DS38 won't/can't commit to his long term DP and she wants a break

[nunnun]

My DS has been with his partner for five years. She wants to start a family but he says he isn't ready to commit to that. They've discussed it and she's told him that she wants a break from the relationship to decide what to do. He's told me he feels 'very, very down'. He's recently started a new job living in London, earning good money but in a career that he dislikes, while she's remained in their home eighty miles way. He's texted me this morning and wants to talk to me but I don't know how to advise him. It's not just the issue of their relationship, but the fact that he seems to have a fear of commitment to anything or to anyone and is getting depressed about how his 'life has turned out' (his words).

What can I do or say to support him?

I'm not sure there is any advice for him. He's 38, he needs to figure out what he wants.

She should stop wasting her time and find someone who will commit to her. Good for her.

I agree with talking to a Counsellor. Or maybe a life coach type person who would help him to sort out what's important in hi life and what he wants to change. I don't blame his girlfriend for feeling that it's make your mind up time. Especially if she's in her thirties.

Hopefully he'll tell her to take a permanent break & they can both move on!

He's not "hurting her" by being honest and not drifting into fatherhood without reflection.

He clearly has hurt her. Which isn't to say he can help how he feels, but he has.

She wants to consider whether after five years with no engagement, no marriage (she's still young for these but a lot of women/people want to feel their relationship is 'going somewhere' and has some tangible progression) and now no concrete commitment to having children is one she wants to be in. I think that's quite wise.

I know depression can sometimes appear like someone's self-absorbed. That's how he's coming across.

25 with a 38 year old - She seems more mature than him. He says he feel "very down"? Well, what the fuck did he expect? I young woman to just wait around for an almost 40 year old to decided if he wants her or not? Good for her for pandering to him. I hope she doesn't waste anymore time waiting on someone who clearly doesn't want her long time.

*for NOT pandering to him

He’s not making great choices, is he, really? He’s picking a really young partner, probably because they won’t question him, then panicking when they grow up and do. He’s shying away from having a family when he’s getting fairly old himself (obviously he can be a father at any age, but who wants to be a Rolling Stones dad!). He’s doing a job he doesn’t really like for the money. Perhaps he needs to step down a bit. Perhaps a lower paid/stressed and a family would actually give him a more enjoyable life? I’m not saying he should have a family unless he’s really ready, but perhaps the life he’s chasing isn’t the one for him and that’s why he’s down?

He's nearly 40, if he's not ready to settle down now then that suggests he's either not found the right one and should let her go, OR that he's not capable of commitment, in which case ditto. It's sad, but he really shouldn't string her along if he knows that it's highly likely he won't want marriage/children for another decade.

You mentionned she's only 25 whilst he's late 30s - my guess is that he has commitment issues and part of her appeal was that being in her early 20s, he assumed he would have a lot longer than 5 years before she started wanting to start a family.
I don't think it sounds like he's in the right relationship sadly and I would be advising him that if he's not 100% committed to having children, the only fair option is to tell her he isn't ready and isn't sure when he will be, and that if she therefore wants to move on else it's a decision he would respect.
It's not fair for him to string her along whatever the reasoning and obviously he shouldn't give in just to please her either.

Perhaps he sees that he wouldn’t be able to easily escape his job/career if he’s financially supporting a family. All of a sudden the option of giving up and retraining or having a less well paid role is not so straightforward.

I would advise him to separate the two things from each other. There’s plenty of career coaching out there and he ought to get to the bottom of that.

The relationship: tell him to be respectful of his partner’s wishes and if she wants time then he ought to use that to contemplate that too. Maybe suggest a couples counsellor.

It sounds like he was managing thinking things weren’t too serious and that he could get out if he needed to and all of a sudden he’s facing up to a life decision that he wasn’t prepared for.

It’s perfectly natural for a 25 year old woman in a five year relationship to bring up the subject of marriage and children. The break should be permanent if that’s not what he can offer her.

If he doesn’t want marriage and kids he should find a like-minded woman (not another 20 year old tough, that would be pathetic and a bit sleazy).

I agree with PPs in that he sounds a bit indulged and immature. That said, he was right not to do the “maybe one day” speech to prevent her from leaving him, which is in his favour.

He needs to be honest with his gf about whether he ever wants children, and if he does, when. And based on what that decision is, he either commits or lets her go. GF deserves honesty just as much as he deserves his happiness.

He should definitely see his GP about his feelings of depression.

His lack of fulfilment is probably a direct product of his inability to commit. It's causing him to feel detached and like he's coasting through his own life. I'm sure it's fixable, but he needs to change how he's doing things (though he should let his current GF go because if he doesn't know he wants children with her after 5 years together, then it's not the right relationship for him or her).

There are so many good ideas here, thank you all.

I split with my DS's father before my DS was born. I haven't seen him since despite my writing to him and he and my DS have never met. I believe that this may be one of the reasons he's reluctant to commit to having a family. And I do think it's to my DS's credit that he hasn't just gone along with starting a family to please his partner, but I agree he has to be painfully honest about that with her.

OP - I am sure your son’s experience with his absent father has affected him. But it may or may not be the cause of his issues with commitment.
By the way you describe him - and by little snippets of what you say about him - it does sound that he is a little stuck in not wanting to grow up.
And - I am guessing here - but you probably have quite a close relationship on an emotional level. He must have been the center of your life for a very long time. Have you remarried or was it just the two of you over the years?
You talk about emotionally supporting him and not wanting to hurt or criticise. It seems you are treating him with kid gloves, as if he is somehow fragile.
It is often difficult for men who grew up this close to their mother to truly separate and move on and commit to an another female.

At 38 it may still be possible. Maybe.
But it’s good news that his gf is young and can (and should really) move on to someone who is in a different frame of mind.
If she came on here the consensus advice would be to move on and pronto

Maybe he just doesn’t want to ever have kids? Nothing wrong with that but he needs to admit it.

You say he has issues with commitment? What else is he not committed to?

It's not just the issue of their relationship, but the fact that he seems to have a fear of commitment to anything or to anyone and is getting depressed about how his 'life has turned out' (his words)

I know you're his mother, but you may not like what I've got to say. I spent 3 years with a man like this in my early 30s. At first he was serious about a family & settling down etc. But he started havering & making excuses. Having hooked me in - I wasn't that bothered about having children before my relationship with him, but I really wanted to have children with him.

Anyway with the havering and the to-ing and fro-ing, it took around another 2 years to realise that in the end it wasn't going to work.

Not once would he take responsibility for this. He manouevred and havered so that in the end, I had to finish it. I think he didn't want to look like the bad guy. I was 38 by that point and I could see my fertility slip away (indeed, it had). I really feel that he "stole" my best years by vbeing a Peter Pan.

It still gives me the rage when I see newspaper articles or the like telling women to get their fertility sorted out. In my experience., it's usually the man who is the delayer, who doesn't want to take responsibility for participaring in an open & honest relationship ie grow up.

So - my advice to you as his mother is to tell him that if he really thinks a family with this woman is not for him after 5 years he OWES her - a lot. He owes her the respect to get out of the relationship as soon as possible, and as kindly as possible, to give her the chance to recover & see if there's a better man about who is responsible & grown up.

He owes her to make it easy & he owes her to make any financial arrangements generous towards her. If she wants a family, he's done a fair bit towards scuppering her chances.

"Depression" is not an excuse - he's been less than open or respectful to the one person in the world to whom he has a deep responsibility.

So if you can't say any of that to him, advise him to leave her, and explain to her why. Make it a clear clean cut, and don't faff about pretending he's having a crisis etc. Tell him to have some respect for the woman who trusts him.

Is he down because he diesnt know what he wants? He has to work that out. I feel for his gf. She is right to take time out. If he doesnt know if he wants to marry her and have kids after 5 years, then I'd surmise he doesn't want this. I'd ask him what he wants and see if he even knows. It's never fair to string someone along.

You should tell him to break up with her. Very unfair and selfish of him to be wasting her fertile years yet taking all the benefits of a committed relationship. I'm sure she's feeling much more 'down' than him at the realisation that someone she loves and saw a future with has actually been stringing her along for half a decade by having his cake and eating it. He should set her free to find someone else. If after FIVE years you're not sure enough to commit to someone, the answer is right there.

@nunnun

She is only 25, so she does on the face of it have plenty of time, but after five years in their relationship she feels she's ready to start a family. She's very sensible and I love her dearly and I'm gutted that he's hurting her like this. I have told him my feelings previously when a similar crisis has come around but I don't want to be too hard on him because I'm worried about him.

So he was going out with a 20 year old young woman who's just out of her teens when he was 33! He was basically on the cusp of being old enough to be her dad

Something not quite right there. When men have those sorts of age gaps is often due to the power balance that favours the older man. He's probably feeling down because he's sensing he's losing control of her and therefore his life somewhat (it may be unconscious on his part).

Even if she's only 25, she may not want to wait until 30s to have kids which is very understandable and not everyone takes fertility for granted. If you end up having fertility issues, so much better to find out when you're younger and many prefer to be younger mums anyway. Children aside, the lack of commitment to marriage is also an issue after 5 years. If she was my friend I'd be advising her to run for the hills. Even if they settled down, as a commitmentphobe, he's more likely to turn out to be one of those flaky men who hate the selflessness needed for kids and marriage.

He really needs to let her go realistically, all this faffing about wanting space, and not being able to make normal decisions at his age is odd. Surely he is able to come to terms with some basic things, as it isn't fair on his partner how she has to wait around for him to sort his head out.

Not everyone wants to settle down and have children. Maybe he wants her but not the kids/responsibility. Either way an honest conversation is needed.

@ItalianHat

It's not just the issue of their relationship, but the fact that he seems to have a fear of commitment to anything or to anyone and is getting depressed about how his 'life has turned out' (his words)

I know you're his mother, but you may not like what I've got to say. I spent 3 years with a man like this in my early 30s. At first he was serious about a family & settling down etc. But he started havering & making excuses. Having hooked me in - I wasn't that bothered about having children before my relationship with him, but I really wanted to have children with him.

Anyway with the havering and the to-ing and fro-ing, it took around another 2 years to realise that in the end it wasn't going to work.

Not once would he take responsibility for this. He manouevred and havered so that in the end, I had to finish it. I think he didn't want to look like the bad guy. I was 38 by that point and I could see my fertility slip away (indeed, it had). I really feel that he "stole" my best years by vbeing a Peter Pan.

It still gives me the rage when I see newspaper articles or the like telling women to get their fertility sorted out. In my experience., it's usually the man who is the delayer, who doesn't want to take responsibility for participaring in an open & honest relationship ie grow up.

So - my advice to you as his mother is to tell him that if he really thinks a family with this woman is not for him after 5 years he OWES her - a lot. He owes her the respect to get out of the relationship as soon as possible, and as kindly as possible, to give her the chance to recover & see if there's a better man about who is responsible & grown up.

He owes her to make it easy & he owes her to make any financial arrangements generous towards her. If she wants a family, he's done a fair bit towards scuppering her chances.

"Depression" is not an excuse - he's been less than open or respectful to the one person in the world to whom he has a deep responsibility.

So if you can't say any of that to him, advise him to leave her, and explain to her why. Make it a clear clean cut, and don't faff about pretending he's having a crisis etc. Tell him to have some respect for the woman who trusts him.

Completely agree with you about women being blamed when it's non committal men who are mainly the issue.

However like you said, they wouldn't be able to steal women's fertile years if we didnt let them. This modern day living where women are primed to give all the benefits of marriage to a man (living together, domestic labour, sex, emotional support etc.) without their commitment and expected on top of all this not bring up marriage/kids for fear of 'pressurising' or 'scaring him away' is utterly ridiculous. We need to be pushing back against the selfish indulgent Peter Pan role men are afforded in this sexist society, speak up for our expectations/desires as women, and kick such men to the kerb much earlier.

He's feeling sorry for himself about it being impossible for him to pretend that he's a lad in his early twenties anymore.

He's a middle aged man and needs to let the girlfriend become the ex, separate amicably (ie, not making her homeless) and start dating people who have already decided that they don't want children.

The last thing she needs is for him to say 'OK then' and then dump her and a baby for another woman just out of her teens because 'Being with my ex made me feel so old'

I suspect an engulfing mother and then no surprise failure to launch.

I really can’t imagine how overbearing you must be to take to the internet to crowd source info on a middle aged mans RS. Totally bizarre and controlling.