Should I be concerned about Grandad paying for these people?

[Happinessinapeartree]

Put this in relationships in hope I get some good advice. I've called my father in law grandad as my grown up children have also highlighted concerns.

My father in law is 85 and very fit and active. He lives 200 miles from us.

He was widowed 10 years ago after 50 years of marriage. He subsequently met a lady friend and they met up regularly and were a great comfort to each other, she was also a widower. Unfortunately she died two years ago.

So here is my dilemma. When with the Lady Friend (LF) my father in law paid for everything they did. He was in a position to do so and has that old school approach that the gentleman pays. Since LF passed away her family have stayed in touch and FIL sees them regularly. However my grown up children have increasingly noticed that FIL always pays for their extended family meals and drinks when they meet up, including a gathering for 12 of their family for one of their relatives birthdays. We've also noticed this and that FIL seems to pay for quite a lot of things. The daughter of the LF even said to my daughter (age 25) that she was like his daughter now.

We're staying with FIL at Christmas and he's just said all the LFs extended family will be meeting up with us for a meal out. I just know FIL will offer to pay. Should I step in and say something? Or keep my nose out?

I'm worried they are encouraging him to buy their friendship and starting to milk this situation.

I mean I've called my father in law Grandad in the title of the thread! But then father in law as well.

If he has full capacity and can afford to pay and also wants to, there’s not much you can do. I’d keep an eye on it though.

Is he fully capable of making decisions regarding money? Full capacity?

Yes I would if this was my grandmother.

Even if he still wants to pay at least the other family will know the situations been clocked.

I’d insist at the meal that you will be paying your own way as it’s too much, not fair, he’s not made of money ect..

Is your fil quite happy to do this? Has he raised any concerns? You say he is fit and active, so I’m assuming he is capable of making his own decisions.
You could gently say to him about not feeling obligated to always pay for these people, but if he’s happy to do so then I don’t think there’s anything more you can say. Id also be wary of how you raise this with him, as it could be construed that you’re only concerned from a financial point of view rather than his wellbeing.

Yes, I think you're right to be concerned. If I was in their position I'd want to be treating him, not being paid for. I think they're seeing him as a soft touch. Can you consult Age Concern for advice? I don't like the way they are behaving at all.

I think it sounds fine. It is nice they are still all in contact.

Yes, he's perfectly bright as a button and full capacity. My DH and I have power of attorney if anything happens.

It just doesn't sit well with us. I always make sure I dash to the till to pay for meals when we go out as a family and I think my father in law quite likes that he is treated at times. He's lovely.

It's just not something I would ever allow a non relative to do for me and my extended family. Don't think many would.

I don't know. Just a bit worried.

Yes, I think you're right to be concerned. If I was in their position I'd want to be treating him, not being paid for. I think they're seeing him as a soft touch.

^I agree

What if I said at the meal something along the lines of 'so lovely that we can all get together like this and treat FIL'? Then mumble something about us all paying for him?

I'd be keeping an eye and using the opportunity of going out for the meal to see what their expectancy is re the bill.
Eg, bill comes, I'd be getting my purse out and money in my hand, saying ' so that's about ££ each to round it up'

Hopefully the reaction will tell you something?
I'd hope they'd be reaching for their money too.
I'd make a fuss, like oh grandad we want to treat you, bla bla

I’d be inclined to have a word with the LF family and the server at the restaurant’let’s make sure we keep all our food separate so we can pay our own way’
Call me cynical but I’d also be concerned there may be some softening up for a Will going on

Good idea to suggest treating him, I'd be making loud comments in advance too so no forgotten wallets.

These people are obviously part of his life. He socialises with them, and presumably they live nearby to him which is a valuable thing in friendship and family groups.

He has full capacity, and presumably wants to enjoy the money he has. Leave him to it unless you believe he's become/becomes somehow vulnerable.

The will is all secured in a trust and money tied up so they could never get near it, but they don't know that.

FIL isn't rich just comfortable but more well off than any of LFs family.

@AhoyMrBeaver that's what I'm struggling with. Is this really our business? Am I overthinking this or spotting a pattern?

My FIL would insist on paying for meals out in this way. He hasn't got many other expenses and enjoys treating people. If it is just the odd meal out he is paying for then I would just leave it. He may be embarrassed if you all try to pay for your own if he sees it as his treat.

If they can’t get near the bulk of the estate and it makes him happy, go with it, but I agree with making sure they know it’s been noticed.

Good point Apollo.

Thank you for your advice everyone, helping me to see both sides.

It is tricky and you shouldnt undermine his choices, however at the joint meal I would insist the cost was shared, even if it was to say I think we should treat FIL today, do you all agree ( pref before the meal so they are prepared)

He is YOUR elderly relative it's totally your business to look out for his interests! He lost his wife of 50 years so is automatically vulnerable. I really do whiff potential exploiters. Sorry.

My grandparents were far from rich - no money tied up in trusts! - but when they had the opportunity to pay for dinner they always would. They liked to treat others, and they would say things like ‘I can’t spend it when I’m gone/what else am
I going to spend my
Money on”. I wouldn’t assume
that these people are taking advantage. I couldn’t be bothered seeing someone who I didn’t care about just because I got the occasional free meal! At this time
Of year, when so
Many old people are alone and lonely, I imagine that your FIL considers himself
Lucky that he has lots of family and friends.

How often is he paying for meals out with the LF family? If weekly I might be concerned but if it's the odd occasion then I wouldn't be too fussed. It's nice they still include him in "family" occasions.

He’s your FIL, not your father.

If you say anything it may well be seen as trying to stake a claim to his money on behalf of your DC/DH.
Keeping a weather eye on things, making sure he isn’t getting fleeced... that’s sensible.

Worrying whom he treats to drinks and a meal out is overkill.

Just because some has full capacity doesn’t mean they are immune from being manipulated/scammed/taken advantage of!

OP I too would be concerned however do you know the context of him paying for everything? For the meal for 12 he paid for, do you know if they tried to pay but he waved them off and offered to pay himself? Or when the bill came did they just sit on their hands until he got his wallet out?

It’s nice that they are still seeing him if their intentions are noble and if he is wanting to pay then that’s up to him.

However maybe you need to speak to FIL to gauge the dynamic of the relationship. If they are always inviting him out and expecting him to pay every time, then there is a problem which needs addressing.