Is this sexual assault? Rape? Neither? TW

[daretodenim]

I'm wondering what this experience is.

I don't know how to talk about this event because it was so deeply upsetting, but I don't know what to call it. I'd like to

This was years ago.

My mother was visiting and in the next bedroom. Mother is abusive and had spent her holiday flirting with my then boyfriend and telling him how crap a person I was dressed up as jokes that he didn't always catch, but I did.

Boyfriend wanted anal. I'd never done it before. I didn't want to. I told him I didn't want to. I whispered things like not tonight, another time. He kept going on and on and in the end, because I didn't want an argument about anal sex, with my mother in the next room - she'd have probably told me to stop being a bitch to him - so I just let him.

It hurt, I did not like it and I didn't want it. I was aware that she was in the next room. I dissociated.

But on his side he'd have said that I'd agreed - and I didn't disagree in the end.

So what would you call this?

You are not wasting resources meant for rape victims if you seek help/support on this, and nobody would say you are being ridiculous.

In my opinion it is rape. Question over wether ex realised it or not maybe, but don't let it stop you getting help.

@TheStuffedPenguin - where did you read the OP said yes at all?

Enthusiastic consent is not ‘being silly’. Consent in my view involves a damn sight more than ‘just letting him’ after being pestered repeatedly whilst scared of waking your abusive mother in the next room. If you think that’s silly then that’s pretty worrying actually.

I don't think it's rape, but I think women being bullied and coerced into sexual acts is a serious problem in itself, it doesn't need to be grouped in with rape for it to be awful and for you to be traumatised. Bullying is considered bad, as is beating someone up once, we don't need to compare crimes to reach a level of accepted "bad thing to happen," we can accept a variety of different ways humans can treat each other badly. The same with sexual assault.

You might find the healing process is different, and that's okay. It was a horrible situation to be in and you have made positive changes in your life since. Well done you!!!

I hope you manage to find peace and a much nicer partner, best of luck.

It was rape. Its not borderline, it's not bad sex. She said no, she didn't want to do it, she wasn't an enthusiastic participant, it caused her pain. A yes given reluctantly after ten no's is not consent. It's coercion.

It was rape and i would urge you to seek help from the appropriate services if you need to.

Being pressured and not left alone until you give in to a sexual act you don't want, is not consent.

Re consent, the met police has this to say:

What separates sex, or a gesture of affection, from sexual assault? It's a matter of consent. That is, both people agreeing to what's happening by choice, and having the freedom and ability to make that choice. See Consent is Everything and Support for victims of rape and sexual assault for more advice and information.

Those who say it wasnt rape, does it sound like the op had the freedom to make that choice to give consent? In a room next door to her abusive mother, where she had a choice between alerting her mother to what was going on in her room or giving in to painful sex she didn't want? That is not freedom of choice, not is it enthusiastic consent. Which for the hard of thinking means sex that is actively wanted. Not someone saying yes to get it over and done with, to avoid an argument, to avoid a beating for example, out of fear, out of not wanting to make a fuss. A woman in those circumstances might also say yes but it doesn't mean it was actually consent.

I would class it as rape, but as others have said it doesn't really matter what it would be considered in a court of law unless you're looking to prosecute, which it doesn't seem like you are (and you undoubtedly wouldn't be able to anyway). If you're traumatised by an extremely negative sexual experience you have every right to seek trauma counselling. You don't have to tick a certain 'rape box' to access those services.

I think it's rape. You said no more than once. He kept pressuring you until you "let him". You obviously weren't actively consenting in your body language. DH always says he was taught not to just listen out for verbal agreement but look for positive signs - smiling / eye contact / clearly relaxed / reciprocating affection - the whole way through. You don't just give consent once and that's it. It's ongoing and a 'no' doesn't have to be / can't always be verbal. Unfortunately, in the eyes of the law, it would be very hard to prove and I doubt he'd be convicted of anything. But for you I think it absolutely warrants therapy or even just acknowledgement that that's what it was. He sounds dreadful and I'm glad he's an ex!

@daisydaisydoodle great victim blaming there, this didn’t happen because the OP ‘has problems standing up for herself’ it happened because the man ignored her repeatedly saying no.

Not sure if i would class it as rape. But you were definitely coerced into it, which is absolutely wrong.
Its borderline for me. I do think if its on your mind such a long time later you should seek help and you shouldnt worry about using services meant for "real" rape victims. Your situation is just as real! Use the support you can get!

I used to be a police officer, it is rape. If a person keeps on and on and the other person said "ffs fine get on with it then" etc etc not because they wanted to but to shut said person up, its still rape, its not true consent.

FFS, and they wonder why rape convictions are so low.

Rape = sticking your penis in someone when you aren't sure they want you to. That's it.

All the rape apologists on this thread should be absolutely ashamed of themselves.

Well that's actually wrong too, a woman or man for that matter doesn't need to be pinned down or forced for it to be rape.
It hinges on consent.

That is for a jury to decide, yes it's easier for them to reach a decision of guilt if force is used but it's all about consent.

I was bent over the edge of the bed. I froze and dissociated (so I wasn't "in" my body any more). I've no idea if he "pinned me down" but I couldn't move - couldn't even speak.

Jesus, stop questioning Op about the details, you freak.

The rape apologists on this thread are making me feel ill.

You don't have to be pinned down, to not consent
You don't have to fight, or make an excuse, or go sleep downstairs, for it not to be rape
You were coerced into having sex you clearly didn't want, it would have been massively obvious you didn't want it. Not least because you repeatedly said no, but because you were frozen. Consent should be freely given and at least reasonably enthusiastic, sex is a reciprocal act, you are not a variety of holes to be penetrated by anyone who likes it, you don't have to fight, run, kick or scream for it to be rape.

I'm sorry this happened to you and I'm sorry you have to read the utter shit being spouted on this thread.

Yeah the rape apologists are making me feel sick too. I don't want to read any more of it but i think it's important for the op and others who might read this to know that if you lay there and let it happen, ITS STILL RAPE if you didn't consent. If you were drunk, or naked in bed with a guy, or changed your mind halfway through, or wore a short skirt, or shared a cab home, that is not consent. Op please don't feel you need to give details of what he did to you. It's really disgusting that someone is asking you for details. I will say if you consented to have vaginal sex, or oral sex, or any other kind of sex - if you didn't consent to anal, IT IS STILL RAPE.

People say when you're threatened or in danger, you have a flight or fight response. Not strictly true. There's a third response. People also freeze. If you froze, it doesn't mean you wanted it. It doesn't mean you were ok with it. It means you were literally frozen through not knowing what to do. No doubt you were in shock and in that moment, freezing was your body's way of protecting yourself for fear of what might happen if you didn't. It's a very very common response with rape for the victim to freeze.

It's not a case of not standing up for yourself like some utter fuckwit says up thread. If someone beat you up in the street, and you didn't fight back, would that mean it wasn't assault? unfortunately even amongst women it's very common to want to paint rape or sexual assault as being in some or all ways, the victims fault. I dunno, maybe that way the rape apologists can fool themselves that it would never happen to them, because if they were in that situation, they'd never allow themselves to be raped. Theyre deluded. They're just very lucky they've never been in the presence of a man who wanted to rape them.

Sorry no more details - this is bringing a lot back. I'm homeschooling/dealing with kids while I read and post. I can't give any more details. Does it make a difference anyway though?!

Rape isn't about force. It's about consent.