Feeling shamed for being sexual - have you ever experienced this?

[Vanillacheeseke]

I’ve been dating a guy for over two months now. We are both in our 50s. We have long, interesting chats and enjoy spending time together, he’s smart, caring and attentive.
The chemistry was very strong from the onset and we both acknowledged that, and I’ve enjoyed being intimate with him - until recently…
I am a mature woman with a healthy self esteem. I feel confident in bed, I see intimacy & passion as something beautiful, an expression of my femininity, connection & feelings towards the other person.
However, his recent comments start making me feel like it’s shameful for me to be sexual (but he likes sex!): ‘your kisses are too sexy, I get too aroused’ or ‘you want to seduce me again’ or ‘you like sex don’t you?’. It’s also the way he says it, as if I’m guilty of leading him down the erotic path. Just to explain: we have sex maximum once a week and I definitely don’t chase him for it!
Anyway - I’ve realised that we are not compatible and we should part ways as his comments have been a major turn off for me and are ruining the joy of the experience. My self esteem has not suffered but I just wanted to ask if any of you have ever encountered men like that? For me it feels like a sexist, outdated attitude?

Totally sexist (women are supposed to be innocent and chaste, have to be persuaded and cajoled into sex dontchaknow) extremely commonplace, and I’m really glad you got rid of him.

That’s what I thought! I’ve never ever heard comments like that from my previous long term partners, I’d expect a man to be happy that a woman is attracted to him! I feel disappointed as otherwise I really like him but this attitude of his is not going to change, is it!

I don’t think it’s the comments themselves if said in a jokey way. But you obviously got a different vibe.

Really not sure what's wrong with his comments.

I understand it’s difficult to explain in writing…it’s the context and the pattern. It’s like I’m always the one trying to seduce him and initiate sex (I’m not) but said in a way that is not flattering (not ‘I feel great that you are attracted to me’, more like a slightly arrogant ‘you just can’t say no to me, can you, I’m so irresistible’). Not sure if I’m explaining the difference well…

As PP said. In his world women arnt meant to be coming on to the guy. Doing so means that they are confident / hold the power and this is damaging his male ego.
It’s all about the male ego.

I get shamed for not wanting it. Frigid, old woman etc etc. You can't win either way.

OK. I experienced these comments all through my life, heard them as judgmental and it had a hugely detrimental effect on my sex life for years. I am sure I was right that at least some of them were judgemental from the other person. And it was sexist and shit and left me in a straightjacket i didn't even know was there for a long time.

However,it is possible that in some cases these comments are meant to be sexy chat and he's just got the tone wrong. Is he into being dominated?

It sounds like you don't want to be with him any more anyway. But if I heard this now and liked the person, I'd try coming on even stronger. 'Yes I love sex and I know you do too, you can't resist me when I...[insert filth here]' and see what happens.

I was with a guy like this for several years. I hated it; we had good sex that I was very enthusiastic about and so was he, but he talked like I was some mad nymphomaniac. It is sexist, the underlying message is that women should have to be persuaded to have sex, not want to have it. I was giving it to him too freely seemed to be the attitude. I remember him once stopping mid-shag and asking if I was “putting on” those “sexy little moans” and I was completely confused, hadn’t even registered the moans!! So fucked up in your attitude to sex if your first thought is that a woman is curating sex-sounds as part of a performance rather than enjoying having sex.

Give him the elbow, life is far too short.

A lot of men have imbibed the notion that sex is a thing men do to women — a lot of porn supports that idea, with women being treated roughly, coerced, crying etc. So if you’re sexually-confident and make it clear you want to have sex, that flips his idea that ‘nice’ women have to be persuaded/coaxed into sex, that they don’t have an active libido of their own.

I’d find it enormously unattractive in a man, and think you’re right to end it.

Don’t let him blame you for his inadequacies! My guess is that he has erectile issues and will escalate to gaslighting you into taking the blame for that.

Have you spoken to him about it? Or has the ick set in?

I've had a couple of men I was with who had hang ups about sex. Saying I was like a wannabe porn star or came across as being obsessed with sex, because I wanted to make love to someone I loved.

He has issues, you don't, and you know that. x

I can understand that some women might be ok with a man talking to them like that and some not, or that someone's tone of voice etc might make it more offensive.

You don't like it and see it as a red flag and that's all that matters. You are the only one of us that was there to fully catch his implications. Trust your instincts.

@TrampolineForMrKite - that’s how I’m starting to feel.
@justilou1 - He has no erectile dysfunction and is enjoying sex.
I’ve mentioned to him how I’m feeling about it but he keeps coming up with the same comments…it feels too embedded…
@Silverswirl - it does seem to be about his ego. My concept of ‘feminine’ is different than his.

Yes, a number of times. I feel like I have a healthy interest in sex and a medium - high sex drive.

Some blokes have definitely viewed it as a bad thing, slutty and somehow an affront. Some seem to struggle with sex being something I actually want and enjoy, and appear to feel emasculated if their libido is lower.

Does he feel like it’s pressure on him to perform?

I totally get what you mean, OP. His comments make it seem like he's embarrassed or ashamed on your behalf. "You like sex, don't you?" Like you're supposed to say, no not really? Or do they prefer to feel like they're forcing you a little bit? Bit rapey, no?

I've known men like this, too, and I think you're absolutely right to throw this one back.

@Theuniverseandeverything - he never expressed any concerns…I never put pressure on him to be sexual.
Thing is - we are in our 50s and I just feel too old for these dilemmas. Sex should be an enjoyable experience…I feel grateful that I have a healthy libido and I thought it would be welcome by a potential partner.
Hence my bewilderment.

Yep, I’ve encountered this because I enjoyed sex in a dating relationship (eg not pulling men off the street to seduce!). Any sign of “forwardness” was really treated like I was going all out dominatrix style (which is really not me at all) - lots of comments on how I was enjoying it and how “cheeky” etc I was…honestly it was very off putting. Like a PP says, as if I was curating my responses and moves to elicit a response when actually I was just being open and natural. I ended up feeling like a dirty little secret and it definitely stopped a relationship developing, because I think he saw sexual urges in a woman as deviant and couldn’t build an emotional relationship with a woman with a sex drive. Not a problem every man has!

@beastlyslumber - exactly. He’s enjoying the act and the attention but at the same time I feel shamed for showing that I’m enjoying it too and for expressing my preferences.

What it boils down to is that he doesn’t see you as an equal, not in the bedroom at least. He’s feigning some slight surprise that you actually want to have sex so willingly and thus doesn’t see you as someone who has exactly the same emotional and physical relationship needs as he does. And I say that as a man. I’ve never really been into porn as it’s so blatantly false and scripted most of the time, but I can see why some men would evolve a mindset like this - so much of porn seems to revolve around the needs of the male star and not the female. Bin him and move on to someone who recognises you as a person in your own right in every aspect.

Maybe he's just not used to a women who is sexually confident and actually keen to have sex with him? I think you need to be really blunt with him on this and ask him if he thinks there's something wrong or unusual about a woman enjoying and wanting sex because his attitude is starting to give you the ick.

@Tal45 - I tried and he seemed to be embarrassed that I was so open about bringing it up. As if me talking about sex was shameful, too.
But again - he has no problems with dtd.
The more I write here about it the more I realise how incompatible we are.

@DoctorManhattan - I think you are right.

There is nothing wrong with enjoying sex but I suspect that most men don’t actually come across that many women who ‘love’ sex.
Even after 30yrs with DH he still is in awe of my enthusiasm.
I was chatting with my DSis recently. She is twice divorced and has been dating over the last few years. Her last relationship ended because she found her bc comment about her liking ‘dirty’ sex a bit weird. Nothing kinky or fetish , but she was happy to initiate and thoroughly enjoys giving oral sex.
Apparently’ dirty’ is what most men dream of but may find a bit intimidating when they actually are confronted by it.
Best to find someone who appreciates your talents.

@Justilou1

Don’t let him blame you for his inadequacies! My guess is that he has erectile issues and will escalate to gaslighting you into taking the blame for that.

How can you possibly jump to that conclusion?