How do couples survive small children?

[itchyfinger]

This is a genuine question, I'm looking for advice from people who have experienced similar (dont want to hear "I've never had an argument with my partner" answers!)

Me & DH were very happy before kids, rarely argued. And then, BAM, twins! Quite early on in our relationship. The early days were a struggle, we were just so so tired that we argued a lot. We both recognised this was down to tiredness I think, but the relentlessnes of it all was too much.

Now the DC are almost 5, and our lives have changed for the better and generally we get along more for longer periods of time. But our kids are seriously high energy, dramatic, feisty etc. And it becomes too much and me & DH can end up fighting. Today we had a lovely day planned with a picnic in the sun, but the DC fought/whinged/ate too much sugar and it was so hot and everyone was irritable, and we ended up taking it out on each other. I feel shit about the day, and the thought of spending tomorrow with DH is already making me annoyed.

I just dont know how much longer we can go on for like this. I realise that lockdown has heightened things immensely, but tbh things always got a bit much before the pandemic. I dont understand how couples manage it? Early mornings, not having a second to yourself, the tediousness of small kids and barely being able to speak without being interrupted.

We have jobs/childcare/family help etc. Does it get easier? Will we have more time for each other? Will I ever feel like not murdering him after a weekend together (lighthearted, I'm not going to commit murder)?

Time alone most days. The reason I love my husband so much is that him being in the house let’s me get out for a walk or run most days. We take bedtime duty in turns and the other one gets out. We also each get one weekday morning out alone and only do family together stuff from lunchtime.

My husband and I have been together for twenty years. 8 years ago we had our first daughter then 21 months later our second. Two under two was tough and life was tough. When the youngest hit four it got easier. We found that having so much time before the kids meant that when we were under strain we already had the resilience and understanding to deal with problems. We fight and shout but can usually recognise who was in the wrong and apologies fairly forthcoming.
We talk and explain of things are hard. If we need time alone, I garden and he lies down so if one is struggling the other sends them off for a bit. It's a total team effort and some days it is literally taking things a minute at a time.

Take turns to have both kids so the other parent gets a break, you both need down time for exercise/shower/whatever. Try to also have individual time with each child as one can seem so much easier compared to two. Afternoons, after lunch find quiet things they like to do for an hour (reading, drawing, Lego, movie time). Good bedtime routine so you get child free evenings.

And practice CTFD (calm the fuck down), if you find yourself losing it, seriously just calm the fuck down. Most things I used to get crazy about don’t really matter. I have two boys, they do dangerous things, I stop them, apart from that it doesn’t really matter and there’s no point shouting and getting angry. Kids can drive you insane but if you calm the fuck down and laugh about it it’s so much easier, better atmosphere and less arguments between parents. Chill out and life is so much happier.

Mine are 8 and 10 and it’s getting slightly easier. I used to say ‘things will be so much easier when they’re 4 and 6, which turned into 5 and 7, then 6 and 8 .... It is now getting better at 8 and 10. They fight, wind each other up, answer back and the eldest one is developing an attitude (prequel to teenage years). I don’t believe it ever gets easy, but we do sleep these days which definitely helps.

I think those early years can be relentless TBH! Twins are hard work I should imagine ,as you never really get "Time off " in the same way as with one child .I think arguing is fairly normal really.My DC are older now and I look back and wonder how we managed .Lockdown has certainly not helped! My DN has 2 DD and is trying to work from home as well! Not easy !.Do you have relatives nearby?can you get out for the evening sometimes? Either together or with your friends occasionally .The media present us with "perfect" family models who are nothing like us or anyone we know! I think it gets easier ,and as they get older they will probably want to see their own friends /have them to play /go to their house and so on .Hang on in there ,you are doing a great job!

Small age gap here and it got better once they were both at school. One of ours didn’t sleep so that nearly broke us and we certainly weren’t a couple - we just coexisted in the same house.

Thanks all. We argue about little annoyances but under the pressure it blows up. Yes workload is the usual one, who has done more, why haven't you done this etc etc. Yesterday it was because apparently I was being too anxious about this kids, y'know, not wanting them to run near the road or out of my sight. He kept saying "leave them alone, you're making it stressful" (I was stressed).

We are both quite stubborn and he gets moody when tired which is all the time right now.

It just feels impossible to maintain a harmonious relationship when the focus is on parenting and keeping 2 very demanding little people happy.

If your kids are in bed at a good time, why don't you each have a night where you do your own thing? Depending on what you're into, a run or a workout dvd, a long bath and a book...? Sometimes, doing things that make you happy individually make you happier together.

It is hard when they're young but just try and give each other support and time out when you each need it.

5 years old is old enough to know right and wrong. Why are you giving them sugar when you know it stirs them up? You need to become more authoritative and lay down rules when you go out and stick to them. If they whine/argue then you go through with punishment.

I don’t think you are a team with dh which is why you start arguing. Mornings don’t have to be tedious with 5 year olds. Why don’t you sit at the dinner table and let the kids make you both breakfast? Toast and cereal and some OJ is manageable for children that age. Again, keep the rules, if they whine/argue then they can’t help.

Honestly, having 3 young children was a nightmare for us; but giving children responsibility and purpose distracts them. If you start arguing with your dh it just shows the children that there is no unity. Also, days at home alone whilst kids are at school keep us connected. Obviously not now, but something to think about for the future.

Time out to ourselves.
For example during lockdown I have been going mountain biking on my own 3 times per week for 1-2 hours. It had saved my sanity. We do this in normal times too not just lockdown.

Do you think DH was right in this case? Were you being a bit stressy and overprotective or do you genuinely think he was being too lax? Try to see the other person's point of view.

I think the main thing is to be kind to each other. Remember you're a partnership working together, not in competition against each other.

It will get easier OP. Probably quite soon!

Sometimes it's just a bit shit and you have to cash out on the good will built earlier in the relationship and muscle through it.

If it’s the children who are badly behaved, why is it your husband you are having an argument with? Both of you probably agree that the kids wind you up so it’s logical that both of you, as a united front, tell the kids off/discipline them and stand together as a team.

Following.

Talking to dh about this earlier today. My conclusion? Actual time together. Time to talk, have dinner together, go for a walk. Anything! See where each other are coming from and realise how frazzled you both are. A date night would be ideal. Might have to be in a post covid world..

Why is he so tired all the time? Do the twins wake you both throughout the night?

We discovered that when we had time away from the kids we got on better and made sure when they were small that we got a night away without them once a year. I've been told on here I'm v privileged and that its unrealistic for most, but honestly I think that saved our marriage. That and both of us getting the odd night off to be with friends. I found having small children very draining.

Mine are 9 and 12 now and much much easier.

A few years ago DH and I went on a marriage course. It was a bit like counselling lite - I don't think it would have saved our marriage if it had really been in trouble, but it helped with the little niggles and really improved our communication. May be worth looking into?

No advice but hope this makes you feel better one dd 11 she goes bed fine . 1 ds who is 5 bed 7pm sleep 8.30pm then I have ds who is 9 goes bed at 7:30pm sleep by 2/3am and up at 6/7am everyday he is adhd then during day 2 of them play nicely behave . 9 year old fights with other throws things around screams shouts cries when things don’t go his way or don’t like something . So I don’t get any time to myself and 3/4 hours sleep and on rare occasion 6hours sleep so my relationship with partner well we just get on with it we hardly spend any time together .

It reminds me of that advert - can't remember what it's for - where a couple are on a fairground round and they age as it goes on. When they are young they are all lovey dovey, when they are married they smile and hold hands etc. When it gets to children the toddler sits between them and they both look furiously in opposite directions not touching! I think that really shows it's a universal experience! I'd say try not to stress. It can be hard to relax when someone else is on edge. Remember he is the parent too, so you can take a back seat and let him make some decisions. I actively make that choice at weekends - I think, right I've done the week so it's DH's turn! I let him run the show for a bit and it's really nice to just let go for a bit and potter around in the background while DH plays/disciplines/sorts lunch and so on. Sure, sometimes he makes calls I wouldn't but I expect he thinks the same of me sometimes. Also agree that days out/special trips/holidays are way too much pressure with little kids! I think if you've designated a certain time to have fun it really puts the pressure on. After Peppa Pig world and a holiday to Italy, both of which were spent dealing with one tantrum after another, we've decided all such excursions are on hold for a good 5-10 years.

Time for yourself, time as a couple, teamwork, seeing the others perspective and apologising.

Sharing the load is critical, as is making sure you get equal amounts of leisure time. I do more for the kids as they were both BF but DH does more around the house. We both maintain social lives together and separately and he will actually prompt me to make arrangements to see my friends. We make time to do things together, even just dressing up for a nice lockdown dinner date at home and banning phones for the evening. Scheduling and prioritising sex. We alternate weekend lie-ins. If one of us is at their limit with the kids the other steps in. Divide and conquer, taking one each for a while. We each get 1 week solo holiday time a year - our youngest still BFs so I take mine as multiple weekends rather than a solid week. Supporting each other's goals. Always backing the other parent up in front of the kids and thrashing it out later in private if needed.

You have lots of good things going, eg family help and DC who go to bed at 7pm!

DH and I often have sole charge of the DC while the other has time for practical stuff or ourselves, eg exercising, socialising, and do well with that, but not at all well on doing stuff together as a couple.

You describe your DC as “seriously high energy, dramatic, feisty”. Except for DC with additional needs, the DC I know who are “hard work” or described like that, IMO, behave in challenging ways partly due to their parents’ parenting choices! So you could look at that, particularly if you have parenting differences. From 5 it often gets easier.

I think what kills relationships is the negativity around who is worse off, you know, the sleep (lack of) competitiveness is the worst. Recognising that helps.

Work out who is better at what (I mean the adults) and don't necessarily split chores by time spent on them.

And don't strive for the perfect lifestyle a la Instagram, though doesn't sound like you are OP.

Unless they are sen, I'm sure that at 5 they can be trusted to stay on the grass and not run off into the road so in that example, maybe your anxiety was impacting on a nice day out. Does that happen often? If it does, that's ok, I used to have terrible anxiety which really impacted our family life. I now take medication for it, and cbt, and since seeking help life is 1000x better.

I'm so glad you posted this! I couldn't believe there weren't more posts like this on Mumsnet when I was looking for help.

Honestly, this sounds weird and like an advert but I started listening to a few audiobooks on how to manage toddlers' emotions and tantrums etc, one was all about staying calm, and then applied it to myself and my husband . I asked him to listen to it too and we both got why we needed to be a bit less reactive and calm with each other.
It just helped ramp down the underlying tension. Your example of him getting at you for being stressy and you reacting to that is so classic. I think you both just need to put a pin in the stress as much as you can, if you run at a 7 it's easy to get to 10. Try and run a bit lower. In that case he needs to not have a dig or work on other ways he can raise something like that without it being critical, and you can work on a response that's calmer and less escalating. If you really want to change the relationship dynamic it might be you setting an example for a while and it won't be 'fair' that you are being kind and letting shit go and working on being calm, but he should respond to it and reciprocate eventually.
I think having young kids is stressful and you can try and reduce that with me time and splitting the load etc but really if you can deal with stress better as a couple you'll be iron clad for most scenarios. For example, your DH can't just aggravate you and chip away at your relationship every time he's tired, that's not a sustainable marriage (not placing blame, just saying there'll be plenty of times when he's tired that you can't help).
We knew something had to change, we weren't us, we didn't know how to be happy and stop things escalating (the all day arguement including tears and talk of divorce over some curtain hooks springs to mind) and were desperately trying to make the most of our alone time and being a bit more romantic but when the stress hit that shit didn't last. I think we both knew we didn't want this to be our relationship and something had to change, and I felt crushed every time we 'slipped' and didn't model great behaviour in front of DC. We were trying to get the finances for couples counselling when I just happened to listen to the stuff about controlling your reactions to toddlers and it was what I needed to change how I was reacting to my husband. It really made a difference to us. Also when I felt our relationship was faltering I tried to spend our free time together - it was a bit suffocating and now when DC naps we both fuck off to separate rooms but have our evenings together.
We are now bracing for number 2 and I'm a bit terrified of slipping backward but genuinely feel we've laid some good groundwork for dealing with stess.

Tag teaming.

I've found DC play up if the adults in the room are talking to each other. Heaven forbid DC is not the centre of attention! They can't help it, that was lighthearted.

Giving DC lots of positive attention and focus first thing does help start the day off right. Even though you just want 10 mins with a coffee. That first hour really sets the tone for DC to connect and feel secure.

But yeah. Tag teaming in separate rooms.

I have twins too! Ours are 2. Lockdown is taking its toll but we try not to argue. When I get angry I go for a walk. I know my husband is digging deep for empathy. It's give, give , give. That's how you survive. It's work. Kids are also work lol understatement.
Keep your energy up, meaning keep positive. Focus on what you CAN do not what you CANT. Your husband is not the problem. Our ability to achieve lies within us all.