Forgiving an abuser!?

[Forgiving83]

I’ve done a lot of reading about abuse after leaving my 10 year abusive marriage a few years ago. I sometimes now feel the same emotions like anger and frustration a lot like my husband did towards me.

He was abused by his father and when he was triggered he reacted. I now am dealing with the same issues only he has given these to me. I now deal with traumatic memories and my nervous system is really on edge a lot. His father did it to him and he did it to me. I want people to forgive me when I am triggered (I’m not on the same level as him, I tend to withdraw instead of hit out).

Should you forgive him? He has caused me a great deal of stress and my health has suffered because of that relationship. He was only acting out his traumatic childhood on me. It is up to him to fix his problems though like I am trying to do. It is hard to not react when you have been abused. I still struggle with noise, I can’t take too much noise as it puts me on edge.

He has not fixed himself though and has moved on to another lady. We share a child and he does have this victim issue, he has to be the one who was wronged. He tells our child lies in order to look like the victim. The relationship was toxic. If he felt wronged I was in trouble.

I can empathise with him but I still have feelings like I hate him. I also struggle with the fact I let him treat me so poorly.

A lot of your feelings seem to be still tied in with how he feels, and his reasons for acting the way he did/does.

If you can separate your feelings from his, forgiving him or no forgiving him won't be an issue. Not caring will be the key.

It would be better if you were able to be NC with him, you really need to separate in order to heal. Forgiveness may come when you have healed yourself, the anger you feel is hurting you now, not him.
It's not for everyone but I healed from childhood abuse when I did EMDR. Any similar therapy which allows you to let go and let traumatic experiences become the past should help. Somatic bodywork of various kinds (Feldenkrais or this page is worth a look, it's a UK approach, there is so much about trauma that is US based - www.psychologytoday.com/gb/counselling/england?category=somatic.)
I think you need to find help, it's hard to deal with this stuff yourself, take as much care of yourself as you can and try to stop thinking about him and explaining what happened, it is in the past and you have a life to live which is hopefully going to be happier without him in it.

Sounds like he is just a covert narcissist. Even if he hadn't had a tough childhood, he'd probably tell everyone he did.

Plenty of people have hard lives and don't abuse other people. So it's no excuse.

Instead of forgiving him, give yourself permission to finally stop making excuses for him. Then file him under: arseholes from my past. Focus on forgiving yourself for tolerating his bs for so long. Hell, we all make mistakes.

As for your own behaviour, you are nothing like him because you recognise your shortcomings and can self reflect on your choices and actions. You don't want to hurt people and you care when they hurt.

He's a grown man capable of making choices. He chooses to abuse people. Because he's a bastard. Not because of some bs past.

You're a grown woman. You choose to look to be compassionate to others even when you are struggling. Irregardless of your past.

You are nothing like him.
Going forwards, try to have compassion for YOU.

Unfortunately I still see him as he picks up and drops child at my house (court ordered).

Sometimes I just wonder how abusers are made. You say bad childhood or not he would still be a narc. But would he though. Surely his brain was damaged from him childhood like mine is. I’ve got rid of a lot of bad coping mechanisms I developed to survive him but I’m still quite an edgy person who gets overwhelmed pretty quick, I’m now crap under pressure. I also developed chronic fatigue syndrome.

If I triggered his trauma he was doing those things to survive also, they just happened to be unhealthy. I have a problem with whether he was being deliberate or not. When I get overwhelmed it’s not deliberate, I struggle to calm down. I have to remove myself to calm down. I would never hurt someone to make my pain go away and if I do I feel guilty. I guess that’s the difference. I triggered him and he hurt me to make his pain better but he didn’t feel guilty.

Perhaps I struggle to forgive myself. I’m annoyed that I have such little tolerance anymore, I’m easily frustrated. Mostly down to having C.F.S and he doesn’t have has moved on. I’ve been with someone for a couple of years and they are lovely. I’m just tired of being permanently damaged and changed by him and fatigued.

Is he good with your dc?

Where are you getting this idea that you 'trigger his trauma' from? If that were the case he would have noticed that long before you married him. And he wouldn't have stayed around. Men don't tend to hang about in relationships that make them uncomfortable.

It just sounds like you're making excuses for a bully. Who is perfectly capable of making excuses for himself without you joining him. And probably spun you all that 'triggering my trauma' bs in order to make his abuse, your fault.

I think the argument with npd is there is a genetic predisposition. However, life in early childhood can also contribute. Irregardless, a grown up going around abusing people ect...I don't think bad childhood remotely excuses it.

@Pinkbonbon not saying it excuses it but I guess if you grew up with a narcissist drunk father who you saw beat your mum it must do something to you. He took drugs and was pretty self destructive. When I met him he said he always wanted a family of his own. I came into the relationship with my own unresolved issues and after a while it pissed him off, spoilt his happy family idea. He was so fixed on looking successful he seemed to forget I was a real person, in the end it seemed like he hated me but he didn’t want me to leave, which was really odd. It was so emotionally exhausting being with him. He did everything he could to get me to dote on him but it always came with a price, it was awful.

He is in another relationship now and they recently had a baby. She seems really lovely in ways I was not, on the outside they seem perfect. I can only assume she is doing a better job then me at giving him the perfect looking family. It makes me think perhaps it was me who brought out the worst in him because I also had my own issues. He may have been right with what he said to me but was so desperate to try and keep the family as it was all he ever wanted.

Good people can bring out bad sides in each other. It's not a failure, it's just incompatibility. Even if you did trigger his trauma, it doesn't mean his lies were/are ok, or it's ok for him to be abusive.

Think about the difference between a reason for something happening, and responsibility for it happening. For example, you might have been raised in a house where everybody at 15 Mars bars a day. So if you eat 15 Mars bars a day, it makes sense. But it doesn't mean it's good for you, or that you're taking responsibility for yourself, or setting a good example to your kids.

There are no excuses for abusive behaviour. Even if his abusive father had been stood behind him, screaming at him 'Abuse her, right now!!', he still could have chosen not to. How much his past affects him is up to him, and if he felt you triggered him, it was his responsibility to leave.

Stop trying to take responsibility for his actions. He chose to do those things. You didn't make him. Why would you?

I have absolutely no doubt he will be abusing his new partner.

It won't al be anything to do with her. Or him.

Stop trying to take responsibility for this abusive adult's behaviour. It's ridiculous.

Or you not him.

He doesn’t appear to be abusing her at all, well from what it appears and from what daughter says. He has picked some one 12 years younger so can have a family like what he missed out with my. If he picked a similar age lady they would be too old to start as he is late 40’s. He appears to have what he was looking for in me. I can’t help but feel it was me that was the problem.

I got myself trapped as he was not from this country and his visa had expired. I thought we were something special so agreed to go to his country and marry him (I was young and stupid). I told him that I would not get the support of my family so I did it with no one knowing. I got trapped then and he always used it by saying he’d tell my family what I’d done when he was angry with me. Being with him was so awful, he was awful. He used to tell me how I was such a liar not telling my parents, I was the dirty one but I was only helping him. It was his problem he didn’t have a visa and he knew I couldn’t tell my family. I don’t understand how he was horrible to me and now he seems perfectly happy with someone else. She must be better somehow or more deserving.

They seem to be able to move on so quickly from what they have done. Whereas I’m stuck feeling guilty or feeling blame or wondering what was I thinking. If I’d done what he’d done I would be so ashamed and could never move on so quick with someone else and have a family ASAP. If I’d made someone so ill and so scared I don’t know how I’d live. Yet he has and now appears to be happy and have everything he’d wanted. It really sucks tbh, it’s a kick in the teeth. I wish I didn’t have to know anything about him but my daughter tells me lots.

Whether he's abusive to others is not of any importance to you. Your relationship with him didn't work because he treated you poorly. That was his choice, because he always had the option of stepping away rather than abuse you.

He is responsible for his actions. Do you understand that, op? Do you know how much effort an adult has to put in in order to cause another adult's behaviour to change? Most of us can't control 100% of our own behaviour (ever eaten the last biscuit because you couldn't resist?)

You are assuming a level of control over him that you don't have. Bluntly, if you were capable of changing his behaviour, you would have changed it for the better. You would not have chosen what he did.

Your daughter does not see everything. No way.

Come on. He hasn't changed. They never change.

And he is still working his abuse on you without even trying because you feel guilty.

Seriously. The abuse was not your fault. At all.

I think I could forgive someone who I knew was badly damaged but who was remorseful and tried to apologise or make amends (or leave me alone if that's what was healthiest for me) but I don't think I could forgive where there was no self awareness or remorse as you have described.

I don’t feel guilty for him I feel guilty for myself, for staying so long with someone who treated me so badly. I don’t understand how he has stopped dead all the things I used to beg him to with the new girlfriend. He smoked weed for our entire relationship despite saying he would stop, but with her he has stopped straight away. He doesn’t shout at her but why with me. I only wanted him to treat me better then I would have been a better wife. Instead I was an anxious mess. I don’t understand why he isn’t making her an anxious mess. Every time he drops daughter back to me my mind keeps on with these thoughts. I wish I could just not have him in my life. It makes me feel so rubbish about myself that she gets to be treated better.

@Watchkeys yes I absolutely understand how much effort has to be put in, I really tried and it got me nowhere but burnt out and feeling unworthy of the changed behaviour. Well he told me he would change when I did, which was an impossible viscous circle. He wanted me to be someone I was not and visa versa. You say he could have left but so could have I. Well I guess I did several times but he enticed me back, which makes no sense if he was so unhappy with me.

Honestly it sounds like you still believe all the bullshit lies he told you.
You are not responsible for another adult’s behaviour. You did not trigger his abuse. He will never show any remorse for it. Abusers always blame others. He didn’t abuse you because he was triggered. He could have left you instead of abuse you. Abuse is generally about control.
Stop comparing yourself to the new girlfriend. You don’t know what goes on behind closed doors. He could be using different tactics with her.
You need to focus on you here. Look into counselling with someone who specialises in past trauma. Also from reading your post it really sounds like your body is still stuck in stress response mode. So I would suggest in addition to therapy doing things that reduce levels of the stress hormones on the body. For me exercise was key to this but find what works for you to reduce those cortisol levels.
I really empathise with what you’re going through and honestly all is us that have been in an abusive relationship have been in the stage where we blamed ourselves for it. I don’t know if it’s possible to fully get over it, but you can get to a stage where overall your in a good place and it doesn’t have as much of a hold on you.

I'm not sure how to say this kindly, but occupying your mind with sorting out how to think and feel about him isn't the way forward towards you managing your life without him. He treated you in a way that made you obsess, and you're still under that spell. How you think of him isn't the issue here, it's whether you bother thinking of him at all that will make the difference. Nothing is happening now in terms of his effect on your life, except the churning of your own brain. Leave him to his bliss, leave her to hers, if that's what they have. You have your own bliss to create now, and a way to go with that job, before you've got time to consider what he's up to.

Your life is not based on him.

@Watchkeys nothing is happening apart from what he is telling our daughter which I think is churning up my mind. He is telling her about me and him, about how happy we were, showing her photos etc. They didn’t have contact for a while (court ordered) And he is telling her how he fought tooth and nail for her, mummy stopped me. It got me thinking and now my mind is busy again.

Should you forgive him?

Why do you need to forgive him or not forgive him?

Why would anyone?

He is what he is. He acted the way he acted when he was in a relationship with you. You're no longer together; why does it matter whether you forgive him or not.

I was treated poorly by a man I was in a relationship with; I don't forgive him and I don't not forgive him; he is what he is. His decisions and behaviour during the relationship were what they were. People are flawed, some more than others.

I'm not with him, so I don't care.

This sounds like parental alienation.

Who h I think you need to talk to someone in SS about.

It proves he is still an abuser ..... As if it needed proven. Abusers rarely change l.

If it was court ordered that he had no contact, until that was changed; there must have been v good reasons; so he's lying to your dd and rewriting history. And trying to make you out to be the bad guy who denied him access; that is a slur on your character and an untrue one; I simply would not have that sort of parental alienation and character assassination without reporting it to whoever managed the contact arrangements (including the no contact).

I feel guilty for myself, for staying so long with someone who treated me so badly.

I think almost everyone who was with an abuser feels that way.

It's incredibly common. There are lots of reasons people don't leave abusive relationships. It's very common to take a while to leave or not even leave at all.

There is absolutely zero point beating yourself up for not leaving immediately or quickly .... You're not any better or worse than everyone else who was in (or is still in an abusive relationship) in not leaving quickly, or at all.