this is emotional abuse, right?

[irishoak]

I've lurked on mumsnet over the years, but never posted, and tbh I don't even have kids, but this has always seemed like a place where women were supportive and so...I've come to the realization over the past few months that my husband is very abusive. He got a (preliminary I suppose) diagnosis of BPD about a month ago and it's just been non-stop since then. The past week I've started talking to counsellors online and the women's aid phoneline...last night was pretty much the nail in the coffin for us, and today he's trying to sort out welfare and somewhere else to live, but he's just....idk half the time he's so sorry, he just wants my forgiveness, the other half it's not his fault, maybe he's autistic, I'm as bad as him cos sometimes I lose my temper and call him names back, etc etc.

I just walked into the room where he was calling his friend and he just seemed so...idk cheerful, and his friend had a girlfriend once apparently who has BPD oh but actually later they said autism, so it must be that and not his fault! So now I'm back in the bedroom, trying to get my head together to concentrate on work (I'm so behind, so so behind), and I just want....idk, validation I guess, that he is abusive, and that it's not just me being unfeeling.

Things he's said to me over the past month:
I'm a fucking liar, I ruin the lives of everyone around me with my criticism and negativity, I fuck everything up for him, i'm a hypocritical c**t, I only care about money (he's not worked for the vast majority of the time we've been together, I pay for everything), I am mean cos I don't give him extra money for weed every month beyond the money he asks for, I've got no friends, I've got a warped idea of friendship, the only people that talk to me are my family and they're just as bad as me, I'm so fucking stupid, and these are just what I can remember off the top of my head.

And then, when he calms down after screaming all this at me, that I should know by now after 3 years of marriage that he doesn't mean these things and so I shouldn't be hurt by them and should realize what he's trying to say.

@Bananalanacake he's always struggled with work, relationships with employers, etc. Apparently his psychiatrist has said he might be unsuitable for employment, which I think can be the case for people with BPD. He is very good about doing housework, cleaning, etc - not trying to defend him, but feel it's only fair to say, as he regularly does more of that than I do. No claim on property - I don't own anything except a car and a bunch of credit card debt, which he says he wants to help pay down.

@Weirdfan I know, and he even he knows - I asked him in the past what he would say to one of his female friends, if they came to him and said all the same stuff as he put me through, and yeah, he agreed, he'd tell them to leave...but that's as far as the conversation ever seems to get, before he starts talking about what a c**t he is, he's so awful, etc.

He's talked about suicide before, even telling me the place he's had picked out for it, and even though I don't think he would do that, these days, it still just breaks my heart to think of how he'd be living. I know there's no understanding it, but I just sit and think to myself...you'd choose a homeless shelter over our life together, our pets, the nice things we have around us, the nice evenings watching netflix and eating chocolate curled up with the dog on the sofa...is all of that not worth being nice to me? we have all of this together, but it's still not good enough, because I don't want to live in fear? because I want him to tell me the truth about things? because I want to be able to ask questions without being worried he's going to flip out? because I want to not walk on eggshells from the second I get up?

and his defence will be that he is nice to me, he makes me tea, he tells me I'm pretty, he praises my achievements....but that's when things are going okay. when he's angry, it's all swearing and screaming and cruel things I can't get out of my head the rest of the time.

@irishoak

and his defence will be that he is nice to me, he makes me tea, he tells me I'm pretty, he praises my achievements....but that's when things are going okay. when he's angry, it's all swearing and screaming and cruel things I can't get out of my head the rest of the time.

you can do all those nice things for yourself OP without the high payment price of abuse. Even my flatmates back in the day made me tea, said I looked nice and bigged me up on a bad day. Time to do the Freedom Programme?

The irony of this if you stay is that, once you are truly broken from this, and he has his passport, he may well move on to suck all the life out of another capable, bright, energetic caring younger woman.

BPD diagnosed here. I was actually diagnosed autistic first and then they told me it was BPD later which was much more fitting but not really the point of the post.

Diagnosis or not, yes this is emotional abuse. Speaking from experience, being in a relationship with someone with BPD is hard. I have said and done some vicious things to partners in the past. Having BPD is often likened to being the emotional equivalent of a burn victim by specialists because we feel everything so strong. But we can feel one emotion with every ounce of our being and then an hour later it’s gone. It’s an emotional rollercoaster. I look back at past relationships with regret because they were all train-wrecks.

It took me years of therapy and healing to be able to be in a proper, healthy relationship and even now I have outbursts, I have to physically remove myself from situations so I don’t say something I regret. If he’s just got a diagnosis then he isn’t going to get better any time soon, it will take years of working on himself and that’s only if he really sees it and if he really wants to get better. I was in and out of counselling for years before I finally committed. You don’t have to be his punching bag in the mean time.

@ChronicallyCurious I don't know if he really sees it yet. I'm in no way a perfect human being or a perfect partner, but in his head at the moment I'm the absolute worst wife ever, I never listen to him, I am too defensive, I can't admit I'm wrong, and because I have, in the past, lost my temper and shouted back at him and called him names back, to him now I'm the same as him and we abuse each other the same. I'm ashamed of those things, and they're not something I've ever done in a relationship before, and hope never to do again. And tbh, these days I don't have the spirit to do argue back much anymore, I just agree, and then get told off for not agreeing in the right way, not admitting I'm wrong enough, saying "okay", etc.

He just came in with a cup of tea as a "peace offering" and then coldly told me that one day I'll look back at this marriage and realise the reason it broke down was because of miscommunication and not admitting I was wrong. Nevermind the lying and cheating and the cruel cruel name calling eh? I feel like I'm living in a parallel universe to him or something.

Just a heads up op, often bpd is co-morbid with npd. Think it's something like 20% of cases.

And either way, theresnobexcuse for abuse.
Get yourself free.

*there's no excuse xD

He knows he is dependant on you for everything including his status in the country. This guy is being so manipulative and has you dancing in circles. You don't know ur arse from ur elbow.... Get him out now, before Christmas. Do not let him delay any longer... Not your problem if he has nowhere to go or no money. Bet if you put it up to him in that way he'll be backtracking so fast. But don't fall for it. Get him gone... He's a head melt, a peaceful Christmas just you and the dog will be so much better than this waster

Yes this is abuse and it is specifically extremely akin to BPD abuse I suffered at the hands of my ex husband. Thank god he’s out of my life. He almost destroyed me. Please look out for yourself. I’m so so sorry you’re experiencing this. I wouldn’t wish it on my worst enemy and additionally I wouldn’t wish BPD on my worst enemy. I also believe it’s an awful mental illness with very little clear way of getting help and eventually I was able to forgive my ex although he wasn’t sorry and won’t change. I accept now that he had an illness incompatible with marriage to me. I am better now and it’s almost two years on. But it takes time.

And I should say mine was also completely dependent on me for everything but I got him out and he was of course absolutely fine. And you know what as soon as he left, that very night, reclaiming the house, getting warm in bed and not anticipating midnight screaming at me, porn abuse or disfunctional gaming addiction, it was bliss. Don’t get me wrong I had to do a lot of work on myself to rebuild but it’s like from the first minute he’s gone you’ll be one step closer to being back to wonderful you. And lean in to your dog, they will be there to love you no matter what. Also read ‘Stop Caretaking the borderline’ by margolis fjellsted I think it is, I can’t remember the last name but easily searchable. This book helped me no end through the initial crisis I felt of leaving him.

@Mumandsome78 thank you for your comments, it means so much to know i'm not the only one who's been through this. I feel like such a fool for letting all these things happen and for so long. He's so clever and knowledgeable and a good guy in so many ways, but at the moment he just says so many things that make me wonder - can he hear himself? does he actually understand what he's saying? and I don't know any more how much is illness and how much abuse, although even the abuse was learnt from his father during his childhood I suppose.

it's hard to admit you've been used OP, but the sooner you can, the sooner you can move to a life where you no longer are.

It was another hard day yesterday. I'm drowning under my workload but it's so hard to focus. I need to give up trying to talk to him about anything, he just comes up with reasons now why it's all justified.

He says it's my fear that makes him angry, so I need to control my fear, like he controls his fear and anger, and then I won't make him angry. He says it's okay to shout at me because I interrupt him, and anyone would agree that those are extenuating circumstances. That it's okay to tell me I have no friends, because he was trying to make a point about how I don't share my relationship problems with any friends.

I don't share my relationship problems because I'm so ashamed and feel like such a fucking idiot and a fool. I interrupt him...maybe I do, because I desperately want him to talk to me and to like me and I'm so lonely. But it's never been right for him, it feels, unless I'm agreeing with him. The amount of freak outs, fights, shouting, him getting wound up to the point of tears over years, because I've dared to have a different opinion about a TV show or an event in history. But does it mean it's okay to shout at me?

I can't control my fear anymore, and I don't really know how it started, because I was always wary, always trying to manage situations and his moods and this year I just haven't been able to do it without panicking and being afraid of him. I started having panic attacks and doing things like picking holes in my clothes while he's going on at me, or even before he starts and I'm just afraid the situation will turn. I have some other self-soothing behaviors, and he just mocks me when I do them half the time.

Just get yourself out of there asap. He is horrible.

Surely you can see the damage he's doing to you iris? He's dismantling your MH bit by bit and he's not going to stop til you're a shadow of the woman you were. You really need some headspace from him, I honestly think a few days without him and you would feel stronger and more able to see things clearly. Is there any way you can make that happen?

please speak to someone www.safeireland.ie/get-help/where-to-find-help/

It doesn't matter whether he's diagnosed with BPD, autism or galloping dandruff, none of that gives him the right to be horrible to you, and none of it means that you have to accept it and stay in the relationship if you are unhappy.

I have diagnosed BPD. No way would I ever speak to anyone like that.
He is an abusive person with BPD, 2 separate things. Having a mental illness does not give you any excuse to treat another person that way.
I really hope you are ok and stay strong, please bin him you deserve to be treated with love, kindness and respect x

This is awful, it brought tears to my eyes. There is absolutely nothing you can do to support him he can only do that himself. You can't be responsible for his wellbeing and he won't let you anyway. Just make arrangements to leave and leave. Don't let him destroy your life like this give yourself permission to be happy.

It's been a hard few days. Again. Thanks to everyone who posted on here, it helps so much to feel like I'm not alone in this, that I'm not going mad. Like I said before, sometimes it feels like I've slipped into a parallel universe, the things he says just don't make sense to me.

After his screaming and intimidating and name calling the other night, I put my passport in my handbag and started keeping my car keys and my phone in my pocket all the time. Today he spotted that I'd taken my passport and is so deeply offended at this, telling me that he sees the real me now, the deeply unpleasant person who could do something like this. He says it's as hurtful as the things he's done to me. He says that me acting so scared this week and doing things like staying in the bedroom, not wanting to leave him alone in the house, wanting to keep my handbag with me - these show the real me. Are they not reflections of the things he's done to me? Why would I react like this if I wasn't scared?

I know it's not me being awful, and it's just me scared and panicked and trying to take care of myself, and I know a person who loved me wouldn't be offended by me doing this - they'd be horrified that they'd done something that merited it, they'd want me to do whatever I needed to feel safe. But he just turns everything around on me until I believe it. I am everything he says, I am an awful person who shouldn't ever be married to anyone, it is all my own fault because I'm cold and don't put out. I am critical and negative and selfish and greedy.

I don't get it. I look into his eyes and look at his face and I just...I don't understand how someone so cruel is there. Someone who hates me and has turned against me so much. What happened to the man I married? The man who was kind and took care of me and we laughed at jokes together and all of those things?

we are over, and he will be going soon. I'm just struggling to make sense of it all, how it all ended up like this.

It's been a while since I added to this. DH is still living in the house, separate rooms. He's mostly on his best behaviour, doing jobs around the house, controlling his temper, etc. He says he's looking for somewhere else, but given lockdown and him not having a job I don't know how that's going to go. I'm not pushing it because to be honest I'm scared of how I'm going to cope alone, house is a renovation project and needs so much doing still.

Most of the time we can be friendly enough, but I struggle with feeling really down a lot of days. Tonight, just now, he's woken up and could hear me crying in the bedroom, so came in to check on me. I just feel so worthless all the time - I wasn't worth respecting, telling the truth to, just feel really unlovable after all the things he's done and said to me.

I said this to him, and I just can't believe his reply, which was that he doesn't know why I insist on feeling worthless, as we know it's him and his mental health that's the problem. And when I dare point out that I don't insist on it, that it's a result of his actions, he says I'm being mean and scaring him by feeling this way. Not just no responsibility taken, but actually mind boggling mental leaps taken there. He said maybe I wouldn't have felt worthless if I'd just listened to him - doesn't he realise that yeah, he said nice things to me over the course of our relationship, but when he also says and does really horrible things, they stick? And they drown out all the good things, because I don't know which are the truth anymore? How is it my fault for "not listening", because I've internalised the awful things he said more than the nice things?

It sounds like he's gas lighting you, which is a common trait of BPD. The weed habit probably isn't helping him at all either. Also, people with BPD often have addiction issues as well. As a pp mentioned NPD often comes with it too.

I know first hand how hard it is to live with someone with BPD, it's a total emotional roller coaster. Stick to your guns and don't agree to reconcilliation. It sounds like he's either in denial about you separating, or is expecting you to change your mind.

He's still scrambling for ways for all of it to be your fault. Try to let it wash over you, it's not true. Ignore and focus on getting on with your life and tell him to go.