30 year marriage on the rocks

[Idonthearawordtheyresaying]

I can't believe I'm writing this. All I did was take a photo with DHs phone and go to whatsapp it to myself. There above me in the chat was a woman I had asked him to stop communicating with. I challenged him and got excuses. My favourite being 'she was messaging me, I was just replying'. I have been uncomfortable with their friendship for years, then my gut instinct kicked in last year that more was going on. He was her support through a tough mental health period in her life. I'm struggling with menopause, fatigue and mental health. He never asks me how I am, he has watched me slowly disappear into myself and gave me nothing. I feel like shit. I honestly don't know what to do next. He is denying it but I just know. I don't think it's a sexual affair tho I am now questioning his very long cycle rides. He offered to show me his laptop (emails) but never offered me his phone to look at texts and fear of what I might see stopped me from asking. I saw her whatsapp messages and what is obvious about them is that they are parts of conversations. He tried to tell me she was just sharing random information when I challenged him last year. This time he has told me he has found my menopause difficult when we talked around our marriage and he gave me a list of my faults - all health related. He pretty much shut me down with 'you know I find it difficult to talk'.
I'm working mainly on gut instinct here and I'm not even sure what I want to hear from you guys. I don't know what to do. Except cry and occasionally be physically sick. I trusted him 100%, convincing myself I was paranoid. Now I go over things I just accepted and feel like I've been lied to.

Thank you @Malibuismysecrethome

You deserve better. The fact that you’ve been together so long is not a reason to stay it’s an absolute for leaving: after all that time, all those shared moments, all that love and trust he flings it away as if nothing.

How can you bear to look at him?!!

I'm guessing my sudden urge to move to Orkney is hormonal

Wanting to escape when you're in a very stressful situation probably isn't due to the menopause @Idonthearawordtheyresaying . It's part of the normal range of feelings someone might have.

It seems to me you've convinced yourself you're acting bonkers for quite a while- your husband probably has a hand in you feeling that way, too.

What happened between him and this woman in the past, that he was banned from messaging her? Just wondered if he had cheated/flirted with her before, which'd make it even worse. But even the being overly supportive to her in the past rather than you, his wife, is aggravating/inappropriate.

Gus is right- they almost always try to blame their victim.

Apparently it's only because I have pointed out how the relationship crossed boundaries to him, he sees the problem

But you'd already done that in the past @Idonthearawordtheyresaying . Plus the flirting/physical compliments to that extent is not ok if someone is in a relationship, everyone knows that. I mean, a few people might be ok with it, but most would think it out of line.

You also had told him not to communicate with this person, so he knew doing that crossed a boundary he had agreed to respect.

I think I want us to continue talking though.

Why? You know what he's done and that it's not ok. Don't let him convince you you're to blame for any of it, or make you feel sorry for him when he's the one that's acted out of line.

@PegasusReturns I can barely be in the same room. All the comments on here are very helpful for me. They pretty much cover everything that's gone on in my head.
@me4real one of the things he's glossed over is why he kept messaging, I'm not letting that one go. I agree that he has contributed to me feeling bonkers.
I became uncomfortable with the relationship quite quickly. He works in a female dominated environment and I never, ever felt like that about any of his colleagues. He changed his phone behaviour, had it with him all the time, on silent. We went away together one weekend and his whatsapp went off. I'd reached the stage that I recognised it was from her because of his body language. He became more animated. At that point, I asked him if he'd heard from her recently. That's when he said it was just random. I told him I didn't like what was going on and for him to stop messaging her. Only now am I realising she knew that he was somewhere without a phone signal.

Look whatever you do op, don't let him convince you that you are crazy.

His behaviour will affect your mental health and not just because you are suffering with menopausal symptoms. He should be helping and supporting you through this period of your life not making it a million times worse.

He really has not acted with kindness at all.

How long has he known this woman and how old is she? Does she know you do not want them in communication?

Op is it possible to find out more about this woman, just for your own peace of mind. I would want to know about her.

@Malibuismysecrethome @Onthedunes as far as I am aware she doesn't know I don't want them in contact. She's our age. I have met her, I didn't really take to her, couldn't understand what sparked their friendship, he worked with so many other more fun, interesting women that never got that reaction.
I cried last night in a way I never thought was possible. This loss has triggered every other loss I have ever felt. There was a weird peaceful feeling after, probably caused by hyperventilation!!!!

That’s heartbreaking I’m so sorry. Is it possible that she instigated contact and is driving this.

@Malibuismysecrethome I think last night was cathartic for me. I think she does instigate things but that's the way he works. Emotionally I have always had to be the instigator in our relationship. We talked again today and I am holding nothing back. I'm going to move forward from this with him but I'm not going to feel bad if I can't work past the loss of trust. I knew when I started this thread that I would probably have replies that I would really connect to and replies that would give me different perspectives and make me think more. He has behaved like a complete shit. For years. But I want to try to work through it. The relationship we had before this is worth trying to get back but I'm also not fooling myself that it will be easy or that we will even make it. I've already told him I don't think he is capable of giving me what I need in a relationship but I want to know we have given this our best shot. It may sound like I'm not committed to my decision but I think it's also important that I give myself permission to walk away if I feel the damage is irreparable. I'm not going to waste precious years on a relationship that has me second guessing who he's messaging or if I can't move through the hurt of his absolute selfishness. So practically, I've moved a chunk of our retirement fund into my account. I'm pretty shocked at how easy it was. Money is more important to him than me so I don't want to be caught out. I think he would be fair in a divorce settlement but I also thought he would never hurt me like this.

I’m glad you are protecting yourself financially please also protect yourself emotionally.

Take care

OP Find a way of living with him now that suits you. You say he is not there for you emotionally so cut that part out.
I think you need time to think and to be left alone to think rationally before you start getting emotional and saying things you do not mean.
behave largely as if he is not there and start doing your own thing. Value yourself more.

[quote Idonthearawordtheyresaying]@Malibuismysecrethome I think last night was cathartic for me. I think she does instigate things but that's the way he works. Emotionally I have always had to be the instigator in our relationship. We talked again today and I am holding nothing back. I'm going to move forward from this with him but I'm not going to feel bad if I can't work past the loss of trust. I knew when I started this thread that I would probably have replies that I would really connect to and replies that would give me different perspectives and make me think more. He has behaved like a complete shit. For years. But I want to try to work through it. The relationship we had before this is worth trying to get back but I'm also not fooling myself that it will be easy or that we will even make it. I've already told him I don't think he is capable of giving me what I need in a relationship but I want to know we have given this our best shot. It may sound like I'm not committed to my decision but I think it's also important that I give myself permission to walk away if I feel the damage is irreparable. I'm not going to waste precious years on a relationship that has me second guessing who he's messaging or if I can't move through the hurt of his absolute selfishness. So practically, I've moved a chunk of our retirement fund into my account. I'm pretty shocked at how easy it was. Money is more important to him than me so I don't want to be caught out. I think he would be fair in a divorce settlement but I also thought he would never hurt me like this.[/quote]
Moving money to your account will not make any difference to the division of assets . You will have to declare all . If a man came on here saying he was moving money so his wife could not access it all hell would break loose . You don't need to worry about him being fair in a settlement - the law provides for equal provision .

I'm so sorry op.

You sound bereft, I know how much it hurts, like a death, there's nothing wrong in getting it out and crying.

How has your husband responded, has he said he would cut contact? or do you think he could not enforce boundaries with this woman.

He needs to step up for you, tell him exactly what would make you feel better. Will he listen and act ?

I do understand about the instigating of emotions, you feel you need him after the many years of lifting him up that he needs to reciprocate that at at time when you need him.
Unfortunatly he sounds quite immature in that respect and is receiving the attention from this ow, whilst you are down.

She sounds an opportunist and he's lapping it up.

What if you were to shock him, make a solicitors appointment, make him realise there has to be a choice.

I'm sorry he's hurt you.
Keep posting we are here, sending hugs.

He's behaved like a complete Shit for years but you want to work through it with him? Why? Raise your bar ffs, no wonder he does it as he knows you are going nowhere

You may have to declare the money but at least it’s in your possession. So many women are had over by men financially so good on you for protecting yourself.

@IamGusFring yes, I will definitely be not keeping more than I should, I in fact moved less than I will be entitled to, just enought to feel I am in control of my own future. It will also shock him that I have done this, he will see this as me protecting a future without him in it.
@Anordinarymum I have been very calm while talking with him so far. I think because I have been processing everything by myself, it's kept me calm. I know exactly what to say before we talk.
@amiafreakofnature I want to work through it for me. He's pretty shocked I'm staying. He's also aware I don't know if I can forgive him.
He knows I won't stay if I can't.
@Onthedunes Thank you. he's cutting contact. I'm a bit late with catching up with what's been going on so I think at this point she's more invested than him. He is very emotionally immature, I have told him this isn't just a couple of difficult chats and move on because everything is fine. He said about him needing nudged if he let things start to slide. I was clear that I am not doing that. If I have to remind him to actually connect with me, that's me doing all the work, nothing will have changed.
Honestly, I don't think he will be able to give me what I need. We are having a bit of time apart to think more, I want to breathe by myself so he's staying with a friend for a couple of weeks.
Thank you @Malibuismysecrethome
I'm exhausted. All this and teens and pets are bouncing around as usual.

I think I'd be hiring a PI to see what he gets up to on this break.

Use the joint money.

Take care
x

I don't have much insight to share, but @Idonthearawordtheyresaying I just wanted to say, if I was in a similar situation and could be half the amazing woman you're coming across as, I would be very proud of myself indeed

Being also married to an emotionally unavailable man struck a chord with me. In the early years of our relationship he had an emotional connection with another woman who he claimed was just afriend. But I quickly realised she was moreinvested in the relationship and struggled with the fact that he could talk to her in a way it didn't feel that he could talk to me. What I've realised since is that emotionally unavailable people respond better where there is nothing at stake for them. And where the other person is venting about something unconnected to them so they do not feel defensive and can respond in a way that feels easy. After all it isn't about them. Equally, their egos are flattered by someone who it seems is interested in them and who they can help.

Given this has been going on a long time it is possible that if it was going to be more then you would seen evidence of that in the messages. Could you perhaps ak to see the text messages so you can see the other messages? A more complete picture?

As others have suggested take your time. And don't accept his gas lighting that the issues all stem from your menopause and nothing to do with his behaviour. Menopause is an illness and he would hardly use the same excuse if you had cancer. You have been through a difficult journey and you've had to do it alone. He needs to understand that. Woud he feel good if there was another man offering you the support you need?

He said about him needing nudged if he let things start to slide. I was clear that I am not doing that. If I have to remind him to actually connect with me, that's me doing all the work, nothing will have changed
Good for you !

@Catch32

I think *@MMmomDD* advice is sound here.

So do I.

Thank you @onthedunes @IamGusFring
@vitriolaa what a lovely thing to say, I really appreciate it. The help on here has carried me through the last few days. Reading others opinions, taking advice and having to think when replying has been very positive for me.
@Whitehydrangea that seems about right. He's offered to show me his emails. I made it clear yesterday that he contributed to my struggle. I'm really angry about that. I also asked him how he would feel if I was speaking to another man on such a personal level (including martital problems as she did) and he agreed he wouldn't like it.
@SalveVagina so do I. I almost turned round to see if @MMmomDD was in the room with me

It’s great you have started to talk and you are taking your time.
I do hope you would also consider having couples counselling. A good professional in the room can make conversations a lot more productive. They can also help you figure out what you feel and what you need to process it.

@Idonthearawordtheyresaying.
I was just wondering how you are getting on?

So sorry. You need full and frank discussions here. It is possible to start again if you think things have gone too far with this woman. I just feel they if she is saying they she is dreaming about him turn they are very close. Xx