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Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

Original poster

Well you were all right...he hasn't changed.

78 replies

zizzis · 17/07/2022 12:27

Name changed many many times. Mumsnet admin must think I'm an absolute idiot.

Left H last year, he was emotionally abusive. He went to therapy, I've been living with my mum ever since. I've not gone back which I'm thankful for.

So he managed to convince me he had changed, he seemed to have and we were seeing each other again, just not living together.

He has become extremely paranoid since I left him and last night he showed it again. My mum wasn't at home and it makes him uncomfortable - in his head, I'm going to have some random man round. I have dcs with me!

I would never ever do anything to hurt him. I never have done. When I left him, he slept with at least one other woman and messaged god knows how many. I did absolutely nothing.

This morning, he said I had said a couple of things that made him think things. I told him I couldn't carry on like this. I asked him what he was going to be like if I ever went out with friends on a night out (which I hardly ever do). He said he would be suspicious as I never go out and he would think things.

How can I live like this? Obviously I can't. And I won't. I've had my own therapy and I can see everything so much clearer. He gaslights everything.

I feel like such an idiot for believing the changes. In fact there really has been some positive changes but what can I do if he has these thoughts? I would never ever hurt him. Ever.

OP posts:
Imogensmumma · 18/07/2022 15:56

zizzis · 18/07/2022 15:51

So in a conversation we've had this afternoon....

He's basically saying that my reaction to his 'thoughts' is the reason we cannot go on anymore. The fact that he has feelings and every time he mentions something that I've said to cause his paranoia - my reaction to that is why he cannot continue. Because he has feelings too and can't cope.

How else am I supposed to react? Say 'oh it's ok that you're thinking I've got some random man round for the night, don't worry'

I obviously go defensive but surely I'm entitled too?

This is gaslighting isn't it?

As others have said stop talking to him about anything that isn’t the kids , otherwise you are just submitting yourself to further pain and anguish…. You’ve got this 💪

Original poster
zizzis · 18/07/2022 15:59

@Imogensmumma I know he isn't worth it. He's finished his therapy and wont even try to get more help. Came off his anxiety meds too.

I can see it's all wrong, I know it's all wrong but it's getting through it all

OP posts:
LittleOwl153 · 18/07/2022 16:18

Your marriage is dead. You need to do the sweeping up now and get the divorce, split the assets before he spends anymore on other women and get a place for you and your dc. He is trash, abusive trash, sweep up the rubbish and move on.

It's hard, but you've actually done the hardest part. All this it's your fault I can't continue bollocks is his attempt to guilt you into continuing with his crap. (Is he benefiting from living in the marital home by any chance? Who is paying for that?)

user1471538283 · 18/07/2022 16:26

Please have nothing more to do with him.

My ex constantly accused me of cheating. And guess what? He was the one cheating!

You need time to build your confidence back up.

WinterMusings · 18/07/2022 16:35

@zizzis yes, it is 'getting through it' but you will!

your therapy seems to have done you the world of good, you know this is going to be hard & it hurts, but you already know it HAS to be done.

you WILL get through it, you ARE strong enough & your life will be SO MUCH better than you can even imagine right now.

you know you tried, you know he made some changes, but fundamentally he is who he is and he won't get more help & it's not your responsibility.

see friends, do stuff, keep busy!

and just remember, you don't live HIM, you live the man you want him to be, but he's not. & never will be!!

are you journaling this journey? You should be.

Original poster
zizzis · 18/07/2022 16:53

WinterMusings · 18/07/2022 16:35

@zizzis yes, it is 'getting through it' but you will!

your therapy seems to have done you the world of good, you know this is going to be hard & it hurts, but you already know it HAS to be done.

you WILL get through it, you ARE strong enough & your life will be SO MUCH better than you can even imagine right now.

you know you tried, you know he made some changes, but fundamentally he is who he is and he won't get more help & it's not your responsibility.

see friends, do stuff, keep busy!

and just remember, you don't live HIM, you live the man you want him to be, but he's not. & never will be!!

are you journaling this journey? You should be.

Yes I've kept a journal since I left him 9 months ago and I'm so glad I have. It's my life saver! I haven't written in it much lately as things were ok and it was too painful but I've actually flicked through it this afternoon.

I have found that reading it and I'm back to thinking 'it wasn't that bad' but I need to remember it really was.

OP posts:
Original poster
zizzis · 18/07/2022 16:57

user1471538283 · 18/07/2022 16:26

Please have nothing more to do with him.

My ex constantly accused me of cheating. And guess what? He was the one cheating!

You need time to build your confidence back up.

It won't surprise me if I'm the last 24 hours he's contacted some of the women he was speaking too previously. One rule for me and another for him

OP posts:
IdisagreeMrHochhauser · 18/07/2022 19:48

I wouldn't get too hung up on trying to put a label on it. I was in a controlling relationship with a woman and it's enough for me to know that it was a controlling relationship and therefore not loving and healthy rather than trying to analyse whether what she did was bad enough to be considered abusive. It's enough to know that real love doesn't feel like this and you deserve so much better.

Original poster
zizzis · 18/07/2022 20:18

IdisagreeMrHochhauser · 18/07/2022 19:48

I wouldn't get too hung up on trying to put a label on it. I was in a controlling relationship with a woman and it's enough for me to know that it was a controlling relationship and therefore not loving and healthy rather than trying to analyse whether what she did was bad enough to be considered abusive. It's enough to know that real love doesn't feel like this and you deserve so much better.

Maybe a label just helps for closure but either way it doesn't matter does it? I've had so many posts on here about him and pretty much every one over the years has told me he won't change and to leave but I just found it so hard to accept it. I'd think it was easy for people to judge on here when they didn't know the full story....yet I'm the one that's created a post at how unhappy I am.

It's just all horrific, never experienced anything like this in my life!

OP posts:
CantGetDecentNickname · 18/07/2022 22:59

zizzis · Today 15:51
So in a conversation we've had this afternoon....
He's basically saying that my reaction to his 'thoughts' is the reason we cannot go on anymore. The fact that he has feelings and every time he mentions something that I've said to cause his paranoia - my reaction to that is why he cannot continue. Because he has feelings too and can't cope.
How else am I supposed to react? Say 'oh it's ok that you're thinking I've got some random man round for the night, don't worry'
I obviously go defensive but surely I'm entitled too?
This is gaslighting isn't it?

Please OP stop having conversations with him beyond childcare arrangements. You are spending a lot of time analysing his behaviour and most of it is deliberate to make you think about him and nothing else. Don't play his games any longer. It doesn't matter what says he thinks you are doing - his opinion does not count now you are separated. You also know that he doesn't really think that, he is just trying to get you to move back with him so he can control you better.

In response to the above, I'd just agree with him that you cannot go on as a couple any longer. He's absolutely right that you should divorce. Tell him you will just have conversations about your DC from now on and don't want to hear his opinions anymore and won't be responding to them if insists upon making them. Tell him you are not his therapist and as his now ex-wife, are no longer interested in him or his life, who he sleeps with or whatever. If he keeps on trying to bend your ear with his bullshit (and attempts to make you jealous) tell him that it will end up with his solicitor talking to yours only and access to DC determined by the court.

You do not have to respond to every message or speak to someone if you don't want to. Please ignore him as much as possible and don't defend yourself to him - you are separated and entitled to see your friends whenever you like and it is none of his business so don't talk to him about it. It's good you are recognising the gaslighting attempts.

Original poster
zizzis · 19/07/2022 00:37

It's officially over. I took DS out for a drive tonight as he was struggling to get to sleep in the heat. I had missed messages from him and then a phone call. He knew I was driving straight away. When I told him I was out taking our son for a drive, he replied with 'oh really' and 'I won't even tell you what I'm thinking' and then hung up on me.

I then got a message off him saying I'm not supportive enough.

I'm a single mum who's shared a single bed with her son for the past 9 months because I have no where to live and this heat is unbearable for us. I still have to be a mum through the heartache while he just is alone feeling sorry for himself all day. I explained I was trying to look after our son who was beside himself with the heat but it did no good.

I cannot go on. I couldn't of carried on this morning or even yesterday.

I've sat and cried for an hour but now it's a new day (past midnight) and I'll be ok.

This is the end of this now

OP posts:
SuperCamp · 19/07/2022 01:02

Good.

No more ‘explaining’ , no more appeasing him and justifying your own life and actions. Don’t explain, don’t discuss. Do not engage with his gaslighting guilt tripping abusive accusations.

How are you going to keep him behind your Exclusion Zone? Set up an E mail address which you use only to communicate child access issues? Block him on everything else.
Here and now promise yourself that you will call the police if he turns up and harasses you. Make that resolve.

You have a life to live, and can get on with it now!

Good luck OP.

mathanxiety · 19/07/2022 03:51

He thinks you belong to him. You don't. You are dealing with an angry and controlling man.

There is no point trying to have a relationship with someone who basically sees you as an extention of himself. Stop living like this.

Tell him he is never to contact you again except for communication about the children. Get a burner phone for that, and tell him to text only. Keep all texts.

mathanxiety · 19/07/2022 04:05

You need to keep all the messages he has sent you.

He's clearly stalking you/ watching you. You may need a non molestation order and you will need evidence of his accusations and knowledge of your movements.

Get a mechanic to go over your car with a fine tooth comb to see if there's a tracker.

Original poster
zizzis · 19/07/2022 07:08

mathanxiety · 19/07/2022 04:05

You need to keep all the messages he has sent you.

He's clearly stalking you/ watching you. You may need a non molestation order and you will need evidence of his accusations and knowledge of your movements.

Get a mechanic to go over your car with a fine tooth comb to see if there's a tracker.

I have all messages. I don't think he's stalking me but it wouldn't surprise me if it got to that point.

OP posts:
Annoyedwithmyself · 19/07/2022 07:13

Well.done on ending this. You've now seen things through and realised there was no potential for the healthy relationship you deserve, the man is a paranoid, hypocritical mess with too many issues to list. That doesn't make you an idiot, you just gave him one final chance to be sure things weren't right, they're not.

Original poster
zizzis · 19/07/2022 07:14

What an awful awful night. Absolutely drained this morning.

We're supposed to be going on holiday next week. Him included. I'm still going with dc but he's not. I feel like even that is now ruined. Yet it also won't surprise me if he still turns up.

This is all such a mess and I'm too tired to think clearly. I do know I cannot let someone treat me like this anymore. I do know that he doesn't even see that what he is doing is not normal. I do know I need to be free of him.

I'm just so heartbroken from it all.

Thank goodness I have therapy today. I don't even feel like I have the energy to speak but I'll get through it

OP posts:
Original poster
zizzis · 19/07/2022 07:15

Annoyedwithmyself · 19/07/2022 07:13

Well.done on ending this. You've now seen things through and realised there was no potential for the healthy relationship you deserve, the man is a paranoid, hypocritical mess with too many issues to list. That doesn't make you an idiot, you just gave him one final chance to be sure things weren't right, they're not.

I just need to get through this pain but I'm hoping it won't be as bad as previous pain I have felt with him.

Your username is exactly how I feel right now!

OP posts:
Newestname002 · 19/07/2022 07:55

@zizzis

We're supposed to be going on holiday next week. Him included. I'm still going with dc but he's not. I feel like even that is now ruined. Yet it also won't surprise me if he still turns up.

Are you able to remove his name from the booking? I can't see if you've given your holiday details but, if flying, cancel his flight (without telling him) for example? Tell the hotel it will just be you and your child?

I hope your therapy session goes well. 🌹

Original poster
zizzis · 19/07/2022 08:04

Newestname002 · 19/07/2022 07:55

@zizzis

We're supposed to be going on holiday next week. Him included. I'm still going with dc but he's not. I feel like even that is now ruined. Yet it also won't surprise me if he still turns up.

Are you able to remove his name from the booking? I can't see if you've given your holiday details but, if flying, cancel his flight (without telling him) for example? Tell the hotel it will just be you and your child?

I hope your therapy session goes well. 🌹

No it's in the uk and his booking is separate to mine unfortunately. There's nothing I can do but hope he doesn't come. He was bringing my step children - I'm incredibly close to them. As far as I know, they don't know they aren't coming yet.

All such a mess. I am finding myself questioning myself this morning. Probably due to lack of sleep. And the fact he turned everything around on me again.

He said last night he wasn't ringing to check on where I was but because he loved me and hated the atmosphere between us. Yet when I explained I had taken DS out for a drive, he responded with 'oh really'.

He twists everything but then I sometimes wonder if it's just me that's the problem

OP posts:
ThinkingaboutLangClegosaurus · 19/07/2022 08:26

He twists everything but then I sometimes wonder if it's just me that's the problem

No no no no no no no no no!

It’s him. Gaslighting you. You do know this now. Please take up your journal again and write down every bit of gaslighting, and the responses you’ve had in this thread.

You are acting normally. He is paranoid. That is not your fault. But do get yourself and DS away from his influence.

GeriSignfeld · 19/07/2022 08:26

Toxic people will always blame you for their behaviour

The sooner you realise you cannot control or prevent his behaviour the better as you will be free of this cycle

This drama sounds utterly exhausting & you’re tying yourself in knots over him trying to appease someone who is completely unreasonable.

keeping you exhausted, worried & focused on them is right where they want you to be

You have the power to get off this roller coaster.

Try to take care of yourself & get some sleep, your mind must be understandably burnt out from all his drama

if I were you would cancel the holiday & do something else.

try to surround yourself with positive people who don’t harass you to jump through hoops or accuse you of things you haven’t done

this is psychological abuse & it’s why you feel so confused, burnt out & exhausted by his behaviour.

All the best getting away from this toxic situation

Original poster
zizzis · 19/07/2022 08:36

GeriSignfeld · 19/07/2022 08:26

Toxic people will always blame you for their behaviour

The sooner you realise you cannot control or prevent his behaviour the better as you will be free of this cycle

This drama sounds utterly exhausting & you’re tying yourself in knots over him trying to appease someone who is completely unreasonable.

keeping you exhausted, worried & focused on them is right where they want you to be

You have the power to get off this roller coaster.

Try to take care of yourself & get some sleep, your mind must be understandably burnt out from all his drama

if I were you would cancel the holiday & do something else.

try to surround yourself with positive people who don’t harass you to jump through hoops or accuse you of things you haven’t done

this is psychological abuse & it’s why you feel so confused, burnt out & exhausted by his behaviour.

All the best getting away from this toxic situation

Thank you. I cannot cancel the holiday as my whole family are going - sorry should of explained that and it's for an important birthday. But I won't be alone and I'll have my family surrounding me.

I've had another message this morning to say all this shit is ridiculous and he is past caring. Told me to take care. I won't reply to that.

I think I am now so burnt out by him that I just cannot think straight. I wasn't being too hard on my left by giving him another chance as now I know it will never work but equally it has created a deeper trauma bond. I will feel well and truly lost without him. How sad. Someone that's treated me so badly.

However even my mum can see it now, my family can. They all loved him and thought he was doing great at getting over his issues. Encouraging me to take it slowly which is why I never moved back and thank goodness I didn't.

He is toxic and has probably become even worse to be honest. When I left him, he blamed his paranoia on a mental breakdown. He was full of apologies while accusing me of everything.

Now he's just not even bothered. He can't use that excuse. Just turns it all into being my fault somehow. Wow....

OP posts:
Shgytfgtf111 · 19/07/2022 08:38

He will definitely turn up on the holiday with the step kids to 'prove' that it is you that is causing the problem. They dont know they arent coming yet because they will be.

Echobelly · 19/07/2022 08:42

It's a situation where you can't win - presumably you hardly go out at least in part because of the way it sets him off, but then you going out sets him off because you hardly ever do it so it must mean you're 'up to something'. That's not a healthy dynamic.

And no, tracking your partner should not be a thing unless there's a reason they want you to.