Need courage to ask DH to separate

[Needyourhelp123]

I've been married for nearly 18 years. My DH and I were madly in love when we married, or so I thought; then, overnight he seemed to fall out of love with me. Suddenly he found many things about me irritating, and he stopped wanting any intimacy, let alone sex. I stuck around, mainly because I didn't want to go back to being permanently single, and I was in my mid-30s so it didn't seem like a great time to be looking for a partner. I've never had an affair. We have 2 DD (10 and 13), and since having them I've felt I can't leave. My DH is a very good father - much more affectionate and engaged with the DDs than he is with me. I've always planned to leave him but now I'm over 50 and really desperate to. I'm still in good shape, and I just want someone to desire me/appreciate me. Could anyone give me some motivating words, coz I can't bear the thought that I'm going to disrupt my girls' lives just to be selfish. Our marriage is a poor role model though, which is the only thought keeping me on course to do this. Any help gratefully received!

Please don't insult me by implying I'm naive to think he won't use every trick in the book to get back at me. He has quite a strong temper (verbal, not physical) and I wouldn't be at all surprised if he's really, really horrible to me. I'm not expecting this to be easy, I just want to have a nice life before I get too old.

You are right to leave if you are unhappy but you are very naive if you think all you need is love.

Your plan is to get a full time job which will pay enough to rent your own place, big enough for the children to visit you, pay all your bills and put away enough savings to give you some sort of pension in 15 years time.

Unless you are going to be a very high earner, I don't see how you can do it without divorcing and splitting the marital assets.

OP - you aren’t selfish to leave your H.
Or old, or hormonal to want to do that.

But I do think your state of mind (whether it is from being unhappy for a long time, amplified by hormonal storm of big M) - isn’t allowing you to think clearly about the path from where you are to where you want to be.

In a long marriage - assets get divided 50/50. A judge won’t sign off on an unfair deal that leaves you without much, while your H stays in the house.
So - you will be depriving him from half of joint assets. And both of you will be deprived from time with kids - as you’ll have to share them.

So - don’t take when people say it will be hard - as some sort of attack on you. It is always hard, and ALWAYS worse than you thought it would be.
This is where you aren’t seeing clearly and where you are being naive to expect the best.

Hard as it is - try to prepare for the worst. And plan.

Good luck.

You are in no way being unreasonable for wanting a better life. But have you actually tried counseling or other forms of working on the marriage?

You say you were both madly in love when you first met. Well what if you could rekindle that love, surely that would be far easier than starting all over again from square one?

@Needyourhelp123

Thank you for all the responses, and thanks for some of the more encouraging ones. I do have skills that will get me a job, and I last had a job for over 2 years that ended mid-2019 so I'm hopeful of finding something. The jobs I'm looking for are mostly remote, flexible, desk-based jobs so childcare is unlikely to be a problem.

We managed to buy our house thanks to the equity built up in a flat that I owned - my DH has contributed much more to the mortgage, but had no equity at the outset. I really don't care about money, or where I live, or how much I have to live on. Life is short and love is all that matters.

I really don't care about money, or where I live, or how much I have to live on. Life is short and love is all that matters

It doesn't matter where you live or how much you live on? Are you for real?

Only the incredibly naiive or the privileged would be able to afford to be so nonchalant about things that are so fundamental to most people.

To take what you said very literally - where you live can influence your children's education, their social circle, their safety and their health. It affects you to, although you might not see that if you've never had to live in a rough or deprived area.

If he wanted to sell the house, where do you think you will live and can you afford that on your own? Will you be ok? @Rangoon points out a few sensible things to consider first.

Thank you tiredofthisshit21, much appreciated

I only want a divorce and all the financial/emotional heartache that goes with it, some time down the line.

But your husband might not see it that way. No fault divorces are due to come in April - he might decide he wants out and to start his own new life then.

The financial and emotional heartache, as you put it, will kick in as soon as you separate. Because you'll no longer be on the same side, wanting the same thing.

Your wanting to separate is not a bad thing, most people haven't suggested you stay together. We're just suggesting that you consider practicalities of splitting your household. Because once you've put it out there that you want to separate, the little snowball will gather pace and grow and you will want / need to understand what's going to happen.

Plan for the worst, hope for the best. If the worst happens you're prepared, if it doesn't that's a nice bonus. I agree with PPs that even if he wants this he could turn nasty. A friend's Ex had an affair and left and still punished her for the divorce. In his mind the affair was her fault, so it was her fault their marriage was over.

I'd get a job first, then start the seperation and divorce process. See if you'll be entitled to any UC on that wage as a single person. Work out your income and outgoings. Have a look at child maintenance. If you both have DC 50/50 then you might not get any.

Get an idea of house value and work out roughly how much equity you have and write down all assets/debts including both your pensions and any cars, car loans, personal debt and so on. Then go and see a solicitor to get a rough idea of what you may get out of divorce.

Then you talk to him and tell him you're seperating. You talk about the DC whose going to have them when and so on. You can actually seperate under one roof if needed till the house sells. Or if both of you are in agreement you can, at least during seperation, take turns being in the house for your agreed time with the DC and staying somewhere else when it's not. This is called nesting. This is where a flat could come in, but keep in mind this set up only works if both parties are amicable and willing to work together.

I wouldn't just leave, unless you can be housed in a way that your DC could be with you at least 50/50 as this could effect how much time you get with them post divorce and you could find yourself paying maintenance if he has them more than 50%.

@WhatsitWiggle

I only want a divorce and all the financial/emotional heartache that goes with it, some time down the line.

But your husband might not see it that way. No fault divorces are due to come in April - he might decide he wants out and to start his own new life then.

The financial and emotional heartache, as you put it, will kick in as soon as you separate. Because you'll no longer be on the same side, wanting the same thing.

Your wanting to separate is not a bad thing, most people haven't suggested you stay together. We're just suggesting that you consider practicalities of splitting your household. Because once you've put it out there that you want to separate, the little snowball will gather pace and grow and you will want / need to understand what's going to happen.

I agree. The sooner you sort the financials and the divorce, the better. You can't properly move on until then.

Thanks LunaAndHerMoonDragons, that's a very useful and kind (!) post. I can see from all the responses that I've kinda been in denial about the reality of initiating a separation.

Could anyone recommend a resource that I could go to for advice on all this, or do I need to find a divorce lawyer, even if it's just to talk about separating?

I should have said, start looking for a job, as obviously it can be hard to get a job. I'd take it as given that your H isn't going to just move out to a flat or pay for a flat so you can move out. The other option to look at if after a couple months you can't find a job, given how much you want out asap, would be to seperate under one roof and apply for UC while job seeking. You'd need to sit down and work out first if this would be enough and given you have to officially seperate first you'd need some money to cover the period post seperation until you either find a job or your UC application is processed. This could be a couple of months.

At 10 and 13 childcare won't be an issue by the time you're employed and in a position to leave. The elder will be at least 14-15 and the younger 12 or so. Mine both came home from school together at that age and had a toasted sandwich or soup or whatever....then I came home a couple of hours later.

I’m in a not dissimilar position in that I’m ending a very long marriage. Your reasons for wanting to end it are perfectly valid - lack of intimacy in a marriage is utterly soul destroying, and very hard to get back when it sounds like it’s never really been established in the first place.

I agree with others though, have a plan about what you want to happen with the kids, what you want to happen financially (do you want to buy him out, sell and buy somewhere else etc, what about pension settlement - could you forgo a claim on his pension to keep the house if you wanted, what will your income be post split, what benefits are you entitled to etc etc), what about furniture for a new place how will you manage that, what do you want from your marital home?

It’s easy to say you don’t care what you live on etc but this is 18 years of your life, a commitment made together with all the things that go with it. The reality is you will need an income, somewhere to live suitable for your kids. What if he doesn’t want 50:50 childcare, what support will you need to be able to work etc etc. Having a clear idea as a starting point doesn’t mean you’ll get it all your own way, it’s a starting point for negotiation. He may be perfectly reasonable, he may not - who knows - but knowing your own limits will stop you ending up in a tricky spot down the line.

I really understand the wish just to be done with it, but it’s a marathon not a sprint. Like any marathon, the more preparation you put in the easier it will be.

Something that's comes across strongly in your posts is your focus on finding someone else, and a physical connection - from I'm still in good shape, and I just want someone to desire me/appreciate me to saying later on how you just want a night of passion, or how you keep mentioning that you haven't had an affair.

As others have said, separation is not going to be simple compared with a divorce, not least because there's no way he's going to fund a flat if your letter even hints that you'll be using the opportunity to have a sexual reawakening.

The other thing you might find is decent men are very thin on the ground as a single mum or 50+ (and even in the cases of my friends and I, in our 30s and conventionally attractive). Pretty much any woman out there can get sex, no problem - though not necessarily with the people you'd want to be with - but it's a really bad idea to split on the basis that you'll find someone who'll love you better. There's a fairly high likelihood that in a year's time he'll be dating a lot, or settling in with a younger woman, while you have the kids a lot of nights and aren't getting a lot of Tindr swipes - or are trying to extricate yourself from what seemed a passionate fling who turned out to be either DH 2.0 / a cocklodger/ borderline alcoholic and abusive. Single and solo can still be great, if things at home are horrible. But if it's mostly the sex, it's worth really acknowledging that the grass is not necessarily much greener if it's a swift new love you're seeking.

Other thing is to consider the story he'll be telling himself, and your shared friends. In return for 'sexless marriage, bad temper', he'll be saying 'supported her as a SAHM even though we had school age children, broke up her home to find passion'.
You can still be right - chances are that you'll both be right and both be wrong - but again you need to think this through first, to have a shared front with children and anticipate what others might be hearing.

Relationship counselling can be very good for all of this, you'll need to communicate better to be good coparents. If you're struggling to do it, it could also be a way to share your desires.

OP I just wanted to come on and say good luck to you whatever you do. Going without any kind of sex life for ten years sounds absolutely awful - and I have admiration for how strong and clear-headed you seem about wanting passion and affection - you haven't let this mans dreadful treatment of you affect your self-esteem and you seem determined to see this through.

I agree with the points about getting a job and being prepared to see your dh behave in a way you would never have expected once the die is cast - my very best friend has been going through a nasty divorce for the last two years and the way her (seemingly to us all very nice before) dh has behaved throughout (despite him being the one who cheated) has been nothing short of outrageous.

You absolutely deserve a chance at finding love again.

Jesus Christ @OverTheRubicon - way to ruin OP's self esteem. Don't leave your shit husband who you don't love any more because you're probably to past it to find anyone else and most single men are also shit even if you're attractive and in your 30's like me? What a crappy and unsupportive thing to say. I agree that dating is hard the older you get. But speaking as someone who remarried well into my 40s it's clearly possible.

Thanks guys, those posts are really helpful and a lot kinder than some of the earlier ones! I've looked on dating apps and I know that attractive men over 50 are thin on the ground. I'm aware that my H will probably have much better options and I don't mind - I'd just like us both to be happier than we are now (yes I'm being naive, I get it). I don't even care whether I never have a relationship again - I lived on my own for 10 years and was single for most of that time, so even though it'd be nice to have some passion let alone love, I can cope with being alone. I'd rather be alone than lie in bed every night, listening to my H snore, knowing he'll never touch me.

It is never too late to be happy.
This is your one life.

Focus on getting that job, getting organised financially and getting as much support as you can around you.

Making a plan and taking back control through doing so, will empower you hugely.

Thanks billy1966, I think you're right :)

FWIW my XH and I separated reasonably amicably. Of course we had some harsh words and it wasn’t all plain sailing. But he’s fundamentally a decent person and so am I. So he stayed on the mortgage and paid a decent amount of maintenance to allow me to stay in the family home, even now 10 years later. We were always pretty flexible on access to the DCs, with me accommodating his shift patterns and him coming to stay at the house with them while I went away on holiday with DP to avoid disruption.

He works abroad now. The DCs miss him when they don’t see him for a while of course, but then he worked away from home when we were married too, so that’s not a specific divorce thing. But they all see that he’s happy, I am happier too (or at least was happy most of the time with my now XDP. And will be again.) They understand that we drifted apart and that we can both parent them in our own ways separately.

Divorce doesn’t have to be hard on them (or you). If you both put the DCs’ needs first it will all work itself out.

Hi, my h left me a few days ago after 17 years of marriage. Entitledto is a good website to help give an idea of financials. I'm a part time low earner but I think we'll be ok once house sold. Good luck op.

I've been pretty badly treated by my disgusting ex so I'm all for getting your ducks firmly in a row. Also protect yourself from taking the blame if you are proactive in leaving. He's herded you by his actions. This is not your fault. What I do want to say to you is this, life after the deep freeze is fantastic! Go for it! Good luck lovely!

Thanks so much, RoyKentsChestHair. I know someone who also managed to divorce her husband with a fair outcome for both of them, mainly (as it sounds like you guys did) by putting the needs of the children first. I'm sure my H and I would do the same, as he's a devoted father and would never do anything to hurt them (same as me).

And thanks, ThackeryBinks - sorry your ex treated you badly, and I'm very glad your life is fantastic now!

And also thanks thisyearsuckssofar. Very sorry to hear your ex seems to have sprung this on you after such a long marriage. It sounds as though you're coping, though - I do hope so.

This thread was a real reality check. I realise I'd been trying not to think about the enormity of what I plan to do, but all the messages telling me to get my ducks in a row have woken me up. I will come up with a plan and work towards it. I will also edit the letter I have written to my H to make sure it's not so obvious l'm leaving him to try and find someone else ;)

Thanks everyone, and good luck to those of you struggling with a difficult separation / divorce. It seems it's always worth it in the end :)

@tiredofthisshit21

Jesus Christ *@OverTheRubicon* - way to ruin OP's self esteem. Don't leave your shit husband who you don't love any more because you're probably to past it to find anyone else and most single men are also shit even if you're attractive and in your 30's like me? What a crappy and unsupportive thing to say. I agree that dating is hard the older you get. But speaking as someone who remarried well into my 40s it's clearly possible.

That's not my point. OP has said in her latest message that she's fine to be alone, and that's great. But her earlier messages were extremely focussed on finding someone new, and experiencing passion, and said how she'd be happy to have an affair. In my life and on this site, you see again and again people who've left unhappy marriages looking to find someone, and either jumped in to something worse, or are miserably alone. Just like it's important to separate with reasonable expectations about maintenance, I think it's important to leave a marriage because alone is better, not with the goal of finding someone new soon after - it is much more likely to result in a better outcome.

(and lest that is all too depressing, statistically the vast majority of single parents do end up in relationships - and probably all the ones who want one. It's just that a good one takes time)