DS38 won't/can't commit to his long term DP and she wants a break

[nunnun]

My DS has been with his partner for five years. She wants to start a family but he says he isn't ready to commit to that. They've discussed it and she's told him that she wants a break from the relationship to decide what to do. He's told me he feels 'very, very down'. He's recently started a new job living in London, earning good money but in a career that he dislikes, while she's remained in their home eighty miles way. He's texted me this morning and wants to talk to me but I don't know how to advise him. It's not just the issue of their relationship, but the fact that he seems to have a fear of commitment to anything or to anyone and is getting depressed about how his 'life has turned out' (his words).

What can I do or say to support him?

[LemonBreeland]

I think he needs to hear that if he won't commit to her then he is going to lose her, and he needs to make a decision on what he really wants.

[InfiniteSheldon]

If he's nor sure after 5 years he's the problem and he needs some tough love. He doesn't get to waste so much of her time and not face the consequences.

[SVRT19674]

My sister in law was with someone like this. Nice guy, who went along with her lets have a family desire as long as she had fybroids and was having op after op. When she was finally rid, he suddenly wasn´t ready bla bla bla. She wasted her fertile years on him and is now childless when that wasn´t what she wanted. He should have had the balls to speak up and not string her along which is what he eventually did.

[DioneTheDiabolist]

I am worried about his negative view of himself and how that's affecting his inability to commit to planning a future

^^This is a good starting point for a discussion with your DS OP. I would leave the gf out of it as IME he is unlikely to commit to her, even if he works on his issues.

[nunnun]

I'm not an overbearing mother, nor do I make a habit of interfering in his life but I am worried about his negative view of himself and how that's affecting his inability to commit to planning a future, whether it's with his gf or not. She does love him very much, but she's level-headed and clear about what she wants and is tired of his prevarication, which I completely understand, as I said in my pp I love her dearly and respect her decisions. I just want him to be happy with his life and his decisions, like all mothers, although I do realise there's only so much I can help him with.

[Knittingnanny]

I agree he needs to be honest with her
My eldest two sons are around that age and whilst one wantedto and had a family with his wife in his twenties, the other parted with his partner early thirties as she wanted a baby and he wasn’t ready. He didn’t marry and have children until late thirties . My youngest son approaching thirties is adamant he doesn’t want any children ever and hopefully he will make that clear to a long term partner.

[tornadoalley]

It sounds as though he needs some professional counselling. I'd also suggest he switches jobs to something nearer his DP and that he likes.

[Dery]

@nunnun - I think there are some very unkind remarks being made against you here and there's no need for it.

It's good that your son is close to you and able to talk to you about what he is feeling.

But he needs to recognise that a lot of his dissatisfaction is coming from his failure to commit because it is commitment - to people, to jobs, to interests and so forth - which gives life so much of its meaning. I think he must imagine that everyone else goes through life feeling extremely certain and secure about their choices - that's certainly not the case for me and I doubt it is the case for most people; there's an element of risk in every major decision that things will not turn out the way we would have chosen but we make the choices anyway because that is part of growing up and moving forward. It's all part of life's journey and part of the learning.

He's 38 now so he really does need to start taking these steps. That is not to say that he should have children - he absolutely shouldn't when he's so uncertain - but he should find other things he can commit to just so he can experience it. A hobby. Maybe even a pet! I also think he would do better dating women his own age or older rather than pursuing women so much younger. That's a sign of real emotional immaturity and he needs to start growing up emotionally.

[Iggypoppie]

I think your advice to him would be to let this young woman go and get on with her life.

[DioneTheDiabolist]

but I don't want to be too hard on him because I'm worried about him.
What are your specific worries OP?

[NearlyGranny]

I think you can only listen, and perhaps suggest he seeks help if he's down. If he can't or won't commit to his partner after five years together, it's not surprising if she gives up on him, really. What is he waiting for? Why should either of them carry on as before if there is no progression in the relationship?

If you were her mother, what might you say to her? Perhaps you could usefully tell him...

[alreadytaken]

Talk to him - if he's scared of being a father point out that just because his father was rubbish doesnt mean he will be.

Time to point out that you wont be in his life forever and he needs to either start a family or accept that he lives alone. There will not be many women prepared to settle for not having children.

Sometimes men just need a bit of a push. I gave a male friend some encouragement to commit years ago (pointed out his lovely girlfriend was not going to wait around much longer) - they've been married many years now, their 2 children are adults.

[IncandescentSilver]

If he's not ready to commit at 38, then he's likely the flaky type and thars a deliberate choice on his part.

I kniw it's common on mumsnet to have big age gaps but I have to say that amongst my friends and work colleagues, none of us would want to get involved with a 38 year old at age 25. What would we have in common? And at 20, we would still have been university students as well, mixing with our plenty of other students. So I'm guessing that not only is there a big age gap but there is a difference in educational level between them too.

He reminds me of my ex, who was basically a spoilt brat who had been given everything he wanted all his life and who expected it from women as well. In his case, he rotates increasingly unsuitable younger women with whom he has nothing in common with and he's been around the block so many times that most women with prospects would have nothing to do with him.

Or another make friend who had a lovely girlfriend 10 years ago who left him because he wouldn't commit. He's now mid fifties and desperate for another girlfriend, but no one wants him. He still can't see that there was anything wrong with his decision to let his girlfriend go and still thinks he should be able to find another one who will be happy to do the same thing while he offers no commitment. You do find yourself wondering what is so entrancing about no commitment that becoming a sad lonely older man contemplating spending their senior years tended by strangers in a nursing home is just so worth having!

It's likely that his 25 year old girlfriend has got fed up with him and realises she could do much better, especially finding someone who wants to get married and give her some security. It may not even be abiut children.

There's a lot to be said for bringing up children to respect women and family, rather than as little emperors who are entitled to everything they want in the sweetie shop. It's really shocking that he has gone to his mother about thus rather than being able to sort out his own personal life by making normal adult decisions!

[KatherineJaneway]

That's such an unkind post Sssloou

[Sssloou]

I suspect an engulfing mother and then no surprise failure to launch.

I really can’t imagine how overbearing you must be to take to the internet to crowd source info on a middle aged mans RS. Totally bizarre and controlling.

[MitziK]

He's feeling sorry for himself about it being impossible for him to pretend that he's a lad in his early twenties anymore.

He's a middle aged man and needs to let the girlfriend become the ex, separate amicably (ie, not making her homeless) and start dating people who have already decided that they don't want children.

The last thing she needs is for him to say 'OK then' and then dump her and a baby for another woman just out of her teens because 'Being with my ex made me feel so old'

[LilyWater]

@ItalianHat

It's not just the issue of their relationship, but the fact that he seems to have a fear of commitment to anything or to anyone and is getting depressed about how his 'life has turned out' (his words)

I know you're his mother, but you may not like what I've got to say. I spent 3 years with a man like this in my early 30s. At first he was serious about a family & settling down etc. But he started havering & making excuses. Having hooked me in - I wasn't that bothered about having children before my relationship with him, but I really wanted to have children with him.

Anyway with the havering and the to-ing and fro-ing, it took around another 2 years to realise that in the end it wasn't going to work.

Not once would he take responsibility for this. He manouevred and havered so that in the end, I had to finish it. I think he didn't want to look like the bad guy. I was 38 by that point and I could see my fertility slip away (indeed, it had). I really feel that he "stole" my best years by vbeing a Peter Pan.

It still gives me the rage when I see newspaper articles or the like telling women to get their fertility sorted out. In my experience., it's usually the man who is the delayer, who doesn't want to take responsibility for participaring in an open & honest relationship ie grow up.

So - my advice to you as his mother is to tell him that if he really thinks a family with this woman is not for him after 5 years he OWES her - a lot. He owes her the respect to get out of the relationship as soon as possible, and as kindly as possible, to give her the chance to recover & see if there's a better man about who is responsible & grown up.

He owes her to make it easy & he owes her to make any financial arrangements generous towards her. If she wants a family, he's done a fair bit towards scuppering her chances.

"Depression" is not an excuse - he's been less than open or respectful to the one person in the world to whom he has a deep responsibility.

So if you can't say any of that to him, advise him to leave her, and explain to her why. Make it a clear clean cut, and don't faff about pretending he's having a crisis etc. Tell him to have some respect for the woman who trusts him.

Completely agree with you about women being blamed when it's non committal men who are mainly the issue.

However like you said, they wouldn't be able to steal women's fertile years if we didnt let them. This modern day living where women are primed to give all the benefits of marriage to a man (living together, domestic labour, sex, emotional support etc.) without their commitment and expected on top of all this not bring up marriage/kids for fear of 'pressurising' or 'scaring him away' is utterly ridiculous. We need to be pushing back against the selfish indulgent Peter Pan role men are afforded in this sexist society, speak up for our expectations/desires as women, and kick such men to the kerb much earlier.

[BewilderedDoughnut]

Not everyone wants to settle down and have children. Maybe he wants her but not the kids/responsibility. Either way an honest conversation is needed.

[1forAll74]

He really needs to let her go realistically, all this faffing about wanting space, and not being able to make normal decisions at his age is odd. Surely he is able to come to terms with some basic things, as it isn't fair on his partner how she has to wait around for him to sort his head out.

[LilyWater]

@nunnun

She is only 25, so she does on the face of it have plenty of time, but after five years in their relationship she feels she's ready to start a family. She's very sensible and I love her dearly and I'm gutted that he's hurting her like this. I have told him my feelings previously when a similar crisis has come around but I don't want to be too hard on him because I'm worried about him.

So he was going out with a 20 year old young woman who's just out of her teens when he was 33! He was basically on the cusp of being old enough to be her dad

Something not quite right there. When men have those sorts of age gaps is often due to the power balance that favours the older man. He's probably feeling down because he's sensing he's losing control of her and therefore his life somewhat (it may be unconscious on his part).

Even if she's only 25, she may not want to wait until 30s to have kids which is very understandable and not everyone takes fertility for granted. If you end up having fertility issues, so much better to find out when you're younger and many prefer to be younger mums anyway. Children aside, the lack of commitment to marriage is also an issue after 5 years. If she was my friend I'd be advising her to run for the hills. Even if they settled down, as a commitmentphobe, he's more likely to turn out to be one of those flaky men who hate the selflessness needed for kids and marriage.

[LilyWater]

You should tell him to break up with her. Very unfair and selfish of him to be wasting her fertile years yet taking all the benefits of a committed relationship. I'm sure she's feeling much more 'down' than him at the realisation that someone she loves and saw a future with has actually been stringing her along for half a decade by having his cake and eating it. He should set her free to find someone else. If after FIVE years you're not sure enough to commit to someone, the answer is right there.

[Windmillwhirl]

Is he down because he diesnt know what he wants? He has to work that out. I feel for his gf. She is right to take time out. If he doesnt know if he wants to marry her and have kids after 5 years, then I'd surmise he doesn't want this. I'd ask him what he wants and see if he even knows. It's never fair to string someone along.

[ItalianHat]

It's not just the issue of their relationship, but the fact that he seems to have a fear of commitment to anything or to anyone and is getting depressed about how his 'life has turned out' (his words)

I know you're his mother, but you may not like what I've got to say. I spent 3 years with a man like this in my early 30s. At first he was serious about a family & settling down etc. But he started havering & making excuses. Having hooked me in - I wasn't that bothered about having children before my relationship with him, but I really wanted to have children with him.

Anyway with the havering and the to-ing and fro-ing, it took around another 2 years to realise that in the end it wasn't going to work.

Not once would he take responsibility for this. He manouevred and havered so that in the end, I had to finish it. I think he didn't want to look like the bad guy. I was 38 by that point and I could see my fertility slip away (indeed, it had). I really feel that he "stole" my best years by vbeing a Peter Pan.

It still gives me the rage when I see newspaper articles or the like telling women to get their fertility sorted out. In my experience., it's usually the man who is the delayer, who doesn't want to take responsibility for participaring in an open & honest relationship ie grow up.

So - my advice to you as his mother is to tell him that if he really thinks a family with this woman is not for him after 5 years he OWES her - a lot. He owes her the respect to get out of the relationship as soon as possible, and as kindly as possible, to give her the chance to recover & see if there's a better man about who is responsible & grown up.

He owes her to make it easy & he owes her to make any financial arrangements generous towards her. If she wants a family, he's done a fair bit towards scuppering her chances.

"Depression" is not an excuse - he's been less than open or respectful to the one person in the world to whom he has a deep responsibility.

So if you can't say any of that to him, advise him to leave her, and explain to her why. Make it a clear clean cut, and don't faff about pretending he's having a crisis etc. Tell him to have some respect for the woman who trusts him.

[AnnaFour]

Maybe he just doesn’t want to ever have kids? Nothing wrong with that but he needs to admit it.

You say he has issues with commitment? What else is he not committed to?

[MMmomDD]

OP - I am sure your son’s experience with his absent father has affected him. But it may or may not be the cause of his issues with commitment.
By the way you describe him - and by little snippets of what you say about him - it does sound that he is a little stuck in not wanting to grow up.
And - I am guessing here - but you probably have quite a close relationship on an emotional level. He must have been the center of your life for a very long time. Have you remarried or was it just the two of you over the years?
You talk about emotionally supporting him and not wanting to hurt or criticise. It seems you are treating him with kid gloves, as if he is somehow fragile.
It is often difficult for men who grew up this close to their mother to truly separate and move on and commit to an another female.

At 38 it may still be possible. Maybe.
But it’s good news that his gf is young and can (and should really) move on to someone who is in a different frame of mind.
If she came on here the consensus advice would be to move on and pronto