Intimacy & Menopause - DH question

[Folkmusic]

Hi All, I would like some advice on the following. DW and I have been married for 23 years with late teen children. For the last three years we have not been intimate in anyway and this started at the commencement of DWs menopause. Obviously this has led to some issues and we are now at a stage where we don’t even kiss or cuddle - I am sure partly due to the fact that she doesn’t want to give any signals of leading me on. Essentially we have a relationship of co-parents. My wife is on HRT and has changed the prescription of this and also seen the doctor on this matter.

My wife does not like to discuss the menopause to any extent as I think she feels embarrassed, however she has said that she ‘doesn’t feel it anymore’ and ‘has nothing left to give’ due to tiredness. Have any women gone through something similar and did your libido return, or is this the end of our sex life?

Before anyone flames me, this is genuine question and not wholly self-cantered as I think sex is one part of a marriage. Also as I have seen this raised before we both pull our weight equally in relation to house and finance matters. Also I am sure that DW is not seeing anyone else and there is no history of infidelity in our marriage from either side. We treat one another well in all other aspects of our life.

Libido often does return after the menopause but the period leading up to the menopause (the peri menopause) can last years.

I'm menopausal and my libido has vanished. I'm taking testosterone but it doesn't seem to be working.

I am sure partly due to the fact that she doesn’t want to give any signals of leading me on.

I think this is key, you back yourself into a position and it's really hard to move it on. It's well worn advice, but if you can talk to her, tell her that you hear her and agree to both take sex off the table completely for a period of time, then you can relax and concentrate on creating a space for intimacy to return, without the fear of "leading you on" or you worrying about pressuring her or feeling rejected.

Re the HRT, a private check up can be worth it's weight in gold, to make sure the prescription is righ, if she's only seen the GP this far, testosterone can help massively with libido.

There is no after the menopause as someone suggested. Lack of oestrogen is forever. There is a huge lack of understanding of Menopause, even amongst women as you can see.

If your wife asked me I would tell her to go to the doctor and ask for HRT and testosterone. I would suggest she went private for HRT if testosterone was refused- it isn't actually licensed for women so some GP's won't prescribe it .

It sounds like she has vaginally atrophy- some women lose absolutely all sensation and sex can be painful.

She would be a lot happier with HRT I think but you can't force her. Perhaps suggest she join a group on Facebook like The Menopause Network where you can ask questions anonymously.

I think it's a tough time for men too so you have my sympathy.

The more recent research suggests that the situation might be more complex than the drop in oestrogen on its own. It might be more about the 'mix' of levels, e.g. the ratio of oestrogen to testosterone for example. That makes sense when you consider how the ratio of different hormones affect pregnancies and indeed are responsible even for which sex the baby becomes.
There is most definitely 'after the menopause'. It is most definitely a thing. Some women describe it as finding themselves again.

Thank you for your replies. I have this horrible feeling that our marriage is fading. It is not solely a sex question but just a lack of intimacy generally.

@GoldDuster - I am not asking/raising the sex question anymore. To be honest after no sex in over 3 years I have taken that as a given. However living without any form of intimacy (kissing & cuddling) is a lonely existence.

How many times have you made the move to show non-sexual affection recently @Folkmusic ? You can do this in words and careful physical gestures which ensure that your wife doesn't think you are 'trying it on'.

Based on my wife’s experience it does take a while to get the dose right and quite a lot of persistence with the useless go. The results are fantastic.
no brain fog, sleeps better, more energy, less grumpy, happier and libido has returned. No doubt party due to the Oestrogen itself but also because she feel’s her 30 year old self again.
But every woman will react differently and so many GP’s are useless when it comes to menopause

@Withazjump I do try and compliment my wife and support her in other ways. I guess it is now the situation where I am completely at a loss as to what to do and even how to approach it.

18 months ago my closest friend got remarried and I must admit to being envious of the way she looks at him and touches him. I know there are few comparisons between a new marriage and a 20+ year marriage.

It might help if you say you’d like to resume cuddles / kissing without any expectation of anything further. As you’ve identified this could be why she’s stopped even that. Which is a real shame as if you’re experiencing some physical affection at least it helps

Giving her compliments and supporting her might not be cutting the mustard. Those touches and looks you describe a new wife giving your friend might just be exactly what your wife has been missing. You need to be more romantic.

Menopause is really hard on a woman's body, mind, and emotions. Yes, for many women libido does fade. Sometimes HRT helps, and other times, not. Sometimes different ways of gearing up for intimacy work, other times, not. This is the reality of being married to a person with a female body.

I'm somewhat troubled you say your marriage is fading. Subsidence of a woman's libido with menopause doesn't mean the marriage faded, it means the life-stage of the marriage changed. For a young married couple, the woman's body provides gratification for the husband in the form of physical pleasure and, if they have children, she is the one whose body is making the physical sacrifice. That's the reality of marriage for women, i.e. it's women who bear children. For an older couple, I think maybe it's time for the man to return the favor and accept that he has to make a sacrifice about his own gratification because his wife's body has done the normal thing that women's bodies do when we get old. For women at this age, not only does libido often subside, but the fragility of the tissue and the changes in hormones can also make sexual activity painful or even physically problematic, with UTI's or abrasions and so on.

So for 3 years have you

Been out for romantic meals ?
Been for weekend breaks away ?
Walks, cinema or hobbies together ?
Holidays together ?
What do you do for your wife's birthday, Xmas, valentines days ?
Do you help with chores round the home & garden
Done something nice on the spur of the moment ?
Do you Talk to your wife
Do you listen
Do you spend quality time together
Look at the 5 languages of love

Because if you aren't doing any of the above, why would she want to cuddle or do other things with you

Ok, this is my experience as a menopausal woman who has had some vaginal issues. When married i had no desire to sleep with my DH, and was not bothered about sex, instead I avoided it.

Since divorce I'm up for it always with my new partner, I'm on HRT but still with some issues but I'm working through it and probably my ideal sex would be twice a day. Sometimes i can feel that the hormonal impact means i dont feel as excited and aroused initially but sex for me is about connection, intimacy, bonding and my body responds to my attraction to my partner when things kick off. The more sex you have, the more you want I think. It is about emotions as well as physical symptoms. So some women will seek to find a way through menopause without losing that.

But you're in the honeymoon stage, this advice doesn't apply to a long term monogamous woman. She couldn't generate your level of spontaneous desire even if she tried

DH and I were struggling with physical intimacy - I had lost my libido, and was struggling with some long- held concerns about sex and my body. When I woke up and realised I definitely didn’t want to lose my marriage I took a three pronged attack - sex therapy (alone), pelvic physio, and testosterone. It has worked for us, emotionally as well as physically.

but all this was my idea. DH said he would rather have no sex at all than lose me. I realised that just wouldn’t work, I’d always feel nervous, physical intimacy is important to him. So I did the work.

I think I’m different to a lot of women with regards responses to hormone changes throughout the menopause. I’m 50 now but at 45 I became ridiculously sexual (which I now know as the sex surge or menopause). However, I hadn’t had any sort of intimacy/sex with my older husband for many years so this caused issues for me. I wasn’t attracted to him and saw him as a flat mate.

I was uncontrollable for a long time driven by crazy hormones and the wake up call that I had been living in a sexless marriage for a reason. Quite innocently, I searched out other men to talk to - in a forum similar to this - and boom…I found someone who was entertaining and interesting in every single way my husband wasn’t (and he was my age). We just stuck to phone calls and Skype chat for a long time but I was already developing feelings for him. We ended up meeting again and again and again. Amazing passion. Amazing connection. I had to wake up and accept my marriage was over (I ended it pretty quickly after meeting up with the OM).

Not that I am saying this is the issue here. I did settle down but I am still more sexual that I ever was. However, partly due to the fact I’d been with someone I wasn’t attracted to and my switches were all turned off iyswim.

Most women go off sex completely as their role in producing offspring is over. It’s natural. There are a lot of men in your shoes.

Either deal with it and fulfill your marriage in other ways or leave. Or, have a secret affair!!

Look to put the fun back into your marriage. Get out old pictures. Visit places you went on dates in the early days. Chat about memories and fun times. Book a weekend away. Take up a joint hobby. Take sex off the table. Have fun together and see where it goes. If you put the passion and joy back into your marriage it may make it easier to talk about everything.

This has nothing to do with menopause

My point was, and as evidenced by another poster above, its not about menopause, its about attraction, even at our advanced ages

Next time you’re together sat in a traffic jam and you’re driving, reach over, take her hand, kiss the back if it and replace.

My partner does this to me and it makes me feel lovely.

Tiny romantic gestures with no agenda is something you might try. Consistently.

Valentines day is coming up. Get a table booked soon!

Menopause affects people very, very differently. So you can gather experiences on here, but it will not help you with your problem IMO. Essentially though, menopause isn't the end of everyone's sex life.

I think it's quite poor on her part that she refuses to discuss it with you, after having been married so long. You are now forced into celibacy so I do think she should be honest about what's happening - because celibacy can make people depressed. It's very different saying that she is suffering from dryness/atrophy/whatever and that she therefore feels unable to or doesn't want to as compared to saying, OK no sex ever again because "menopause". Or worse, she's not even saying no sex ever again, she's just making that the reality without any regard for you.

I wonder if she actually wanted to have sex before or whether she was just doing it to please you - as otherwise you'd think she might feel sad as well about the fact she doesn't have sex anymore.

I'm menopausal, on hrt and my libido is pretty much the same as when I was in my 20's.

It's very unfair of your wife to unilaterally decide to remove sex from your relationship. It would be (and was) a deal breaker for me.

I'm at the same place in life as your wife. Sex has its challenges and I could do with it rarely, but it's not really about the sex. It's about the current stresses of life and mostly about feeling the emotional connection. My husband is a poor communicator, including around sex, so it's not something we ever really talk about. I feel like I can't be bothered being the one that does all the emotional labour anymore, so I'm not. I want to see him take some initiative there for once.

The emotional connection is so much more important before I can feel like sex these days. If he'd give me a back rub rather than suggesting a 'quickie', it would be more likely to happen. If he shows me he wants to spend time with me, I'm more likely to feel it.

I don't know if this helps. That you're asking says something as I'm sure my husband never would. Is your wife the one who carries much of the emotional load in the family? That puts me out of the mood more than anything as I've reached a stage where I refuse to carry the emotional load for some aspects of our relationship anymore. Either he comes to the party, or he misses out.

Compose her an old fashioned love letter explaining that you miss her, miss the intimacy, love your marriage but would love to hold her, etc. Shower her with love & compliments, tell her you adore her etc etc.

Treat her to a lovely spa day, cook for her, buy her lovely things, flowers, court her again. With no expectation of anything. Just show her how much you adore her.

Life can be very hard on women - having to chop & change roles constantly - career / pregnant / new mum / exhausted / lonely / career again / pregnant again/ then kids grow up & you feel a bit left behind / un-needed / shit menopause stuff / older women are looked upon badly by society etc - a lot to wear you down! She's probably just done in.

You sound like a decent guy...good luck.