Cannot communicate with DH , I’m so unhappy

[MRS54321]

I’ve been with DH for around 15 years. 6 married, one DC

I’ve often found him to be a “difficult “ man , owing to the fact that he suffers greatly from anxiety , and for years I “let him off “ or normalised his behaviours/quirks/ticks/obsessions ..
Since having DC ,my eyes are wide open to his issues and how deeply they have affected my life.

Amongst the many issues we have, a huge one is communication.
I cannot talk to or ask him about anything without a show down
So I realised for years, I would not even ask him if he knew where my keys where because it just was not worth the effort
But since having DC I now HAVE to rely on him and discuss things: and I just cannot be bothered with him and his “issues” anymore ..

• recently I’m failing to see anything I like about him , but I’m trying at least whist the DC is young.

I cannot ask him anything when he arrives in form work as “ he’s just in from work!”
if he’s doing another job , he cracks up when he’s disturbed and cannot take any direction
If I ask him to do something which he wasn’t planning , he is unhappy and lists the things that he DOES do..

Tonight, ( after informing me that I’m in a bad mood as soon as he walks in the door-a guaranteed way to actually PUT me in a bad mood) I asked him to fix a messy item in the home ,which he had broken. And I had to establish how much cleaning and where to clean up,after he’s finished. This has lead to an argument : he thinks I’m nit picking or trying to catch him out ( a common reply) when actually, I’m just trying o establish where in my house do I need to defrost because a: the job was gross b: we have small DC and c: he had clearly not thought to do so
I didn’t say any of the reasons ( which I think are quite reasonable ) as he kept cutting me off so I gave up.

He doesn’t like when I ask sweetly/nicely ( I’m condescending) He doesn’t like it when I ask flatly ( I’m not being nice about it)

Often , I have to text him lists of anything that needs done or I need to ask him.
This isn’t a practical way to spend our lives.
Me: tiptoeing around asking something as simple as “ have you seen that letter that was on the ta so yesterday?” or just not asking at all

• he refuses marriage therapy and also ADHD diagnosis

I’m so deeply unhappy every single day. He is unhappy too, but thinks he’s trying. But it feels like small tokens , so he can carry on and not have to change anything about himself

Any practical advice? Not just “ he’s rubbish leave him” as ever

The practical advice is to see it for what it is.

The things he does makes things better for himself and no one else.
He doesn't have to compromise, discuss anything, do anything he doesn't want to do.

He's happy because he gets his way all the time.

Is he moody and snappy at his work or to other people?

[quote MRS54321]@girafferafferaffe that’s great you were able to deal with it
It’s such an ongoing issue now I’m afraid he’ll do it all and I simply couldn’t be bothered to deal with it a minute longer.
I’ve tried lists. And notebooks. And texts reminding.
I can pretty much deal with all of it, it’s just the arguing back with me even when he knows he’s over reacting or wrong I can’t deal with
How did your DP get a diagnosis? Did you have to march him to Gp? Did he recognise his behaviour was abnormal?[/quote]
He did it all himself after I told him I couldn't cope with his spending anymore and being left with the consequences. I am not responsible for his lists or timekeeping at all - he is. It's why it works. I'm not his mum, I can't make him do stuff and he knows it. He honestly tries his absolute hardest to be the husband and dad he wants to be. Occasionally he will fuck up but it is what it is. I see the effort he puts in and that's what I appreciate.

I think your h doesn't seem to want to do that and you can't make him either. If I were you I would drop all 'wife' duties for him (as he will see it). Separate bedrooms. No sex. Don't do his washing. Don't clear up after him. It's not your responsibility if he's late or whatever.

He needs to see that you are absolutely done.

I remember telling my h didn't he want better for his family, for his dd? He did get very upset, but it worked. He needed that shock.

Sorry also meant to say, he got the diagnosis himself. Paid for a charity to do the assessment. He was 32 at the time. It was a lot to take in at that point in his life when he realised that his parents (and others) had just labelled him as a pain in the arse. He looked at the way his life had gone and realised that a lot of things would have gone differently if he knew what he had. He didn't dwell on it for long. He set out to better his life (and by proxy, ours)

Why would you want your sc to live in this environment?

Also, is he like this at work, I'm sure he's asked to do things by his boss or colleagues, does he react in the same way? If not, then he can control his actions and chooses to be like this at home

He’s conditioning you to never ask him to do anything, so he can carry on as he is, uninterrupted.

I feel like MY life would be harder ( for different reasons) but he’d be back, dating and living a feckless life within about a month 🙄

That's patriarchy unfortunately.

But honestly though, would it be harder? I think you're possibly underestimating the burden of trying to arrange your life with somebody who won't communicate. Of course you would still have issues communicating with your future-ex. But that would be a much smaller part of your life. Other things that are hard like money, childcare etc are at least fixable or flexible problems that will change as the DC grow. This problem is impossible and yet it's taking up so much of your energy every day as well as already having to do the job of two adults because you can't rely on him to do it.

I have ADHD BTW. Nothing about this is reading to me like an ADHD diagnosis would help. The lack of communication isn't an ADHD thing or if it is related, it's so deeply ingrained as a trauma response that it's not going to go away automatically - that will take decades, if he wants it to, which he probably doesn't because it doesn't sound like he recognises it as a problem. Diagnosis most likely would not highlight that for him - there isn't really follow up therapy and most resources focus on day to day issues like organisation, work deadlines, impulse control, addiction.

Whether or not he has ASD, ADHD, anxiety, whatever. It doesn't actually matter. He might be doing this on purpose because it suits him. It might be an unhealthy coping mechanism/learned response. But he doesn't sound like somebody who is trying to be a better partner but failing. And that means I don't think any diagnosis would help.

Try reading "Why Does He Do That?" There is no section about ASD/ADHD/mental health disorders but there is a section about alcoholism, and if you substitute "ADHD" for "alcoholism" and "medicated" for "sober" you will probably find a lightbulb goes on. It's like one of the stages of grief - bargaining - it's like you're pinning all your hopes on this being a disorder and not really him, and therefore if the disorder can be identified, it can be medicated away or you will understand him and he will make sense. The problem is that these things are not a magic fix and he probably still won't make sense. Abusive behaviour rarely makes sense until you understand patterns of abuse and control.

I know that there will be some parts of him that you really like, some nice sides to his personality or character. You wouldn't have got together otherwise. Perhaps there is a lost little boy or a damaged soul that you can see inside trapped in some angry outer layer or some past hurt. We are often attracted to this kind of thing because it makes us feel nurturing but then it traps us, because you can never quite reconcile what other people are saying or the behaviours you find difficult or abusive, with this vision of our partner that nobody else seems to see. The reality is that nobody is ever 100% a bastard, non-redeemable. But they can be enough of one that it is impossible to have a healthy relationship with them, and that's what you probably need to work out, if you're at that point. At some point you need to stop papering over the cracks and realise you will never be able to mend some holes.

@girafferafferaffe

Out of interest

Do you feel you get emotional support from him? Do you feel loved?

@Toanewstart23 yes absolutely. If I have any kind of problem he will talk to me about it. He will always ask how I am, how my day was. When I cry (rare!) he is there to support me when before he would have turned away. He comes up with solutions if I want them. He is really kind and patient with me and dd. Since his diagnosis he has tried to open up to me more about things. He would regularly struggle at work and it would cause him such huge anxiety that he used to shut down but now he can say I'm really struggling with my anxiety and overwhelm. I'm glad to be able to talk things through with him because I could never figure out how to before.

He's setting you up op. It's gaslighting. He knows what he is doing. Deliberately making you feel you cannot raise anything with him or you are 'nagging'.

For the love of goodness don't have kids with him. You'll be knackered all the time and stuck.

He is manipulative and - you can't fix it.

@Ploppingperp06 it was the loo, so we kind of needed it. And he broke it

I have to ask him things when he gets home ( usually as I’m having him a coffee and putting his dinner out) as we live in a small home and any loud /noisy jobs have to be done by baby’s bedtime at 7pm

ADHD , Im fully aware that it doesn’t excuse. poor attitude ( for eg : the loo- usually he would start it, and just not finish it )
I ha r a good friend with it and in a workplace , if was nearly impossible to work WITH her, she’s very lovely
I just don’t think it helps his frustration at me or himself.
Ive said severaL times my eyes are open now.

You have to ask him things when he gets home? Why? How many “things” can there be that your often asking him to do jobs as soon as he arrives home?
Tbh this does sound pretty naggy as I can’t believe there are that many jobs he must do right on arrival from work.

He is doing this because he can. He absolutely feels entitled to act as he does and he only cares for his own self and his needs being met.

"I think about leaving so much @stuntbubbles but my little DC may see his DF less and MIL would be broken hearted"

Neither are any basis at all to stay with such a man and there are no prizes for martyring yourself as you are doing.

Do you honestly think that this man would want to see his child anyway going forward; no because all he cares about is his own self and getting his own needs met. Your MIL can still maintain a relationship with her grandchild if she wants to. Stop kicking the can down the road here.

It sounds exhausting. You’ve spent 15 years already - but it’s worse not better. It doesn’t have to be that way

Oh and what is this about asking a Poor Man to do a job when he comes home? So MEAN. What a load of bull! Anyone with a baby knows that arriving home is time for a burst of activity not lying on the sofa with a g&t and your slippers ffs. Get a grip!

I’m sorry to be blunt but your “MIL being broken hearted” is not a good enough reason to spend YOUR life in utter agony and unhappiness every single day. I have a marriage like this and my kids are now teens and it is horrendous. It does not get better. You cannot totally change someone. This is who your husband is. He is difficult and passive aggressive and his way of being works for him. You are stuck in a pattern and it will only get worse. It has for me and I did all the stuff you are doing right now eg try for the little kids excuse, see if he will change, try all the different ways of communicating, bend over backwards, speak in a monotone, I even tried sitting on the floor in front of him when asking something to be “non threatening” as me standing up and asking was me “being angry”. Nothing works. My husband is defensive and avoidant and resentful and everything is awkward. It is a SHIT way to live. Please please do not be me. I wish I’d got out 10 years ago. I could be happy now. It’s too late for me but it’s not for you. Getting out when kids are little is MUCH MUCH easier than when they are teens and can beg you not to go and you can see the heartbreak on their faces. Your husbands crap attitude will impact them every single day if you stay. This will get worse. You will find it harder and harder to leave. Do it NOW. You’ve tried. What has he tried? What one thing has he tried? Nothing. Stand up for your own life and your own well-being. You deserve a healthy partner and you will find one but you cannot do it while you are stuck in this shitstorm.

You must be absolutely devoid of attraction for this man.

@howtoleaveit that sent chills down my spine
I’m so sorry for you , too

I have an old friend whose parents divorced when we were in our late teens. His parents had been miserable for years and years, and the dad was a selfish git too. When they finally did divorce, they told my friend that they had stayed together for his sake, but he wished they had done it much earlier, instead of being so unhappy for so long. Because he knew, you can't hide misery from children.

We are 40 now, and I see the impact of his upbringing on so much of his attitude, his behaviour, and in his relationships. It's not good.

Being happy, and teaching your kids how to be happy, is surely a better thing to do than pretending to fit in with a societal norm, isn't it?

If you take nothing else away from this thread, please understand this - you can not change him. You can only change how your behave. He has to want to change, and right now, he thinks he's happy.

May I suggest you find yourself some counselling support to think through how you would like to live your life, and how you could achieve it.

This could mean leaving him (after taking advice on the legal aspects and any benefit entitlements), this could mean staying in the same house, but living completely different lives. Either way, you will be taking control of your life which can do wonders for your mental health too. Also, and I make no bones about bringing this to your attention, you will be making the decision for your DS. He's living in this tense environment, learning how to relate to people and he's not learning in a happy place.

Your DH has anxiety issues you say.
Is he on medication for that?
Has he ever been for any kind of therapy for it?

Unfortunately only he can decide to go to the gp but it sounds like he doesn’t want to.

Anxiety and stress may well be the root cause of his behaviour towards you but that does not mean it is not abusive.
He knows he has issues but chooses to take it out on you. Does he behave like this at work or with other family members?

His behaviour may well be just plain abusive. Could it all be a control thing to keep you in line ?
Or it could be not coping with his anxiety issues.
Unfortunately there is no real way of knowing because he won’t go to the dr.
So he knows that he is treating you badly, knows it’s having a negative effect on you but he continues to do it . That what makes it abuse.

Don’t assume that bad behaviour can be attributed to adhd or autism.
I know people who are close to me who have these neuro developmental disorders and they are the kindest, gentlest people you could wish for.

You have to recognise abuse for what it is.

Your DH won’t change.
You have to decide whether you want this life for yourself and dc or whether you deserve something far better.

Right, so you don't want to be told to leave him, he won't do counselling and you are "deeply unhappy every day"

So the only real solution is to stop trying to be "nice"

He doesn’t like when I ask sweetly/nicely ( I’m condescending) He doesn’t like it when I ask flatly ( I’m not being nice about it)

Who cares if you are being nice about it? Frankly, he is being 0% nice to you so why are you bending yourself into knots trying to find a magical way to communicate where he will listen? It doesn't exist. Just be done. Be blunt with him, tell him things flatly and when he complains that you are not being "nice" tell him you've tried being nice for X number of years and it's got you nowhere. Then dont engage further. It takes 2 people to argue and if you refuse to participate past "I'm not having an argument because i asked you a simple question" then you can the drawn in.

I have lots of experience dealing with people like your H. They know exactly how to manipulate you to behave a certain way. Once you stop caring what they think or what their reactions will be life gets a lot more free.

@Comtesse

Really? So if he had of been home with the kid and she’d just walked in the door and been like “here’s a job you need to do” you’d say that? I doubt it

Yes @Ploppingperp06 that is exactly how it works in my house. My DH is a sahd and I work full time - do you think I come home from work for a lie down? No i take off my coat and jump into cooking the dinner or English homework or whatever it is that needs doing until whenever the kids are in bed. Yes it is relentless but so be it - And if I can do that working 50-60 hours a week then I expect the dads to do it too.

@Comtesse exactly! Particularly if he was the one who broke the toilet and toilets are essential. People need to feel the repercussions of their actions