Empathy at menopausal age?

[Adlibadli]

I hope I don't offend here, but I have noticed something in some women of menopausal age that is bothering me.
Do you lose all sense of empathy?
My own mother completely changed when she became of menopausal age; she went from a loving, caring woman to being as cold as ice and unable to relate to others struggles. When a local girl was murdered, she said "I don't see why everyone is so upset,it's not like they even bloody knew her."
Stuff like this.
When I had my children, she had no ability to empathise with sleep depreivation or anything really, she would say "yeah,I'm tired too. "
Yet as a mother when I was younger, she was extremely loving and compassionate. My MIL is exactly the same.
When I was diagnosed with a chronic auto-immune health condition recently, she barely acknowledged it and wittered on about herself and her own ailments. Infact, she never stops talking about herself. Apparently, she hasn't always been this way. I've seen it in supermarkets when cashiers of menopausal age complain about customers, ome recently complained that customers were making her ill and spreading their germs around whilst sneezing all over my shopping.
My female boss completely changed when she reached her late forties and seemed completely unable to relate to her staff anymore having always been so supportive. Is this actually a thing? Or am I imagining it?
My own Gran picked up a gambling habit at menopausal age and my grandparents had to remortgage the house. It lasted 8 years and she hasn't had a gambling habit since. She's in her late 80s now and very empathetic.
Is there something that happens to our empathy when we reach a particular age? I'm worried I'll forget how to empathise with my daughters as I age!

I’m more inwardly focused perhaps.

In some ways I think I’m more compassionate actually.

I also do worry about young people and some of society’s ills. If my health was better I’d do more.

But I do see people’s flaws more easily, I do have less time and energy for time-wasters, but I would say it’s probably just exhaustion from having dealt with so many by this age (59)

The behaviour might be a result of lower levels of the bonding hormone oxytocin. Perhaps there is a return to the mindset of girlhood so that women don't feel they have to take care of everyone and can be a little more free in how they lead their lives? Perhaps empathy is still there but the quality of the empathy changes? Could it be more detached, less angst-ridden?

@Kit19 exactly

Do young women believe they’ll never be menopausal or older?

If my DM had talked about how she was feeling and explained to me and the rest of the family that she was going through a really tough time with not sleeping and experiencing hot flushes and brain fog, etc, then I think we'd have all tried to accommodate her much more
I doubt it. Experience is that when you try to explain, people respond by telling you to be positive, to stop feeling sorry for yourself, to stop moaning and that you're not the only one who has it bad. Experience is that trying to explain often leads to feeling even more misunderstood.

The lack of sleep is really the worse. It is really torture after months. With babies, you can fantasize about someone else getting up for them, you can convince yourself that every night might be the last they wake up. More importantly, you Dan pass out when they finally sleep. Menopausal insomnia means that even when you are so exhausted you can't function any longer, you still can't fall asleep even when you are lying peacefully on the sofa or bed.

@Dontdisturbmenow
Spot on 💐

I had absolutely no idea how awful the menopause can be. Thank you for shedding light on this. I'll certainly have more empathy for my DM from now on! Never heard of women suffering with so much lack of sleep at this age... it sounds like absolute torture. Not something to look forward to. Has any women found suitable remedies that have helped them? Just trying to turn the thread around a little to offer some support?

Hrt.

@Adlibadli HRT for me too. I had horiffic insomnia until I started on it along with itchy hands, hot flushes and horrendous mood swings. Now most of those are gone - insomnia is still an occassional problem but nothing like it was

I can’t say I have noticed this in myself or other people.

I have definitely become more cynical with age (messy divorce, nothing to do with menopause) but I think I am more compassionate and empathic now eg towards the elderly and people with illness due to witnessing how my ageing parents have suffered.

The poster who mentioned about many women having a lightbulb moment and realised they weren’t having it all— they were in fact doing it all rings true and it often coincides with menopause at a point I have to admit I felt totally crap some of the time, hot, sleepless, getting fatter, libido shot etc. I do think you develop less tolerance in many cases for trivial shit or drama llamas

Lack of sleep is one of the worse symptoms actually. It's very difficult to be cheerful and happy when you are constantly exhausted.

And many menopausal women not only still have a job, teenagers, and often grandchildren they are expected to help out with too.

Bizarrely in some ways I feel better in menopause. I think maybe my periods and PMT were worse. I used to suffer a lot with brain fog. I do take loads of supplements though which might help. I do have sleepless nights but have always had that due to chronic pain. I think I am more savvy now so less tolerant but that could just be age rather than menopause. Technically I am peri as I had a rogue period after 12 mths.

Suggest you talk to her and ask her about the menopause. There is also the psychological impact of saying goodbye to your youth and knowing society ain't that interested in middle aged women. Also we have spent years thinking about others and that can be exhausting.

OP, The menopause board typically has a lot of useful stuff on symptoms and what has worked for other people

I'm going through the menopause at the minute and I'm finding that I'm a lot more empathetic and tolerant than I ever used to me. That's probably been coming over a number of years but the onset of the menopause definitely hasn't diminished it.

I'm gonna suggest that the menopause will affect each of us differently: there's no hard evidence that you'll change into someone that you don't want to be

I had absolutely no idea how awful the menopause can be.

It certainly can be and I know that from reading about other women's experiences. But, just to give a balanced view, I have absolutely minimal symptoms, no problem sleeping, no problems at all really. It really does affect everyone differently.

There is a theory that during childbearing years we are driven to build a community support network- work for the village because the village raises your child. Then as you age out of that phase, you are more interested in getting your own needs met.

Over the last few years that I am much less Community minded. I've done voluntary work for years, taken on lots of emotional labour, been very outward looking and concerned for the wider community.
The last few years my focus has been closer to home, I'm less prepared to go out of my way for 'the common good'.

I don't think it's wrong to notice that many women find their focus changes with age/life phase. And of course some women won't experience things in the same way.

I'm happy to no longer give a monkeys about things that I made an effort with in the past!

I wouldn't exactly say I'm less empathetic but i am less nurturing i think. I really cant be bothered cooking and baking anymore and laundry is always in a backlog. i am also struggling to listen to the trials and tribulations of my young adult offspring and as for DH if he's ill...I particularly notice it at this time of year, cannot be arsed with christmas, used to love it with little ones in the house, used to make a lot of presents etc. Things do improve on the rare occasions when I have a couple of good nights sleep.
I am definitely more crabbit though unfortunately, I have to make an effort to be nice rather than it coming naturally.

I'm in peri and it's not too bad for me most of the time though I have no idea what crap may yet be in store. I really notice the hormonal fluctuations though, and my fuse is very short.

Regardless of all this, when I hit 50 I decided that 50 years of taking crap was enough and that I want to do things my way from now on. I don't think I have become a nasty person overnight, because "my way" does not mean going out of my way to be selfish or insensitive. My happy means as many as possible around me being happy. I'm just no longer prepared to put myself at the back of the queue.

I'm pretty much through it, but symptom free so can't blame sleeplessness, anxiety, flushes or anything else. I have empathy, loads of it, but have no patience for being patronised, 'snowflaked' (I was actually called a snowflake the other day for not liking Trump!!!) or generally talked down to.

So in my case it's not the symptoms of meno, it's the cutting out of the people pleasing hormones, I hope.

I'm in peri and, while I've managed to get on with things to a large extent, the insomnia is a complete bastard. I mainly just lie there feeling ultra-aware of all my limbs and thinking about how much sleep I could be getting if only I could fall asleep NOW. As for empathy, I think you've chosen the wrong word there - it's more like tolerance. I certainly feel less able to tolerate people talking shit at me and demanding my emotional engagement while offering nothing in return.

It's not menopause, its realising that you give so much of yourself and no one else really gives a shit.

I got there at 30. I was a child-carer in my youth, then let down horrifically by friends, later became ill and in response, rather than returning the care I'd given him, my already abusive husband chose more abuse and everyone around me turned a blind eye. My experience of the health system during pregnancy, birth and postpartum sealed the deal.

I realised that women are for service but recieve none in return. I resigned from service.

For the women really suffering with menopause, are you on HRT?

I'm only 35 but fear the menopause. My mum went through it very hard but never took HRT so not sure if that's who hers lasted so long.

I suffered with anxiety after having my dc and I have serious fear about feeling anxious again.

HRT has been a game changer for me - sorts the hot flushes, insomnia, brain fog and general can't be arsed-ness.

Still have that lovely liberating feeling of "don't give a shit any more" though. OP probably wouldn't like me.

When I went through it I concluded that menopause might be responsible for loads of divorces. I was brain fogged, lethargic and depressed, concentration in shreds, irritable and impatient. DH drive me up the wall, I couldn't sleep and nothing was funny. It was wast to think our relationship was over. Then I got HRT, could read a page in one go, laugh at jokes and appreciate DH along with the rest if humanity again.