Trying to set boundaries but just pissing her off?

[LadyPrigsbottom]

I have a family member who I really love, but who I find communicating with quite difficult at times. I always manage to piss her off, without meaning to.

She is a little younger than I am, but we are both in our 30s. She lives on her own, so we are her support bubble, which she wanted. She works all week (not from home), so is only free at weekends. So, she came to stay a couple of weekends ago. All fine. We had a lovely time and it was lovely to catch up. However, it obviously eats into family / couple time (which we get little enough of) and one of the kids has to move beds as we have a tiny house. No big deal and no trouble in the scheme of things, but not something we want to be doing every week iyswim.

Anyway, all fine. She asked to come back as soon as she left, so we said not this weekend, but the one after. That is this weekend.

She lives a couple of hours drive from us and last time came for one night, so we assumed that would be the same this time. Then she asked could she come straight from her work on the Friday, so arriving Friday evening. We said could we see how the week goes and let her know later in the week. Then she said she had applied for A/L on the Friday, so, good news, she could come on Friday morning. I said ok, so are you coming for the night again and going back on the Saturday night? She said she'd planned to stay the extra night and go back on the Sunday afternoon. I said, politely, could she just come for the one night, because it's been a busy week (it has) with one thing and another.

This upset her a bit and she said she thought she was like one of the family and I said yes, she is, but she doesn't live here and, crucially, she doesn't have a room here, so it's just a little bit disruptive for the kids and DH who is not obviously related to her at all. I wouldn't want his relative coming for the whole weekend every other weekend etc. This all came out in quite a long conversation btw. I didn't pepper her with all of that in one go and I did try to say it as nicely as I could without being TOO "sweet", (as I have tried that in the past with her and that annoyed her too - I asked her if she was ok because she had been so ott angry with me about not answering the phone to her - I called her back 15 minutes after she called - and she got properly pissed off when I asked if she was ok "don't send me messages like that").

Anyway, the long and the short of it is, that she became upset on the phone today, said "at least I know where I stand now" and then cried and hung up without saying goodbye. I immediately apologise by text for making her cry. She responded saying she isn't coming as she doesn't want to be a burden and also doesn't want to do the drive for just a short stay all the time, which I obviously understand.

At the moment, I just don't have the energy to respond. Many members of my family are volatile and I honestly need to be in the right place to deal with them sometimes, so I know this is also a "me problem". I am not blaming her, because I know I sometimes come across as defensive / territorial about having family time with DH and dcs? And that is genuine. I do think I come across that way at times and wonder if I'm being a twat and need to lighten up about that...

Jesus Christ this oxygen thief is in her 30's?! are you serious ?

OP you need to prioritise your children and your husband... stop pandering to a needy selfish self centered adult who is clearly jealous of you and your family unit... and just uses your home and putting one of your children out of their bedroom no less.. and doesn't care a jot..

FUCK that... you need to stop this now.. I don't care how fractured her bereavements are... everyone suffers great and painful loss.. it does not give us carte blanche to piss all over other peoples lives....

Please OP.. think of your own family unit now

I’d be removing the one night invitation, she sounds like a nightmare to deal with! And I’d never have people staying over if I had to move my child from their own bed to make it happen. You’ve been far too accommodating.

I think her behaviour is completely unreasonable now as an adult. No matter what has happened, you have to move forwards and can’t behave as she is. HOWEVER, sometimes siblings do have a different take on parent dynamics and their experiences of childhood can be wildly different. She has said things to the surviving parent that you disagree with, possibly because you feel what she is saying is false. Perhaps it isn’t though!

I had a similar background with my sister. She is younger than me so doesn’t remember a lot of what I saw and experienced. The way my parents treated her and behaved with her was wildly different to how it was for me. Yet, I could never (even as an adult) voice this because she would claim things didn’t happen and I was wrong!

Whilst you do have to move on as an adult and shouting and violence is 100% wrong, people do carry childhood baggage into adulthood. Some people ruin their whole adult lives because of things they have experienced as a child or younger adult, because they just can’t move on. Although family can’t fix this, if they aren’t believed or are criticised for saying things/bringing things up that they feel, this can make things even harder and cause serious damage. I don’t know from your posts what she is alluding to when saying one parent wanted the other dead, but maybe there is some truth in that? It can feel very isolating to not be believed or be told you’re wrong, when maybe it all depends on how you remember things or what you witnessed?

Just another take on things. Definitely don’t get into rowing with her though and I wouldn’t put up with shouting and violence around your children.

I've been on my own since the 7th February...in that time, the only person I've seen (apart from delivery men) is my ex H, who lives nearby and has been helping out with getting me food etc. My partner lives 200 miles away and is a carer so can't risk travelling and catching the virus.

I've now got Covid - from my one supermarket trip in a month - so won't even have that contact for at least two weeks as his girlfriend is in a high risk category.

Your sister needs to grow up. She's lucky that you are letting her come to stay at all right now.

I've now got Covid - from my one supermarket trip in a month - so won't even have that contact for at least two weeks as his girlfriend is in a high risk category.

I'm so sorry to hear this.. take good care

@Fiveasidefootballfamily, it was more of a grey area than a literal accusation of one parent wanting the other parent dead. We were both there when our parent died and we could see this was not a happy thing for the surviving one.

What my sister meant was that the surviving one had hurt the deceased one so badly in their marriage, (by infidelity), that they didn't look after themselves or their health and this lead to their death. It was only ever said to the surviving parent that they had "killed" the other parent. By the time my sister spoke to me about it, it was toned down. My reaction was not "you are wrong" because I could see her point. I just thought that her choice of words was damaging and unkind in the circumstances. Most of what she said, I could see the truth of. I just didn't think that it meant I should be baying for blood, as she seemed to be at the time. Especially, since the deceased parent had forgiven the surviving one and they were happy again when one of them died.

The other thing which I don't get, (and yesterday was the first time I so much as mentioned this to her), is that my sister was extremely critical of the now deceased parent and seemed to support and sympathise with the surviving one.

Of course, nobody ever knows what another sibling might have experienced growing up though, you are obviously right there and if she ever wants to have an adult conversation about that or with family therapy, I will be here. But no, I'm not being her emotional punch bag and I do not think it is fair for me to be made to feel responsible for her problems.

The other thing which I don't get, (and yesterday was the first time I so much as mentioned this to her), is that my sister was extremely critical of the now deceased parent and seemed to support and sympathise with the surviving one.

Before the death I mean.

I really feel for you OP. But surely I cant be the only one who also really feels for the sister? I think people are being a bit harsh on her. It sounds as if there's alot of behind the scenes stuff and also as if she's somewhat the family 'scapegoat' (and the OP is the golden child)

After reading page one I was going to say she’s a twat, then read page two and it confirmed it. Haven’t read all the comments but I still think she’s a twat! I wonder why she’s so alone and relies on family for company and doesn’t seem to have any friends hmm...manipulative, selfish and entitled. Not saying that being close to family is bad but it is in this example. One of the wonderful things I’ve discovered in life is that you can cut out family members and it can make your life better! It’s great.

It sounds like she feels you are her mum and she's not moved beyond adolescence.

I really feel for you OP, she sounds identical to my sister. It's taken me six months of therapy to realise that she behaves appallingly, it's not my job to be responsible for her and if she hates me that's her problem not mine. When I started to put in boundaries she cut me off and although that was my biggest fear beforehand, my life has been much better since. I'd very much recommend therapy, it was very liberating. Also look into cptsd and bpd. Reading Walking on Eggshells was what caused me to commit to therapy. Life changing. I've stopped blaming myself for everything in my family now and come to terms with the fact that they are very unlikely to change. It's made me a better mother. Good luck with your sister. I found mine was truly vile after the death of our second parent (worse than the first time). It may be best to prepare yourself for that eventuality now.

I think some members of families can adopt the role of fixer, or have it foisted upon them.

In this thankless role, you are going to be expected to suck up a lot, be an emotional punching bag and always be a available to accommodate others...listening to their problems etc., irrespective of whatever other responsibilities you juggle in your life.

Really thankless.

But the reality is none of us can fix another person.
By allowing another person, particularly a sibling to feel that you and your life is at their beck and call, is just wrong IMO.

I appreciate people can go through hard times, but accepting being the one they emotionally abuse and tantrum to, is just wrong.

We can only fix ourselves, not others.

In my case that is a life's work and quite enough to be getting on with.

OP, you sound like a very nice woman who needs to start thinking about your own self care.

Unfortunately I had to get to my 40's to understand that I couldn't fix the lives of those I cared about by running myself ragged.

Hugely liberating.

Just wish I had known it earlier.

Really plan on teaching my girls though.

My son's have it genetically!🙄😄

@Redyellowpink, I do feel sorry for her a lot. The last time we spoke I made it clear that I don't think she is the cause of any of this. She is a victim of it. I would hate her to feel scapegoated. She does say that she always feels as if we are dismissive of her, because she is the youngest, like she doesn't know anything. And I definitely think there has been an element of that. We do 'baby' her a bit and if things happen that are bad, sad etc, people often say "don't tell X yet". This obviously just excludes her, which is not helpful. So there is definitely a dynamic of which she is a victim and, I mean, I don't know how many times I have to say it, she does have a point in lots of what she resents me for. I hold my hands up to it. I have throughout the entire thread. She is right to resent me, because there is a very long history.

That being the case, I think it's a good thing that we work on things away from the children when things have calmed down. Her pretending we are fine and then letting loose at me when I do something small, like not answering my phone etc, is not helping EITHER of us.

Thanks again everyone. I am reading them all and thank you.

@LadyPrigsbottom

She was spitting mad. "OK, Prigsbottom, you REALLY need to make sure you have your phone near you in case of emergencies" in a totally arsey tone. She also sent a message to my DH telling him the same, that I had to be available. It was not an emergency btw, or, at least it was not something I had any control or say over. She thought this was fine, that it wasn't aggressive and that I'd misinterpreted her "panic" for aggression.
Your sister sounds so angry and manipulative with you. Sounds as though she can't put herself in your shoes at all to realise that, actually you have commitments which can't just be dropped in case she, or anyone else, calls.

When she called your DH to complain about you not responding to her call - what did he say to her? If he was non-committal perhaps he could be proactively say that he'll get a message to you but that he knows you have your hands full with the children and any other commitments you have so your sister is hearing the same thing from you both - that he is reinforcing what you would say to her. (I'm not saying he isn't but a suggestion.)

I have to say your sister sounded far younger on your OP than someone in her thirties because she sounds so emotionally immature. It may be (and you are probably not the one to suggest this) that she needs to have professional counselling to analyse why she's so volatile at you and angry that you are so "lucky" in having a family of your own. How is it your fault or responsibility that you have a husband and children and she has not?

It sounds to me, whatever acceptance you have that you might have managed things differently in the past, you are now being used as a scapegoat for how she feels. How does that improve things for any of you?

Not discussing this situation in a mature and calm manner, either with you or, better still in counselling, isn't helping anyone. Until she gets to this point and stops being so manipulative, I suggest you protect yourself and your family by being less emotionally or physically available.

I hope things improve for you all, your sister and including the surviving relative. Stay strong. 🌹

If it makes a difference, neither of us sees much of our family other than each other. She is more in touch with one set of aunties, cousins etc and I am more in touch with another. Some neither of us see. At the moment, she is more pally with the older sibling as they're both single, but they changes on and off.

I agree with the pp, that, whatever the history, this is helping neither of us. I'm not blaming her. I truly believe she is a victim in this. I just don't feel anymore that I can be responsible for making her better. It isn't helping at all. Her or me.

I do speak to our parent more, but I always call them. They never call me. Sister could do the same and parent wouldn't over the moon yo hear from her regularly. They used to be great friends till they fell out over the death. I think they are be coming friends again now which is great. Even when sister refused to speak to parent, except to give them a dressing down, parent funded her. Parent respects her career a lot. I don't think there should be any barriers to them being friends again, except that sister doesn't want friendship with parent. But maybe there us something I don't know. Hope not anything awful.

Honestly this sounds like such an enmeshed extended family which is really emotionally unhealthy. This your past birth family - if it at this stage in your life it is draining you or causing negative emotions / issues you need to realise that that is decades of stuff that is entrenched and is never going to be fixed. The v best you can hope for is a cordial, shallow, protective, customer service style RS when you meet on neutral ground. You need to emotionally detach in your head and withdraw from this so that you can focus on your own new little family - because your DS, DP, etc are sabotaging that.

You do not owe her anything - either to fix her, fix her RS with you or fix her RS with the parent.

You would help everyone by withdrawing a bit and disconnecting, so that you don’t function as their emotional dumping ground, vent, punching bag rescuer, fixer.

These issues are so entrenched and pervasive they need neutral and professional help. Signpost her to that.

Once you relieve yourself of this futile and inadvertently enabling and facilitating task - they will have no where to vent, the pressure will build up and they may choose to look at themselves or seek professional help.

Your focus needs to be 100% on the here and now and your future building your beautiful family unit. It doesn’t get tainted, polluted or drained by difficult people and you need to actively manage that.

Have you read up on the drama triangle? You might recognise the toxic and futile dynamic.

Wow excuse the numerous typos in the last two posts .

...that changes on and off*
...parent would be over the moon to hear from her*
...maybe there is something I don't know*

Thank you gutterton. No, I haven't read up on that. I will try to stay polite and friendly. I know she appreciates directness and openness, which I will do as far as possible, while trying to maintain the boundaries that I think will be much less stressful for my family and me. I can't speak for her and I don't want to, but I honestly do think this will be less stressful for sister too.

She maintains normal relationships with colleagues and friends as far as I know. She has boundaries too though and has had to be firm with friends who she has thought have overstepped her boundaries. She has also had to distance herself socially from colleagues she has found difficult. I hope she can understand me doing the same with her, (yes, I know it isn't the same, as it's family, which is why I am not in any way cutting her off. But we definitely need space from each other. I do anyway).

happy, DH didn't respond, because it was so silly and I had already called her back by the time her read the message. She then calmed down and it turned out the emergency wasn't such an emergency after all, (even if it had been, again, this was nothing I could have had any control over or could help with, in practical terms. It also was something she couldn't practically help with or something which directly affected her either. She just needed to tell me some slightly bad news about someone else, which turned out not to be so bad at all).

@Gutterton, meant to say, I have not read up on that, but will do. Thank you for that.