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Relationships

Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

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Original poster

Is it cheating

97 replies

DoTheyNeed · 02/03/2023 09:42

DP and I have been together a while and have a DC. DP job involves him going to different locations but the same locations on a rota system. He receives a referral and then attends the location. He has a work phone a personal phone.
He has befriended someone at one of these locations. She is not a client of his but works in a similar field. I think he is at her location once or twice a month. Anyway, a while ago there was a bit of mentionitis but this has now stopped. I asked him if there was something going on but was reassured there was not. I stupidly went through his phone and they message almost every day, rarely at the weekend. Mainly silly things, day to day things about her children ect but also some flirty innuendos made by him. She is also muted on his phone. They also call each other a few times a week. Sometimes instigated by her, from looking at the messages. Some messages prior to the calls appear to be professional related some where she just wants a chat.
Am I reading to much into this? I’m not comfortable with it at all, if it’s work related surely it should all be on his work phone? Or am I just being over the top.

OP posts:

nc1013 · 06/03/2023 09:10

My exH made derogatory comments about the OW and said he didn't really want to talk to her but did it out of politeness. He called her fat and ugly and said she was immature. We're now divorced and they're married.

snap!

Ihaveoflate · 06/03/2023 10:07

Interestingly, my DH also made derogatory comments about his OW in conversation with me during their affair.

I think it's totally standard behaviour in these circumstances, unfortunately. Either it's to throw you off the scent, or it's darker than that, like enjoying the power of unwittingly leading the wife to engage in conversation about the affair partner.

Whatever it is though, it's part and parcel of the selfishness, entitlement, narcissism and cruelty of intimate betrayal. I am genuinely sorry you're having to deal with this.

Thewookiemustgo · 06/03/2023 12:00

I was going to talk about his anger but I see upthread that @MsDogLady has it spot on as usual. It’s just deflection. “Don’t look, don’t pry further, don’t get any nearer.” He’d be way more matter of fact or just hurt that you even thought this of him if it was nothing. Anger always comes from other emotions, his is pure panic that you’ve got absolutely the right end of the stick. So sorry OP, you must ignore this behaviour and concentrate on you now. State exactly what you will and won’t put up with and explain the consequences of him continuing a relationship with this woman. Then carry them out. He needs either a big kick up the arse wake up call and/ or, if that’s not enough, he needs to go.

newlove22 · 06/03/2023 13:54

This is exactly how my my EH's affair began and mirrors his behaviour to a tee. Started off with text messages and then phone calls too and from work, I paid the bill and for once looked up the sheer volume of contact. Hs solution? To take the contract under his name. He then began leaving for work earlier and arriving home later and was permanently glued to his phone. Then his behaviour towards me turned really shitty. We've been apart for over a year now. Have gone complete no contact. She's welcome to him. They deserve each other!

Original poster

DoTheyNeed · 07/03/2023 13:13

Again, thank you.
He has been sulking since we spoke about. I’ve tried to talk to him more but all he has said is more derogatory remarks about her and that my behaviour is over the top and I wouldn’t be upset if I hadn’t looked through his phone. He has denied any sort of affair.
He is at her office some time this week which is causing me some anx. I don’t see the point of asking to look at his phone as I’m sure everything has now been deleted.

I will try answer some questions.
We have never really had any sort of conflict where emotions or our relationship is involved. We’ve had general disagreements in the past but like I say nothing like this. DC is very young as is our relationship. In regards to being a Dad he is hands on when it suits him but I do most of the parenting due him working. He has never been very attentive towards me which suits my personality.

OP posts:

1Fedup2023 · 07/03/2023 13:24

Its how it all starts, :(

BibbityBobbityBollocks · 07/03/2023 14:04

I've read your updates but I can't see if you said that the woman's responses were flirtatious or whether it's just your DPs, so I don't want make you feel worse by saying he's having an affair, emotional or otherwise but an affair requires two people to be invested in it.

However his behaviour is upsetting you and that's not okay. Hopefully at worst he's been a bit of an idiot and you've let him know it's not okay and that's enough once the sulking has worn off, for him to give his head a wobble and refocus on you and the DC.

I wouldn't feel anxious if you don't think the behaviour he has shown isn't reciprocated by her, but I would still feel angry at his actions and lack of respect

Fingers crossed that she knows about you and DC and she's got some respect for that even if your DP doesn't.

Hereigoagain45 · 08/03/2023 09:37

I hope you are OK going through something similar myself at the moment.
Just the lack of clarity, honesty and openness but the lack of respect hurts the most right now.
I just want the truth and to not be lied to because what little trust I had has been eroded away and it's hard to rebuild that.
I am also very sad because we had so much planned, lovely things that we planned to do together and he's spoilt all that through stupidity.

Original poster

DoTheyNeed · 08/03/2023 11:37

He is still sulking and hasn’t really spoken to me.

I am hurt by his actions and the horrible comments he has made about her. I feel lied too and question if he were in a situation to cheat would he?
Her responses/messages are usually just chit chat type stuff. Is there flirting from her? Or am I reading too much into some of her messages?
I am confused and don’t know what to do for the best.

OP posts:

Watchkeys · 08/03/2023 11:41

I feel lied too and question if he were in a situation to cheat would he

You are defining 'lack of trust'. It doesn't matter why you don't trust him. You don't. Why would you over ride your feeling here?

It's very simple (although I know not easy).

It boils down to 2 questions:

Do you trust him?
Do you want a partner you can't trust? ...?

Crikeyalmighty · 08/03/2023 12:00

@DoTheyNeed Ignore whether she's flirting back. The point is that you think his messages are flirty- so why make derogatory comments about someone he clearly fancies- you don't usually flirt with people you don't have an attraction to - rare exceptions tend to be to gain or retain business - I have seen that before- could there be an element of that? It was the case though I would expect him to reassure and explain - whereas his behaviour seems to be more that you have 'caught him out' and he does indeed fancy this person

BibbityBobbityBollocks · 08/03/2023 14:36

Watchkeys · 08/03/2023 11:41

I feel lied too and question if he were in a situation to cheat would he

You are defining 'lack of trust'. It doesn't matter why you don't trust him. You don't. Why would you over ride your feeling here?

It's very simple (although I know not easy).

It boils down to 2 questions:

Do you trust him?
Do you want a partner you can't trust? ...?

I agree with this.
Ultimately his behaviours, including the sulking and failure to offer anything resembling reassurance or respect is awful. That with the lack of trust would have me questioning our future.

WidthofaLine · 08/03/2023 16:57

When women find out their husbands work is their playground for fun.

No it's not pleasant and it really is difficult to trust them in the future, what's stopping them doing it in the future when he won't even aknowledge he's doing this now.

When they dig their heels in and refuse to reasure you by responding with, how dare you accuse me or anger then you are dealing with someone who doesn't think you deserve the truth and is very selfish.

He is destroying your trust, that's on him.
They force you into a corner, stop talking about it or I will punish you, with sulking, aggression, withdrawl of affection or back down get back in your box and allow me my freedom.

It's not how a marriage should be and you are not wrong to question him.

Foolish man, he's playing a game of chance, I suppose how far he goes will be how good the prize is.

MsDogLady · 08/03/2023 17:22

@DoTheyNeed, I think his derogatory comments about this woman are a con meant to throw you off the scent. If he truly held her in low esteem, he wouldn’t be participating in the daily messaging, wouldn’t be calling her, and wouldn’t be flirting with her via innuendo. He wouldn’t have an agenda to use subterfuge/mute her messages.

When you rumbled him, he became enraged and has been sulking since. These are highly manipulative responses. He wants to punish you instead of providing reassurance and showing remorse for crossing a line.

These are not the actions of an innocent man. As for her, we don’t know if she was flirting, but she was reciprocating an over-investment of emotional energy, time and attention which is inappropriate for married people.

Crikeyalmighty · 08/03/2023 17:26

@MsDogLady absolutely- as I said on previous posts, men rarely flirt with women they don't have a thing for unless it's to 'gain business' (not unheard of) and would just explain in a non defensive way and certainly wouldn't be 'muting'

Torn153 · 08/03/2023 17:44

OP i’m sorry but this is how it starts. I have been the OW in this situation. Worked in the same place as a guy, our conversations were all work related then over time they changed. Asking about my DD speaking about his. Then they turned flirty, innuendos started. Messages and emails came in there hundreds daily. They were always muted and deleted. We were having an emotional affair.

He then asked to see me, was asking me to take half days from work, wanting to take me out for meals whilst our DP’s thought we were working. I quickly realised it was all wrong. Stopped all contact. Would only speak to him for work purposes. He was persistent, I ended up having to leave my job. We still work in the same field so there is fleeting contact. But I still receive messages and pictures from him on occasion on evenings.

the fact ur DH is even entering into this sort of “friendship” is a red flag. And his sulking is deflection. Don’t put up with it.

MsDogLady · 08/03/2023 19:12

Meant to say: …inappropriate for married/partnered people.

Fladdermus · 08/03/2023 19:18

He's punishing you by sulking so that when he decides to come out of it you don't dare ever question him again.

Cappuccino17 · 08/03/2023 19:39

It could be some light flirting but doesn't necessarily mean your husband is having an affair or is going to take it there. You can speak to him about it, maybe mention you aren't comfortable with it.

WidthofaLine · 08/03/2023 19:53

Fladdermus · 08/03/2023 19:18

He's punishing you by sulking so that when he decides to come out of it you don't dare ever question him again.

Yes sulking is a punishment but it can also be them engineering the situation to be apart so they gain more privacy.

Sulking is a very powerful tool for controlling someone and if that doesn't work many go onto be aggresive.

cosmicbabe · 08/03/2023 20:43

He's angry you've found out his secret and now that's ruined and not private to him anymore. It's your call if you want to let him treat you like he is doing.... I know I'd be off !

wellwelllwell · 08/03/2023 21:41

I don't think it is cheating. Maybe getting close to the line of your boundaries but if this is as far as it's got it's mild flirting and lots of people do that at work.

Original poster

DoTheyNeed · 09/03/2023 21:57

I did not plan on speaking about it today but with him at h work the anxiety got the better of me.
More of the same.
I asked him to explain their relationship to me and if there had ever been anything physical. He said they are work colleagues. He said that they have had lunch together in the past while at work and that she has previously made some “forward” comments/flirt towards him but wouldn’t go into detail. The only thing physical was a friendly hug.
I asked if he is still texting her, he said he hasn’t seen her or spoken to her. He had nothing to say about his own flirting/innuendo?
Again got annoyed at me about going through his phone and “can we just move on”
Still not feeling assured by his explanation and not sure I even believe him.

OP posts:

1Fedup2023 · 09/03/2023 22:09

Sounds like you have uncovered the sort of behaviour I uncovered in the early days. It got worse and I kept believing the lies 17 years later I’ve finally realized it was all lies from the start

Watchkeys · 10/03/2023 06:26

Anxiety didn't 'get the better of you', OP. Anxiety is where you're at. It's your genuine, actual feeling in your relationship, and you talked to him about your feelings. That's not something 'winning over' you, that's how relationships are supposed to be: you feel something, and you feel that you can talk about it, even if it's an uncomfortable topic.

Your feelings will come out, whether you want them to or not, and that's good. That's a definition of health. Why not decide that you will speak about your feelings from now on, rather than supressing them? Then, if a relationship fails, you'll know you did what you could to try to get your needs met, and you'll know what your partner feels about it too.

This guy... he's not interested in you feeling good, is he. He's giving you a half assed explanation that doesn't help you, and then shutting you down by getting annoyed at you. It's not you he cares about: it's the easy life.

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