How could I not see this?

[Wtfareyou]

Hi there,

I am a new poster and looking for some support or words of wisdom as my head is fried from a situation I have found myself in. I'll try to explain as well as I can

I moved to another country on a secondment for a year and am now half way through. I have a great friend who I met through the organisation we both work for, although we dont work directly with one another. He lives in the city where I have been seconded to, and he and his partner have been so hospitable and helpful with my transition here. As it is so far from home he invited me to spend Christmas with his extended family in a much more remote part of the country, a few hours by plane. The is a very beautiful place and it was very kind of him to include me. I am there now.

Now, prior to me even coming to the country my friend (let's call him James) would often mention that he thought his youngest brother (let's call him Jack) and I would be great together, even if just for some fun. We have both been single for a while, mid thirties, quite driven when it comes to our careers and not necessarily looking for a relationship but also not entirely opposed to the idea. He lives in this remote location, and I got to meet him twice a few months ago when he was visiting family in the city I'm based. We had a great night out with James, and had another evening out, after which Jack and I got together. All good, we clearly fancy each other and have a good laugh together. He goes back to his remote town and I don't think too much about it. A week or so later he starts texting me about an international sporting tournament we are both following, and there's lots of banter about this, all good. I quite like him but am wary of getting to invested. Our texts start becoming more frequent and some sexting also starts. Again all good, it's super hot, fun etc. I tell him James has invited me for Christmas and does he mind, check with James too that it's definitely okay with everyone. But yes, all good, of course, more fun.

I really look forward to hearing from him, the texts become more frequently, daily in fact. And we start to talk about more personal things, call each other cute little names. He sends me good night texts. He generally starts the conversations each day, and talks about how excited he is to see me, what he'll be cooking etc. If anything I start feeling a bit overwhelmed with the amount of communication as I'm busy and have lots to do with work and life. But figure it's better he's so enthusiastic than the other way round since I'm going to a completely new place with all his family We have a couple of tipsy phone calls not long before I'm due to arrive and loads of texts about how excited he is.

James, his partner and some other family aren't arriving until Christmas eve, but I have the time to go a few days early and spend some time seeing the beautiful surrounding area and generally chill out. Jack says that he will pick me up from airport and will take me to see and do all this great stuff. I'm staying in a hotel nearby, and so is James and his partner once they arrive, as there will be other family at Jack's from Christmas eve onwards.

I get there, very excited and kind of nervous. He meets me, we're both a little bashful but start chatting, he takes me to my hotel. We go for some food, few drinks. Enjoy the hotel facilities, chat away for hours. He seems a bit shy for all his sexy texts, but that's all fine. He's fairly blokey and a bit rough round the edges you might say but we have similar views on some things and both work with marginalised groups. We hook up, fall asleep, all good. Though I notice he doesn't like to be close in bed, all fine.

Next morning I'm awake early, he likes his sleep. Once he is waking up we're chatting a bit about the day ahead. I'm horny, after all this time I was hoping for lots of hot sex but he's clearly not up for it, not responding to any advances by me. Ok, maybe not a morning person. We have all these plans so he gets up, heads home to change etc and will pick me up asap, which he does. We're on a long drive, I'm happy enough. Spend the day doing stuff. He seems standoffish, even though he's spending all this time with me and going out to dinner etc. He starts saying I'm slamming the car door a bit hard, and to stop 'staring' at him. I'm just looking at him when I'm talking to him etc in the car. I start feeling quote homesick and a bit vulnerable somehow. Perhaps I become a little quiet, but I'm also enjoying the beautiful scenery as we drive. He starts making comments about me sulking or having no chat, and then when I try to start conversation he'll make a sarcastic comment that shuts down what I'm saying. Or when I respond to something he says or asks he'll say 'I didn't ask for an essay' or 'didn't want your life story'. It's starting to make me feel shit and I feel tearful, wondering how I should act to make things go smoothly. Sometimes I don't quite hear what he says as he speaks quickly or under his breath, or not looking at me, and then gets rolls his eyes when I ask him to repeat himself. When I say oh ok sorry or whatever he then says something like 'oh lighten up I'm just joking, jeez you're hard work' or something like that. He kind of snaps at me once or twice.

I'm feeling awful by this point but he still seems to want to spend all this time, makes plans to watch a movie at his, still no physical touching at all, not even much eye contact. We go back to my hotel for dinner, some wine. After this we are relaxing on my balcony area and I want to figure out what's going on, so I ask him if I've done something wrong, as he seems very different to his text messages and I'm feeling a bit flummoxed by the whole thing. He immediately gets aggressive, says I'm criticising him, he's been a gentleman taking me everywhere spending time with me even opening doors . When I ask about the whole lack of intimacy he says he 'doesn't do affection or feelings' that what you see is what you get with him. That he doesn't do relationships because it's always this sort of shit with women. I say it's important to communicate about whatever is going on, and I'm not criticising I'm trying to understand him and where he's at, and Im just asking for the same consideration. He completely shuts me down, says nope, not happening. I even get visibly upset trying to explain how I feel, and being homesick and vulnerable as my dad isn't well etc. About which he was so sweet and kind in messages before I came. He won't have any of it. Says he does listen what more do I want. This is all very aggressively said all whole refusing to even look at me. I'm flabbergasted. Manage to start talking about something else. To be honest I want to bolt, but am essentially trapped in this remote area with him as my only transport. I figure it's best to try and carry on as normal as I actually feel a bit afraid of him. Also my friend arrives in a couple of days and I don't want to create any drama or be labelled difficult.

We carry on the night as if nothing happened. I even sleep with him again though it feels as if it's to keep the peace or something. I hope that maybe tomorrow will be a bit better, but know it won't. Odd thing is he is still making all these plans and I'm not away from him for more than an hour, when he goes home to feed the dog and change before another day trip. Why not just leave me to it? I also feel I can't ask to have some time along as that will be seen as being precious or moody or ungrateful, and I'll be punished somehow. Which is definitely what it feels like for trying to have an open honest conversation.

Maybe I should mention I'm well educated and speak and dress fairly nicely I suppose, unlike him perhaps. I couldn't care less what someone's background is, just whether they are a good person. There have been a few words I've used he has not understood and immediately just calls me posh and takes the piss etc.

So as you can imagine the next day was worse still. Everything I said he shit down or took the piss out, all u derived the guise of joking around. And when I went quiet or said something about the weather or being tired or whatever he would say 'oh is that you whinging again'. Yet won't leave to be on my own. Honestly, it's so exhausting and upsetting. I've never experienced behaviour like this before. I could go on with the rest but right now I'm just so shocked and sad.

Because the rest of the family has arrived I'm finally now on my own in the hotel for a bit so can regroup a bit.

Please can someone help me figure or what the hell is happening? Or just some kind words of support from someone who understands this?

Are you back in the UK OP? If you have a good family, pop around to your family and enjoy the security of being with people who care for you. If you can’t tell your family, write down your feelings about what happened. Writing will help you to rationalise what happened and realise it was not your fault. Then put the letter away. Do not correspond or contact that man again. Nothing you say will make him see what he did was terribly wrong. He hasn’t got the self awareness to see let alone accept criticism.

In less than a week you will start a new decade. Leave that man in the old one.

Rest and take care of yourself. You may feel terrible but you’re not totally broken and you’ve just had an invaluable lesson in how dysfunction works and how easy it is to get sucked into it. For now, everything is about restoring your self-esteem. You will recover and be wiser for this. It didn’t go too far – just think, women MARRY these kinds of men. And stay with them, too. And procreate with them. You got out so very early. You are a very, very smart woman. whatever restores you.

onalongsabbatical Is absolutely right. You dodged a bullet.

Thank you. I sent James a message thanking him and his family, but saying I had to go. He got back in touch asking if I was really ok and whether I felt included,he knows his family are odd etc. I said no that wasn't it I was very included etc. Then I did esky and say things had been very difficult with his brother and I would explain next time I saw him, and that might explain me being subdued and disengaged. He said ok and take care and he'll see me soon.

Before James got that message I had two messages from jack asking if I was alive, from both text messaging and social media messaging app. Again I didn't respond. Then this 'Oh well yeah James passed on the message about you heading back.... would've been nice to hear it from yourself after we spent three days sleeping and being together... but hey glad James got the thanks for having you. Good luck with everything'

Why did this make me get so upset and anxious again? I maybe should have been civil and sent as basic goodbye and thank you. But I think he would have just carried on messaging me loads like before I arrived. I don't think he gets it. Can that be possible? That he didn't sense anything was wrong?

Does it matter if he got it? He's an ass and you owe him nothing. He's not your problem to fix thankfully. Block him and focus on healing yourself.

Tbh I would be tempted to reply saying that the time you spent together was actually a massive let down and tell him some of the things you told us about his attitude. Then block. Some people wouldn't bother but for me that would be closure and remove any doubt from his side too. You don't have to be rude about it just 'I felt that you were quite aggressive and difficult to communicate with during our time together. This hasn't worked out.'

No i guess not. Thank you

Just block him, you owe him nothing. If you want to give him both barrels then go ahead though then tell him to fuck off and never speak to you again.

Up to you, but please done feel guilt, you've done nothing wrong.

Can that be possible? That he didn't sense anything was wrong? No, thats not possible. He's arranging his alibi in case you go to the police and make a complaint.

I am constantly amazed by the dreadful things some women put up with..

prior to me even coming to the country my friend (let's call him James) would often mention that he thought his youngest brother (let's call him Jack) and I would be great together, even if just for some fun.

I know you don't want to hear it, but James has arranged this sort of thing for his brother before. There have been other victims. I really doubt James is innocent and doesn't know anything is wrong.

@Wtfareyou - I've been involved with a man like this. I haven't read all the other posts, so this may well have been covered before: he is abusive, and the abuse plays out in avoidant behaviour. He'll seem absolutely fine at a distance, but the closer you get - geographically, physically, emotionally - the colder he will become. He is damaged; wholly damaged. But his inability to achieve any insight into his behaviour means that he will push the blame for his feelings out on to you every time.

Those awful feelings you have now that you've felt the sting of his actions? That's countertransference. He depends on being able to push his self-loathing and pain on to others - who then walk away feeling crushed and confused. He, for just a moment, feels better. And then the self-loathing starts again and he'll find another target.

This is not about you. It is about him. But what you need - and what you appear to have found, thankfully - are impeccable boundaries. Any further involvement will simply result in more pain.

And please, please don't bother explaining anything to him.

Thanks for letting us know you are home safe. I agree with your Mum btw - survival mode engaged. Do not reply/send him any messages at all just block.

Thank you to the poster for sharing your experience. It somehow really helps to hear other examples of this happening to kind and intelligent women who were able to recognise it. I feel less ridiculous, and much less alone

He gets it. He knows exactly what he did. Part of the mo of his sort is to act like they 'just don't get what they did wrong'. Trying to get you to feel like you overreacted or are 'oversensituve'. You didn't and you aren't.

He is also trying to goad you into replying by making you feel as if you need to defend your actions. It would be wise to block him now.

I'm immature, so I'd probably text Jack to say, 'To be honest you were unpleasant, aggressive and disappointing in bed, so I didn't want to spend any more time around you'. And then I'd block him.

I’d give him both barrels as well, wait until he’s read it, and then block.

What an awful thing to happen, it's horrendous being stuck in those kinds of situations but honestly it doesn't reflect on you at all - he sounds like a total psychopath. I once had a date with a guy who seemed so charming, nice and polite when he asked me out, only for him to start our first (and only) date by saying "Are you taller than me? I don't like it when women are taller than me" and it was downhill from there, he followed up with multiple sexist comments and eventually tried to follow me home. Charming by text, but in RL a rude, egoistic, misogynistic pig. We can't always spot them Hope you manage to put this to the back of your mind and enjoy your time at home

And ^^ what Timeforachange said - do it!

Your brain will probably go into overdrive now you're safely away trying to process everything you've been through. Be gentle with yourself.

This might help you with coming to terms and processing it all in a way where you don't lose confidence in yourself:

www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B000Q9J0RO/ref=dp-kindle-redirect?_encoding=UTF8&btkr=1&tag=mumsnetforu03-21

@Wtfareyou , sorry, just saw your question from yesterday.

We had kids and he got progressively worse, couldn’t get any joy from his lovely children, drank more and more. Hit me a few times but the emotional (& financial) abuse was almost daily. He was starting to wake up a little drunk most days and our youngest (aged 5 then) said to me one day “oh mummy, you silly cow” & that was it. I couldn’t have the kids exposed to him anymore (he was constantly calling me stupid, telling me my breath smelled, telling me I was “poison”, interrupting me to attack me). So after 13 very, very long years I asked him to leave. It took a long time as he’d really ground me down.

I try to have very little to do with him and the kids see him out of duty (they are young adults), but find him very hard work.

I try really hard, but the long-term stress of it has really affected my confidence and mental health.

It’s so good your instincts were strong and you got out early.

Wtfareyou, it's all over now, please put it behind you. He was a horrible chap, James has probably never seen that side of his brother, wouldn't know what he's like with a woman.

You are worth so much more and there will be good times ahead for you.

OP I had knots in my stomach for you.. that Cretin jack dos not deserve your time or your attention, even in a text.. block this vile man, do not let him make you feel like this again.. you have experienced the real man behind the texts.. THAT is who he is... vile.. controlling manipulative.. gas lighting.. disgusting man...

Glad you are back home.. be careful of sharing with James, as clearly he shares with Jack.. close the door on Jack lady