Not the sort of girl boys like

[FuckItAllOffRightNow]

That's what I was told about myself growing up.

Apparently it's true.

I'm most definitely a woman now and still the sort of woman that men don't like.

I know it's not the be all and end all but it fucks me right off sometimes.

It sounds like you absolutely are the type of woman men like. You just think you aren't worthy of being in a relationship with and end it or don't progress it.

I'm feisty and opinionated and also loving and passionate, tomboyish but packaged femininely and I've been in relationships most of my adult life.

Just be yourself op and believe that you do deserve to be in a relationship (that's if you do want to be in a relationship with these men!)

Do you put a lot of effort into these initial stages? Is it hard to keep up?

Good question! I don't think I put a lot of effort into this stage but I suppose I feel more relaxed and comfortable and flirty. As time goes by, I pick up on signs that they are not that into me and withdraw a little around the 3 month mark. Sometimes I just end it. Sometimes I give it another couple of months just to make sure. I've not yet been proven wrong.

But I also know that my expectation is now that they won't want to pursue anything beyond that mark with me so I am actively looking for sogns they're not interested. But they are always there. Even if, in reality, its just that they don't want the same sort of thing from a relationship as I do. I feel they become less interested around that point and I feel foolish for being with them.

In what way is it not one? The label, or more?

Just the fact that it isn't really. We have talked about it. I know he is wary that I ended it before which is fair enough. But he was also single for a long time and his previous relationship was difficult (confirmed by mutual friends). He had just got very used to filling his time as a long term single man and he just didn't fall in love with me 🤷🏻‍♀️

But we're very close and what we have works for us both in any ways.

zaema

I can't change who I am though 🤷🏻‍♀️ and that's how I am with male friends, not with men I'm hoping to have a relationship with.

I'm not a damsel in distress so I'm not going to pretend to he one. I'm not resistant to someone helping if they possess a skill set I don't etc but I'm not going to ask a man to do things for me as a default.

Your mother is a nightmare telling you you are not his type of woman to attract a man! What a peculiar and damaging thing to tell a child.

Yeah, I know. It started when I was still at primary school - probably around 8 or 9 and continued until I last saw her 10 years ago.

I've dealt with it in therapy but I guess some programming is very difficult to undo!

And, as I keep being told, the right man will love me for me... 🙄😉

I'm feisty and opinionated and also loving and passionate, tomboyish but packaged femininely

This is probably a good description of me too!

I also think you make a good point with the deserving.

Before I'd dealt with my 'issues', and when I wasuch younger,I used to wonder what the decent ones would see in me and pushed them away for their own protection. I felt shake for them if they were interested. I'm no longer like that but it's made no tangible difference.

It's when they discover the tomboyish opinionated element that insense them.losomg interest. I'm not doing 'womaning' right kind of thing.

I dated one man many years ago who pretty much told me that I was doing being a girl wrong.

How do you imagine a proper relationship progressing beyond the flirty stage - what would you like to happen after the initial excitement is over?

I think you should stop listening to other people. Not everyone is right for you and vice versa. You aren't going things wrong. You are you.

@FuckItAllOffRightNow

It's when they discover the tomboyish opinionated element that insense them.losomg interest. I'm not doing 'womaning' right kind of thing.

I dated one man many years ago who pretty much told me that I was doing being a girl wrong.

The ultimate in mansplaining ...!

“I dated one man many years ago who pretty much told me that I was doing being a girl wrong.”

What do you think he meant by that?

What do you think he meant by that?

He referenced two film scenes.

Bridget Jones running down the street after Mr D in her underwear in the snow and Monica Belluci's character dancing around the bedroom in her underwear in L'Apartement.

So, essentially, women should be like that. Gentle, sexy, adoring, frivolous... I got it wrong when I tiled the bathroom and drank beer. As well.as pretty much every day I didn't dance around anywhere in my knickers. Which was never.

The ultimate in mansplaining ...!

I know, right!!

@ravenmum

How do you imagine a proper relationship progressing beyond the flirty stage - what would you like to happen after the initial excitement is over?

Hmm. Well I'd imagine it settles into something predictable and reliable. Something we're you're a team. Do stuff together and are supportive of each other doing things independently but with a common goal of growing and doing stuff together. With a healthy dose of love, respect, loyalty and affection. Just a sense of 'championing' each other for the duration of the relationship and a desire to see the other person happy amd fulfilled and be that yourself. Contentment. Not constantly looking elsewhere.

I've never met anyone interested that with me.

You sound very much like my SIL. Last boyfriend she had was 20 years ago. She's pretty, feisty and v v independent. A good laugh to go out with and can do DIY better than any man I know and drink everyone under the table.

She comes across as not needing anyone and I think this is an issue for men. Even if you wear the trousers they do like to feel needed, it plays up to their egos somewhat.

Don't change though, you sound like an amazing person. Somewhere there is a man out there who will get you and adore that you're not a simpering woman running after them or dancing around in your granny pants.

“Bridget Jones running down the street after Mr D in her underwear in the snow and Monica Belluci's character dancing around the bedroom in her underwear in L'Apartement.”

Well he sounds unhinged, so you’re well shot there.

@zaema

“Bridget Jones running down the street after Mr D in her underwear in the snow and Monica Belluci's character dancing around the bedroom in her underwear in L'Apartement.”

Well he sounds unhinged, so you’re well shot there.

I'm not going to disagree with that!

But it doesn't help me either.

@Twinkie01

You sound very much like my SIL. Last boyfriend she had was 20 years ago. She's pretty, feisty and v v independent. A good laugh to go out with and can do DIY better than any man I know and drink everyone under the table.

She comes across as not needing anyone and I think this is an issue for men. Even if you wear the trousers they do like to feel needed, it plays up to their egos somewhat.

Don't change though, you sound like an amazing person. Somewhere there is a man out there who will get you and adore that you're not a simpering woman running after them or dancing around in your granny pants.

But I do need someone sometimes. I'm not all "fuck off, I don't need a man!" But I've also experienced men who will then refuse to help me if I ask saying, "I thought you could do everything yourself?" When it becomes a punishment of sorts.

You post here wanting a relationship.

You had a relationship. You ended it.

Now you are still having a relationship with him - you see him, you celebrate with him, you have sex with him, you clearly have warm feelings for him.

It's not a "relationship" in your mind though. Perhaps this is why you feel it is now working.

If you think you are in a "relationship" (quote marks) then something happens to put the tin hat on it.

What is that "something" and is it something that you are doing, rather than the man?

I think this is what you can be curious about.

@zaema

“Bridget Jones running down the street after Mr D in her underwear in the snow and Monica Belluci's character dancing around the bedroom in her underwear in L'Apartement.”

Well he sounds unhinged, so you’re well shot there.

Haha! Yes we'll shot!

Op tiling the bathroom and drinking beer you sound fab There will be someone who will love you for just you just haven't met them yet. Tbh you sound a lot like me. I'm married and happy but if anything happened I think I would stop single as I would also I'm not the type generally me go for (don't think I'm unattractive a size 12 and age 40) just the way am am sounds similar to you...my mum would never of said what your mum said she thinks anyone would be lucky to have me know doubt (a typical gushy mum who is totally biased about their kids). Tbh it's a minefield out there with finding someone but at least you got a good filter on you!

Somewhere there is a man out there who will get you and adore that you're not a simpering woman running after them or dancing around in your granny pants.

Thing is, my male friends like that about me. Less so men who are looking for a relationship. For whatever reason, I'm just not 'girlfriend material'...

Well I'd imagine it settles into something predictable and reliable. Something we're you're a team. Do stuff together and are supportive of each other doing things independently but with a common goal of growing and doing stuff together. With a healthy dose of love, respect, loyalty and affection.

this seems quite a big expectation if you're not sensing it by 3 months in though, with my now DH we weren't like this until at least 18 months - 2 years down the line.

“Thing is, my male friends like that about me. Less so men who are looking for a relationship. For whatever reason, I'm just not 'girlfriend material'...”

I’ve been married for 17 years, but used to have the opposite problem in that I could never be friends with men. To be honest, I’ve never had a male friend to this day. I just don’t know how that would work?

Do stuff together and are supportive of each other doing things independently but with a common goal of growing and doing stuff together. With a healthy dose of love, respect, loyalty and affection.

You don't think it could develop into that with this guy if you gave it time?

Have you wanted/tried to move into this stage yourself?

I'm the same . I'm too forthright, outgoing, over confident and assertive. But I don't care, I don't want to change.

Thing is, my male friends like that about me. Less so men who are looking for a relationship.

This is probably part of the problem. I work in a male-dominated place - I have at times called colleagues up on sexist comments and had the response, "you don't count, you're one of us." (True or not, that still doesn't make sexist comments okay.) It means they don't see me as a real woman (whatever that is,) but as a token man, despite the amount of time I bang on about feminist issues and do on. So I'm not on the radar as an available woman - which is fine in the workplace, especially as most of them are married, but I suspect that other men outside of work also see me that way, too.

From a male perspective I find your self-awareness and independence big pluses, and certainly wouldn't dream of advising you to pretend to be something you aren't.

It might be worth reflecting on whether your self-sufficiency is the characteristic people most associate with you though. I'd find it attractive, but would possibly be reluctant to pursue a relationship as I'd, even subconsciously, expect to get rejected eventually.

I'm also longterm single and have been spending time with a platonic female friend recently. No interest on either side, so no pressure/tension, etc, but I can see the barriers she puts up so clearly its made me reflect on my own.

So I'm going to do some work on making myself slightly more open to other people (lockdown loneliness has been a factor too, as I don't want another year like the last one).

Your current casual/non-relationship would suit me down to the ground (perhaps too well actually), so I'd enjoy that and see where it goes.

Good luck.

OP - Have you asked your female friends why they think you struggle to form long-term relationships?