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Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

Original poster

What do you do when children act like the Ex?

64 replies

QuentinWinters · 09/04/2021 11:48

Very long story but I spent 20 years in an EA relationship, exH was very good at manipulating and gaslighting me so everything was my fault and I constantly had to justify myself about even tiny things. If everything was going his way he was lovely but if my needs or wants even slightly diverged from his I'd get manipulated into giving up.
Left 3 years ago and shared care 50/50. My eldest DC is 17 and he has started using the exact same tactics on me. Currently he's at his dad's as he stormed out after I wouldn't let him put the playstation in the bedroom above me at 11pm at night. The row was because I wouldn't get into a debate about whether my decision was right - he was demanding I justify myself and then if I did arguing with me so I told him we'd discuss it the next day.
He also likes to tell me what I should be doing and makes me feel like a bad mum for not prioritising his comfort at all times and is happy to use his siblings to escalate rows. E.g. the other night when I wouldn't discuss it, he started playing music really loudly and woke up his younger siblings, then told me he would not stop until I explained why he couldn't have the ps4 in his room.
Basically his style is very similar to exH and I don't know how to deal with it. I didn't leave my marriage to get into the same situation with my son. But also I feel like I over react to my son because of how his dad treated me.
Has anyone got any experience of this and suggestions for how to deal with it? I'm exhausted and upset, I am starting to not want him around because of this and I also don't want him to think this is an OK way to treat women Sad

OP posts:
EvenMoreFuriousVexation · 09/04/2021 11:50

This behaviour is unacceptable for any teenager, no matter whether their dad is abusive or not.

Did your DC have any help from school, CAMHS etc after the split?

Theunamedcat · 09/04/2021 11:58

My son does this with his baby brother im dreading it when he gets older but I've made it clear its my house my rules the last time he tried acting really badly (smashing my house up age 9)I called his dad and put him in his car said I wanted a night off from his mouth go stay with him his dad made it clear that he didn't want him and I took my devastated child back into the house (I had honestly thought he would take him) he has improved but his dad does still fall out of his mouth and I pull him up on it everytime

Justify yourself? My house my rules
Loud music? Pull the fuse
Aggressive? Police

Ive told my son if he hits anyone like his dad did he will be arrested just like his dad

EarthSight · 09/04/2021 12:38

If his Dad is so fabulous, why doesn't he go live with him?

Have you tried calmly saying 'I'm happy to explain to you why you are not having xyz, but that's all it is - an explanation. It's not an opening for a debate on the matter'. Or 'I'm not sure why you are asking an adult woman to justify herself to a 17 year old. I totally understand that you're fustrated that you can't do everything the way you want, but I'm afraid that for now, you live here and you have to accept that it's not reasonable for you to demand to get everything you want. If don't accept that, then please find a job ASAP so you can afford your own place'.

I can't imagine how difficult it would be to say that to your own son, but he's starting to behave like a bully - the fact that he feels it's perfectly in his right to distress his siblings as a sort of tactic or revenge tool against you is worrying, but maybe not in the context of how horrible some stroppy teenagers can be.

GettingUntrapped · 09/04/2021 12:48

It's good that you see it for what it is - aggressive abuse. Many single women aren't able to cope with their bullying sons. Good for you that you won't let that happen.

Temp023 · 09/04/2021 12:50

Pull the fuses.

Original poster
QuentinWinters · 09/04/2021 12:51

Yes, I try talking calmly. Then I try "my house my rules". But unless I'm giving him what he wants any discussion just turns into me justifying and him saying he doesn't understand.
I did take away all his music stuff the other night and turned off the router so he climbed out of the window and went for "a walk" at 12pm. Then told me the next morning I was a terrible mum for not begging him to come back Hmm. I did check he had a key so knew he was safe.

I'm worried too because my DP was here on Tuesday but if I was alone I think he would use force to make me talk to him e.g. pushing into my room.

My ex is no help, just says he doesn't behave like this at his house and let's DS do whatever he likes.

TBH I am getting to the point he can stay at his dads. But I hate feeling like that about my own son.

OP posts:
Original poster
QuentinWinters · 09/04/2021 12:51

It's good that you see it for what it is - aggressive abuse. Many single women aren't able to cope with their bullying sons. Good for you that you won't let that happen.

Thank you so much Flowers

OP posts:
nolovelost · 09/04/2021 13:24

My children have adopted an aspect of his attitude that I despise. I pull them up on it, but at the same time, in the back of my mind I don't make a massive thing of it as they love everything about him. One day they'll see why that side of him bothered me so much!

Stay firm, it's your house and boundaries.

wewereliars · 09/04/2021 14:44

OP you have all my sympathy. My son has gone to live with his abusive father, after I got an ocupation order to get him out.My son has seen a lot of the abuse, shouting and aggression mainly, and I am heartbroken that he has made this choice. At the same time, my son was horrible to me in the last few weeks befor our house sold, so maybe some time with his dad alone may give him a dose of reality. Demand respect from him and if he wont behave properly maybe send him to his father?

Original poster
QuentinWinters · 09/04/2021 15:00

Thanks for all your support
Demand respect from him and if he wont behave properly maybe send him to his father
Stay firm, it's your house and boundaries
Intellectually I know this is right but if he does go to his dads it makes me feel like I failed as a mum.
Part of the reason I left was because I didn't want my kids to think that behaviour is acceptable in relationships but it appears I was too late and I'm horrified.

OP posts:
HeartsAndClubs · 09/04/2021 15:06

I would send him to live with his father.

Reality is that he knows you’re scared of him and his reactions which is why he keeps pushing and pushing and pushing. If you’ve got to the point where you think that he will hurt you then I would tell him in no uncertain terms that he’s pushed you too far and he has a father he can go and live with. And if he doesn’t want that he’s free to find a job and move out.

Honestly, at 17 I wouldn’t be beyond throwing him out.

BluebellsGreenbells · 09/04/2021 15:11

Whilst there’s a lot of good info on here you need to keep it short and sharp

I’ve told you no. You can do what you want when you leave home.

He’s looking for a fight, no need to get dragged into one.

Wanderlusto · 09/04/2021 15:28

Unfortunately he probably has the same cluster b personality disorder his dad does. Normal people don't abuse other people, it usually comes from cluster b personalities (unless mental illness or booze/drugs cause it).

You show him that it isnt tolerated by telling him to leave. Boundaries and rules are totally pointless as they will be taken the same way a bull takes a red flag being waved at it.

Be can stay with his dad if he wants but he is to move out permanently either way.

You've already been abused once. Your kids have already been around it once before too. Dont tolerate it again. Out with him.

Singlenotsingle · 09/04/2021 15:35

I agree with others. You have to be firm. Tell him this behaviour won't be tolerated here and he will have to go to his dad's. Anything less will be seen as weakness. It will also be a demonstration to any siblings that up with this you will not put.

FinallyHere · 09/04/2021 15:40

Having him live with his father is in no way any failure of you as a mother.

Giving you a break from each other sounds like an excellent idea.

He will either grow out of it ... or not.

Good luck.

pog100 · 09/04/2021 15:47

I think this behaviour isn't really that unusual in 17 year olds, particularly when they have experienced some major changes and trying to work out boundaries, where they stand etc. However, I think you need to stick to your guns. If he chooses to spend time with his dad you can't really stop him but don't consider it a failure. As a PP said he'll either grow up or he won't. Your ex never did, hopefully your son will. We made a pact not to make and judgements about how our kids were turning out until they were 30.

Original poster
QuentinWinters · 09/04/2021 15:55

We made a pact not to make and judgements about how our kids were turning out until they were 30.
This sounds like an excellent plan

OP posts:
Original poster
QuentinWinters · 09/04/2021 16:05

wander this is exactly what worries me. DS admits to thinking that being able to lie convincingly is a talent he has. He manipulates all the time and only pays attention to rules or boundaries if they suit him.
But what do I do about this? I don't want to have to avoid interacting with my own son

OP posts:
Wanderlusto · 09/04/2021 16:10

Yeah it sucks. Unfortunately there isnt really anything you can do if he has gone down that route. You gotta catch that shit very young.

It might be it is just a phase and he will grow out of it as pps have suggested but...

I think I'd focus on protecting yourself for now. He is at that age where he will be heading off do do other things now anyway so you can put distance between you for a bit and maybe he will mature.

But I think the most important thing you can do for both of you now, and his siblings, is to make it clear that you do not negotiate with emotional terrorists. Unfortunately, your only way to do that that will not result in him just pushing back tenfold, is to remove him from your home.

2bazookas · 09/04/2021 16:17

He's not a child any more. I think you should just say to him straight, wte

"Look, your father used to  do/say  stuff like that to me.   It's bullying  abusive behaviour. I would not take it from him,  and you know that.    You're a young man now so  we need to have a  talk about how YOU treat women ."
FusionChefGeoff · 09/04/2021 16:22

What @2bazookas said.

Then from that convo onwards, you grey rock him. Don't give him 'the other side of his script'

One response to explain.

Then nothing or just a 'I've already answered that'

felulageller · 09/04/2021 16:34

I'm sorry but often the apple doesn't fall far from the tree

My adult DS is just as much an ars*e as his F.

I can't see us having much contact long term.

My biggest regret was believing it's nurture that shapes a person not their genes.

Original poster
QuentinWinters · 09/04/2021 16:57

Oh it's so horrible.
Obviously I thought exH was lovely when we had kids due to low self esteem and his ability to love bomb.
Now I see it for what it is but it looks like those genes are also in my children.

OP posts:
wewereliars · 09/04/2021 17:04

He has your genes too, and has had your influence growing up, that's what I am holding on to. Most teenage boys can be pretty unpleasant, it's so much harder when their father is a terrible role model Flowers

Partlysunny · 09/04/2021 17:12

Really sorry to hear that, OP. Am there too with slightly younger 6’2 rugger buggervtype son. Which is relevant as he knows I can’t take phone whatever off him.. nightmare. He’s been gone after a similar event for avfew months now. Am heartbroken and despairing. No idea what the future holds. Trying to get on with my life but it’s so hard sometimes.