TW: grooming. If you were a parent to teens in the 90s/00s...

[backtothe90s1]

Anyone is welcome to give me their views on this, but I'm particularly interested in hearing from people who were parents to teens in the 90s or early 2000s or earlier. People today including myself would have a 2020s view of this situation, but I know things were seen differently in the past.

When I was 15 I met a man who groomed me for a year and then started dating me when I was 16. He was 24. He sort of wore me down until I said yes. Sadly I was so desperate for love in any form at 16 I just went along with it.

My parents were aware of this and encouraged the relationship, even encouraging me to stay with him when I wanted to leave him after a few months. He coerced me into sex with him before I was ready amongst other things. I stayed together with him for a few years, and we bought a flat when I was 18. I finally left him aged 19 and my parents let me walk away with £0 equity from the flat (this was the point in time when the house prices started to skyrocket).

I'm now in my late thirties with a young daughter. I would never let her at 16 date a 24 year old, and I'd be very open as to the reasons why. I would also not let my daughter be taken advantage of financially in this way with anyone she got together with at whatever age. As a parent by today's standards I can't imagine acting like how my parents did.

I asked my husband, when you were 24 would you date a 16 year old? And his response was absolutely not and he would take a very dim view and not want to associate with a guy in his twenties who was pursuing a teenager.

I suppose what I am asking - particularly to the more mature in age mumsnetters - is, is this a case of all this would have all been fine by the standards of the 90s, or did my parents let me down badly?

I think I already know the answer but I'm really interested to hear others views.

Thanks

I was 17, inexperienced, and going out with a man in his late 20s. My parents didn't like it when I told them, but didn't try to stop me; they hoped it would blow over faster and they wanted to keep communication open with me. And I don't think they should have tried to stop it really - I was over the age of consent and knew what I was doing, and would have been even more stubborn about it if they'd tried to stop me. It would possibly have driven me to cut contact with them when I turned 18. I went out with him for 3 years and he was a very caring and attentive boyfriend who made me feel treasured. I only wish I'd held subsequent boyfriends to the high standards he set. I have several friends now who also had relationships with much older men as teenagers, and who have felt it was their decision to make, and don't regret it.
I think the issue is perhaps less about the age difference and more about whether the relationship was something to wanted and felt valued and respected in. You don't need an age difference to be taken advantage of and manipulated.
Whether parents should, or could, stop such a relationship depends on the individuals involved I think. If you have a very strong willed and stubborn 17 year old who is determined to do something, trying to stop it would be likely to fail and just drive them away from you. And a teenager who had a good relationship with her parents would be more likely to confide in them that she was unhappy, and to seek help.

I have a bizarre experience- I must have been about 19 (I had started Uni) - 1991 and my DM arranged for me to go on a date with one of her colleagues - he must have been about 40?
I really cannot remember why I would have said yes.
My main memory is that he was wearing cowboy boots.
I remember we had a meal (and he had a daughter my age ) and he dropped me back and went in for a kiss but I swerved.
He rang for a second date but I said I was busy.
Were parents different in the 90s?

I had a 25 year old boyfriend when I was 16. He was lovely; I met him at my weekend job and we had similar academic interests. There was no power imbalance and it was great. I dumped him because it was all a bit boring and I met someone cooler (who was also older than me and also an extremely nice, gentle and kind young man). It's not necessarily all bad. I was from a very supportive, loving family and quite independent; left home at seventeen because I got a job somewhere more fun, and went back to sit my exams.

I think you also have to remember that it wasn't unusual to leave school and home at 16 at that time.

@Gigia

Also some posters mention this happening to the "cool" girls. I was probably considered cool but in truth I was emotionally and physically neglected, left to fend for myself too often and subsequently wise beyond my years. I certainly didn't feel cool.

This was also me. I had a thread recently as I was thinking about my childhood and it suddenly occurred to me that what I had considered to be my first “relationship” aged 13 was actually a grooming situation, but at the time was almost considered normal. My parents facilitated the relationship and even talked about it as me being so mature I was “able” to get an older boyfriend. His age - 19

I was a teen in the 80s and this wasn't a thing amongst my friends anyway. I often heard about girls in school (yes the cooler ones) going out with older guys with cars but i never saw any evidance of it. Seemed more of an urban legend than a reality, everyone i knew went out with lads their own age. When i was 17 there was a 21 year old who wanted to date me but i thought he was way too old and i know my parents would have thought so too. It definitely wasn't 'normal' in my circle.

Yes,I was persued by men in their early 20's when I was 16. It was relatively normal, I'd say.

It also happened to my best friend when she was in sixth form. The guy was about 5 years older. Her Mum gave her blessing but kept an eye by inviting him around for cups of tea. The Mum eventually had a word and told him to stop messing my friend around.

I was 16 in 2007 and dated a 23 year old. My mum knew about it and facilitated it. It was actually quite a healthy relationship and no harm done really, but now I'm remembering it I'm wondering what on earth she was thinking!

My mum was quite old fashioned, I think she maybe saw it as a good idea for me to settle down early with someone who already had a job and some money behind them. We only dated for a few months in the end but I remember she was happy he had a car and things like that. Weird!

I was a teen in the 90s and whilst my mother would have been horrified at the idea I can see her agreeing, if not encouraging, such a relationship if she approved of the guy.

When I was early 20s she thought I should date the friend of a friend as he was 10 years older than me so would know what he was doing wrt sex. He was fairly perry but that didn't seem to matter.

Around the same time I was being hassled by another, older, guy. He invited himself to the house with a legitimate reason, so I begged mother to stay in. She did, but 'made' me take him to see something elsewhere in the house which gave him the opportunity to get his hands on me. And she made out the whole situation was a great joke with her friends.

So yeah, although she'd claim to be horrified I can see that actually she would possibly have encouraged it..

This is not a matter of an era in time, this is a matter of you having piss poor parents. I am so sad for you that you were so unloved and unprotected. :(

My daughter was a teen in the mid-2000s and there is no way she would be dating anyone more than a year older than she was. I didn't even allow her to date until she was 17 anyway. She could go out on "group dates" with her pack of friends that included both males and females, and I knew each and every one of those little knuckleheads, and had their phone numbers and addresses. Any monkey business goes on, I am acting a complete fool and showing up at your house to have a not very nice chat with your parents. May even bring my attorney along.

So again, what happened to you was wrong on all counts. I cannot understand their reasoning for pushing this on you instead of threatening that guy's very existence on this planet!!

I think some parents encouraged it because they wanted the daughters married and out the house and had no academic/career ambitions for them.
These threads always bring out the 'I was 17, he was 32 and we're
still together' pps, doesn't mean it was ok.
Personally I find something amiss with men who go after very young women with huge age gaps.

I have a daughter who was a teen in the 90s. I tried to give her an upbringing which included showing her that a woman can survive very well on her own even with DC.
When she was still at school she took up with a male a few years older than her. I tried everything to suggest that even one night at home would be nice. She wanted to spend all her time with this boyfriend. There was drink and some drugs involved at the boy's parents house which would never be allowed at my house. The boy's parents and I were both trying to get them to be sensible but they moved in together but it did not last.
Next she took up with an awful person with a lengthy criminal record. Again I tried to get her to spend an evening at home but she wanted to spend every minute with this guy. He was the same age as her. That relationship also ended in a dreadful mess.
Next she took up with the laziest person on the planet. A total cocklodger. When I got the demand for money I just backed off. It was a losing battle, She seems to think waste of space men are the thing to have.
I don't know what any parent could do to stop a teenager determined to go out with an unsuitable male. The law does not allow parents to lock teenagers in the house. We cant stop them smoking drinking and any form of drug taking. As much as we can love our children we have no legal way to keep them away from unsuitable males. Parents would be slammed for smacking children of that age group, we had nothing we could do to "force" our children to be sensible (as we saw it).

I would really love to know what it is that these unsuitable males have that make daughters go against their parents even to their own detriment. I only ever wanted my DC to have nice lives and not to be victims of anything

I would not have allowed my girls to date someone so much older. Men who chase after very young girls are looking for someone they can control.

I think you also have to remember that it wasn't unusual to leave school and home at 16 at that time.

I think this is probably the difference isn't it? Teenagers are considered children for longer these days. Combined with perhaps individual parents not seeing the power imbalance or not having very good boundaries.

Cimone's approach though sounds more like what we were seeing on American TV. I'm guessing from the use of attorney that's where you're from? I don't think anybody in the UK was doing group dates (that was just called hanging out :o) and I always remember finding it weird that parents would set an age that their children were allowed to start dating! It wasn't a usual practice in the UK at all.

When I was at Uni in the 80s I met a girl who was dating her teacher from school. She was his 16 year old student when they met. They got together as soon as she left school and married as soon as she graduated university. I thought the whole thing was odd but no one else seemed to bat an eyelid.

At the wedding, i do remember saying the naff "oh you must be so proud" to her mum ( I couldn't think of anything else to say!) Who said nothing. Didn't even crack a smile. At the time I thought it was because what I said was so naff. Now looking back, maybe it was because she wasn't happy with the situation. Who knows? I don't know if they stayed together.

I hear you @User57327259. I wonder about the ages or personalities involved when PPs say they "wouldn't allow" this; try stopping a determined 17 year old who has somewhere else she can stay! In the late 1980s when I was 16-18 there were still plenty of people who left school at 16 and were earning. You couldn't lock them in, and if they wanted to live independently, and had the means, I don't think you could have stopped them. You have much more influence over a teenager who you have a respectful relationship with at that age, than one who you sees you as just standing in the way of the love of her life.

As for the older men who went out with young girls, I think they're often immature and "playing above their weight" by showing a younger girl a good time. There wasn't as much social disapproval then, though of course there was some. The older man who I went out with was a great romantic and I think he thought that anything could be overcome if you fancied /loved someone enough. I never thought of him as a predator, just thought he was daft, and I outgrew him. His subsequent partners were never as young as I was, but still younger than him. I'm still in touch with him and he says now that he never used to think about whether he and his girlfriend were compatible, just whether they fancied each other.

It was really common in the 90s where I lived for teenage girls to go out with much older men. Amongst me and my friends it was pretty normal to have a 3-4 year age gap, so you’d have a 16 year old with a 20 year old etc. I’m not sure a what age it becomes acceptable to have an age gap, but many of my friends have a similar gap now in our 40s. I met my now DH when he was 22 and I was 17.
For many girls I knew it came from poor treatment at school, rather than at home. At school you had years of the same stock of boys over the years, who were of the “treat em mean keep em keen” mentality to say the least. My own experience was that teenage boys were pretty horrible. When teenage girls started seeing boys who were more mature, with cars and their own houses etc, I’m the appeal was obvious. They spoke much more kindly to the girls, even if it was to try to get them into bed (which was the same motive for the teenage boys in my experience). I hope things are better now.

I hear you @User57327259. I wonder about the ages or personalities involved when PPs say they "wouldn't allow" this; try stopping a determined 17 year old who has somewhere else she can stay!

Oh for sure, but quite a lot of us on this thread, including the OP, are thinking of instances in which the parents actively encouraged or seemed to approve of the relationship.

In addition to the one I mentioned upthread where my friend (15 at the time I think) was introduced to this guy in his late 20s/early 30s by her parents, I've just remembered another one whereby my friend (also mid teens but looked way older) was regularly brought along to 18+ events by her Dad and encouraged to get together with his friends. Just awful.

Hi everyone, thank you so much for all your replies.

First of all, to anyone who has been through this, I am so sorry you went through this too. Thank you for sharing your experiences

It seems as though older men/teen girl relationships were really common. Sadly I am not surprised.

I can relate to a lot of what you have shared. I was nodding my head at the parents wanting the girls out the house, seeing the guy as having “good prospects” comments! I wasn’t a cool girl at school at all, but it was seen as “cool” that I had an older boyfriend - even by the teachers! I was seen as very mature for my age, mainly because of emotional abuse and having to be a parent to my parents. At 15/16 emotionally I was still a child though and not ready for adult relationships.

I do agree with PP who say that this is not a generational thing, it’s a poor parenting thing. It’s about boundaries isn’t it and the basic duty as a parent to protect your child.

It must be hard as a parent to try and stop this from happening. @User57327259 - I agree it’s difficult to stop determined teenagers from getting themselves into bad situations. I would say to you, the main thing is you tried your best and didn’t encourage it. Your daughter will look back in time and see that you tried to help her.

Thanks so much for sharing your experiences with me, I wasn’t sure if I was overreacting to what happened or not but I feel validated now.

I had a 3 year relationship with a 30yo man when I was 17. My parents were fine with it, despite the fact he was an out-of-work musician and very obvious waster. Odd. I think even now they would say it was fine, or at least if it wasn't fine that was my look out.

Obviously 17 is above the age of consent so it's slightly different but I know I'd be terribly worried if my DD were in a relationship like that.

I think perhaps that generation sees younger girls with older men as more acceptable than we do- look at how pop stars with underage girls was treated as a bit of a joke. I also think there was less understanding of how vulnerable teenage girls can be and the fact that maturity and judgement take time to develop. My parents were teens in the 60s and their view of sexual relations was very much coloured by the idea of free love etc (despite having married early themselves and having a conventional relationship). They see our generation as very po-faced and find the idea that a relationship might be exploitative because of power dynamics etc a lot of "woke nonsense" designed to trip men up.

Things change OP but it doesn’t sound like you parents were supportive or had your best interests 100% at heart?
My grandmother married my grandfather when she was 18 and he was 31. It was HIS family that shunned her as they all thought she was some silly young girl and not suitable. Her family thought it was all hunky dory. They stayed happily married for over 60 years.

I can remember 2 women between the ages of 16 and 18 who were coupled up with older men - women all still in school (this was about 1997).

One of the men was mid-20s and had divorced, his girlfriend used to be able to stay over with him (and go to school the next day) quite often. Social life quite tied to one particular pub, where I think they met. The parents were not cheering them on but were ok about it. She was a very nice and normal person but was looking forward to getting away from school asap and getting a house etc.

The second went to university but stayed with her (much older but not married before) man in a long distance relationship all through, and married almost immediately afterwards. That was...uncomfortable. After a few years, they split up.

From my point of view I had a fair bit of attention from guys mid-late 20s when I was 17, mostly from jobs and from things like singing and theatre groups. Parents quite liked them I think, I went on dates and had a couple of short relationships but nothing serious. I'd guess my Mum was worried but also trusted them at least halfway as I think she considered them reasonably responsible - she was more concerned about longer nights out clubbing with friends etc, not that I did that much. At 18 I went to uni and was then more interested in my immediate peers.

I met my 21-year-old boyfriend at 16 in 1999 and was with him for 5 years. He wasn’t dodgy at all, and we‘re still friends now. I moved out for a while at 16 and was pretty much living my own life.

I do remember friends younger than that dating guys in their 20s, although not sure what their parents’ thoughts on that were, or how much they knew. I had a friend who was dating a 24-year-old at 15, which seems crazy to me now. They went on to have a kid together, who is now in his 20s.

At the time I think she (and I!) just considered ourselves to be very grown up (😂). We were out drinking in pubs from 14. I don’t think we’d have been interested in anyone older than early 20s though.

@BertieBotts

I think you also have to remember that it wasn't unusual to leave school and home at 16 at that time.

I think this is probably the difference isn't it? Teenagers are considered children for longer these days. Combined with perhaps individual parents not seeing the power imbalance or not having very good boundaries.

Cimone's approach though sounds more like what we were seeing on American TV. I'm guessing from the use of attorney that's where you're from? I don't think anybody in the UK was doing group dates (that was just called hanging out :o) and I always remember finding it weird that parents would set an age that their children were allowed to start dating! It wasn't a usual practice in the UK at all.

By 18 I'd been working full time for 2 years and often spent whole weekends at boyfriends houses. My 18 year old is still putting her school uniform on every day. I definitely see the difference between 30 years ago and now.

I also agree that Cimone sounds American, I didn't grow up with anybody who's parents had those kind of rules, especially regarding an age allowed to date. However, I have cousins in the US and that was definitely their teenage years. Any guy that turned up to pick them up for a date had to meet the parents and be vetted first. Here in the UK, most of us would just skip outside when we spotted the car and he wouldn't even meet your parents unless you started dating regularly.

I left school (aged 18) in 1997, six months later one of my classmates married our history teacher. None of us had any idea, we were all appalled. Tbf we were mostly appalled because he was very unattractive - if it had been our 25 year old geography teacher we could have seen her POV.

Several girls were secretly dating older men but I don't think most parents would have been fine with it. I think they didn't know

Not as bad as your parents, but similar, when I was 16 my boyfriend was 21. He didn't work, took drugs, would pick me up from school and him and his friends (some 23) would even come to youth club with our friends. My parents loved him and encouraged me to move in with him, but the worst thing is when he cheated on me my mum encouraged me to forgive him. My friendship group was mostly 14-18 year olds and then about 5 20-23 year old men who most of the girls slept with. Only one parent hugely objected as far as I recall, her parents reported him to the police for constitutional rape (she was 15, he was 21) and we all thought her parents were way OTT at the time. This is at a time when teenagers were topless in daily newspapers and there was definitely a culture of barely legal teens being some kind of trophy. Many friends dad's were leery. It upsets me a lot looking back.