partner suddenly against marriage

[JaneOo]

Hi,
Im sure this has happened the world over but Im feeling really at a loss and would love to get any advice.
I have a partner of 8 years, we have a child together who is 4 and we have lived together for 8 years. We've travelled, renovated a house and about 5 years ago I left my career in teaching because we wanted to travel for a few months. Also even day going to work was stressful as he used to not like that I worked with male colleagues and made my life difficult. It was easier and also very very agreeable to me. Especially as he was earning a lot of money at the time.
We have a nice life and have our ups and downs. He has a lot of time to spend on his creative work. I have less time to myself and I dont really have many friends anymore.
We have talked about marriage before and he's said oh he'd like to do it somewhere far away in a lovey place.. which sounded lovely.
Well years later I have became very aware of my vulnerable situation regarding legal rights financially as well as other things. If he left me I would be in serious trouble having gave up my career. Everything is in his name and he owns his business. I am worried if one of us dies or becomes ill then it neither of us can make decisions for one another.

I've mentioned marriage to him because it was clear he was never going to ask. Now he said he's against marriage and always has been. He's say he loves me and is committed to me. That he will do a civil partnership but not marriage and doesn't want to do the wedding thing. I have never wanted anything big and fancy, all i would like is just a small celebration with close family and friends.. because why not? we celebrate birthdays!
He's just got this really sudden aversion to it and I can't help feeling he's made promises to his ex who he broke up with after 9 years because he wouldn't have children with her..
Anyway so I feel a bit trapped. Stuck in a situation where Ive got no power in the relationship, no security and it's making me anxious. He can be quite controlling sometimes and does try and gas light me quite often. He threatens to leave me at the sniff of an argument.
I love him and want to be with him. This makes me not sure he feels the same despite what he says. What would you do?

Just to add OP, if he's been living in your house and has been the only person paying the mortgage etc for a while he might be entitled to more than you think, even if his name isn't on the mortgage because you'll legally have formed a trust as you'll have benefited financially from him.

apparently he's always been against it and made that clear and apparently i have too.. weird..because like i say he's even brought it up in the past when we've been away. It was the same with having our child, we talked about it for years wouldn't it be lovely etc and then when it came to it he was saying the same.. I was going to have to break it off because I was at that age and I wanted a child. So he gave in

You said he has a history of gaslighting. Also it sounds like you are forcing things on him, baby, marriage. It must be exausting.

yeah, i guess when this stuff is written down it sounds awful. Ive never had an interest in money, Im not bothered about it but what I do want is recognition and respect in the relationship. And security. Like I say Ive given up my career. We've had a wonderful time on the whole but now Im becoming very aware that I've got myself into a vulnerable position. As it becomes even more apparent if we have a disagreement because he threatens to leave me. This is one tiny part of what is normally a lovely family life. My mum and family adore him.
I hadn't forced it on him. We had lots of talks about how it would be lovely to have a child together but it was always i have to wait longer and longer, for the business to improve or whatever. I did not want and couldn't physically wait any longer and so I had to make the choice genuinely whether to stay or leave. I presented that to him and he decided to take it. If he did not want kids at all then thats different.

he just said she wasn't the right person and they had not much in common

So why didn't her tell her this, so she could leave in good time and find someone else?

He stayed with her for years, yet he says they had nothing in common and in the end she had to end it. If they had nothing in common, why didn't he end it himself?

He has always been against marriage, but he told you he wanted marriage and even the kind of place he wanted to get married. He also said he wanted kids but he didn't really.

He lies, because neither you or the Ex would have stayed with him, if he said he didn't want marriage and kids from the beginning.

I'm sorry if you can't see that dishonesty and deception in him. It's also very selfish of him.

Of course he's chilled now, because you don't work with all the men and have limited interaction while you're trying to set up your own business.

You had to push and press for a family.

What he does, is get women and hope he can string them along till it's too late to have kids.

Happened to the Ex and almost happened to you. Don't you see the pattern?

He's not a great guy, but you have a child and are going have to deal with him for many years...even if you split up.

Honestly lovey I don’t see how your DP threatening to leave you everytime you have a disagreement can EVER be part of a normal family life!

If he did not want kids at all then thats different

You said you were a bit younger than him...you were getting to the age where conception might be difficult...(im guessing late 30s) so how old did he want to be when he became a dad?

I reckon if you didn't push the issue and deliver an ultimatum, next thing is he would have said he's too old.

The man has been happy to manoeuvre you into being financially & emotionally insecure. You are good enough to raise his child & no doubt do the bulk of the work required to run your home, but not good enough to marry? Mmmm. Then threatens to leave when you have the temerity to disagree with his Lordship? Yep, financial independence then wake up & smell the roses & tell him not to let the door hit him on the way out.

Financially speaking:

You have an asset (house) and a career you could return to. He earns little (at least on paper) and has no assets. Further, reading between the lines, he emotionally abuses you. I wouldn't be surprised if his whole "don't want to marry" schtick is a ruse so that when he proposes you'll be so grateful you won't think twice about financially protecting yourself or better, saying no.

You have an asset, potentially higher earnings and are the primary caregiver to your child. He is abusive and feckless. Don't marry him as you'll simply end up spending a fortune on a divorce and financial matters to extract yourself - probably paying him out on the way though.

I'm advising you to get legal advice before you do anything else whether that is selling the house or organising a civil partnership.

He is abusive. He's isolated you, convinced you that you were 'wild' and you've given up your career because he's worried about you working with men. The only reason he's 'chilled' out now is because he's got what he wanted. The controlling behaviour would soon start up again if you went back to work.

It doesn't matter if other people find him charming etc What matters is how you've been manipulated into isolating yourself and making yourself vulnerable. You are now about to move, sell your only financial equity and split it with him.

Please wake up and get legal advice.

He's abusing you. It's a crime. It doesn't matter that he doesn't hit you or that he's not the most abusive man on the face of the earth. It is still abuse.

There is no amount of abuse that is acceptable in a relationship and no child deserves to grow up in an abusive home (yes it will affect them, no you aren't hiding it) or to reach adulthood thinking abuse = love, so they end up in their own abusive relationship.

Your child has lived in an unstable, unpredictable, abusive environment for over four years. That will already have affected them negatively.

Have a look at the Freedom Programme.

So if you marry and divorce. He gets half the house and you get very little in CMS? You wont get spousal support.

If he earns little in paper, how do you afford to live? You seem aware he is fiddling something somewhere.

Hang on.

He didn’t let you work with male colleagues.
You gave up your career.
He has never acknowledged the sacrifice YOU made but thinks you should be grateful.
You had to give him an ultimatum to have a child.
He threatens to walk off at every argument (DH and I have been together for 16 years, married for 11 years- we have plenty of arguments but walking ‘off’ has never been something either has ever thrown at the other- just for context. This is NOT normal).
You are now selling your house to fund the deposit for the next one.
He doesn’t want to marry you.

This is madness. This is actually horrible. This is NOT a nice life with a few bad bits thrown in. This is actually a really unpleasant life. I am willing to bet a LOT of money you don’t argue more because you know what upsets him and you leave those topics alone. And that you walk on eggshells around him.

And how much does he do as a father? Is he an equal parent? (Mine gets the kids ready, does the school run, goes to work, puts them to bed when he is home, batch cooks on the weekend and does the laundry and I get lie ins on the weekend- and works as a full time doctor). I bet he left all the parenting and housework to you and told you to be grateful. I also bet that you don’t get weekend lie ins or any time to yourself while he gets to have creative hobbies.
When was the last time you went out with friends in the evening?

Don’t have a civil partnership. Don’t sell your house. You then won’t have a house or a career.

thanks for your replies everyone.. I am reading them all with contemplation. Im starting to feel a bit anxious about this whole thread thing now because I feel two faced. He's not fiddling anything just the setup of how a business operates. It all gets taxed but money remains in the business of which he can take as and when he wants and then have to pay tax.
I haven't talked about any of his great characteristics of which they way our number the bad ones. I made my own choice to leave work because who wouldn't .. gorgeous bloke wants to take you around the world and you can forget about all the stress and crappiness of going to work everyday! Yes late 30s and he older. And yes thats what I thought, he'd be saying he was too old next. But at the end of the day having kids is daunting and a massive decision. I can understand why people are scared. But he's a lovely caring dad and caring partner most of the time. He sees my position as something he's given me and Im working on him understanding what I do for our family which is a lot. Our child is a happy little soul and I've heard a million times from strangers how much he smiles and a happy little person. I feel I just need to assert myself and understand its a realisation and recognition of my own self that has taken place. I have called him out when he's gaslighted me and he shrinks down as if he was shocked himself and doesn't realise. Part of my self employedness is going to my own office in a shared building and he's been fine and supportive of that. I think we'll be ok. Thank you all.

@HuloBeraal

Off topic...but what do you do? If he does all this?

Mine gets the kids ready, does the school run, goes to work, puts them to bed when he is home, batch cooks on the weekend and does the laundry and I get lie ins on the weekend- and works as a full time doctor

He has crushed you and you now have little to no self worth at all, this was his intention all along. He will not let you assert yourself, why would he want to change this cost set up for you?

Controlling behaviour is abusive behaviour and if you sell your one physical asset i.e your house you and your son will be in a really worse position.

Do not just hope for the best here.

He is not a loving and or caring dad to his son either if he treats you like this

Women in poor relationships often write the good dad comment too when they can think of nothing else positive to write about their man

Abusers as well can be quite plausible to those in the outside world so I am not surprised that your mum likes him. Image is all important to abusers

I also work FT. I finish early , I pick them up, I supervise homework and music, I do all the weekly cooking, I handle all the school related stuff, I clean the house, I garden, I do DIY. And then because I finish early I work another 2 hours every single night. Happy?

If you sell your house to buy a joint one make sure you ring fence your deposit!
Don't get the civil partnership, don't marry him and start to get yourself back to work!

Let’s see. I also, iron their clothes, make packed lunches the day before, load and unload the dishwasher. I also wake up every morning at 5 am so I can be at work by 7:30ish and finish early. (And then work at night). So I roughly have a day that starts at 5 am and finishes at 10:30. And then between 4-7/7:30 I look after the children.
And when DH is on call I have to do it all including on the weekends.
Anything else I need to justify?
And when DH was a junior doctor and I was a junior academic he worked insane hours and we had small children including one who spent four months in intensive care I handled that almost single handedly because DH just couldn’t get time off.

Honestly. Even if I did ABSOLUTELY NOTHING, how is it anyone else’s business?

@HuloBeraal it doesn't sound like you care about your family very much, why don't you do more?

I should. I should. I sent shop bought for the last bake sale in school.

But I don’t want to derail the thread.

OP listed some really worrying things and has backtracked. Which is fine. But sometimes the OP refers to him as a child almost. How it was hard for him to make a decision to have a child, how he ‘shrinks’ when she tells him off. And it is as if that gives her comfort in what is a deeply deeply unequal relationship. I am sure your son is loved and smiling all the time. It doesn’t mean your husband isn’t a complete arse who sees your ‘position as something he’s given you.’ That’s just incredible- you have lost your career and he’s made you feel grateful for it.
What would have happened if you did want to work FT? And your holiday hours didn’t coincide? Would he pick up the slack? Would he do extra housework?

It all gets taxed but money remains in the business of which he can take as and when he wants and then have to pay tax.

Then his income cant be that low if he is declaring it all.

I made my own choice to leave work because who wouldn't .. gorgeous bloke wants to take you around the world and you can forget about all the stress and crappiness of going to work everyday!

Umm me. I never gave up my career, was married and had 2 kids. Travelling was done within the confines of our life. Because having no income of your own, makes you vulnerable. Especially when not married and all the family money is in his name.

OP, you have no intention of doing anything because you quite like the opportunities you have. You dont want to rock the boat. You seem grateful he had a baby with you. You should be having children because you both want them.

You shouldnt have to call someone out for gaslighting you. They shouldnt do it. Hevis shocked because you figures it out.

I hope it works out for you, though.

HuloBeraal
When you said batch cooking at the weekend, I assumed that was for the meals during the week.

Whatever works for you is good for you.

Honestly. Even if I did ABSOLUTELY NOTHING, how is it anyone else’s business?
Nobody said it was their business....but are the one who brought household chores into the thread...so what if the OPs DP does nothing and she does everything...how is that your business.

You sound incredibly defensive.

Yes that’s fine if he does nothing but he is also threatening to leave her after arguments. And makes her think SHE should be grateful. That’s why that is relevant.