Underage sex / rape

[witcherbewitched]

I've name changed, as this is a dark topic and I'm not entirely sure what I need - possibly just the catharsis of telling someone.

When I was fifteen, I was in a sexual relationship with a twenty five year old on and off for a few months. It started off really well (/ as well as it could have given my current perspective on the situation) and he acted as though he was very emotionally invested in me - e.g. spending a lot of time with me, telling me he thought he might love me etc etc. I was a bit emotionally broken and probably didn't think I loved him, but I guess I enjoyed the attention to a certain extent.

Some stuff happened that (obvious age issues aside) made me feel like I was in the grey zone between rape and sex. So, any time I would come and see him and not want sex he would be fine on the day and continuously reassure me that I didn't have to do anything sexual - only to come home and return to messages from him about me wasting his time and essentially making false promises. This happened once on a day where I didn't want to have sex with him because I was dealing with emotional fallout from family issues, but after that I just had sex with him (or did sexual things) because it was easier to say yes and not deal with him taking his "love" away.

Writing it down it does seem closer to sexual assault than sex - but I still feel like it was my fault. I told him I wanted sex and he met up with me I guess under the idea that I would provide it, and he was never violent so it never really registered as anything dodgy.

I also had a whole slew of family / mental health issues and after this, when I was sixteen I had a one-night-stand with a fifty one year old (I guess out of anger and self destruction).This also made me feel like what happened with the 25 year old was my fault, as no self respecting person hops into bed with someone who might hurt them (particularly with a big age gap).

I'm now getting closer to his age, and I can't ever imagine having sex with a fifteen year old, but I also can't quite connect the dots as to if it was sexual assault or a miscommunication. It makes me feel like shit, as I never want to have in my head that someone had bad intentions if they didn't but I think it did fuck me up pretty badly - sexual assault or not.

Sorry, I know this is a bit of a dark and odd one for a Thursday night. Feel free to tell me I made shit choices, if you think that's the right thing to do. I think I just needed to tell an unbiased party.Thank you x

Hey. You were fifteen. You were groomed and abused. By two men. It was not your fault.

@Asterion

Hey. You were fifteen. You were groomed and abused. By two men. It was not your fault.

Thank you .

As ridiculous as it sounds and as much as I KNOW that when there is sexual assault it's not the victim's fault (I would never doubt any victim or blame them) I can't help feeling like I should have known better. Because it wasn't just one person, and it wasn't violent, that it was my fault for I guess "seeking out" shitty men or not learning from being hurt. I feel like I SHOULD have been aware something was wrong (it took me a few months to actually acknowledge my pain afterwards, and I still doubt my own experience. Maybe that's part of the abusive childhood though, gaslighting yourself).

Thank you for saying that. I needed to hear it, I don't talk to people about stuff like this much. x

Well I'm not a psychologist but it sounds textbook - a young girl has an unhappy family life, and looks for 'love' and validation where she can get it. And two older men took advantage of you.

Be kind to yourself. They are the ones who made the wrong decisions here, not you. You were a child.

That was absolutely not your fault.
He was 25, even the vast majority of 18 year boys would consider that to be wrong and would never sleep with a 15 year old.
It was a massive abuse of power due to the age gap.
He groomed you and coerced you into sex. He was a sexual predator.

Please know that there are a huge amount of people who blame themselves for their sexual assaults/rapes or any sexual trauma they suffered. It's a common theme unfortunately. There are always reasons we will blame ourselves or feel reluctant to label things as rape or sexual assault. That doesn't mean that you did do something wrong. You're feeling the guilt or shame or blaming yourself or whatever else, not because you genuinely deserve to feel those things, but because unfortunately that tends to be part of the experience of sexual assault/rape.
I went to a therapist last year and discussed several incidents of sexual trauma. One in particular the therapist called it rape but he could sense that I struggled to call it that. He told me that it was rape and it was ok to call it that. I still personally struggle to call it that in real life.

As for the 51 year old then he was a pig. He might not have groomed you but he's clearly a slimy disgusting opportunistic predator to do that even if you were over the age of consent. Ugh!!!

You were only a child. Those things weren't your fault .

Thank you for responding. I'm a few minutes away from a big cry now honestly, I can feel the wave hitting me.

I just can't help but feel so stupid. And I feel guilt for calling it sexual assault, as in my mind I have so many excuses ("Maybe he did have feelings for you" which is fucking naive, "maybe he didn't understand consent", "maybe it was my fault for leading him on".) and I feel like because it wasn't violent I shouldn't get to lump myself in with survivors honestly.

@Asterion Thank you for your words. It's so good to hear some reassurance, that I'm not crazy / something WAS fucked up in the situation. I'm not always good at realising abuse until a long time after (particularly due to my childhood, as we've mentioned) and I think if I had told my mum or an adult it would have been swept under the rug.

@user1481840227 Thank you. It's so strange because I've heard experiences of sexual assault where people feel guilty and I've always had the thought process of "you shouldn't feel guilty, you're the victim." I guess it just hits differently when it happens to you.

Re; the 51 year old, it was definitely not right. He had an ex wife and kids and grandkids, but I was too self destructive to care. I feel a lot of shame about that - it was only two weeks after my sixteenth birthday. I can't class that as assault or anything as I was legal and I consented, but I think it'll eat me up until I die probably.

YOU are not the person who should be feeling shame here!! A 51 year old had sex with a girl who was barely legal - HE is the shameful one!!!

OP, have you considered/are you able to have counselling about this? About your childhood, and these abusive men?

It sounds like you've reached a stage in your life where you are thinking about it a lot. And it sounds like you need help to process the abuse, and work through things such as your unhappy childhood which led you to the place of being abused by these men.

@Asterion

YOU are not the person who should be feeling shame here!! A 51 year old had sex with a girl who was barely legal - HE is the shameful one!!!

If it happened to anyone else I would consider it disgusting - I guess I still just don't have much self respect / preservation for myself. I know if that ever happened to a child of mine I'd be angrier than words can express though.

If anyone knows how to deal with trauma (particularly buried trauma like mine) it would be great to hear. I don't have the money for counselling unfortunately.

@Asterion

OP, have you considered/are you able to have counselling about this? About your childhood, and these abusive men?

It sounds like you've reached a stage in your life where you are thinking about it a lot. And it sounds like you need help to process the abuse, and work through things such as your unhappy childhood which led you to the place of being abused by these men.

I would love to work through it all, I just don't have the money. A lot of it stems from familial abuse (as is probably apparent) and I went to therapy for a lot of issues when I was younger, but I no longer have the disposable income to pay for a private counsellor (and I've had some seriously damaging sessions with NHS counsellors - not to put off anyone who reads this and wants to try it though).

It was abuse. You were groomed. Even at 16/17 you were still a child and the older men had a responsibility to stay away. They didn’t.

Look too see if there is a women’s Abuse centre in your area. I have been in very similar situation. 25 years on they are quite literally saving my sanity.

@CornishTiger I'll have a look - if it's not too personal, what can they help with / services can they offer? I've not got any family to speak to (as is made clear by my other posts haha) and I don't want to upset my DH with any of this, so someone who could listen would be great.

Thank you for your advice though, I'll look into a centre. x

You could also try NAPAC?

@category12 I've never heard of this before but it looks really promising. Thank you for the suggestion - feel a bit foolish to have not heard of a lot of support systems but I guess this is the first time I've ever acknowledged I might need one. Thank you. x

Please don’t blame yourself, you were a child, they should have definitely known better. I think you’ve had some good advice to try and find a qualified person to speak to.
You’ve made a big step to acknowledge what’s happened to you, and to reach out couldn’t have been easy.
You hold your head up high, you’ve done nothing wrong.
I hope you find a way to go easy on yourself.
This breaks my heart to hear how awful grown men can be to a vulnerable child.

@RossPoldarksWife Sorry, I know to everyone reading this thread I'm talking about myself a lot. Also sorry if this can be considered "drip-feeding" I'm just toeing the line between exposing myself and unintentionally concealing important information.

If I'm being 100% honest, which I guess is the idea on an anonymous platform, I felt horribly guilty about it because this happened and then I proceeded to essentially be promiscuous with another 25 year old and the aforementioned 51 year old. I guess I felt so self destructive that the worst had already happened (i.e. getting sexually assaulted) that I didn't care what happened to me next. I also didn't have any adults who cared about me or would have given me enough love to get by without needing to sleep around with dangerous people.

It scares me to know how many older men will sleep with illegal / barely legal girls. I'm genuinely so scared, along with feeling like it's my fault. It's blokes who you wouldn't have expected at all, and I'm glad to be married and away from the dating scene as it's truly terrifying to think that if I weren't married I could be in a relationship with someone who slept with a fifteen year old and I didn't know.

Thank you so much for your support and kind words. I'm trying not to beat myself up too much, but it's a learned response. I really appreciate what you've said and I'll try and find a professional to get some help (if I can with financial problems and Covid). x

You are not alone and you are very brave to be thinking about your experiences and trying to understand them.

There are some really horrible awful men out there that prey on young vulnerable girls or women.

It was not your fault.

From someone who understands

@Someone1987 Thank you . Genuinely thank you, and I'm so sorry if you've experienced something similar. I hope your pain eases soon. x

I think it's quite common after experiences like that to become promiscuous - sort of a way of getting control back (in a self-destructive way).

Thank you @witcherbewitched. 💐

I hope you manage to be able to get some professional help, as I can hear a lot of self blame and criticism when it is not needed. Have you asked your GP or would you avoid NHS help if you haven't had a good experience before?

You were not to blame. With your childhood experiences, you were vulnerable and this is where people like this take advantage.

Therapy such as EMDR deals with trauma and may help you to think of the past traumas, but without so much inner pain.

Look after yourself tonight, you have been very brave xx

@category12

I think it's quite common after experiences like that to become promiscuous - sort of a way of getting control back (in a self-destructive way).

Sure is a quick and easy way to feel absolutely shit about yourself honestly. I'm still trying to unlearn self destructive tendencies based on the scars they've left.

@Someone1987

Thank you *@witcherbewitched*. 💐

I hope you manage to be able to get some professional help, as I can hear a lot of self blame and criticism when it is not needed. Have you asked your GP or would you avoid NHS help if you haven't had a good experience before?

You were not to blame. With your childhood experiences, you were vulnerable and this is where people like this take advantage.

Therapy such as EMDR deals with trauma and may help you to think of the past traumas, but without so much inner pain.

Look after yourself tonight, you have been very brave xx

@Someone1987 I had a speak about it with my old GP around the time it happened, but nothing was done about it. I went through CAHMS for self harm and suicidal tendencies when I was 11/12, but they dismissed me as mentally fine - which was later disproved (obviously). I couldn't speak about the abuse as they kept my dad in the room which didn't give me a lot of support options.

I'm not opposed to speaking to a GP but I'm aware that I'm not actively suicidal or wanting to hurt someone else, so I'd be very low down the list (particularly with Covid). Hopefully one day I'll have the money to go to private counselling, until then I've just got to do what I can I think.

Thank you for your help, you've been very kind x

I had very similar experiences OP and for similar reasons from the sound of it and I very definitely see myself as a survivor. I was 'promiscuous' and anxious not to 'lead anyone on' too and carried a lot of guilt and shame for a long time. It's only really now (in my late 40's) I can see just how wrong the mens' behaviour actually was, and how vulnerable I was.

My DD is coming up to the age I was when it all started for me now and the thought of 30-odd year old men taking advantage of her like they did me from the age of 13 onwards utterly disgusts me. There would be nothing she could do, no amount of 'leading on' or flirting that could make an older man touching her in any way her fault so it's baffling why we blame ourselves when thinking about our own experiences.

I don't quite know how I've come to not blaming myself but I absolutely don't anymore. I spend a lot of time on the feminist board on here and have learned a lot about grooming and how safeguarding should work which I think has helped because I can see how wrong the adults' behaviour was, and that I was very definitely a vulnerable kid. I've also done a lot of reading around abusive relationships and that's helped me understand a lot about my own responses and behaviour. I guess I've sort of done self-therapy which might not work for everyone but it's helped me make sense of things, might be worth a try at least until finances/covid situation improve

The work has involved role modelling and messages from childhood and adolescence.

Boundaries in all relationships.

Acceptance of victim status ( really really struggle with that)and that I was a child.

How the abuse made me feel. What I have taken into future relationships.

It’s really heavy. 26 sessions and nearly half way through them.

I reported some of the historical abuse through the SARC and got appointed an independent sexual violence advisor. Reported via 101 and made statement. I’m on waiting list for counselling support through ISVA but woman’s centre have been great and shorter wait time.

@TwixTwixtwoo

Thank you for sharing, and I'm really genuinely sorry that something similar happened to you.

If you don't mind me asking, do you have any advice for safeguarding for your daughter? I really love the idea of having children and a family with my DH, but I'm concerned about passing on a proclivity for self destructive behaviour (as my parents also self harmed back in the day, and I'm also terrified of repeating their abusive behaviour). I also know that it's often hard to see things with perspective when you're very young, but I don't want to come down too hard on my child about all of this stuff and traumatise them or make them not comfortable talking to me about sexual experiences if necessary.

Sorry, lots of worries. Don't feel any pressure to tell me anything that makes you uncomfortable in any way, I'm just working hard to not have this family cycle keep repeating and would like to protect my future children.

Thank you for sharing and offering up advice, I appreciate it and I'm glad you've healed ( / or are in the process of healing) from your experiences. x