Am I too soft on my son or expecting too much, puzzled by his attitude?

[PurpleSapphire]

Bit of backstory. I'm a single mum to two dc, I worked most of their lives until various health issues meant I had to claim ESA which i'm on at the moment. Some of my conditions i'll have to live with, two of them are "fixable" which would probably enable me to go back to work. Unfortunately the way things are at the moment any treatment I need to have is on hold, completely understandable.
My son is 24 and came back from Uni last year. He has had to claim jobseekers, has been applying for as many jobs as he can but no luck so far and so I have never asked him for anything towards the bills or food as I didn't think it fair when he gets so little to live on. He doesn't have a car, the only thing he has to pay out is £10 for his PAYG mobile each month. He never went out before the pandemic so doesn't spend anything on travel, his money is basically his own to spend as he pleases. I'm currently waiting for the sale of my parents house to go through. It is shared between myself and my two dc although theirs is held until the age of 25 so he'll have a decent start next year. Last night I was checking my bank statement and half jokingly said to him if it gets any lower I might have to borrow some money from him (he has a small amount of savings within the limit allowed to claim jobseekers). He absolutely point blank refused. I told him I would give it him back as soon as the house was completed and I get my share of the money (a couple of months hopefully) and his answer was "IF I get it back". I was so hurt, i've NEVER asked to borrow money from him, not even a pound for bread, and I dont spend stupidly, have never owned a catalogue or bought anything expensive, so where he's got the idea from that he wont get it back I dont know. Growing up, his dad never paid any maintenance, I paid for everything and often went without things I needed. Now i'm wondering if I should be making him pay something towards living here as yes, I do have some money coming but as I wont be able to claim esa anymore i'll have to live on it until hopefully i'm well enough to get back to work and it isnt a great deal of money, will probably last two years at the most. His attitude really shocked me and I dont know if he's just had it far too easy or i'm expecting too much of him. I'd never ask to borrow from him under normal circumstances dont get me wrong but we would be talking just a couple of hundred to get the house cleared out, for a few weeks, paid back in full. He wouldn't even miss it. He's an adult and is gaining money from the sale of this house too, a decent amount for his age!

He should be paying board. Why is he not contributing to bills and food?

Wow.

Yes, I think I would be setting this ADULT straight on a few things... not least the fact that if he thinks he's got the right to look down his nose on how you might manage your money, then he can fuck off out of the free accommodation provided by the mother who, so far, has funded EVERYTHING that has got him to the position he is now, and prove his own independence first.

How fucking dare he.

Yes, start charging rent.

He won't like it, but - 'Well, I considered us a team, you see. Your comments yesterday showed me that we're not. So - from now on, it's rent at X, or you're quite welcome to move out and actually provide for yourself.'

You've done him no favours it seems. Try and knock some sense into him - nothing more distasteful than an entitled adult male fat and comfy on the labour and support of his female relatives, who nevertheless feels it's his God-given right to judge them.

Yes. Time for a reality check. I assume he paid for rent and food at uni from his loan so he knows it isn't all a freebie. I think you need discuss that he needs to pay his way whilst living with you as an adult whether that is a fixed amount or a %of his income especially in circumstances where you can't afford to keep him.

I wonder if the problem is that you approached it "half jokingly". If you need to borrow money from your son you should have approached it in a serious manner. It doesn't seem right that he is amassing savings while your own savings are ebbing away so I think it's reasonable for you to ask for a contribution, however I don't think you can expect him to just handover his savings to bail you out.

I agree with HotPenguin. This is the kind of conversation that needs you to sit down with him and have a proper chat. The bit in your OP about you paying for him and sometimes going without things yourself is something that seems obvious to you but he may not have thought about.

I don't think you can throw the sacrifices you made for him as a child in his face (and I'm sure you weren't intending to, anyway). That's just what parents do. But as an adult he should certainly be contributing to the household.

He definitely should be paying something. I hope he is doing his fair share of chores too.

You didn't say what his qualification was in but surely, there has to be some type of work even if stocking shelves, call centre, or something.

@YoniAndGuy

Wow.

Yes, I think I would be setting this ADULT straight on a few things... not least the fact that if he thinks he's got the right to look down his nose on how you might manage your money, then he can fuck off out of the free accommodation provided by the mother who, so far, has funded EVERYTHING that has got him to the position he is now, and prove his own independence first.

How fucking dare he.

Yes, start charging rent.

He won't like it, but - 'Well, I considered us a team, you see. Your comments yesterday showed me that we're not. So - from now on, it's rent at X, or you're quite welcome to move out and actually provide for yourself.'

You've done him no favours it seems. Try and knock some sense into him - nothing more distasteful than an entitled adult male fat and comfy on the labour and support of his female relatives, who nevertheless feels it's his God-given right to judge them.

All of this.

It’s appalling OP - and the only way he is going to learn to behave better is to be made to act like an adult and contribute. He should have been made to before- but never mind, tell him now.

Apart from the fact you need to start looking after yourself, you’ll be doing his future partner a big favour.

You matter as a person - you aren’t just a mum - take care of yourself, no one else will.

I have never asked him for anything towards the bills or food as I didn't think it fair when he gets so little to live on.

You also have only a limited income - so why do you think it's fair that you should have to subsidise another adult? At the very least, your food bill will have doubled.

Your son is 24. He doesn't even have the excuse that he's never lived away from home before. He knows that it costs money to buy food, pay rent, have broadband etc.

You're not doing him any favours by subsidising him. All it's doing is reinforcing his belief that the woman of the house should use her income on the essentials while the man keeps his for his own personal use. Not a great mindset for him to have if he's ever planning to live with a partner in the future.

The house you're inheriting is a separate issue. As there will be 3 new co-owners, the costs involved should be split between the 3 of you. If your other child isn't yet an adult then their share should come out of the proceeds after the sale. Your son has the funds to pay his share up front.

What a selfish twat.

My parents always have my back money wise when I need them but there have bern times my mum has realised she us short for a bill so I wire her the money to cover it fast (as they dont use internet). Even if she didnt pay me back it would be fine considering all theyve done for me over the years.

How monumentally selfish he is. I wonder about the level of respect he would have for a boss or a partner in future if he thinks the whole world revolves around him like this.

I get not charging him rent...before this. Bit now I would make a point of doing so. Because clearly he is a spoilt brat who needs to buck up his ideas.

You are shocked but its probably because he was never expected to or made to contribute in other ways growing up. He is selfish because he never had to experience doing anything unselfish. Give him a sharp and fast lesson for his ungratefulness. Start charging him and treating him as he would if he were living somewhere else

The state benefits he gets, which all working adults contribute to, are intended to pay for his necessities, food and his share of heating/facilities. You are acting like it is pocket money, for personal spends. That is ridiculous.
Don't name it rent/board, call it paying for his own food and utility costs. I can tell you that my calculations say that just food and toiletries for an adult man come to at least £25, probably £30 pw, and that doesn't include his share of electricity/gas/broadband/Council Tax etc.
Tell him you can't afford to subsidise him any more and as from now he'll have to contribute. Either he pays an appropriate percentage of every bill, or he gives you an agreed amount sufficient to cover his share.
You are not doing him any favours by letting this slide.

He has a very selfish attitude. What's he doing with the money? If he's saying for a flat etc I could maybe understand it more but if he's passing it away he's be out on his ass.

Frank conversation needed about how selfish he is and what decisions he needs to make going forward.

Thanks for comments, I honestly felt like I was being cruel.
I'd never expect him to hand his savings over to bail me out, it might be that I would need to borrow a couple of hundred for a house clearance but I can probably fund that from my bill account and put it back by the time the water comes in as I pay that six monthly. I didn't anticipate needing it but circumstances as they are no charities are collecting and the house sold quicker than I thought it would.

As for the sacrifices i've made in the past, I just highlighted that to show I cant understand where his attitude has come from as its not as if he's had to go without whilst watching me spending on myself. I'd obviously never rub it in his face as thats just what parents do, quite rightly, putting children first.

Ask him straight why he thinks that as an adult his living costs should be paid for by another adult?

He sounds a right delight

Start charging him for rent and food.

Are you absolutely sure he wasn't joking?

I have DC's in their 20's and if any one comes into money (tax refund, birthday money etc) we always joke' 'ooh now you are rich can I have a sub?
The one with the money will reply 'no I might not get it back'
Just a silly family joke, we would help each other out if anyone was struggling..

Half joking and not setting up the expectation he pays his way mean he doesn't understand what you need and how he should behave.
Clarify it in your own head — what's reasonable for him to pay—and set up a family meeting. That'd be my approach

Well, I haven't done anything about this yet but yesterday just kind of proved how thoughtless he is. I got a big fat nothing from ds. I dont expect a present, but a card would have been nice, or even a "happy mothers day". But no, nothing. Saw lots of fb posts from the kids of my friends (roughly the same age) saying how great their mums were blah blah and it made me feel like shit. Dd was also annoyed with him as she'd paid extra for quick delivery on a parcel but had to pop out and when it came he heard the door but wouldn't get out of bed to answer it (he admitted that) He just DOES NOT think about anyone else in this family, constantly moans about how rubbish life is and i'm losing patience with him if i'm honest. I'm worried that he just wont be able to cope with real life, his negativity and total lack of understanding amazes me, he doesn't know what a hard life is. I think its more like he just takes us for granted. Dd even told him tonight when he said "oh, you should have told me it was Mother's day"..she said "it's not up to her to tell you!" He's NEVER off social media so that excuse is null and void. I feel terrible that I feel this way about him at the moment but the constant me me me whinging and whining about how life is so unfair is grating on my nerves. Ffs, dd had to leave school early last year with only two days notice to say goodbye to all her friends, no leavers day, prom cancelled, beautiful dress hanging in the wardrobe never to be worn, exams uncertain...did she moan even once? (And I certainly would have understood if she did, I was gutted for her) But no, she got on with it and accepted it. She's realistic and mature and understands that shit happens. How is this lad going to get on in life I wonder. Sigh...sorry for the rant, he's hurt my feelings. Mother's day is hard for me, what i'd give to be able to send mine a card and ds couldn't give a flying.

You need to sit him down and make it very clear that you are funding another adult. He is no longer a child so the fact that he doesn't have to pay for his house, bills and food is because you are paying for him - gifting it to him. But it is not unreasonable that he should contribute and in fact you have decided that he needs to contribute because at the moment, because of circumstances, you need some more money to cover your costs.

Also, whenever anyone gets a gift, the recipient should show some gratitude or they clearly don't value it and the gifts will stop.

Presumably your bills went up when your son moved back home. Charge him the difference at the least. Make him pay for his own food and bills.

With regards the cost of the house clearance ensure the cost is deducted before the inheritance is calculated so you’re not footing that bill completely too.

Do you accept the same level of laziness from your dd? Would you accept her lying in bed all day ignoring the doorbell going?

I’d be forgetting his birthday. He sounds selfish and entitled and greedy.

Does he have household chores to do? Tell us he at least does his own laundry, cleans his own room and take turn cooking and washing up?

As a single mum once my kids started to earn from any type of job or benefit and lived at home I made them pay money into the home. Not just because I needed it but because they need to learn we all have to pay our way in life...so good training from the start.

Sending 💐 he is not being fair

I know it’s a bad time but is he actively looking for work.
You definitely need to reset the living arrangements. He needs to start pulling his weight, the £200 you need for the house clearance is not an unreasonable monthly figure for a start.

Wow.

Urgent conversation needed.

He needs to contribute and not just financially. Personally I think he should be paying a significant amount of his Job Seekers allowance for rent, bills and food but he also needs to step up at home, cook some meals, do some chores and show some appreciation by generally helping out.

He needs to pull his finger out and with the attitude already shown he’s unlikely to be happy about it, you need to be firm about it. There is no way you should be funding him and going short. He is an adult and needs to step up.