DH's addict, abusive (but clean) Brother moving in....

[LoveFood]

Have name changed because this is outing to anyone who knows me in real life.

Dh's brother is an addict. After 8 years of not using, he started again a few years ago, escalating over time, and with him mostly denying it, accusing family members and others of all kinds of crazy things etc etc. Eventually, when every last person stopped helping him and giving him money he went into rehab. He's been out for about 6 months. He's working, but resents it as he doesn't like his boss and it's not the kind of highly professional job he had before (he can never do that again as he's lost his license). However it is a decently paid, office job with a fair amount of responsibility. He got it through a friend.

He's now considering moving to where we live and wants to stay with us and other family members. he claims he'll take any job that comes up eg packing shelves etc.

My issue is that not only do I not believe him, and believe he's a user who will bleed us all dry, there are two specific things I can't get past and I don't know if I'm being unsympathetic to a man who has a disease:

1. When he was using and in denial, his son was living with him. Obviously his son knew what was going on and was trying to talk to people. Brother did his best to convince (often successfully) the family that son was crazy, delusional etc. He also physically attacked/abused him - we know this because he admitted it as he was so delusional himself at the time that he justified it as being "the only way to prevent DS from doing something stupid - if I choke him until he passes out he won't get out onto the streets."

1. Since he's come out of rehab, he's never acknowledged how bad his behaviour was to anyone or made any real effort to form new relationships. He's told his son that he "needs to get over it" and acts towards Dh, his parents and siblings as if everything is fine and normal. He's faintly mocking if anyone makes any sort of allusion to it - in a sort of , " oh come on, it's all over now" kind of way. this goes for the emotional trauma he put everyone through but also the financial and practical. He's never, as far as I'm aware, apologised for the way he basically financially destroyed their parents or made any effort to make repatriations.

So my question is, how do I handle this? Should I (we?) be cutting him some slack as a man trying to sort his life out. Or am I justified in being very concerned about letting him move here, potentially living with us and/or SIL?

Brexit is because he has a European passport so if he wants to come here, he has to come imminently, before Brexit.

NO!

Also, one last thing - DH's family are all very concerned too. So it's not like anyone is welcoming him with open arms. It's just complicated by dynamics, history, their family culture etc. But maybe some f these arguments are ones I can make to others who I know worry.

The reason other people want you to take on this burden is so that they don't have to
They want to talk the talk but make you walk the walk

I would go nowhere near him. He would not be anywhere near my house.

Sorry if you explained this but how's his son doing (Your nephew)?

Just read about your nephew. Poor lad. He's been let down by his Dad as well as the family members who want to sweep it under the carpet.

Sorry if you explained this but how's his son doing (Your nephew)?

He's doing really well. He's early 20s, independent, working etc. Has some issues with anxiety etc, as you'd expect, but is building a life for himself.

For me it'd be a no, because I'd imagine a large part of rehab is looking back and accepting your behaviour and ways to put things right with those you've wronged
(Could be wrong)
To me, if he can't accept and apologise, he can't move forward.

Take him out for tea once a month, but living with me and my kids no. He sounds arrogant and entitled, without drugs he's hardly a great example of a man.

Oh, and nephew has had lots of help from us and SIL. which none of us begrudged him (obviously) and which I think has been really important in him starting to establish himself. He's a lovely lad and would go to the moon and back for us if we asked him.

Since he's come out of rehab, he's never acknowledged how bad his behaviour was to anyone or made any real effort to form new relationships

His attitude tells you everything you need to know really. An addict with no sense of personal responsibility as a houseguest.

No way.

I think that this is one of those situations where you (and DH) both have to say "no, this won't work for us" and not get drawn into lengthy discussions about it.

This man is untrustworthy and possibly dangerous. He will find another solution to his problems and that solution should not involve you, your household or your children.

I know it must be very tough for your DH, as this is his brother, but you cannot allow him to drag your family down.

Good luck.

You don’t have to give a reason for your “no” OP.

Just say it wouldn’t work.

If you feel you must give a reason, just say no space cos of the your children etc.

You can be pleasant or civil, but you don’t need to get involved in any drama beyond that.

Just a little bit of info. You asked about an NA family & friends type thing - there is Narc-Anon, but it's not that big. Most ppl I know use AlAnon because an addict is an addict. AlAnon is really helpful in terms of support & understanding of addiction, and also how to keep your own boundaries.

No is a complete sentence.

Don’t discuss, try and explain or try and reason.

‘Bil will not be staying with us and will not be spending time with our children. We don’t want to discuss this further I am sure you will understand.’

End of conversation.

He’s not just an addict. He’s a criminal - choking his son until he passed out. He could have killed him. He should be in prison. If he were in this country, I would guess that would be at least actual bodily harm if not grievous bodily harm. It’s almost certainly a crime in his home country also. His abusive tendencies are something separate from his addition and a whole separate problem. He is continuing to abuse everyone - especially his son - by minimising what he did. And the family members who are urging the son to have contact with him are also abusing the son. You have to dynamite the family dynamics and create new ones. This man is dangerous. There is no way this man can live with you. As pp have said, if Child Services found out about this, they would be all over it and rightly so. You can use that to make clear to your DH’s family that this is a hard no and that’s that as you will not risk your children’s safety and well-being for anything.

Also, support services in this country vary widely and unless someone has the money to pay for it he won't 'just' being going back to rehab. He'll be living with you. Mental health services won't touch him while he's on drugs and drug support services will tell you they can't deal with the mental health issues the drugs cause, you end up pushed pillar to post and meanwhile the addict won't do anything to help themselves. You end up having to involve the police because it's the only way to get them out of your house.

Absolutely no. And if anyone asks if he can stay with you, be it him or another family member, all you need say is No, that doesn't suit us You certainly don't have to get into a discussion about it, whereby people try to make you and Dh feel guilty for not helping and try to talk you into letting him stay 'for a few nights' blah, blah, blah. If you let him inside the door you will not get rid of him easily and it will only be a matter of time before your marriage cracks from the pressure of always waiting for him to relapse, potentially having dealers calling to the door etc. Do not engage in conversation about it at all. Just keep repeating that it doesn't suit you - nobody can argue with that!

Will he be allowed to remain in the UK if he’s a non national? I’m confused about the Brexit thing. I don’t think it’s a question of rushing in before they close the gates...

He's a dry drunk.

The substance comes and goes but the behaviour never changes. They normally relapse. Even if they don't they are arseholes. They don't do the work in rehab so they never actually change. If you work in residential treatment, there's a few in every cohort. The temptation to say, "see you soon" as they exit is always there.

Don't get involved and don't steal his rock bottom.

I'm with your nephew, I'd be going no contact with the lot of them. There is no way he'd be moving into my house but my husband doesn't do denial.

Will he be allowed to remain in the UK if he’s a non national? I’m confused about the Brexit thing. I don’t think it’s a question of rushing in before they close the gates...

Actually it literally is this. I don't know the details but there's a timeframe. If you're here a certain amount of time before December and final brexit, you can apply for settled status. So that's driving this haste. If it wasn't for that, he'd stay where he is for the forseeable future, perhaps visit, explore options etc. But there's this rather frantic sense of "If I'm moving, I have to do it now." Which thinking about it, is actually a big part of the problem I hadn't thought about. It limits options for him and for what support the rest of the family can provide that's safe.

I do believe in giving people second chances so that's probably why I'm struggling. But you're all right. Giving him a second chance is one thing. Doing ANYTHING that potentially harms my children in any way is completely another. Thanks again.

I’m pretty sure it’s not “just that”, unless he’s lived here previously? Something about a period of 5 years? You can’t just walk in anytime before December and be eligible for settled status.

@74NewStreet - as an EU citizen, he has to live here for a certain amount of time before Brexit which gives him "pre settled" status or something similar. That means he can stay for the required 5 years or whatever it is (with provisos such as not leaving country for too long etc etc). I don't know the details extensively because it doesn't impact me in any way personally. But believe me, DH's family have been researching this extensively on behalf of multiple family members. I do know that DH's status, having lived here for a long time, is different (and better) to any newer family members who are in the process of turning up.

Sorry if it's already been said I haven't read all the replies, but after what he was prepared to do to his own son in order to maintain his secret there would be no way in hell I'd make house room for him.
What if he did work his way into your home and it was one of your children that opened a door and saw something? Not a chance.

You are negotiating with his family. Stop.

The 500 conversations with DH's family had me questioning my concerns
You and DH do not have to have these conversations at all. In my own family these are long discussions where people combine moaning about my SIL and deciding how exactly DB and SIL must run their lives and what we must all do to make it happen. Of course, none of it ever comes off. You can't run another adult's life for them. Things got a lot better when two of us decided to simply shut down those conversations: "I'm sure they'll think of something. What's for tea?", "I can't even think about any of that, he has to sort it out for himself."

DH is trying to work out how to put in place the boundaries he wants to, but that is, understandably, fraught.
Accept there will be upset. Accept people will think you both harsh at first. There will be growing pains as you all learn to deal with BIL more maturely.

the family are always complaining because nephew refuses to contact his dad and they keep telling him its important to have a relationship with his dad
This is your route to resetting things. Start being very very vocal that loyalty is to the nephew who has done nothing wrong and who is a victim. Be openly angry that BIL is not remotely remorseful.

Protect SIL too. BIL should not be living with any of you. You actually need to be giving everyone the words, the backbone, the example of saying "Hell no! He is a bad man. He has to stand on his own two feet."