Split up but still wants to do things as a 'family'

[AtFirstIWasAfraid]

I have a question, because I feel my head is playing games with me at the moment.

I recently split with my ex, who was in a new relationship after 2 weeks (he cheated with this woman). Anyway, he recently told me he still wants to be friends and do things together as a family with our DC. He also said his new partner is happy with this arrangement.

Before he said all this I was in a good headspace and thought I was moving on. Now I feel like he just wants his cake and to eat it, knowing I'm always there if things don't work out with this new woman.

I'm just wondering if doing things together will be good for the children or if it will confuse them more? Their behaviour has changed dramatically since the break up and I'm not sure what to do for the best. I've since gone pretty much no contact with ex as my head is all over and speaking to him fills me with hope.

Thank you

I think it is important to be civil and work together with the children but as far as playing happy families come then no.

When my husband and I split we decided that the children would not be dragged into it and my oldest son says he appreciates us getting along since many of his friends parents that have split 'bad mouth' each other constantly and his mates feel torn..... That's not a nice thing to do to children. It's not their fault. So as far as the children go then yes get along compromise etc however for you. You need space to heal and he has made his choice and cannot have it both ways.

Good luck.

For a moment put aside what's best for your dcs and think about what's best for you. Remember what's right for you is probably the right thing for your dcs.

What would it be like going on happy 'family' days out with your ex only for him to bugger off back to his girlfriend in the evening leaving you with the clearing up and disappointed dcs?

How resentful will you feel when he expects you to do all the planning, booking, packing of wipes and sandwiches and then turns up for the fun bits? (Or doesn't turn up because something has come up)

How hurtful will it be when he starts flirting with you and giving you hope of a reconciliation, only for him to drop you again for his child free easy life when OW clicks her fingers?

Honestly, it would take a stronger woman than me to be able to deal with this. Do what's right for you.

@rockandahardplaice because they need to understand that their parents are no longer together. No reason whatsoever why they can't co-parent in a civilised way but in my experience what helped is telling my daughter what nights she would be at dad's, and what nights she would be with me. Then sticking to that arrangement (bar exceptions if a swap is needed) so that they have a routine.

In my opinion, anyone who has their ex in their life so much that they see them any more than to do handovers is not giving them a chance to move on properly. The OP's ex sounds like he can't be arsed parenting on his own therefore he wants the OP to tag along.

I don't think you should be going on family holidays or days out, I think it just confuses children further. But ideally you would be on good enough terms to both attend parents evenings, school plays, Major health appointments, and eventually graduations, engagement parties, weddings etc.

If the kids are happy enough to be with him without you there then I'd definitely say no to days out etc with him. My ex had an affair and we split when DS was about 1 and DS didn't like to be left with him so I (reluctantly) did a few things together until DS was more comfortable to spend time with his Dad.

It definitely sounds like your ex just wants to play happy families (without the hard bits of parenting or organisation falling to him) and then go back to his cosy new life. You'll need time child free as well (something he may be keen to control/prevent by making sure you do things altogether).

I'd agree a few very minimal things that you'll do together - taking them to school on their first day, birthday parties (they are OK as there are lots of other people around) etc.

When DS was 6, I did a mini family party for him as he'd had a big birthday party the previous year and invited ex to my house for it. Afterwards, DS said that I looked different when Daddy was around and my mouth looked different and he didn't like it. He picked up on my stress at the situation even though I thought I was doing fine and looking perfectly normal and smiley!

I'd say no. Clear boundaries need to be set...your DC will be confused otherwise.

I am always civil with him and talk about necessary things regarding the children. I just no longer feel it's right to engage in chit chat and for him to pretend that everything is fine.

Regarding the girlfriend, he said he's not ready to tell the children about her or for them to meet yet. Which I appreciate and understand. He can't live a double life forever and even after explaining that he said it will be fine.

@Rockandahardplaice I would never stop my children seeing their father for midweek contact. If that's how it came across I apologise. I just meant he wants to see them at my place and have tea with them then put them to bed. I would have no problem with him taking them out and bringing them back before bed or having them overnight through the week.

He just seems to want to do things on his terms. He doesn't pay and maintenance, only has the kids for 48 hours at a push every week. I can't force him to be a better father, but I'm not obliged to carry him either. He chose his path and I think it's only fair he maintains that himself. I believe he's not actually ready to give up on the 'family unit' yet, but that is no longer my problem.

I do agree with relate but every time I suggested this in the past he was never up for it. He's not a talker and just expects everything to blow over if he gives it enough time.

I think it's a case of ripping the plaster off though. Yes it will be painful for your kids now, but it will also be clearer and they will get through it and know where they stand, hopefully with 2 divorced parents who both have good relationships with them, and are polite and hold no bitterness towards one another.

Playing our fake family days, and then having arguments and upsets and disappointments as a result, seems like confusing torture all to appease your ex's Guilt. Let him feel guilty. He's done something wrong and his guilt is an appropriate feeling for him. But you don't need to feel obligated to appease him anymore. You and your DCs don't need to accommodate his needs, he needs to accommodate your healing

I think it's confusing.

They need a new normal with clear boundaries, (and you certainly do !).

Ex can't be dropping in whenever he feels like it or is free.

I would establish a regular access pattern (discussed through mediation if necessary) and stick to it.

You can always make exceptions for birthdays or the occasional school event when you are both present.

@chocolatesaltyballs22

"because they need to understand that their parents are no longer together".

This is a non-answer. They can understand this while still going out for Sunday lunch with both parents, or visiting Alton Towers (might otherwise be unaffordable following a split). What does "together" even mean? In reality it means that they are no longer romantic partners, sexual partners and life partners, but it doesn't mean that they can't carry out a shared activity together. I might take my sister and her kids to a theme park, but I'm not "together" with my sister, at least not in the sense you are talking about.

As with marriages, you can make of a separation whatever you want of it - provided that both parties have the kids interests at heart, and are respectful of each other.

I'm not saying this kind of thing always works, or even that it is likely to in OPs case, simply that it can work - and offering anecdotal evidence from your own experience that it hasn't for you doesn't change that (although I fully respect your experience and am sure that you did the right thing in your case).

Oh I couldn’t be arsed with that! I’d rather do my own thing with my own children than dance to the beat of his drum.

I think it will be far more beneficial for your children for you to talk about him positively on a day to day basis than it will be to go to a children’s farm on a Saturday.

My friends ex said something similar and she realised he’d never ever taken them out on his own before.

When my friend threw her exh out he insisted he join every day out /dc party /invites to parties they got he went along too-even her dm's funeral despite her begging him not to as her dm hated him.
Resulted in poor friend never got any time with her dc being able to kick back and relax +enjoy. Always on pins he was there.. Totally unfair on the dc - a total farce of a childhood.

@AtFirstIWasAfraid

I'm sorry he's not up for Relate. It doesn't sound like he is the type of guy that is going to be easy to negotiate things with. :-(

I didn't mean to imply you would prevent contact - I worded that bit quite badly, and I apologise. I just remember having children of that age and loving bed time routines, and would have been devastated to have lost that myself!

And get on with agreeing on an amount for maintenance (or going to court).

There is no "back payment" and leaving things like this means again he will want to say he is contributing by, say, taking them out for the day (on trips you don't want to go on) or buying the occasional present.

You will feel a lot better and be able to get over him if you have minimal contact and everything is laid out in writing (so no back and forth with him about when he's coming, who pays for what).

Can you write out what would work for you (an overnight mid-week, EOW)? and email it to him?

Then you have proof you have offered regular contact.

Is he living with the new partner? If so, and he doesn't want the DC to meet her, either she makes herself scarce when they are there or he forfeits overnights until he is ready to introduce them.

Either way contact should not be happening in your home, it's too confusing for the DC.

Oh FGS tell him to GTF of course he waves his cake and eat it. If his children were his main priority he'd have thought of them before cheating.

I almost feel sorry for his new GF being told to accept this arrangement too. And OP you don't need to apologise or explain to posters on here, it's your life. I think you're better off remaining civil as you have been but you deserve to be able to move on without him hampering you and being present in your life. He doesn't deserve that. Best of luck.

I know one couple who do this and make it work well. But:

• their decision to split was genuinely amicable and mutual
• they remain friends
• they both put in similar amounts of time and effort looking after their child.

I think if one person cheated, or one wanted the split and the other didn't etc, it would be much harder.

We did (and still do now with step-mum) and works really well for us.

You need to be very sure of his motives before even considering formulating a plan, and if you think for a moment it doesn't work for you, you're absolutely within your rights to not do it!

My exh and I did this from when the children were 10 and 5 until the youngest was 16. He came to all 'family' parties, Christmas and Birthdays though lived 100 miles away with the OW.
Looking back it affected how I mentally moved on but I do believe it made the children's childhood happy. There never had been any arguments before the split anyway and this way they go to see him as often as they would have done. I think it gave them a model as to how people can live apart but still love the children and also respect each other.
Mind you he did also collect the children twice a week on his days off and take them out to dinner without me so had his own relationship with them

He wants to be a Disney Dad, but he wants you to facilitate that.

He gets to come and 'give the kids tea and put them to bed' at your house, using your food, your electricity, having access to your home, all 'because it's for the DC'. So you do the washing up, food cooking and planning and he does - what? Watches them eat?

No. Just no.

@Rockandahardplaice I realised mine was probably worded wrong as well. That's the joy of text, you can never understand the context behind it. I would hate to give up bedtime routines as well but he was never truly involved until we ended. So now he wants everything.

I'm happy to still do things together regarding school parents evenings, Christmas plays etc. That's not an issue and I would never be unfriendly towards him or bitter and full of resentment because that's not in my character.

I have realised even since splitting he hasn't really done anything substantial on his own with the children. Only taken them to the park or for a walk. Nothing that requires planning. At first I felt sorry for him and thought it would be nice for the kids to see their parents getting on. But that shouldn't be detrimental to my mental health (which I 100% know it would be).

I put I claim in with CMS a few months back but nothing has come of it as of yet, maybe due to corona?.

I guess I know deep down what I should be doing, maybe I just thought he'd return if I made it easy enough for him. Although why would I want someone who gave up so easily for a different life?

@rockandahardplaice it's not 'anecdotal evidence', it's what happened. Anecdotal means; 'not necessarily true or reliable, because based on personal accounts rather than facts or research.'

You are in the minority with your opinion on this thread and others are using their actual experience to try and advise the OP. We will have to agree to disagree.

He gave up his right to do family activities with you when he left the family !
Maybe in the future you could work something out but when a split is new I don’t think it is wise .
Been there done it and it didn’t end well.

Don't do it.
He is the only one who would benefit from that arrangement. It would only serve to confuse and upset your children.

Right now they need established boundaries and clear messages. The uncharitable part of me thinks perhaps he wants this to keep his options open, to make it easier on him so that you're essentially supervising the kids so he doesn't have to do it alone and to ease his cheating guilt by showing up and playing happy families.

The good thing about being split up is you do not have to tailor your existence to him. Tell him no, politely but firmly.

Even if it does benefit the kids in some way, it doesn't benefit you. Your kids need a happy, healthy mum. Him inserting himself into your life as and when he pleases is not going to achieve that.

@chocolatesaltyballs22

My apologies - again, I didn't phrase this all that well. I only meant anecdotal in the sense that all posts are on mumsnet by definition due to the anonymity of the posters - I wasn't trying to question the truth of your own personal experience.

I agree I seem to be in the minority with my views here. But it only takes a few dissenters (and several have turned up) to bring down a sweeping statement. And what I was questioning was your blanket advice that it can't work and shouldn't be done.