..so I was genuinely panicked and raised the alarm with his then partner and family. He doesn't so much come to me with his suicide issues, he will just contact in a "dog ate my homework" type of way. He will obviously suddenly remember he is a father and call and say "sorry I haven't been in touch I tried to commit suicide on Friday"....leaving a huge excuse and reason for being absent that I can't really debate or argue with - though i have tried to firmly and gently guide him to understand that his mental health issues are no excuse for not being a parent and forewarn her of how impactful his prioritising of his own struggles will be on dd in the long run.

And how did that work out over time?

Thank you for sharing that btw that's very helpful. I can see the similarities, however I'd argue my involvement is a lot less invested from a personal position. The most i have done is be an ear and really that has happened accidentally. Whilst doing so I will have eye rolled my way through a lot of bs, and I'd prefer to be able to share this with my partner, rather than him alienate himself. I also think on a deeper psychological level, your wife and I may share a deep sense of guilt for tying our poor dds to such a deadbeat dad for the rest of their lives and with that comes the over working to try and control as best we can any part of it to ease that for dd.

We have been together 12 years now, married for ten.

I think you are spot on with there being a deep sense of guilt in who was chosen to be the father, as my wife has explicitly said just that.

I think another large part of it was the fact that their relationship was so tumultuous, such an emotional roller coaster, highs and lows, very abusive.
That was the habit, that was the pattern, and even after they divorced, there was nothing to disrupt that unhealthy dynamic, and since they had a daughter together, that kept the relationship going, and my wife just did not know any other way to have a relationship with him.

Much like you have described, there were periods of calm, and periods of turmoil with her ex, and much like you, my wife wanted to share it all with me, though from my point of view, it felt more like she kept making the same choices over and over, and wanted me to clean up the mess.
There were times where it almost seemed as if she was pain shopping on a subconscious level.

It just took time to move past all of that. As my step daughter got older and moved out, and later getting married and having kids, that eased some of it. I tried to make a conscious effort on my part to not let my frustrations boil over into arguments because I wanted to be a good partner, I wanted her to be able to share things with me, but at the same time, I did not want to become her facilitator or enabler.

I also made it clear what my boundaries were regarding her relationship with her ex by challenging my wife, asking her when the situations arose... Why do you feel as if this is your responsibility? Over time she began to challenge herself and build her own boundaries.

Yes, I can relate to having had a similar relationship pattern with my ex when we were together - only inwas 18 when I had my daughter, and soon grew up and wanted more stability and balance. I realised quickly though, that I wasn't going to get that put of him, and so whilst dd was very young it was such a roller coaster just to organise the bare minimum. Now she is older, I am not so invested in their relationship, she has discovered him for who he is and its his loss for missing out on such a wonderful daughter.

I can see and understand how her involvement meant a lot more work.and stress for you as a partner -but I can't stress enough how little I actually take this stuff on personally..I answer a call I listen to the bs and i move on with my day. Sometimes I'll discuss the issues with dd and check in with her and sometimes I won't. And I have made a conscious effort not to engage barely at all, since I've been with my partner, as I.now understand I need to consider his feelings too in all this.

You can't ' guide' someone like this it'll never work.

ADHD is really not an excuse for his threats of suicide.... he's clever and is playing you.

You really need to think about your own future and not let him sabotage it.

He really is not smart enough to play anyone. He is litterally a mess. I'm not at all using his adhd as an excuse for any of his behaviour, just an example of his "woe is me" attitude to life. His life really could not possible sabotage mine, It has 0 impact on me or even my day. The most this impacts my life is when my current partner makes it an issue because I've received a text from him and instead if being able to have an adult conversation about what a waster this guy is and how best to respond, it becomes this big power struggle with my partner over the fact bio dad is texting me at all. I very much don't trynto change him i accept him.just the way he is and let it be for what it is. My life is no different for it.

instead if being able to have an adult conversation about what a waster this guy is and how best to respond, it becomes this big power struggle with my partner over the fact bio dad is texting me at all.

But why are you discussing it with your partner. What really shouldn't be your problem now becomes your partners problem. Why do you think you ex should sit and give you an adult discussion on going about engaging with someone he doesn't want you to engage with?

He has told you his advice which is to disengage. It must be infuriating to have you then ask him how you should engage.

You must have been in the situation before when someone repeatedly asks you for advice but won't do the one thing you think will help. It is very annoying! Again, try to put yourself in your partner's shoes.

All I can say is I wish you luck for your future OP.

I haven't asked him for advice! I mean id like to generally converse about it if it's relevant. I don't ask him.for advice or to be involved - I think this post is overplaying how involved I am! Months go by, my daughter sees his social media stories and posts and starts adding stuff up, I'll say nothing to him and me and her may share a discussion on how rubbish he is and where his priorities are...then one day ill get a text saying something wild or out there has happened and thats why he hasnt been in touch. Depending on my daughters stance at that time, I may or may not feel it necessary to reply. It doesn't impact my life, its upsetting that he does this to her but she and I discuss it like adults and move on. I can't erase the fact he is the dad of my daughter. Its still rather upsetting for her though, to feel unworthy, but i really just focus on her.

This part right here...

The most this impacts my life is when my current partner makes it an issue because I've received a text from him and instead if being able to have an adult conversation about what a waster this guy is and how best to respond, it becomes this big power struggle with my partner

that's a pretty big disconnect with what you were saying earlier...

but I can't stress enough how little I actually take this stuff on personally..I answer a call I listen to the bs and i move on with my day.

Why is there even any need for a discussion at all with anyone about what a waster that guy is? Especially if that's all that really comes from the discussion...yet another rant fest about what a loser deadbeat the ex is.

Early on in your relationship with your current partner, like say the first few months, was your current partner a bit more understanding and receptive to listening to things about the ex?

The situation really has changed so many times and the dynamic can be different year to year. Last year, before partner was around again, I was giving a little more time to bio dad because he was genuinely going through a major tough life change and I had no partner to consider. I still didn't take anything on personally, I'd just listen and move on with my.day. since my partner has been back around my involvement has naturally waned, bio dads situation has had times to stabilise (it hasn't) and we've moved to a different place again. I was with current partner when dd was 9- 11 and back then there was definitely more chaos regards to pick ups and drop offs, which definitely impacted my life more. But that is no longer the case. He hasn't seen her since last summer. I don't even recall the last time. I've just had a lot of excuses and pretty much ignored them..my current partners fear is that I could take this on again full time, like I did.when she was younger. But he gives no room.for us to grow and evolve through different times with his assumptions. Things change, times and situations change, I haven't and won't always be so forgiving and empathetic with bio dad just because I was last year under specific circumstances.

What you describe here is a repeating cycle, a pattern. What actions have you taken to break the cycle? To allay your partners fears that the cycle won't continue in the same way that it has?

For myself, my wife, and my step daughter, I knew the cycle was broken when my step daughter was about 18, and one evening over dinner, step daughter said her dad had texted her claiming to have been in the hospital a few days earlier because he had tried to commit suicide. My step daughter responded telling him that if he ever felt suicidal again, that he should call the suicide prevention hotline. And that was it. My wife responded by telling my step daughter that she did the right thing, and there are just some things we can't fix. And that it. That was the end of the discussion.

I have messaged bio dad to tell him i will no longer be a go between for him and daughter and his relationship with her is now on him. I didn't feel it necessary to have such a marked event of it because I was stepping back anyway and not responding to his excuses anymore. I gave him.a chance last year, we are all entitled to a naturally low point during tough times and I gave him the benefit of the doubt. But as I've said partner wasn't around then and I had nobody else to consider.