Are my friends just rubbish?

[WinterHearts]

I'm trying to decide if I expect too much from friends or if they really are a bit rubbish.

I'm 32. My friends are all the same age. 2 are single but have lots of other friends and 2 are married, one with a baby.

I'm single and apart from these few friends and a very very small family (parents, no siblings, grandparent) that's it. They are all who contact me. (when they contact me)

It seems they can go weeks without checking in on me/starting convo via message and for me thats too long. I would like to speak to them every 4-5 days each. I don't do social media so we don't speak on that.

Recently, i've been feeling pretty lonely and getting upset alot about the lack of contact. I messaged two of my friends yesterday saying I was a bit down, the 1 messaged me back offering sympathy, but didn't reply to my following message. (she has a baby, yet i've seen her online since so shes not too busy to reply) The other said she would call me today (but didn't) and this seems to be a regular thing, her saying she will contact me and then doesn't. Yet she does contact me sometimes randomly, usually a week or more later by which point i'm annoyed she didn't keep her word and don't feel like talking anyway (of course I do and don't mention how I feel but :() Meanwhile these two friends are very 'facebooky' and on the rare occations I do log in I see them posting things.

I just feel forgotten and lonely. And I question if these friendships work for me a lot. Its like social media or other people are more important to them than me, yet they have expressed in the past that i'm an important friend to them, so why don't they check in more often knowing i'm alone? I can go days without speaking to anyone other than my Mum! At the same time I know if I fell out with them or distanced, then i'd literally have no one. Just ranting and trying to make sense of it all. :(

You have to remember we are almost a year into a pandemic, no one has got anything to talk about anymore and no one has the enthusiasm for friendly chats. I'm not in touch with my friends very often at the moment because it feels like such a strain to have the same conversations over and over. In normal times, maybe things would be different.
Focus on yourself a bit more. Set yourself some life goals and start working on them. And well done for steering clear of social media, it's the biggest mental drain ever.

You really have to change your attitude. Be on social media and don't compare. Use it as a way of keeping in touch.

Your friends aren't being rubbish. If I were to contact all my friends every 4-5 days I would do nothing else. So I use social media as a way of keeping in touch with a lot of people easily and then I can speak or see or whatsapp some friends when we can.

I'm alone and very lonely at times. I have no family anywhere near me. I got social media a long time ago just to sell stuff and then added a few friends and now it's my literal lifeline keeping me abreast with my friends and the outside world. I'm 90% sure that if I didn't have sm I'd be far more isolated. You don't have to invite loads of people to be your online friend, you can do a fake name, no profile picture, just find out which platform your close friends use most and join that and just add them. Then you don't have to worry about seeing loads of crap you don't want to. Keep it simple and keep your numbers low.
I was massively against social media but being home alone every night for years on end takes its toll and unfortunately it is how many people communicate now.
Even if you just use the instant messaging aspect you're still likely to get more contact

I'm maybe an odd one out here but I think your friends are being a bit rubbish.

I have a group of 5 who message between us all maybe once every 2/3 days often once a day for weeks at a time

I also have a group of 2 very close friends who message every day. Even if it's just a simple "today's been shite" or "having this for tea" kind of thing.

I like to keep contact even with the most mundane every day trivial things so I tend to drift closer to people who do the same. It takes two seconds to message someone and ask how they are!!

I am also a bit odd one out here!!
I'm similar age to you, with 2 small children and dh, and I can relate to how you feel.
So I don't really agree about you needing a "fuller life" as such, I think different people need different things from friendships and socialising, and yeah some people are a bit rubbish at it. You just need to find the people on the same level as you.

I have about 5 or 6 proper friends and 3 of them in particular can be pretty shitty. I have been friends with all of them for 10 years ish. I messaged one of them 3 weeks ago to check in on her and see how she's doing as obviously won't see her for a while with the lockdown going on, she hasn't even opened the WhatsApp message - but she has been online and has posted on insta.
Another of my friends is pregnant, due any minute now and our last 2 conversations have been me asking her how it's going, how she's feeling, not long now etc etc and she had only replied back answering me, not further engaging with me or asking anything about my life!
With both of these people - they have forgotten to message me on my birthday and my kids birthday, and I remember all of there's and all of their kids every single year without fail.
So these people imo are just a bit shitty but I have been friends with them for so long and gone through so much with them that I tolerate it I guess, sometimes it gets to me and gets me down, other days I gloss over it and be the bigger person. Like others have said, everyone has their own shit going on especially at the moment so I try to give them the benefit of the doubt and move on, text them again in a week or so.

I also don't do social media as I agree it can add to the feeling of loneliness and is mentally draining. I don't think social media is for everyone.

I do think you maybe need to find some new friends who are on your level but that is very much easier said than done.

I just wanted to put my 2 pennies in because you're not alone in this feeling. I often wonder, why can't they jus take 2 seconds to text me back or jus bloody ask me too how i am!!

Its frustrating, I hope you're OK.

@Sakurami

You really have to change your attitude. Be on social media and don't compare. Use it as a way of keeping in touch.

Your friends aren't being rubbish. If I were to contact all my friends every 4-5 days I would do nothing else. So I use social media as a way of keeping in touch with a lot of people easily and then I can speak or see or whatsapp some friends when we can.

This! If a friend rang me once a week to ask me what I have been up to I'd be "wtf, nothing! As per usual."

I'm sorry you feel lonely OP

I don't think either you or your friends are in the wrong, I just think you have different needs/expectations.

Often when people have children, large families, or a lot of different friends it can be difficult to keep up with individuals (for example i speak to my sister most days but wouldn't have that level of time for a friend unless there was an exceptional circumstance).

Have you got a group chat? I find these the best way to stay in touch in a none pressured way.

Alternatively (and i know it's hard with covid) but could you try to extend your social circle?

Hi OP, I am sympathetic to your situation. I tend to prefer closer, more intense relationships, and it sounds like you do too. I tend to find friendships where we go to dinner once every 3 months or only see each other at parties pretty unsatisfying, and like you, if I feel I like someone and I've made an effort to deepen the interaction and they haven't returned this effort, it can be pretty upsetting.

In this last few years I've grown to recognize a couple of things. First, many people simply don't want deep or intense relationships. They might get that emotional need meet entirely by family, a partner, or even other friends who aren't you. Second, unfortunately it's pretty common to have a mismatch of needs. It doesn't mean your friends don't like you. It just means they don't like you quite as much as you like them, or perhaps their needs are different like I mentioned above.

Only you can decide whether having these unsatisfying relationships is worth it to you. For me, I've kept most of my friendships for what they are and accepted the limitations. I've ended a few others where I felt the mismatch was large and it was affecting my self esteem, even if I still really liked the other person. I suggest you reevaluate each of these relationships and see if you can keep the good.

I also suggest you invest in those who invest in you. Some of my longest and must fulfilling relationships have come from paying more attention to those who I noticed were really capable of and interested in reciprocation, even if they weren't initially the people I thought I liked best or was closest to.

You're not alone in feeling this way, OP. Adult friendships are hard.

@WinterHearts

And for the record, if I don't hear from them I usually do initiate. But its if I don't, we can sometimes go 1-2 weeks or more until they contact me again.

Sorry, I’m echoing pp but this sounds pretty frequent contact to me.

It sounds like you want an idealised best friend type relationship, where you check in with each other very often and are embedded in each other’s lives. But lots of people don’t have or want that type of friendship.

And since having dc I don’t contact anyone other than my parents that frequently, not because I like my friends less I just don’t have the time (or energy!).

Sorry you’re feeling lonely

@CouldItBeJeffrey

It doesn't sound as though you are well suited to the friends you have it they aren't meeting your expectations. You're not wrong to want a more intense friendship but not everyone can give that, especially at the moment. I don't talk to my mum every 4-5 days, my friends would have no chance - especially if I thought it was going to be an emotionally draining pep talk. I'm sorry you're lonely but I'd run a mile from someone if I thought they were keeping tabs on my online activity and when I did/didn't contact them.

I agree with this. You seem to perceive yourself as some sort of poor misfortunate who needs people to “check in” on her. I find that an odd phrase to use about friendships. It’s like there’s a one-way obligation. The only people I speak about checking in on are a) my very elderly parent who lives alone and b) my patients, to whom i have a professional duty and obligation.

I work in a job that’s intense and at times very mentally draining. It’s also frontline medical work with all that goes with that these days. I do about 60 hours a week. Sometimes, most times, when I get home I organise my dinner, ring my parent, do whatever housework I need to do and I just chill. I don’t have the energy or headspace for much else. I haven’t even put the tv on in more than a week because I don’t have the enthusiasm to concentrate on something at the moment. I’ve screened calls from my sister and another friend this week because it’s just too much at the moment. Yet I’ve aimlessly scrolled through social media and MN because it is mindless and doesn’t require much from me. I know my friend is tracking me across the internet and can see that I’ve been active on WhatsApp/Instagram/Facebook etc all while I’ve screened her call... she does this a lot and if I don’t read a WhatsApp she will DM me on Instagram instead... I find it very irritating that she does this, and extremely intrusive, and it has backfired on her because I’m now far more likely to put up firm boundaries about contact and don’t have as much casual off the cuff contact as I used to, because I know it will turn into an hour of back and forth texting that’s hard to extricate myself from. Oh, and she’s the one married with kids and I’m single and living alone.

You don’t own your friends or their time. With respect, you don’t know everything that’s going on in other people’s lives, you can’t expect to be a priority for them all the time, you’re not a victim that needs ‘checking in on’ and you will drive them away if you keep this up and have a sense of being hurt and wounded because they don’t jump to your whistle.

I'm going to sound harsh here but it sounds like you are wallowing in self-pity and casting yourself as some kind of feeble person who needs to be checked on and reassured. You need to stop this. Crying and sulking because no one has asked you how you are today is not helpful to you or anyone else, and you can stop it. When you start to recognise those thoughts you need to act on them.

Between demanding jobs, children, partners and general life people are busy. No one i know has weekly contact with their friends, but that's ok. Its perfectly healthy and it doesn't mean that they don't care.

I really think you would benefit from some talking therapy to explore where this need for reassurance is coming from, and they will offer some CBT skills to help you to manage your unhelpful thinking patterns so you aren't crying over perceived rejection anymore.

@WinterHearts I have a job and a family but always make time for friends - that's just me. It's mostly on what's app though

I called two of my best friends at different times and both were busy. But I expressed the need to talk and they called me at a less busy time so we can talk - you can do that with good friends

I am going through a down period at the moment and don't feel like talking to anyone on the phone - not even my mum

I think if you want contact every 4-5 days, start the ball rolling by making it a thing over the next few weeks. If they don't bother to keep in touch after that I think they are too engrossed in their own lives to make time for you and move on

By the way it's much easier to be on social media and "chat" rather than talking on the phone. You can just follow your closest friends so you don't have to feel bad about everyone else's full lives

It's no fun being single after a certain age ...........

Do you have any other family such as cousins to talk to?

Not sure if your friends are rubbish or you just have a diff relationship to what you would like.
I have friends I check in with 1 a week for a catch up on each other- but my closest friends we msg at least every other day, not to see how we are but maybe just to mention something on tv, in the news, send links to properties as many have recently bought homes etc. can literally be one msg and nothing else.

You are expecting far too much, and yes you probably are boring, but we all are these days as nobody is doing anything so nothing to talk about. But expecting friends to contact you all the time is ridiculous. You say yourself you have your mother to talk to everyday. So far more than many people And you are not on social media, where most socialising is currently happening, do you have cut yourself off really

I don’t think your friendA sound rubbish at all. You say they will check in on you every couple of weeks, that sounds like reasonably good friends.

You need to find yourself something to do and a group to socialise with, yes on social media. A walking group, a running group, a bird watching group, a photography group, a voluntary work group, a french class, a creative writing class, the possibilities are endless

People can have different views of friendships and someone who is an important to one person is less important than to the other person. Some friendships just run their course and sadly fizzle out. These may be the case.

Your friend with the baby replied to you but then nothing since but ‘has been online so isn’t too busy’ this is where you need to stop. People are busy, just because they are ‘online’ doesn’t mean they are sitting at home twiddling their thumbs.
As an example, I myself have a baby which takes up a lot of time, though friends with no children don’t see to understand this. I might appear to be online, maybe to respond to someone’s message or have a quick browse, but then two seconds later the baby needs me so I’m sidetracked. Its to the point now that I get scared to even open anything that could say I’m ‘online’ because some people will be right on there noticing and then accuse me of ignoring them. It’s a lot to expect from people, but you can’t be watching if people are online then take it personally that they are specifically ignoring you.
Remember people have different needs too so for you you need contact often but one on one I would find that much contact suffocating! But some people love it and need it. Again it’s just different lives and personalities. For all you know they could have their own problems they are dealing with themselves and painting a happy picture on social media.
You appear to be judging what they should be doing based on your own feelings and needs and how much time you have spare to chat and then taking it to heart.
I would recommend joining some groups on Facebook, even with a new profile where you don’t have your friends on it so you can’t be upset when you think they are ignoring you or having a great time etc, but you have a way to speak with people who have similar interests, some groups might be rubbish but others could be great!

It’s a bit concerning that you can’t see that your friend with a baby wants and needs to spend her emotional energy on her child rather than ‘checking in on’ you. You’re not showing a lot of empathy and if I was your friend and picked up in this, I would be backing away.

Your expectation of friendship is not realistic with this group of people. They don’t want what you want and that is perfectly ok. I don’t want what you want either - my life is too busy and full on with work and family and I don’t have the energy. You cannot make these people, or anyone, sustain the level of contact you seem to expect, so your choices are to be the kind of friend THEY want YOU to be and lower your expectations, or to find so many friends that you’re able to get the same level of contact without an unrealistic burden on any individuals.

This ‘problem’ is likely to increase as you get older and people have busier, more complicated lives. Very few people can or even want to sustain the kind of friendship groups they might have had in their teenage years and 20s. Life moves on and so must you.

OP, your situation is that you’ve made the choice not to access social media and keep your friendship group small - but your friends haven’t made those choices. They may have more people to squeeze in and make time for social media. I think you just have to accept that they’re busy because they choose to be, and that’s ok. We all choose our own path.

Hard to tell if your friends are rubbish or not really.

What I will say though, is if they are on social media it's a lazy and easy way of keeping in touch with people. Actually calling or texting people takes effort.

I would tell them how you feel in a non confrontational way and see how they respond, I think that'll give you your answer.

You're definitely expecting too much.

Do they all know each other? If so, set up a What's App or Facebook Messenger group to keep in touch.

I have a lot of close friends and there's no-one I'm in contact with every 4-5 days and honestly if someone expected that it would send me running for the hills.

Firstly I understand having friends who don't reply to messages but have them time to regularly post on social media and I think it is inconsiderate of them. A couple of years ago when I was having a hard time I found a friend of mine, who was also having a hard time for different reasons, was very rubbish at replying to me. It wasn't me hounding her though. She would message me and ask if I'm free to meet up. I'd say yes how about next weekend and then she wouldn't reply for weeks. I'd then message her after couple of weeks to ask if she's okay. She would say it's because she's down. Given what I was going through I found it selfish that she couldn't make an effort to contact me like I did with her but I also realise people are different. It annoyed me mostly because she was constantly posting online. The fact is I barely speak to her now and I don't consider her a good friend.

Secondly I also think you are being a little bit demanding in expecting people to contact you every 4-5 days. If you are lonely then maybe speak to your friends about this or how about arranging a zoom call for the four of you at the weekend? I have been in your position before where I have felt like I need more friends or I'm the only one who makes an effort. After I went through a really hard time I learned who my friends are and generally I have become much more self reliant in the last couple of years. I'm married so I'm not home alone but I really don't feel like I need to see anyone and I'm not that bothered about being contacted. I think things are much more equal between my friends and I now. I get in touch with people who get in touch with me and who make me feel good. I'm quite happy at home and not seeing people but I do feel like I have interaction from friends as I message someone or receive messages from a friend most days.

I think if you are feeling down then this is more about you needing support than a bit of human interaction and that might be more than your friends can give.

I don't agree being on social media helps, generally. I find it makes me feel worse if I'm already feeling a bit down.

There are other ways to get to know people online. I joined a Facebook group following a Mumsnet thread and that has been good to make some friends.

Sometimes just going for a walk around the block or going to the local shop can be nice for some interaction as where I live everyone is very friendly and last time I went to the butchers I saw a few people I know.

I also think it's a good idea to join Facebook groups related to things that you enjoy eg any hobbies, pets, a local group so you can get to know people.

Another vote for a group chat if possible. That means you can keep in touch with several friends at once and feel involved.
I have one friend I keep in touch with every 2-3 days. All my other friends, some of them close and long standing, once every few weeks or so. Life is just too busy for all of us. That doesn't mean we don't care about each other!
🥀🌺🌻🌼 op, it's tough when you feel lonely 😔

Set up a group whatsapp. My friends are similar but they drop into the group whatsapp fairly often. Sometimes we arrange a group chat through that too.