"But we took you to stately homes"... a thread for adult children of abusive families

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This thread is a follow up to "My mother has cut me out of her life - long sorry" because we reached the end of the thread life.

I originally posted on that thread to say that my mother had blamed me for something that was in fact her fault, called me a liar, got the rest of the family to gang up on me and then blamed me for splitting up the family.

It generated a huge amount of interest from a number of women who, like me, had grown up in an abusive, or "toxic" family environment where we had been the scapegoat or the dustbin for our parents to dump their own unresolved difficulties. My mother, like all our mothers, has refused to apologise for what she has done and many of us have cut ties with our families in order to recover our lost selves and self-esteem.

Wow, it?s hard to keep up with this thread! I?m just catching up with all the posts since Sunday so forgive the randomness of these comments.

Sakura, thanks for posting the quotes from the Continuum Concept, particularly ?He quoted an intelligent, educated mother saying, 'When he cried, it meant he didn't love me, so I hit him'." This struck home to me except instead of ?I hit him? for me it was ?I hit myself?. In the first year of ds?s life more times than I care to remember I?d find myself banging my head on the wall or a door frame because I saw my inability to stop ds crying as a failure on my part and it opened up a well of self-hatred that I?d never really acknowledged was there. My health visitor told me that it?s common for new mothers to get so tired they want to ?throw their baby out of the window? but I never felt like that, all my anger was directed towards myself and I had no idea why. It?s still there, but at least now I know where it came from and can try to work through it.

Hi Ally , overall I think I am feeling better, though the last week has been very very tough. I?m reading a book by Beverley Engel called The Right to Innocence. It?s about surviving childhood sexual abuse but the advice she gives is relevant to many forms of abuse I think. I?m finding it hard to get time to read at the moment, and have to choose my time of day as if I read it right before bed I can?t sleep for all the thoughts buzzing in my head. Love the resolutions you posted. And I also know that my mother will think that me having therapy validates her point of view that I am somehow a ?faulty? sort of person who needs to be fixed, and once I have therapy and the therapist tells me how wrong I am, everything will be fine again. I mentioned to my sister a week or so ago that I?d seen a therapist, so my mother is bound to know by now. It seems that now that I, the daughter who used to have no boundaries at all with my mother, has rebelled and ?left? the family, my sister, who used to have 10 foot high walls around her, has taken my place in relation to my mother. Anyway, how are things with you?

This may have been said elsewhere, but to everyone worried about how they are parenting their dcs and whether they?re repeating their mothers? mistakes (and I count myself in this group) acknowledging there may be an issue and apologizing when you have done/said something you know is wrong is incredibly important. My mother has never apologized for anything, in fact she has bragged about some of the emotional abuse she perpetrated on me as a child as if it were something to be proud of. But I know if she could bring herself to offer me a genuine apology my feelings towards her would change. But I?ve accepted that she never will because she?s never ever wrong (in her mind). And that?s fine. I?m judging her based on my standards now, not her own which she always expected me to share, and that feels good and incredibly empowering. In one of the Alice Miller books I read earlier in the year she cites the case of a male patient of hers who had suffered severe emotional abuse from his mother and as a result as an adult suffered from very bad depression and became suicidal. Independently of him his mother decided to go into therapy, had a realization of how appallingly she had treated him and apologized. His depression lifted and he no longer felt suicidal and was able to end therapy because his mother?s admission had resolved everything for him. I guess it might sound simplistic and perhaps wouldn?t be the case for everyone but it?s a powerful example of how just admitting your mistakes can heal emotional wounds.

PurpleOne ? welcome! I hope you find the thread a big help. It will just be just three of us - me, DH and DS - on Christmas Day too. It feels a bit strange because I?m used to having more people around (though to be honest Christmas Day was always hellish when I was ?in? my birth family, I would hide in my bedroom whenever possible, even as an adult ), and there are some wider family members I?ll miss seeing this year, but I?m focusing on having a nice time with my little, caring, calm, happy family, and having the chance to establish our own traditions and do what suits us without the critical, disapproving eyes of my family upon us telling us we?re eating too much, or watching rubbish on tv, or listening to pop music rather than Carols from Kings, or opening our presents at the wrong time etc. etc. at your parents. In your position I would be doing all I could to stop them contacting your dds.

Danae, I know you posted this days ago now, but I wanted to add to the other posters who are at your mother?s comment about your dd. Beyond belief. How are you today?

Pages, thanks for the blue ribbon trophy . It means a lot.

The last week has been very tough and has made me realize how completely united my family are in the belief that I am wrong to have distanced myself. By this I?m really meaning my siblings. I have a sister and brother, both younger than me. We?ve always got on well, though have lived in different parts of the country for most of our adult lives so haven?t been what I?d describe as very close. I now live within 20 mins drive of my brother and about ten days ago my sil gave birth to a little girl in the nearby hospital. My sis came up and we went to visit sil together. Said hospital is the one I went to earlier in the year for three scans when I had a threatened and then missed miscarriage. Baby would have been due this Sunday . Didn?t really think visiting the hospital would have an effect on me but as soon as we got up to the ward, which is just along from where I had my scans, I had a panic attack, and had to explain to sis (who I?d never told about the mc because I knew she?d tell my mum who would gloat like she did after my previous mc) what had happened. So two days after the visit I get an email from my mother saying ?I have recently learnt that you had a miscarriage last May. I was sad for you.? I know this probably sounds nice, but I know what she?s thinking is ?see, I was right, you?ve got a faulty body? (this was what she said to me after my mc in 2006). And while my sister was here she laid it on thick about how they?d all be getting together at Christmas and everyone would love to see me and why can?t I just act normally, and my dad ?will never change? as if that?s a good reason to put up with his behaviour. Having bronchitis and being exhausted doesn?t help but when I allow myself to think about all this I just feel defeated. I so wanted to maintain a relationship with my sister but I just don?t think I can. I would like to be around to support her (the last year or so hasn?t been a good one for her either), but I think she now sees contact with me simply as an opportunity to extract information to pass on to my mother. Sorry, I?m going on and on here and I don?t think there?s anything that can be done apart from me accepting that my sister is, for the time being, firmly in my parents? ?camp? and I need to stop caring about this. My brother is a lovely guy, but is definitely tied to my mother?s apron strings and doesn?t understand why I have a problem with her. But he?s just become a parent, so perhaps he will start experiencing the same sort of revelations about what good parenting involves that many of us did once we became parents.

Claricebean ? I totally get what you mean about feeling brainwashed. I feel like I?ve just woken up from a lifetime in an alternate, and very odd, reality, but I?m still struggling to get a handle on what my ?reality? is now. Intellectually I totally understand all the commonsense talked on this and the previous thread and in all the books I've read, but emotionally my automatic response still frequently takes me back to my childhood patterns of feeling like a bad, useless and unloved child, accepting all the criticism heaped on me, and turning all this in on myself, and crucially for me at the moment, trying to deny/ignore my father's inappropriate behaviour towards me and my mother's conscious or unconscious acceptance of it. I know I have to get in touch with my anger about this and then I'll be able to move forward. I'm just having trouble getting up the courage to do it because I'm worried my world will just blow apart.

Oneplusone ? your post of Mon 17-Dec-07 21:53:17 was amazing. I don?t think writing a letter sounds silly at all. It?s something I often think of doing for ds and probably will some day when my head is a bit straighter than it is now.

Jenk1, so sorry to hear that your mother?s apparent improvement in behaviour was so short-lived, but good for you standing up to her !

OMG, have just previewed this post and realised how long it is. Sorry!

Thank you bearsmum, I can't keep up with this thread either, i'd like to try and reply to everyone who's posted, especially the newbies, but it's moving too fast and I have so little time what with being a full time SAHM to two DC's under 5.

But, from my quick skim through the latest posts just now it's obvious to me that we are all at very different stages on this journey. Many people are at the angry stage, which I have been through myself and it is a very good thing to allow yourself to feel your anger and also to release it. I moved on from feeling angry by writing down my feelings, all the painful, hurtful and sad memories I had from my childhood that I had never talked about and kept bottled up for years.

I remember I wrote pages and pages and pages and pages. It was incredibly theraputic and cathartic and I beleive everyone should do this if they haven't already. It's probably not practical to post everything you write on this thread as I don't think there would be enough space. But I notice that many of the posters have tried to condense their stories and many have said there was loads more they would have liked to have said.

Well, to all those who feel they have more to say I would urge you to sit down when you know you will have a couple of hours peace and quiet and write down all the things you have been holding inside for so long. Let ALL your thoughts and feelings out, every single one of them. This will not be a letter or a post on this thread, this will simply be something to do for yourself, a release for all the emotions you have been feeling in relation to your family and how they have treated you.

I found it was only after I had done this that I was able to move onto the next stage and I think this is the healing stage ie when you begin to heal the pain you have felt all these years as a result of your abusive/neglectful childhood.

There are loads of books that will help, Toxic Parents is excellent and I have found Alice Miller to be especially insightful.

Bearsmum, have just read your post, the bit about you wanting to have a relationship with your siblings but it's difficult because they are firmly in your mum's 'camp'. I feel exactly the same, i would love to have a good relationship with my sisters but i know they don't have the slightest understanding about why i have cut my parents off. I have now come to accept that perhaps we will never be close but it has been very hard and taken me a long time to accept this. My younger sister is due to have her first baby in May next year and I think it is possible she might understand what good parents should be like after she has her baby but i'm not holding out any hope.

My counsellor said to me that 'every child has a unique experience of childhood' and I think he is absolutely right and this applies even to siblings. Even though we all had the same parents I know we all had a very different experience as children and so they are bound to view my parents very differently to me. My youngest sister especially was the 'favourite' and although she witnessed a lot of my parents abusive behaviour she was not the brunt of if as i was and so i actually think she had a far more loving, caring and nurturing childhood than i did even though we grew up in the same house with the same parents.

Does any of that make any sense to anyone?!

Hi Purpleone, thanks for your suggestion. I think i will do both, write a letter and find a suitable card. I'm not sure if i'm up to a poem, but i just want to say sorry for the way i felt about her during her early years and to try and explain why.

Oneplusone- yes, siblings can have different views, experiences and memories...it is true for my siblings and I at least.

I am sorry to all that my last couple of posts have sounded whiney and petty. I need to accept my personal sadness that my relationship with Middle Sister won't be as close as in the past if at all. It is a big weight in my mind because I often imagine 'what if that were me?'-alone. But as others have discussed a lone parent being alone, I need to remember myself (and family) first.

Oneplusone, you're so right about writing everything down. I feel "cleansed" after each writing session, though also usually exhausted!

Re siblings, don't give up hope of your younger sister understanding what good parents should be like once she's had her baby. Before I met DH and found in him someone who loves me for who I am I thought my mother was a good mother. Having DS brought me even greater understanding of what love and good parenting really is. Perhaps it will be the same for your sister.

And what you say about unique experiences of childhood related to your youngest sister makes perfect sense.

My sister has always been the "golden child" (my cousin's words to me a few years ago, when she asked me how my bro and I coped with my parents making it so obvious that my sister was the golden child), but it's turned out to be a heavy burden for her to bear I think. When I saw her earlier in the year she said to me then how "funny" it was that I had "everything" she "was meant to have" (i.e. happily married with a child). She got married in her twenties, typical white church wedding, my mother throwing herself into all the arrangements, but her husband had an affair and ultimately left her and though she was meant to get married earlier this year that relationship ended because the guy couldn't commit and cancelled the wedding. I guess she feels cheated of what my parents brought her up to believe was her right. And here I am, in their eyes the less attractive one who always insisted on being a feminist (oh my mother hates women who think they're equal to men!!), who was just meant to have a bit of a career and be the family "whipping boy", with the things she was "meant" to have. I find it really so sad that she thinks in this way, and I never realised she did until she said this to me in the summer. I was just living my life whereas she obviously has this very strong idea of what she was supposedly entitled to.

Toomany - I think your posts have been fine. If I was in your position, having to cope with Middle Sister over Christmas, I think I'd feel the need to let off steam somewhere!

To all the posters on this and other similar threads: although I'm not the child of toxic parents in the terms you have described, I felt compelled to write something here. It is hard to imagine what you have all been through during your childhoods, you are all really amazing human beings with great strength (although you may not recognise that). This thread has given me great insight into the kind of relationship I had with my parents until fairly recently. Although showered with love, affection, time, interest etc, with hindsight I also felt pressure. The type of pressure of caring and worrying on behalf of my mum and dad. My dad, always ill (which continues to this day) and my mum who, although did so much for us (I have 2 brothers) never let us forget what she had/has done for us. I can now see my mum was the child of a toxic mother (incidentally, a lovely grandma) and made every attempt to not repeat it with us. However, she frequently would tell us this, which in turn made me feel bad....for her. I don't think my brothers were remotely aware of this. I think I've inherited massive empathic tendancies from my mum: this has not helped. At the beginning of this year, I went to see my doctor because I was feeling very depressed, this manifested itself initially in PND. I had a daughter and felt quite removed from her. I was prescribed prozac. In the last few months I have moved above myself (IYSWIM) and been strong enough to speak out when I feel put upon by my parents and from others for that matter. They both used have a go about each other when the other was not there; I felt a tremendous sicky feeling whenver that happended with a desperate need to 'fix' their relationship. Now I don't. I walk away from it and leave it there...at their house; all the worry and heartache. It has been very liberating. The other day I even had the strength to say to them "stop talking to each other in that manner in front of X" (their granddaughter).
I'm not really sure whether my ramblings warrent being in this section but you lot have helped my immensely and for that I am so very grateful. Thank you x

Toomanystuffedbears, you are NOT whiney or petty! Don't you do yourself down, that's your sister talking!!

Sorry, will say that better...you just had a 'mad sister moment'

So many posts again! Got to keep this brief, got to revise for my first aid exam tonight! Hi to all again! Hi to Purpleone, not acknowledged you yet, but even now I have memories of being truly shocked by your parents behaviour towards you. Truly disgusting. And were they not the one's who are getting at you through your dd1? Beverley Engel 'Divorce a parent' deals with how to explain to your dc about any separation you may feel you need from your parents. If you choose to of course. But it sounds like a poisonous atmosphere.

Hi to Lisalisa, want to say more? Sorry to hear of your father, and sorry you have to be around your mother. Hope something on here helps you.

Hi Cargirl, its your parents that have caused the separation by their behaviour. Your children may even gain by not being in a bad atmosphere...think of it that way.

Hi Elfsmum, your post is so sad, what a lonely scary childhood. How are you now? Sorry if you have posted further up but I'm skimming today. x

Shamefulcoward - namechange NOW. That is your parents speaking. Posting on here disguised is NOT cowardly, we all have covered up identities. And you can't take the award for least traumatic childhood, I've taken it already . Please post again. The fact you feel the need to cover up so much shows you have a bit of work to do to separate emotionally from your parents/family and to work through your childhood abuse. To specify, I would say from your post emotional abuse/emotional neglect/physical neglect. Please be BRAVE and post again. With a new name, like, I don't know...shamelessbravery...or something suitable! Start as you mean to go on. I expect another post within the week! Or whenever you feel strong enough...No timelimits here!

Yummersbrandyandmincepies - That's abuse. But something to be happy about. Your the emotionally strong and healthy one in the family to be able to face up to it. I think when you start to think about the past, it does not go away again until you deal with it. Start thinking about a therapist, read a book or two, read on here. Deal with what you can, when you feel you can. Perhaps mention to dp/dh? Helps to have someone onside just so they understand if you seem a bit down sometimes. Good luck on your journey...remember, the point of life is to keep learning, and we are all learning here how to be decent loving human beings. Imperfect, but who wants to be perfect anyway, we'd have nothing to talk about...

Hi Jen!! Think I started a post to you then had to go...anyway...well done you!!! For award and to stand up to your mum! So pleased you are starting to stand up for yourself! What are you up to over xmas?

Hi sayitagain, thanks for a new perspective. Something I am aware of is not to go too far the other way from my mother. Your post says how this can be done. Your parents do sound a bit trying...

Now is there anyone I missed apart from Pages and Sakura and Bearsmom (so sad for you it must have hurt having your mother have a go and your sister to have told her, last thing you need xxxx) and Smithfield and Toomanystuffedbears and Danae and oneplusone (so happy your reconnecting with your dd!!) and CB and ANYONE ELSE. Next post...must go, may get back on again tomorrow (what am I on about, may! ha!)

P.s. Thanks so much for the blue ribbon trophey.

P.P.S Why does it have a blue ribbon and what does it stand for????

Good luck with the exam Ally

Hi, everyone, don't really know whether to post on here or not. I kind of look back at my childhood and think that it wasn't such a big deal, you know, I'm happy now and have moved on so why worry about it. I also know a lot of people went through a lot worse, and hate erm 'stealing' the attention I suppose.
Anyway I just wanted to say that I'm pleased everyone here has managed to find somewhere they can open up and discuss things. I think maybe I've past that point and have had enough of letting it be in my head, I've talked about it with lots of people and now just say the bare essentials to make a point of my experience in similar situations if I want to advise someone. I hope you can all find some kind of peace too and realise that children are never the guilty party.

For those who have suggested the books of Alice Miller - which ones specifically? Where is a good starting point?

Thanks Bearsmom and Ally-you are right! She does have me trained worse than I thought.

Earlybird: A couple of books that you might want to get around to sometime (probably not as important as Toxic Parents or Divorcing a Parent-I admit I have not read them yet) which helped me are:

Surviving a Borderline Parent: How to Heal Your Childhood Wounds & Build Trust, Boundaries and Self Esteem, by Kimberlee Roth, F.H. Friedman, and Randi Kreger
and

Anger Management: 6 Critical Steps to A Calmer Life, by Peter Favaro

My Oldest Sister's husband has/ is working on anger issues, I told her I'd get her a copy of it-they had read a copy from the library. But I read it before I sent it and it did explain some things about myself (frustration) but more exactly about my Middle Sister (predatory anger).

Alice Miller - The Drama of the Gifted Child is perhaps a good place to start. Alice Miller's books are all translated from German so I think sometimes there are not quite the right words in english for a perfect translation.

The Drama is essentially about how you can look at your family and all the relationships within it and the dynamics through the eyes of yourself as a child BUT with the knowledge and insight you now have about your parents that you obviously could never have had as a child.

I would also recommend having a look at her website, if you google it'll come up, she has lots of articles and stories and letters on there which are hugely informative and helpful.

I am not sure if my story is as bad as many of the others here, but wanted to share what happenned with me in my childhood. Both my parents had no friends and I was frowned upon for wanting to be sociable. My mother would avoid the school gate and would lurk down the road instead, if I was late out of school I would be made to feel terrible. The stately home comment got me too because my parents were fascinated with church architecture so many of my weekends would be spent in graveyards wheras my friends would be swimming, bowling etc. My parents only took me to places they wanted to go and we never did these things. It got worse when I got older. When I became a teenager and became interested in boys my parents would refer to be as a slg or a slt, they refused to keep their toothbrushes near mine because they said I would give them aids. Before I had my first kiss I was on the phone to a friend talking about how nervous I was and my dad overheard. He then put his tongue inside my mouth then pushed me away and said I was rubbish and no-one would ever want to kiss me. Although I wasn't sexually abused as such, my dad used to show me porn and would pour water over my private areas when I was younger and in the bath. I don't remember him touching me but then again I only realised what I suffered was abuse a few years ago anyway. My mum knew my dad was inappropriate but chose to ignore it. I now have limited contact with them and have not seen them in 4 years. My DS who is 6 does not know them and nor do I want him to but at the same time I feel guilty because I know they want to see him. They never call me and e-mail me occasionally. My dad had a major stroke a few years ago and I felt nothing when it happenned. DP says I should break off contact with them but I can't and I don't know why. I hate them but still love them at the same time.

I am shocked at just how many people have suffered similar things. When you are a child and it is happenning to you, you assume this sort of behaviour is normal. I is only as you get older and in particular have children of your own that you realise it isn't. I think you are at least halfway there if you can accept you may have a problem which is why oneplusone, you are not like your own mother. You are acknowledging there is something going on with your relationship with your DD and you are anxious to have a good relationship with her. People who are bad parents would rarely seek a site out like this.

Think I have probably said too much, but just wanted to offload really. This thread has really struck a chord with me

Hi notalone and welcome . Your first sentence made me smile as many of us who post here start off with something like "I am not sure if my story is as bad as many of the others here" because we're so used to minimising what happened to us. Your parents' behaviour was appalling, and what your father did was definitely sexual abuse. I'm reading a book at the moment called The Right to Innocence which lists what is considered to be sexual abuse, and the list ranges from nudity, exposure and observation through to penetration. Showing you porn and unwanted contact (the pouring of water over you) is definitely abusive behaviour. The book makes the point that the intention (i.e. whether it is sexual or non-sexual) of the adult's behaviour regarding things like nudity, exposure and observation is the key to determining whether an act is sexually abusive and it seems clear from what you've written that the intention was there with your father.

I think all that you're feeling (wanting to break off contact and hating and loving them at the same time) is all part of the process. I don't think you should feel any guilt at all about your ds not seeing them. They may want to see him but they are reaping the results of their behaviour towards you and you shouldn't feel guilty at all.

Hi bearsmum, only have time for a very quick post to say my copy of Divorcing A Parent arrived yesterday. I have only had time for a quick flick through but already what I've read has hit home completely. Am dying to read it from cover to cover but probably won't get a chance til the weekend.

Hi notalone, I'm sorry to read about what you've been through. What you're feeling is very normal. I would suggest you read a few books which may help you make sense of what you've been through and your current feelings. Toxic Parents by Susan Forward is a good starting place.

Have to go now, back later. x

This is going to have to be a quick one as I need to go on the long journey to pick ds from school.

Thanks for the book recommendation Oneplusone, I have heard about this one before so will take your advice. Also going back on what you said about the fact that your mother was not physically or verbally abusive, I think as this was more a more subtle form of bad parenting it maybe harder for her to even acknowledge what she has done. I know with my own mother she has probably convinced herself she has done nothing wrong. I would even go as far as to say that I think she herself believes my upbringing was "normal".

Bearsmum - thank you for your honest and kind words. I was seeing a psychologist about this and she said the same thing as I said I felt bad for talking about it as there are lots of others who probably had it worse than me. However she moved away and I never finished my sessions. You don't have to answer this as I know it is very personal, but were you sexually abused as a child too?

Notalone, I'm just so shocked and horrified your own father would a) listen to such a personal conversation b) I feel so shocked and horrified by him sticking his tongue in your mouth (sexual abuse?) then saying you were terrible kisser (emotional abuse). And that's the effect its had on me reading about it, what about what you felt at the time? And at such an emotionally sensitive time in your life.

Your first sentance btw is very normal on here! And we are all equal. No one can tell how much someone else has suffered. Only you know how much you have been hurt by your parents behaviour.

Your love/hate relationship, again quite normal in this thread...I have it myself, feel numb most of time, then sometimes I feel something like love and put a lid on it quick...hate is usually the main feeling...gradually now fading into sadness.

Anyway, just wanted to acknowledge you and welcome you to the thread. Love your name, says it all! Have to say since finding this thread, I'm much more confident that I was abused, as so often you think 'its just me, it wasn't that bad' when you are alone.

Keep reading and posting, lets see if you can move on in your life/relationship with your parents in the new year If you want support/rant/cry, we're right here!

allyxx

Can I join to

My parents are self made high achievers, all emotions were ignored and supressed in my family. We weren't allowed to call them mum and dad, we had to call them by their first names and my mum wanted me to be her friend not her daughter.

It was very clear that they were more important than us, we were expected to achieve academically and be able to argue coherently around the dining room table. I spent my childhood being dragged around golf courses and adult theatre and opera.

My father was physically absent (working hard) and emotionally absent. My mum was emotionally manipulative and took no responsbility for guiding me throughout my childhood.

I had a sad childhood and when I think of it my overriding feeling is one of emptiness and nothing. I don't remember laughing or having any fun, think my parents are incapable of it.

Since becoming a grown up and a parent I have tried to pull away from them, which has caused huge ruptions and emotional hurt on all sides. But nothing has been resolved and I still feel hurt and rejected. They are wealthy and powerful and use their money for manipulation, a subsitute for love. Its hard to turn around and tell them to f**k off, as then the money is/will be withheld.

Now, I find their presence painful and hate them having the kids, which my father is desperate to do for long periods of time ( a week over the summer etc..)

Anyway I have come to an impasse in my life and am about to do this:

www.hoffmaninstitute.co.uk/

Hi MDC

Your more than welcome to join in. Sounds like a really unhappy childhood. I get the emotionally absent, my mother and my father...too busy with their own needs to bother with mine. And I was furious after all the years my mother paid me no attention, to suddenly want to be involved in my life when I got married and became pg. Suddenly I was interesting and she 'needed' me, rather than me 'needing' her after her years of no emotional help/guidance.

The hoffman instit. sounds intersting...recognise some of the names reviewing it from my 'abuse' library.

How did your siblings cope with their childhood? Or have you never mentioned it?

And as for money (another form of abuse) just how dependant are you? Do you have skills? or have they bought you a house etc? 'Divorce a parent' by Beverley Engel goes through the parents who keep their children as children by paying for everything. There is a word for it, just can't think of it now.

allyxxx

Summary of my abuse (well, I use ?summary? in the looses (sp!) way possible )

Mother

Is a mainly a child. Was like my sisters lackey, sister bullied me, mother laughed along. In her 'parent' role constant stream of criticism about clothes, cleanliness, manners, accent, way I spoke, things I said deemed inappropriate, my friends etc. Nothing ever good enough for her. All this done with a sneer/looking down nose at me. Lot of screaming and shouting from her.

Sister

A bully. Humiliated me in every way possible, in front of anyone friends/relatives/strangers. 'Oh don't be so stupid Ally', 'Fancy not knowing that' 'Look at you, you pig'. She would always make friends with my friends, then turn them against me when the came round to play. I remember shutting her and my bf out of my room once I was so devastated by her turning against me. My bf looked upset and confused ie how did this happen. My sister was very good at mimicking, making people laugh, at her cruel impersonations and twisting words. I could never argue against her. She would take the mick out of me for being gullible and naive, ie when I was 6/7 telling me santa was coming down street, I went to look que hysterical laughter from her. I remember her doing 2 nice things for me in my life.
Lot of screaming and shouting from sister as well.

Dad

Lived in study on computer/reading books or at pub or at work. Would sporadically appear in the evening when the shouting and yelling got too loud to shut us up then bugger off again. I believe he became a part time alcoholic when I was in my later teens when he lost his job. Not permanently pissed, but 4/5 times a week heavily pissed, drank at home too. He could be giggly and cruel or just verbally aggressive and physically aggressive to our pets. Very scary.
A lot of yelling and deep rumbling angry voice from father as well...

Realisation

I was 16 and got my GCSE results, I had not revised. Three B's and a C...I was in shock, tears, shaking, saying over and over 'I got a B I got a B I got a B'. Then after a few more minutes more feelings flooded in 'I've been lied to!' Ie by mother and sister. Sister told me outright since earliest memories I was 'thick fat and stupid' and made sure I knew it in numerous ways. My mother indicated it ie talking to me in a 'ittle baby' voice, giving me tablets (not my sister, I suggested, she refused, my mother insisted I take them) for my intelligence. And just a general unspoken thing between my mother and father I was aware of that my sister was the intelligent, funny, artistic one.

The Rage
From 16 to 21. Screamed and shouted at my mother and sister as soon as they opened their mouth so I didn't have to hear one more nasty word from them. It half killed me, hurting my mother, hurting myself.

The Forgiveness
At 21. Felt at peace, like I forgave them both

The Memories
When I moved out I think prompted it. My mothers all 'sad' I'm moving out when I knew she had been bitching behind my back with dad about me moving out and being just horrid to me at home, really spiteful at times.

The White Child at Last

When I met my bf, future dh. Ideal dh material, my mother wanted to camp out, come and see us, we'll come and see you, oh we do enjoy it etc. My sister was finally talked about to relatives in hushed tones on the phone while I was sung from the rooftops. I felt a tad bit bitter about it.

The 'I can't take the lies anymore!!! aaggghhhh!!!!'

Refused to play jolly hockey sticks with my mother when I announced I was married and pg. Cumulating in emotionally blackmailing/verbally aggressive calls (reminded me of childhood with her) so I sent a letter to cut contact with her as I was shaking at her phone calls to me ie stress + heavily pg do not mix. When my dd was just 2 mths old (what was I thinking!!) I sent another letter saying I wanted no further contact, and explained why this was ie 3 examples of her abusive behaviour. Done in a very ?adult? way.

Mothers response

Cards to me and dh after first letter, which set me off feeling panicy (sp?) each time I saw them come in the post. Then when I got home from hospital with dd, still woozy from birth/exhaustion/small baby/confusion/drugs her and father turn up on doorstep Mother has abdabs in front of us, luckily I was in car with dd and my dh came out and sorted it. Turns out (months later dh tells me) she said I was being ?mean and spiteful? (funny, she always had me down as the ?caring? one for the last 28 years?), that she was a ?nice? person not a ?monster?, that she had been to a medium and she had told her that our dead family ie grandparents/aunts/uncles/god etc wanted us to be together and it was up to my mother to do this, that she loved me, no matter what I thought (I heard that bit, it was shouted) (since when has what I thought mattered to her anyway?!) and she loved my dd. Que black grey depression, guilt, fear descending upon me for about a year or so .
Then after my second letter she sent one back, I entitled ?la la la I can?t hear you? . Totally misinterpreted my examples then 3 pages of what a fantastic childhood I had. 3 pages of what a crap childhood she had and 3 pages on how great grandparents are. And then a constant stream of cards/postcards/presents addressed to my (20 mth) dd directly or me or dh. And in autumn a knock on the door about 7 at night and 14 bin bags of my childhood toys dumped on the pavement. And not forgetting her ?memorial? of me. A picture of me as a 6 yr old ?in loving memory of my dear dd ally?. Strangely I am now alive again as have received presents/cards from her this week.

Father?s response

Came to see me alone (I asked), with presents/cards etc from mother. Asked he respect my wishes and not bring anything. So the next time he came he brought things that ?were not from my mother? when they blatantly were. I sent a text saying not to come again due to items from mother and I would contact when I was ready. Also felt sick and stressed at his visits (again?what was I thinking with child under 4 mths?!) Not contacted again as he has phoned once (I changed our number) and sent a couple of letters (1 unopened 1 a blackmailing, sign this and my dd can get extra interest on this savings account) Oh and he brought my mother to see me 2 days after dd birth and he brought her and bin bags this year.

Sister?s response

Silence again. She spat dummy when I met dh. I do think she actually believed she was the pretty/intelligent/slim one and that she would get a dh first/pg first. She rejected me after I met dh as, I think, because I did not tell her first about him. But I did not feel emotionally safe telling her that I had met the man of my dreams. That would have been asking for a verbal beating. She wanted to be close to me, however at the expense of me being ?me?. And to do what she wanted. And to freely criticise me.

How I am today

Pretty good! It?s been hard. I still feel numbness towards my family, occasional flashes of sadness and hurt but I tend to automatically suppress that. I?m feeling more and more this is a good decision. I am always aware that my dd is missing out on a relationship with gp and aunt but the emotional cost to me to let her have this, even indirectly is too high. I cannot be around them without experiencing anger/rage/frustration. The guilty feeling is lessening, my mother and father and sister all expected me to ?look after? them. And this I will not do anymore. It?s a bit like abandoning a litter of puppies, tho not cute one?s . If they came back to me and said they acknowledged my childhood and the pain it caused me, I honestly think I would take the apology, work with it, and not let them back in my life. I just never had any trust with them and my feelings, even as a 2 year old I remember not wanting to be around them. I have seen a therapist for 3.5 years now, and I?m getting through it?had a breakthrough recently?will see how that pans out in the new year.

As for this thread

Since Nov 06 when I joined this thread, I have not felt alone and I feel NORMAL!! So many people sweep under the carpet how their family treat them. You think to yourself ?this is not RIGHT? and you go back to family and question it and they say ?its NORMAL? its you who is ?abnormal?. And your feelings remain invalidated and you feel unsure of yourself, of your gut feelings which say ?I don?t want to be around you anymore!!? and think that you can?t not see them?their ?family?. But at the end of the day, it?s all about how YOU feel. Because you cannot make other people happy. Only they can do that. I really hope this post helps another person to have a ?realisation? of how their family treats them. Its life changing to break free. And you can do it, you are strong enough, and with this thread none of us are alone with these feelings of hurt and pain and anger anymore or with breaking free from the family that binds us.

Cheesy bit is over now?

BTW?only took a few hours to write this?trying to get my ?longest post every? title back since Bearsmom took it

Woohoo!! Got it back with bells on!! (refer to post below!)

Ally90 - thank you so much for your words of encouragement. Its sad so many people go through similar things. Now I am a parent myself I know I could never put my Ds through what I went through. I am by far not a perfect mum - I can be short with him occasionally and I make mistakes, but I also know what is right and wrong and I would never deliberately hurt him or cause him pain. I tell him I love him every day, probably too much actually, but my parents never said it to me. I am always acutely aware that I want to be the polar opposite of them. What you said about seeing a therapist in a different town struck a chord with me too. It sounds as though your parents, if they knew, would treat you seeing a therapist with disdain. I know my parents definitely would. Also what you said about feeling love sometimes then it being quickly replaced with hate. I feel the same. I wish I vould hate them with a passion and have it out with them once and for all but at the same time I don't want to upset them. My emotions confuse me as I know what I feel and what I should feel and sometimes they are too different things.

MDC - what you went through is awful too. Parents should be there to guide children as well as providing them with love support and security. It sounds as though they had an idea of how the perfect family should be which is actually far removed from how a family should operate. My parents are the same with money too, I get a cheque at xmas and birthdays but the accompanying card is cold and is literally "to notalone" "from mum and dad". I was also expected to curb my emotions and I never felt I could go to my parents in a crisis. I remember meeting my DP when I was 18 (am now 30) and we had to have a long distance relationship as we lived 300 miles apart. I got stranded in London due to engineering works on the inbound train from DP's house and it didn't even cross my mind to call my dad to drive the 35 miles to come and get me, even though it was midnight and I was scared. Instead I called my friends stepdad who was there as soon as he could be. How sad when you can't even call on your own parents in a crisis. As Ally90 said to me, keep posting. We all should as we have been through similar experiences and have different coping strategies which could help another poster too.

Posts crossed Ally90. Juat want to say I think you are very brave and some of your responses to other posters have been full of support, empathy and accuracy. Emotional bullying, particularly when it is by more than one family member is soul destroying and after a while it is very easy to start believing what they say about you as they make out you are the abnormal one.

If it means your dc's don't see their gp's then so be it, if it means sacrificing a happy mummy for an anxious / angry / frustrated one. I actually think it is braver to acknowledge what they have done and cut them off than to bury your head in the sand and not say anything like I have done. My parents haven't got a clue what they have done to me and I don't think I will ever have the courage to speak up and say something. I applaud your honesty and courage