Awaiting a call in the next hour or so, upset with my parents.

[HotelChoc]

I've NC'd for this but long term poster and reader.

Where do I start?

I'm awaiting my weekly phone call from my mum.
Last weekend, following my birthday mid week, we had planned to go out, perhaps to the coast and go to see my parents. I've not seen them since Christmas Eve when I drove to them with gifts and spent as long as could standing in their cold garden.

Anyway during a call last Saturday, I agree the plan with my mum. Gets up Sunday and just before we leave home I pick up a FB message to say 'Don't think it is a good idea for you to come here today, your DB is here fitting out the bathroom'. I respond with 'oh, ok'.

I'm a grown up but I was so upset. Long running NC with my DB, however I've always made it clear that I will talk to him, that I'm ok with being in the same place as him. He doesn't want that.

My mum will be ringing in an hour. I'm nervous and busy planning how I address this.

I've not gone into detail of the long running saga, it would take hours...but I'm happy to add detail. I really need some help!

I know my mum will try not to mention this, my parents don't address issues so I'm going to have to bring this up. Recently my DS visited, as he was running an errand for them and was also left outside without any introduction to his uncle or cousin who were there at the time. When I raised that the answer was ' oh I didn't know your DS had seen him'. I really don't like how things are left to fester and never addressed.
My parents won't address any of this with my DB, at the time of the fall out he wasn't in touch with them for 8 years afterwards. They don't want that to happen again.

Sorry, I'll shut up now!

[2021x]

Hi OP

I have the opposite problem, my mum keeps trying to make me and my SIL get on, which will not happen. It’s because my Mum still values my DB as the golden child (she has even admitted to it), avoids conflict like the plague and is worried if she causes a problem my SIL will not let her see her DGC- which I actually don’t think will happen

They are all planning a trip to Disney in Florida, and I told me my Mum that I would not be wasting my annual leave being anxious and walking on eggshells around my SIL.

For all those posters who say you must have done something...it is not true. It started between me and my SIL when my brother chose to go with my answer in Trivial Pursuit (she was right though!). She is insecure and I had a good relationship with my brother- sadly not anymore.

[Chicchicchicchiclana]

Is the long and short of it that your brother doesn't talk to you because you refused to go to his wedding? Also, he may have found it a bit much that you "claimed" the same 3 weeks every year as your time to holiday with your parents but when he wanted to go for one of those weeks one year you ended up not going at all? I don't really understand what his wife's parentage has to do with anything.

I feel for your parents a bit and I expect the last thing your Mum needed yesterday was a grilling from you. It's difficult for them too.

[Onlinedilema]

Did I read correctly, your dps sent a FB message to tell you not to come?
Seriously, I would not contact them again, I would leave them to it. Let them contact you. Tell them to visit you next time rather than you make all the effort.

[billybagpuss]

This does sound difficult. I would message them in plenty of time about Christmas saying something along along the lines of, now you’re back in the uk and you had Christmas here last year we assume it’s DB turn so we’ve made alternative arrangements.

[Junipersky]

It reminds me of the situation when I was a child.
My Mum and her brother stopped speaking after a massive argument.
My Gran used to phone my Mum to warn her that my uncle and family were visiting so we could avoid them and vice versa.
Once we turned up at my grandparents unannounced. My Gran was really anxious but didn't say why. It then turned out that my uncle, aunt and cousins were due to arrive.
They walked in, gave us all a dirty look (us kids included) then proceeded to drag my bewildered cousins back out of the house.
It was so upsetting to be kept apart from our cousins due to the adults having no contact, but when I look back now as an adult it is my poor Gran that I feel for most.
It must have been a nightmare having to arrange separate visits and the fear of both turning up announced on the same day.

[Junipersky]

unannounced that should have read.

[SelkieFly]

Oh boy, I feel like I want to go and have a glass of wine and a good long chat with you because the family dynamics are so similar to my own. It's so good to talk it out on mumnset but I recommend Patrick Teahan on youtube and Jay Reid on youtube. They are all about family dynamics and a lot of their videos have been so comforting. My parents stonewall me when I want to discuss something. Then if I try and force them out of their ''weather is lovely, garden is nice'' repetoire, they accuse me of being angry, shouting... my brother takes their side.
So there is literally no mechannism for feedback in the family ifywkwim. They just won't have that. My Dad is my mum's institutionalised footsolddier. Whereas in your family it lookds like your parents are your brother's foot soldeiers. But nthey think they can control you and keep you summonsed in to the family to play the role of daughter ewhile deniying you any voice, any reall communication, any connection.............


I stepped back from my family a year ago and they are so used to me crawling back to them to apologise for telling them they hurt me. I'm not participating in this dynamic anymore though.


You can't fix this because it's not your that won't communicate.

[SelkieFly]

@Onlinedilema

Did I read correctly, your dps sent a FB message to tell you not to come?
Seriously, I would not contact them again, I would leave them to it. Let them contact you. Tell them to visit you next time rather than you make all the effort.

Yes, on your birthday

I think this is a catalyst.

If these were friends, you'd get the message loud and loud. The message is ''your feelings don't matter''.

it's a really, really, really hard message to process when your parents don't care about your feelings and it sounds shocking to us but I think for some older parents (mine are mid seventies) their adult children remain ''object self''. My mother treats me like an extension of herself so a tool for her people pleasing or whatever she intends. It angers her so profoundly when I do not co-operate that i know she doesn't really see me as an autonomous person she can feel empathy for. But she could feel empathy for the woman next door. But not me.

Please step back from the dynamic and stop participating in it @HotelChoc

It doesn't have to be a big announcement that causes more drama. But perhaps stop contacting them and if and when they ever address that, respond.

My parents have so far spent a YEAR (almost to the day) sticking their heads in the sand. They have successfully stonewalled me for a year so far. So I can't reassure you that this gets sorted out quickly, but in that year i've been to see a psychotherapist and it's been really really helpful.

I feel a bit more calmness at the sad reality now. I have accepted it over the last year, much more than I ever could have accepted it if I was still summonsed to play the part of daughter and getting wrapped up in that role. I have stepped back and realised that I have played the role they wanted me to play but I have still been denied any voice.

So although it doesn't magically give parents clarity! I still recommend it. Take a year or maybe it will take two years, or three years, but respect your right not to participate in this dysfunctional dynamic anymore.

xx

[SelkieFly]

Go away next christmas. Do not sit around waiting to see where you fall in their pecking order. It's ridiculous and it's demeaning. You've done this for 20 years?!

[UpTheJunktion]

Your father sounds horrible, prioritises his Golden Child son, and your Mum doesn’t or can’t stand up to him.

No point in an appointment system: you had an arrangement to visit for your birthday. They cancelled.

I am glad you told your Mum how you felt about that.

It was a horrible, horrible way to treat you, just sending a brush off by message.

To be honest, their behaviour is toxic. You face constant disappointment while ever you chase the family closeness you yearn for.

I would plan something nice for next weekend and not be available for the regular call. Prioritise other people and yourself for a weekend.

[Roboticcarrot]

I'd be upset too, a message just before you set off is cowardly and pathetic. Did they not know they needed the work done, or more than likely they probably said ah x is coming over today and suddenly it was the only time he could do whatever in the bathroom. If was a genuine last minute thing, a call saying its not the best idea would have been better.

Leave them all to it OP, they all sound pretty pathetic to be honest.

[SelkieFly]

@Iminaglasscaseofemotion

YABU. Your parents don't need to address anything. Your brothers issues with you are not their responsibility.
He doesn't want to see you, and he was the one their doing a job for them (I'm assuming as a favour) so that takes priority.
Why would your parents introduce your ds to his uncle if you are all no contact? Surely that would just be more awkward than anything else.
I don't really see why you would bring it up, or what you expect them tk do about it?

Really? Nothing to address?

Their adult children aren't communicating and their son was NO CONTACT for eight years. Their pattern of communication is to not confront anything difficult. That has avoided an argument where they were blamed (obviously something that terrifies them) but they play so completely in to the brother's narrative that they leave a boy/teen (?) outside and involve him in the non - contact by acting weird and not bringing him in to the house on principle to show their son that he cannot dictate which of their grandchildren can come in to the house.

[diddl]

I'm not sure why your brother doing the bathroom meant that you couldn't have met one or even both of your parents elsewhere?

I agree with pps-draw back & leave them to their son!

It's a difficult situation for them but they don't seem to be trying to accomodate you at all.

As for being called an awkward bitch by your own father!

[SelkieFly]

''As for being called an awkward bitch by your own father!''

Yeh, angry with OP for not accommodating the toxic family dynamics. That would have been a moment for me....

It's really sad but I have detached a lot from my parents in the last year. I'm sick of playing the part of daughter. I want a respectful, communicative adult to adult conversation where I have a voice. And that just is not on the cards.

[PersonalAssistantParent]

I am really upset for you. There are a lot of people in this treating you like crap.

Your DB is an arsehole and his DW is a nasty piece of work, probably as a result of her own shitshow. Your parents, although in a bad place, are enablers.

You seem in a bit of a vulnerable place. Your parents marginalise you to keep the peace with your DB. Your DB treats you like dirt with his wife's hand up his back. You aren't with your DC's dad.

I think you need to start thinking about yourself and improving your support network whether that be with another partner and friends.

I have 2 DBs and we have had our failings out but they were always made up quickly and we have each others backs. You seem to be your DB's whipping boy. He sounds like a horrible bastard. After the way he has treated you, you should no longer give him and his wife the time of day, let alone be willing to talk to him. TBH I would have told him exactly what kind of poor excuse of a man he was by now.

[OnlyInYourDreams]

There’s something more going on here IMO.

I get the prioritisation of one child over another etc but this seems to go deeper.

The fact they said you couldn’t stay elsewhere in the same country while your brother was there leads me to think that they have probably told your brother they’re NC with you as well.

He probably believes that the whole family have cut you off because that’s likely what they’ve told him. Why else would they try to keep your presence in their life such a secret.

[SelkieFly]

I wish the people who won't have these difficult conversations would realise that they actually prolong the awkwardness and the problems by never talking about them. How can some people believe that not talking about things solves the issue!?
If you have the conversation then there's a chance that you can solve the issue.

I suppose it's because if they sit down and properly TALK they know that their actions aren't fair. But they also know that the ''house of cards'' only stays up if they're unfair to you!. How nice for you.

I was listening to a Patrick Teachan clip on youtube about the drama triangle last night and he was saying how making the scapegoat the persecutor (OP) brings the enabler and the rescuer closer together.

In their bizarre interpretation, OP is the ''persecutor'' by wanting (for example) to still come to parents' house abroad on the same dates after her brother had said he was coming. OP had booked first but she is a ''bitch'' for not accommodating her brother.

On some level the parents in this scenario and others like it must know that the reason they cannot risk sitting down for open honest communication is that if their backs are up against the wall, they cannot offer up any defense of this other than to appease the persecutor/narcissist.

Some family systems need a scapegoat. My own family needs a scapegoat and I'm it.

I've stopped playing.

[PersonalAssistantParent]

''As for being called an awkward bitch by your own father!''

He said this to keep you in line and he knew you wouldn't do anything about it whereas your DB went no contact for 8 years for some unknown reason. He would never say this to your DB.

By any chance is your DB a chip off the old block of your dad?

[UpTheJunktion]

The fact they said you couldn’t stay elsewhere in the same country while your brother was there leads me to think that they have probably told your brother they’re NC with you as well

This holds water. And fits the other scenarios in which you and your Ds have been vanished away.

[MichelleScarn]

That has avoided an argument where they were blamed (obviously something that terrifies them) but they play so completely in to the brother's narrative that they leave a boy/teen (?) outside and involve him in the non - contact by acting weird and not bringing him in to the house on principle to show their son that he cannot dictate which of their grandchildren can come in to the house.
This would be the end of it for me, they left their grandchild outside to appease what sounds like a truculent adult. How on earth did they explain why they did this to your DS? And still they expect you to play host at Christmas? And I'm sure they would drop you the instant your Dbro wanted to change plans.

[butterpuffed]

What an awkward situation. You're stuck in the middle , OP , but then so is your mother . Eggshells all round.

I don't understand why your brother suddenly blew up about the engagement party, so I'm guessing he was always awkward and wanted things his own way ?

I'm sorry to say, I really don't know how it can be resolved. The whole family is being ruled by one person.

[6Helen7]

I would like to hear the other side of the story. Your brother's side. There are always two sides to a story.

I don't understand what his wife's father's relationship had to do with anything?

[MichelleScarn]

@UpTheJunktion

The fact they said you couldn’t stay elsewhere in the same country while your brother was there leads me to think that they have probably told your brother they’re NC with you as well

This holds water. And fits the other scenarios in which you and your Ds have been vanished away.

Ah yes, this is highly likely!

[HarrietYeti]

OP this sounds like such a draining situation. Would you suffer if you just ignored your parents for a few weeks? Don't ring on Sunday, just let them stew for a few weeks. As everyone says, your brother has taken the role of difficult, emotional, unpredictable, must-be-pacified-at-all-costs and you get the role of doormat.

The only way this changes if you change what you put up with. If you stop making the effort (weekly phone calls etc) either your parents will reach out to you or they won't. If they do then you will have to be clear that you feel it is too hard maintaining a relationship with them while your brother is always their priority. Say you really want a relationship with them but they will have to address your brother's issues. They need come up with a plan for what happens, for example, in the scenario with your ds arriving. Once they have made plans then you can resume your relationship with them. Unless you do this, everything will continue as is with you in this cycle of being hurt by them. If you feel you can carry on like that then do nothing.

I don't envy your parents. They are in a very difficult position. My Dh's cousins are the same, she can't bear him, he's indifferent. They just aren't ever together, their parents find it terribly sad but they do not favour one over the other and so have maintained relationships with both families.

Good luck OP. It's very easy to offer advice when you aren't in the middle of this but ultimately only you can change this situation now by forcing your parents' hand.

[Lovemusic33]

OP, I have a similar relationship with my brother but occasionally accidentally end up being in the same place at the same time (usually my mums), it is awkward but I can manage to be civil as can he even though these a obvious atmosphere between us. I think your parents and your brother need to except that there maybe times your all in the same house at the same time and as adults you can be civil with each other but you are never going to be close.

It sounds like your mum is more worried about you being in the same house as your DB than you are, maybe she just doesn’t want to atmosphere or to cause any arguments?