I actually told him

[VJasper86]

Last night I admitted to my dh that I am not happy in our marriage and am still hurting from when he went too far with a colleague 6 years ago.
I laid it all out. How I was a person I wasn't happy with, how I was still broken from what he did, how he has never actually admitted what happened, how I'm fed up of our relationship being unbalanced with parenting and looking after the home falling much more on me, how I've told him a million times and things don't change, how I don't see him as anything other than a friend right now (likely because of all the above and not necessarily permanent if we do something about it).
I feel a weight off my mind having said it all out loud.
I don't understand his response though.
He giggled, a little chuckle, like "oh, here we go again, she's getting all OTT as usual". He then asked me to send him what I'd said so he could "formulate a reply"
I didn't call him out on the giggle, I'm hoping it was nervousness, and sent him what I'd said.
I've not given him a timescale to think and talk as I guess that in itself will tell me if he wants to put effort in or not.
Just wanted to say out loud.

He's just shown you who he is. He doesn't care about you at all. He's gaslighting you and if you separated he will give you the script word for word and you will be the psycho ex.

Get rid of this narc vermin.

Now you’ve told him a million and one, time. Make that the last, unless there are very serious improvements.

A “friend” wouldn’t treat you like he does

He is a low value individual that brings only unhappiness to you. Take steps to end this relationship.

Well done. It sounds like you’ve wanted to say something to him for a long time. No advice from me as you’ve taken the steps to tell him how you feel, so lets see if he wants to try and make a life with you and to put in the effort it takes.

I think you've made up your mind. It doesn't matter now if he does change his ways, it wont be enough. He could become the most attentive and submissive husband ever but it'll still be in your mind.

he has never actually admitted what happened
Doesn't matter if it happened or not, you believe it and therefor it happened as far as your concerned.

I'm fed up of our relationship being unbalanced with parenting and looking after the home falling much more on me
Would it matter if he did more? Really? The resentment will linger

If you've caught him off guard with this confrontation it may well be his 'giggle' was nervousness.

Have you tried counselling?

I suspect that even if he changes he'll be wondering if this is being held over him in perpetuity, not a way to live, constantly in fear of it being brought up. You need real counselling from someone who knows what they're doing not a random bunch of vipers.

This reminds me of when I spoke to my exh about some issues that were causing me some real issues in our marriage. He just shrugged.
I hope in years to come that giggle your H did reminds you of a change in your mindset and the changes are for you.
Good luck whatever your decision

He's probably going to either ignore it or come up with a load of reasons why it's all your fault.

His reaction was not someone who finds it hard to communicate. He very clearly communicated exactly what he thinks of you.

I hope your next steps are to see a solicitor and get a divorce started

I am in counselling at the moment and so am working through a lot of things, it's actually that that has given me the courage to speak up and say what I am not happy with as I know relationships take work and therefore I need to be honest and see how he deals with that.
I've also suggested marriage counselling which he wasn't keen on previously but let's see if he changes.
It's taken a while for me to be honest with myself that drastic changes need to be made, but I'm not perfect either which is why I am personally seeking help with my issues as I am prepared to put effort in.

** Well done OP for confronting him. That takes guts and it appears the work you put into your counselling is paying off. Usually it's pretty hard work to, so sincerely, well done!

I am in counselling at the moment and so am working through a lot of things, it's actually that that has given me the courage to speak up and say what I am not happy with as I know relationships take work and therefore I need to be honest and see how he deals with that.
Don't forget that relationships take work from both parties. As he's the one who cheated, it's him who should be - and should have been - putting in the lion's share.

I've also suggested marriage counselling which he wasn't keen on previously but let's see if he changes.
If you're going to do marriage counselling with him - which it seems you will if he agrees - please first read The Gaslight Effect by Dr Robin Stern. At least you'll have a chance if spotting patterns that are damaging to you.

It's taken a while for me to be honest with myself that drastic changes need to be made, but I'm not perfect either which is why I am personally seeking help with my issues as I am prepared to put effort in.
You're not perfect, but you're not imperfect either. You're just normal. Be careful about taking on the responsibility of "improving" or "fixing" yourself in some way in order to improve the relationship, unless he's genuinely doing the same. Do it because you want to improve or fix something about yourself for yourself.

And from earlier:
I think he is not good at communicating or sharing his feelings so I get why he wanted a copy as its easier for him to think instead of a spontaneous response.
You're making excuses for him. He effectively asked you to put your complaint in writing. If he's not good at communicating and he values you and the marriage then how about instead of adding emotional labour (because I'm betting you didn't just jot some notes down and push send, you wrote so he'd understand you) to you, he sees a counsellor who could help him with expressing himself. If he cannot get words out of his mouth and cannot listen to an adult woman express herself, then he's the one with a problem. As an adult, he's perfectly capable of seeking out help, just like you did.

Take care of yourself because this man can quite easily run you into the ground while you're trying to save a marriage he finds convenient. And until he indicates otherwise, I'm not sure you can say you know for sure that he values you and the union, given how unwilling he is to share the burdens that come with marriage.

You're pandering to his awful behaviour.

1. Writing your complaint is not about him considering your reply before formulating a response. It's so that he has evidence of how unreasonable you are (who emails complaints to someone they live with?) He will be emailing back counter points and a list of complaints about you. A regular person would listen to you and ask to discuss at a later date in person if they couldn't formulate a response. Or they would tell you what their immediate reaction is and ask for another chat at a later date. He sees you like work- a chore.

1. The laughter is him showing you contempt. Your feelings are funny to him. He doesn't understand why you would be unhappy and just considers you a nag always criticising him.

1. It's good that you're doing individual counselling to improve yourself. You can't fix your marriage on your own and the fact that he won't shows that he either thinks things are fine or doesn't care that things are broken.

1. You're making excuses for what is clearly a nasty man who doesn't care about your feelings. Your feelings matter. It's ok that you've decided that you can't move past his infidelity and the fact that he's not honest proves that he is not sorry. He clearly does not respect you.

let's see if he changes

You wait to see if somebody changes on small incompatibilities. You don't wait to see if they change regarding completely disrespecting your feelings, which is what his response was. He doesn't care how you feel; that's not something you hope will change, it's simply something you walk away from.

My next step is to give a little time for him to think, decide how he feels and if he isn't prepared to put work in, doesn't do anything, doesn't communicate his thoughts etc then I expect I would ask for a trial separation.
We get on as friends, have lots on common, but I don't feel like we are married.

I agree with @PeekAtYou this time.

I can't advise what you should do, but if I was you I wouldn't put it in writing for him. Maybe it's not a such a bad idea to keep a record for yourself after having had a conversation with him, when you're alone transcribe in a piece of paper or Word document what you recolect were your exact words and his, and the date, but keep this for your records only, do not forward him this.

What I'd do is to remind my partner some other time that they owe me an answer, and if the suggestion to put it in writing is repeated say that that is not an option (and if he says why do not explain why).

I'd also seek to gain independence progresively so that I can eventually leave my partner. This wouldn't be urgent but it should be done methodically and tracking your progress monthly or something. As at the end of each month, ask, what adjustments did I do this month that enable me to be in a better position for when I finally decide to leave?

That'd also give partner plenty of time to change his attitude and address your concerns. So if you one day you decide to leave your decision will be final and you'll give him no 'second chances'. After enough reminders and allowing him time, he ought to have got as many chances as he needed - he could be granted no more.

Well done for telling him. But he doesn't sound much like a friend to me. A bit of nervousness and discomfort I could get but his utter dismissiveness of you - well that's something that I also think will still be haunting you in years to come.

I hope you told him he could fuck off with his ‘put it in writing’ bollox?

To be fair, I had to write it down to say it. I needed it to be precise, not full of emotion or angry. It needed to say everything I wanted to say, in the way I wanted to without it turning into an argument of pushing back against each other "you do this, you do that" etc.
I'm not bothered about letting him read it through if that's what he needs to be honest with how he feels as he can't be happy as we are either. He needs to really look at why. His response will give me what I need to decide my next choices and he chose to make changes I would make sure he knew that it needed to be permanent changes. Not things are better for a few weeks and then it goes back to what it has been.

OP please take this thread to your counsellor and ask if they think we just don't get it, or if maybe we have a point.

It comes across that your boundaries of what is fair treatment if you are so skewed you actually don't even know what we're talking about.

I'm sorry if this sounds a bit harsh. I could have written every single one of your posts 15 years ago. It's been a long road to find value in myself when I'm living with someone who pays lip service to valuing me and gaslights me. Someone I have to present my feelings to in an acceptable way in the hope he'll listen and this time understand. Hoping that he'll actually care rather than understanding he cares about himself more than anybody else - despite denying that too.

Honestly, take this to your counsellor and have a discussion about the comments on this thread.

Well done for saying what you needed to; it took courage.

Your subsequent words "...let's see if he changes." did worry me a bit. People don't change much and it sounds as though you would like him to change into someone else which he is unlikely to do. His response to you showed that he merely thinks you are creating a fuss (sort of "here she goes again") and not actually going to do anything as you didn't kick him out back when he was caught cheating. He doubts you'll do anything beyond complain a bit from time to time but not actually leave. So he'll probably agree to try a bit harder and might make an effort for a few weeks, then it will be back to normal (his normal which isn't very nice for you).

I suggest you leave it where it is with him and consult a lawyer. Get copies of all bank statements, salaries, savings, mortgage, debts, household bills etc and take with you. When you are ready and the paperwork is ready, tell him you want to talk again and this time tell him that he is leaving. State it as a fact, not an item for discussion (don't give him any scope to talk you out of it).

If you don't feel ready for this, please set yourself a deadline by which things must have permanently improved. Make it long enough for him to have slipped back into his old ways (which appear to be gaslighting and insulting you) and then start the process. After he has gone, you can find a new normal which will be much less stressful and you can work on doing things that make you happy.

If he asks for anything else in writing, please just put "I need you to leave by XXX date"

Good luck💐

Gahhhh the chuckle, the deflection of writing it down. He is making my skin crawl 3 times removed. He has no respect for you whatsoever, he is doing the whole "oh, here she goes again, with her emotions and her needs, amirite lads" shtick.

He will pay you lip service, probably reply to your heartfelt pleas with platitudes and what about ism and slimy words.

I think you should stop being friendly with him, stop doing anything for him. If he comes back to you with a reasonable reply accepting his part in problems and suggestions for both of you to work together to solve them, then great, you can work on a plan together.

He's clearly minimising your feelings and re-forming what you said. Honestly, I think you need to throw this one back. Take legal advice without telling him, get your ducks in a row and leave. You'll be far happier. I'm sorry he is treating you this way.

I really do appreciate all your comments.

And yes, my self esteem and self worth has been an issue for a long long time (part of the reason I am seeing my counsellor) I will specifically talk to her about all this at our next appointment. She does question why certain things have happened (often small but not in line with what I find acceptable) that I have asked about but then haven't followed through with any form of anything so it's on her radar too.
I guess I will continue to be polite as the kids shouldn't be impacted too much until a decision is made. I am very empathetic, make sacrifices for other people's happiness, am a people pleaser etc.
All not good things if they impact on your own happiness and self worth, I know that.
I think he's fallen into a pattern, like I have and that's why I think it warrants time to see his reply.

Well done OP. The first step in taking back control of your life.

What a pleasure to read a women standing up for herself. Good luck with what ever your future holds. 💪