How to deal with my Mother in Laws relationship with my baby daughter

[BreastfeedingMomma2019andup]

Hello Mommas,

Need some advice here. So my MIL and I generally have always got on very well, then I got pregnant and she was great came shopping with me kept showering us in loads of baby gifts, then made a few odd comments “keep growing us that baby” and told nearly everyone she knew “were having a baby!!” before I was 12 weeks, this made me feel like my confidence had been betrayed, it was our secret to tell not hers. I let this go. In between a lot of advice that I didn’t ask for, more gifts and I have to say a lot of kindness, and a request to be my doula which I politely turned down.
So I should probably mention that she has a beautiful disabled daughter, her only daughter who she has cared for constantly upto adulthood.

When my daughter was born she wanted to be with us all the time and would pop round unannounced a lot and stay all day, this was lovely, but a lot. Then she would want to change the baby’s nappy all the time which I found I didn’t really like so I would try to say no don’t worry but she would grab her and take her for a change.

Then one night we were staying at their house and I woke in the morning and the baby was gone and I heard her crying in the hall and leaped out of bed and MIL came back in with baby and said “oh I just took her to make you a drink” I was freaked out, she took my baby whilst I was sleeping.
Then a couple of times I heard her saying “hello daughter” and that freaked me out and I would say “hello grandma” and she would laugh it off and say sorry that’s what I meant.
Lockdown we had a nice break just our little family, the since seeing MIL again she says things like “ooooh baby mummy’s phone is ringing” and I correct - grandmas phone! Then I’ve heard her say “here’s daddy” now about my FIL again I correct - grandad. They don’t do this all the time ofcourse but there have been a few too many slip of the tongues for my liking.
Recently I had to work away for 8 hours so left my baby with the MIL. I kept checking up on them and the day seemed to go well, then when I got back MIL said to me “I’d love to say she missed you, but she just didn’t, not even a bit.” To which I replied “well you know all you want to do is raise a confident child” then later on again “didn’t miss you abit I was so surprised, I thought she would be a lot more upset but children really are merciless” then later more of the same I won’t bore you with. I don’t want her to miss me I want her to be happy, but Christ don’t hurt my feelings!
Since looking after her all she has gone on about is this deep connection they both have and then saying strange things like “ooooh no mummy’s still your favourite, mummy’s still number one and grandmas second” and to me “don’t worrry she still loves you more” um I’m not worried just weirded out. Very odd comments.

I now find I feel a bit over protective and pissed off and when MIL is around which is a lot I don’t like her walking off with baby or holding her. I don’t want to feel like this I want my daughter to have a great relationship with her grandparents it’s so important I just feel so enraged and I guess threatened when she holds her. My mother and father in law are very wealthy and constantly buying new things for baby, MIL has created a whole nursery at her house and recently produced an expensive box of clothes and said “I’ve bought her whole wardrobe” am I ungrateful to think, fuck off, I might not be able to afford it but I want to dress my own child, old clothes or not!

My question to you ladies is what would you do?

Do I talk to her and say, look this is how you’re making me feel?

I’ve spoken to my husband who brushes it off and says you know they’re just so made up to have a baby girl in the family.

Thank you in advance xxx

Hi, I have to say my first impression from reading your post is what a calm, VERY reasonable and fair person you seem to be. Your MIL is so lucky to have a DIL like you, the situation is (rightly) making you feel uncomfortable and whereas alot of women would want to shut off that type of grandmother/granddaughter relationship, you want her in your daughter's life. She is your daughter, your responsibility and at the end of the day as far as your daughter is concerned what you say goes. End of.

It seems from what you are saying that she clearly loves her granddaughter, but maybe doesn't understand that she's overstepping the boundaries here. It's a difficult one as I'm sure you don't want to offend her, but at the same time she needs to know that she cannot just go into your room and take your daughter when she pleases, etc. And as for her referring to herself as mummy, that is way too far. Your husband needs to back you all the way on this, you're being so reasonable about it like I said, despite how it's making you feel.

Something does need to be said because the resentment will just build up and that's no good for anyone, but you really need your husband to have your back on this one. Good luck!

She’s not kind OR nurturing OP, she’s controlling, smothering and has no boundaries!

Your bedroom is your private space. Your MIL should not be waking you up or walking in on you naked.

What’s with all the overnight stays at your house and vice versa? It seems like an unusual set up to say the least!

Has she ever cut the apron strings with DH?

I’ve seen this with a friend’s MIL. They aren’t allowed to move more that 2 miles away despite having incredible jobs that could take them anywhere in the world. My friend would often wake up to find her MIL doing her washing and ironing her lingerie, sneaking in to make breakfast in bed for her and her DH when they were trying to have a weekend shag, she cries hysterically when my friend suggests spending one Christmas with her own family, insists on having a key to their homes etc etc and her DH can’t bear to see his mummy upset.
You have a DH problem too alongside a MIL problem. Show him this thread. She’s overstepping massively and needs to stop.

She is highly manipulative and is insistent on getting her way. She uses money, gifts, fake charm and your politeness to exploit this situation.

She has repeatedly ignored and gone against your wishes wrt calling her Mummy - because she doesn’t care or respect what you feel or want. She is insistent on getting her own way.

She kept repeating the baby didn’t miss you - even though she knows this stung. She wants to hurt and undermine you.

Her own son calls her an “oddball” - that’s his boiled frog “normal” - she is probably batshit and they have all been tap dancing around her tantrums for years.

Expect the howling water works once you raise this with her. Get your DH to tell her x,y,z is not appropriate and what the consequences will be.

Trust your powerful visceral mothering instinct - it is screaming out to you - don’t ignore it through politeness. As Attila said - she is smothering and unhinged.

She has zero respect for you and is prepared to manipulate, trample and sabotage your bond with you baby girl for her own benefit. Know that.

I would write a list of everything that has concerned you to date and then I would update this log with anything that leaves you unsettled or confused. This will allow you to see the totality, consolidation and any patterns to her behaviour - because many might be small / subtle and you might think you are the loon calling it out - but this is deliberate from her to get away with as much as she can.

As others have said she will steal all of your motherhood “firsts” with your DD - have seen this time and time again as PP has said. Don’t let her rob you of this. Put the boundaries up, NEVER leave her alone and keep her at arms length. I had one of these MILs who chopped an ugly fringe into my daughters hair to claim her territory when I had expressly asked her not to. She also came into my bedroom in the middle of the night when I was sat naked on my bed breastfeeding my DS, sat right up to me and stuck her head in my breasts to watch a close up feed. I felt utterly violated - but said nothing as I was in shock and too polite. And so it went on and on and on. Don’t be me.

What would I do? I'd have extremely strong words with the mad bint. If she persisted, it would be low contact.

We do have a lot of overnight stop overs at each other’s houses, it’s something g we have always done, it never bothered me until the baby came along and now I feel like we need our own space for our family. Again something I haven’t really spoken up about. I see this now from talking with all of you, I am a big problem here for not being firm with what I want, just rolling along. I will never forget the night my grandfather died who was like a father to me and my baby was only three weeks old and we were staying at the in-laws and I had gone upstairs with my husband and our daughter and was feeding in the bed crying. MIL knocked to come in came and sat on bed next to me said she was sorry then looked at baby, put her hand on her head and said “this is just comfort feeding now, you mustn’t let her fall asleep at the breast” my own family we’re away in a different country during the first few weeks of my daughter being born and I suppose I clutched to any source of family I had, but now I look back it’s all so wrong and I’ve just let it happen. I need to build up the boundaries I so want now and establish what I want and what feels right.

Thank you all so much for your support and honesty, it feels really good to talk and Your all helping me get a clear picture and reinforcing my courage to my instincts that I’m right in what I feel.

I have actually had a good talk with my husband tonight about how I feel and he has agreed to call the MIL out on any weirdness and support me. I think creating distance is not going to happen as they are a very close family, but baby steps in the right direction hey xx

@NameChange84 please say your friend has dealt with that because that's messed up.

I am so sorry that you lost your lovely DGF and you were all alone in those early v vulnerable days of motherhood. It’s understandable that you were not best placed to express your needs and wants in those v tough days - but the most important thing is that you shouldn’t have had to - her behaviour is way off beam - so far from normal. Engulfing, manipulative, determined and creepy.

Your all helping me get a clear picture and reinforcing my courage to my instincts that I’m right in what I feel.

This is a brilliant stance and great progress. YOUR mind and body knows what’s right for you. Your protective and privacy instincts are important.

You also have to actively protect your motherhood here. She has had hers don’t let her encroach on yours - even if she has had disappointments. That’s not for you to rectify.

This is your experience - these early precious days are yours and fleeting. This is your story - your values, your approach on how to develop your little family - you can be as private and arms length as you want (or NEED with this character type).

Be clear that this is your precious little family - experiences are for you are 3 - not always including them - they are in the next tier down.

*I was the little girl in this scenario with a childless aunt who had a personality disorder but she wasn’t diagnosed until I was an adult. She always had to dress me in a different outfit to the one I’d arrived in, usually to one matching hers, she’d control what hobbies I did, what I ate, tried to get my hair cut short, permed and dyed to match hers so that people would assume I was her daughter, as I got older she forced me to go on sunbeds and tried to coerce me into tattoos, piercings and make certain weird sexual choices, from being very little she made me feel responsible for her and told me I would have to be her carer when she was older. It started small. With the changing clothes, then always having to eclipse my parents birthday and Christmas presents, then a little subtle word hear or there about how Mummy and Daddy weren’t actually very nice people, about how Mummy was jealous and Daddy didn’t really love me and trying to buy my affection and calling it love. The whole time she was just trying to make me an extension of her and freeze my actual parents out. Thankfully as soon as I was old enough I froze her out but I’ve had to have counselling for all the ways I was abused by her.

Seriously. Keep your daughter away.*

@NameChange84 / that is the maddest and saddest thing I have read in a long time. Where were the other adults during all of this - did they not intervene?

Just be careful OP. My sil had similar issues with mil and wasn't firm enough. When my niece was only 3 she didn't want to stay with her Grandma as arranged. Her Grandma actually said 'You and I are finished now if you don't stay.'
At that point my sil realised that she needed to establish firm boundaries but it was a struggle as she had previously allowed her mil to do so much.
A loving gp will want her gc to be closest to the parents because that is the best for the dc.

give MILs an inch and they will take a mile

The only thing mumsnet hates more than men is MIL 🤣

That being said SOME of her behaviour is weird.
If it troubles you so much I'd find alternative childcare and reduce the time she is with them

If you do reduce contact with them - you might well need to proactively fill that time up as a buffer with other people and activities. Can you and your DH get more connected to your wider community and hang out with other young parents - build your social life and family time around them - so that you are already always busy / booked if they try to suck your time - also it would be good for your DH to see how other people parent if his experience is so “oddball”

I went through exactly this. Mine took my baby from my house whilst I was sleeping when she was "helping" whilst I slept. She took her to her own house.
I realised when my daughter was 9 months old, through counselling,that MIL was unhinged.
My husband had not been listening to my concerns and eventually, I completely lost it at MIL, grabbed my daughter and drove off. This left DH with no other choice but to have a meeting with his parents without me there to discuss her behaviour. She is a narcissist so took no responsibility whatsoever. I then didn't see her for 6 months and she had short visits at her house from my DH and my daughter once a week without me there (which I hated).
She then wrote me a letter apologising asking if she could attend my daughter's birthday party. I agreed but outlined my boundaries.
We haven't fallen out like that since, but my boundaries are very clear and I tell her no if I don't like something. DH is now aware of her behaviour and tells MIL when she crosses the line (this is integral- he has to have your back).
The "mummy" thing is unnerving. My MIL asked that my daughter call her "Marma" which we refused.
I've since learned that MIL is an obsessive and my daughter was her obsession,by the time our second baby came along, she had a new obsession and she didn't bother as much- to my relief.

My MILs behaviour was so severe that I came to believe through PND, that my daughter was hers and that I was babysitting her for her. I had to have a lot of help. Please don't get to the point I was at. If my MIL had not listened and adhered to our boundaries, we would be having nothing to do with her. Your DHs handling of this situation is integral.
My MIL is mental. You know that yours is deep down. It doesn't matter how many friends she has, how likeable she is, she is mental.
Do what you have to do. Do it now.

Just to add: I also found alternative childcare, we only relied on her when absolutely desperate.

Things are different now. It's interesting how their obsession changes when children get older as someone has rightly posted upthread.

I can’t thank you all enough for sharing your stories and wisdom.

I feel like I have released so much just talking to you all and you have all given me a massive clarity in how I need to move forward with this.

Thank you xxx

@BreastfeedingMomma2019andup

The overnights need to stop. If you live close by, what exactly is the point of it?

Your MIL, has really manipulated you (groomed), used your kindness and the fact that you let things go, so she can play at being mummy, undermine you and power play (like when she told you, that your daughter really didn’t miss you).

You need to have firm boundaries and your DH needs to support this. I say this, as like others have said she’ll use waterworks, emotional blackmail to keep the status quo.

IMO, I would:

1. Not stay overnight nor have them stay. Ever.
2. She/you will only visit on X day and for Y amount of time
3. Find alternative childcare
4. She is to be firmly told that your bedroom is not to be entered.

I also agree that you need to fill your time up.

As your child gets older, she’ll have play dates, school and won’t want to spend every waking minute with granny.

Also, there is close and then there is enmeshed. Spending your free time with each other all the time is odd. You need to start, socialising with friends and other parents.

Before you follow a lot of the frankly bat shit advice you have been given here, and damage family relations forever, let me give you an example of a mil (my gran) who also had a disabled daughter. My gran had so many unfulfilled dreams regarding my aunt that she fulfilled through her grandaughters. We even called her mum. There was no doubt at all to us that she wasn’t our mother but our memories of her were always fantastic - she really worked hard us to make us happy

Omg OP. I'm so horrified reading all this. I agree with PP your mil has groomed you and makes you feel you're wrong or at fault when you're uncomfortable by her batshit behaviour. I can't imagine the amount of hurt she's causing you with her horrible behaviour and entitledness. This is NOT a kind person! A kind person would have respect for you - especially as a new mum.

Honestly I'd move to the other end of the country as fast as I could. I'm not saying this flippantly - I mean it - move away. Why would you put up with that smothering and damaging closeness. Please protect yourself. You matter too, OP! And it's your relationship with your daughter that's the most important relationship here.

You should have a read of a box called toxic in laws by Susan forward which brings up things like emeshment and boundaries. Its sad for MIL that her daugher is disabled but it isnt your DDs responsibility to be some sort of replacement to make her feel better and shove you aside in the process. I have experienced similar and couples counselling for me and DH was really helpful in cementing that there was an issue to work on that I would no longer be party it.

Can not believe she took the baby whilst you were asleep - that’s overstepping the mark totally. This sounds very frustrating indeed. You definitely need to seek alternative childcare unfortunately. Such a shame that you have to do that but she’s taking the piss!

Your DH needs to man up and talk to the MIL about it. If he doesn't it will get to the stage where you won't want her to see your DD. He'll then have a much bigger problem on his hands!

There are some kind MILs who just get things a bit wrong. I don’t think yours is one of them, though. This is because someone may think it reassuring to say to a mother who’s been away from their baby for 8 hours that she didn’t miss you. Fine. But repeating it, especially when you responded with a positive comment, shows she meant to sting you with this.

As most others have said. Set your boundaries and enforce them.

DH must support you.

If it were me, I’d end overnights unless you live many miles apart and no more child minding.

I am a MIL and also have personal experience of a family member like this. When one of the couple ( son in law) tried to stand up to her she destroyed their marriage.Then made allegations And stopped the father’s access to the child.

Then her DD couldn’t afford the house alone so the mother forced her and the child to move to hers. She bullied her DD until she had a breakdown then took over the mother role in the child’s life.

She insisted the child went to an expensive private school. He was pretty dim and got bullied.

She fed him piles of junk food. He was very Overweight and got bullied.

Child is now an adult and is very psychologically damaged. Hasn’t seen his father for decades. Has distant relationship with his mother who remarried but had no more children.

OP you are right to act now. My advice -

You MUST agree new boundaries with your DH and he MUST enforce them. He will be reluctant to do this as he would rather have you upset than her.

Avoid being alone with MIL. Make sure you husband is home when she visits. He needs to deal with her. Do get go on shopping trips unless He's there too.

Don’t stay at their house.

Don’t have long phone calls with her. Greet her politely then pas her to your husband.

Don’t use her for childcare.

You dont have to be grateful for anything she buys for your DD. If anyone has to be grateful its your DH. It’s his child too.

If its gets too much, DH must ask her to stop.

Don’t confront her on anything . Don’t drop hints. Let your husband do it.

He must always be in the front line. If she thinks you are attacking her she will respond by trying to destroy your marriage.

This isn’t your battle, its his. He needs to step up and make hard choices.

Definitely don't be alone with her.
That is one of my rules even now, 6 years on.
We also have a code word that I use when MIL is getting too much, DH knows that it's then time to go.