Secrets of emotionally independent women...

[WishStarDream]

How do you emotionally detatch and learn not to care as much about having a relationship, or the state of your relationship? I'm in newish relationship but I feel like he's just not as into it as he was, he denies it but I think actions speak louder than words. He makes me feel needy and insecure, so I know I need to back off to see if he steps forward. How can I do that without coming across as sulking or ending up blurting it out? Ideally I'd just learn to care less about him, but I can never play it cool with men when I want them. So if you're a chilled, emotionally independent woman who can take them or leave them...what's your secret?

The secret is surrounding yourself in people you can trust and people who actually love you.

All these people who think they are just emotionally independent because they are strong....they are emotionally independent because either they are damaged (from emotional trauma) or they are just normal people who don't have shit head chipping away at their confidence in their inner circle.

You’re thinking about it in terms of a power dynamic, which is the wrong way. Who is more needy? Who has the most power. Your power comes from within and should not be dependent on how much a man needs you. If I were you, I’d look into your attachment as a child. I used to feel like I needed a man to feel happy. And then after an awful breakup where I was depressed and jealous for years, I decided I would never ever let a man make me feel like that again. And I didn’t. I took my power from myself. It took a huge amount of effort but is totally liberating. I now have a happy marriage and two kids. I also made sure that I always kept my own friends and interests.

My secret is an ex husband who had an affair and broke my heart and made me question everything i thought I knew and believed about relationships and marriage.

I am in another relationship now and have been for almost 2 years, but I don't want the same things this time around. I don't want a joint mortgage, marriage or kids with him. I don't even want to live with him. A lot of that is probably due to me having children and wanting to put them first while they are at home but just can't get excited about that stuff after my experiences. I love him and I know he would live with me and marry me but my feelings and wishes are just as valid so if he wants more in the next few years then unfortunately he will have to look elsewhere for it.

I think I was always quite independent in my marriage too and my ex knew it. I think the affair was partly someone flattering his ego and making him feel needed. I loved him more than anything but I didn't 'need' him.

So I guess I could never chase after a man as it's not in my DNA to do so.

If what you're looking for is commitment, marriage, children, then his easy-going 'let's see where it goes' style is fine for him, but you've got a biological clock ticking.

I'm a lot older, long term single, and had a 3 year long distance relationship which was lovely, but for him it was 'for now' and I gradually realised that that wasn't enough for me, so I gradually withdrew, without saying what I was doing, and when he didn't come after me then I ended it.

There is absolutely no point in angsty conversations about 'the relationship'. Enjoy the times you have together, but if he knows that you want commitment but he isn't committing, I think you need to begin the process of gradually becoming less available with a view to moving on. It doesn't have to be drama.

Hope you find a way through this.

@Sally2791

Bitter experience- they really aren’t worth the effort. I can laugh at myself now, how much emotional angst I put myself through in relationships. If a decent one pops up I may take an interest- but other bits of my life are more dependably satisfying. Invest in yourself, spend time doing what you want, don’t worry about being single.

I think i love you.

My two book recommendations are:
Attached (about attachment types)
The Unexpected Joy of Being Single

Both really good for self development in this area.

People say it's a cliche but I'll be perfectly honest with you, I've never heard a truer word spoken .....you cant have a healthy relationship with anyone if you don't know how to have one with yourself.
Most of the women I know who are as you describe yourself hate being single. It's as though they would rather be miserable with someone than miserable alone, not realising that quite often it's the being with someone that's making them miserable.
Imagine being happy just on your own. Imagine not being scared of being single. Imagine feeling confident as you're controlling your own life, doing what you want, with whom you want and when you want. Imagine having lots of things to look forward to, things you've planned because you want to do them.
Imagine really enjoying guiding your own life in a direction that's completely right for you. Imagine just having time to yourself, being happy and content in your own company. Imagine you controlling how you feel and your mood not being dependent on how happy someone else is that day.
So if you had all that would you give it up to put up with some twat stringing you along, making you feel insecure and doubtful. Of course you wouldn't, you'd blow him out and happily continue until a better man came along. That's the place you need to get to, in your own skin, by yourself. Then it doesn't matter whether they're into you or not, you know that ultimately you're into yourself and therefor it doesn't matter if it works or not, because youll be fine either way. That feeling makes you a whole lot less needy, it stops the over thinking and the gut wrenching omg does he still want to be with me feeling.
Start that process by stop worrying about how much he likes you and start asking yourself how much you actually like him. And whether you're getting what you need from this union.

Have a really good life of your own, so that he understands he is part of it, not the centre of it. Develop strong hobbies, friendships, work or education goals, adventures you want to have in life and put as much energy into these as into your relationship.

This is a win-win situation. If he likes you, your zest for life will be really attractive to him. If he doesn't, you have loads of enjoyable things to do so you won't miss him as much if he loses interest.

Thank you, you're all so lovely! I have children, I've been married. I don't want commitment, I just want to feel like he's really into it and have a lovely romance. Maybe I have too high expectations!
It's hard to be happy single when all your freinds are married. Making plans as a single person is quite hard to do

I'm one of these and I agree with lots of pp - work on being happy with your own company and steering your own ship in life.

Having built a life I love I wouldn't give it up or disrupt it for a man now if you paid me!

And yes, surround yourself with friends and family who love you, but don't depend solely on them for validation and love either. Ultimately when your happiness comes from you, you're in charge instead of it being dependent on another person.

It's hard to be happy single when all your freinds are married. Making plans as a single person is quite hard to do

Forgive me being blunt but I think this is a perception not reality. I have some friends who are surgically attached to their husbands or partners but I have just as many married friends who are happy to meet up just us, or who have opened their existing friendship circles to include me wholeheartedly regardless of my relationship status, and some of their spouses are now my friends in their own right too.

But if when you see them you have an air of jealousy, longing or wistfulness then they're not going to be falling over themselves to include you.

Pp with the win win zest for life had it spot on.

It is a process OP but it's the best feeling on the other side!

Knowing that I dont need a partner in life. That Im capable, happy & independent. A partner will be an add on & not 'my other half'. Learning that we dont need a full blown relationship with every person we date. Its ok to say this isn't for me. If its not easy initially it's not worth it in the long run.

@pointythings I love that analogy!

I'm going to think of myself as a delicious cake from now on, with or without icing

You get into therapy and you unpick all the shit that makes up you as a person and then you rebuild it all.

What you are left with is hopefully an understanding of who you are, why you are the way you are, why you act the way you act and a respect and love for yourself so that you no longer put yourself in harmful situations or engage in damaging behaviour.

It’s not about caring for someone else less, it’s about valuing and caring about yourself more.

Accepting that you may get hurt in life and being ok with that because fundamentally life goes on and rejection is just part and parcel of our experience.

Being open to love is not about playing games, it’s about being open and willing. Learning as you go and forgiving your mistakes and ensuring you don’t repeatedly make them. And forgiving your partner when they fuck up too (I’m talking about acting like a dick occasionally not cheating or being abusive) because we are all just humans trying our best.

You have to remember that YOU create your reality, if you get hurt you can choose to heal and move on. It is part of life. If you do not accept that sometimes it won’t work out even when you’ve given it everything then you’re in for a life of heartache I’m afraid.

You don’t have to care less, you have to choose where it is worth the risk.

Therapy all the way. If you can’t afford therapy then decent books.

Fill your life with things which aren't vices but emotionally fulfill you and you can let go of a few here and there if you need to make space for the right partner. Have a good book in your hand in all your spare time. If the guy calls you, you put it down, but you know it's there to go back to when the call or meet up ends. Start filling your life with so many of these things that a partner can be seen as equal to one of these things, which if they're not available at some point, it won't matter to you, and you won't resent when they do become available.

OP I think you need to be honest with yourself about what is motivating you. For a long time post the breakdown of my marriage I was motivated by the need to have some financial security. I knew the only way I’d ever be able to buy my own property was to do it jointly so that pushed me into looking for a partner. Circumstances changed and I was able to buy a property on my own and that completely altered what I was looking for, or indeed made me realise I didn’t want to look at all. For others it’s often desire to start a family, or loneliness if your circle is coupled up. Some motivations are easy to deal with in other ways, some are not.

@WishStarDream Yes, never vocalise your annoyance, you want affection from them because they freely want to be giving it to you, not because they have been nagged into it, or just to please you.
He might just not have it in him, that's what you find out by stepping back if you realise you've been instigating it all. If they step up without you needing to say, just by noticing you pull away, fine, if they don't, that's when you know you are incompatible and should move on. You can't force someone to start being affectionate with you.

fill your life with things that emotionally fulfil you
other bits of my life are more dependably satisfying

I’d really like to know what things? I’m single but I have a challenging job, good friends and family, lovely children. But I have this emptiness and longing for...something. Not sure it’s a relationship, not really sure what it is but I’d love to hear about how you’ve got to feel emotionally satisfied / fulfilled because that really chimed with me and is what I’m missing.

You get in the mindset "they are fucking lucky to have you" and stay in that mind set.

Having to reassure a relatively new relationship is draining. It is more likely to have the opposite effect.

@IdaArnold I fill my life with the pursuit of the meaning of life.

I draw and paint for meditation, when swimming pools were open I practised getting the longest front crawl stroke, I read philosophy from around the world and note the similarities and the differences, I challenge my cooking and embrace the new (at the moment it's Egyptian inspired food), I organise days out just to find one specific site or object, luckily we saw the Rosetta stone just before shutdown last year and awed in what this one object gave humanity. I do loads of things that I find of interest I understand this is bespoke for each and everyone of us. I learnt the areas of the shopping forecast on Radio4 once because I had no idea what they were!

What does this give me? Endless topics of conversation with the Mr and kids, and friends and school teachers. It makes most of my problems surmountable, it provides distraction and wonder. It also feeds itself once you get going.

I nourish my head and my soul, we get lost down tunnels on Spotify finding great songs on particular genres together, I research plants for our garden that give us and/or the wildlife food. I got a hula hoop, still can't do it but hey it's something to aim for. I've tried knitting, nope can't do it well enough for it to be viable, but I can sew a bit, you can make clothes you like in the colours and textures that shops just can't stock. I made shelves once, steep carpentry curve there. I can now play basic keyboard and picked up my childhood instrument again.

I am also determined to master the Rubik's cube!

I still want to master coin magic tricks to show off basically but for me it's hard. I can't bake big loaves but can do flatbread now.

Just examples of how I end up down rabbit holes. There is a longer list of stuff still to do but I will leave it here.

@IdaArnold yeah everyone is different but I would say it's the things you loved to do as a child and maybe more. Whatever you find interesting and fascinating and want to learn or pick up. Meetup.com is great for mixing with people and picking up new hobbies. Me personally I have lots of things I love to do in a group, like improv and self development courses, and then things I love to do alone, like reading , learning languages, arts and crafts, learning tarot. If you're lost for inspiration maybe start by picking a sport.

@frozendaisy and @Welikebeingcosy thank you for responding, the things you’re doing sound great! I think, due to the nature of my job and too much social media use, that my attention span and ability to get my head into anything for an extended period have been messed up. I can’t even read a book anymore or watch a tv programme without wandering off. Need to work on immersing myself in activities. Maybe something physical would be good to start with.

@WishStarDream

Thank you, you're all so lovely! I have children, I've been married. I don't want commitment, I just want to feel like he's really into it and have a lovely romance. Maybe I have too high expectations! It's hard to be happy single when all your freinds are married. Making plans as a single person is quite hard to do

Those are completely natural, understandable feelings. i know I;d feel the same if I'd been single for ages.

But since you only have control of your own life and feelings, not his, you just have to keep making the best of them. You can make plans with DC. Think of some experiences you want them to have in childhood, some skills you want them to learn, some adventures you'd like to have with them, and start acting on them. Every season when DC were young I'd make a small bucket list of things I wanted to do with them, places I wanted to go with them, things I wanted to teach them.

You can do the same with your own life. I know bucket lists seem a bit silly and people think they are all about jumping out of aeroplanes or climbing Everest but they can just be a list of things you have always wanted to do - small or large. Doing them is so invigorating. I have a lovely partner but almost nothing on my bucket list involves him!

Listen to your head. Tell yourself the blunt truth. Actions speak louder than words and lying is very easy. The knowledge that no matter what happens I will be okay on my own and will look after myself. I have always found men very disappointing from a young age, my own father was useless and I grew up around strong matriarchal women who taught me from being a young teen that you never rely on men or take shit from men. You have to dance to the beat of your own drum.

I really like this thread...not much to add but following for tips.

@IdaArnold oh I know that feeling too! These days I just do five minutes of something at a time and then do a short burst of something else. Hoping eventually it will turn into longer bursts. Also doesn't help that I'm still tuned in to listen out for a baby every few minutes even though DD is nearly two now!