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Relationships

Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

Kind husband , but troubles are huge .

108 replies

Ursula555 · 17/10/2019 22:30

Have been married 30 years . When we met I was attracted to him as he was kind , loyal and adventurous . We travelled a lot together and had good careers , then became parents . We had got used to being just us and some deepish issues arose .
For example , I didn’t realise that once I had dc I wanted to be a stay at home mum . He resented this . He wanted an ‘ equal ‘ partnering terms of work outside the home , and wanted to each work part time and did not want to be the bread winner . On my part , having been brought up by relatives not my parents , I didn’t realise until after I had our first dc that I would feel I strongly wanted to stay at home . We went to counselling and appeared to sort things . I was still at the tail end of breastfeeding dc 1 and got pregnant with dc two. Dh did not tell me at the time , but he felt upset and angry because he felt “ totally fucked “ and would still have to be the breadwinner as we would have a toddler and a baby . He became withdrawn , quiet and I sensed anger but he said things were fine when asked . He , years later told me that he was in fact depressed at this prospect and felt angry and helpless but couldn’t tell “ a pregnant woman that “ .
So on we go .. after dc2 was born I stayed at home and he got promoted .
He said , again retrospectively , that he felt very apart from me at this time . He looked at a porn mag and I must admit I was so upset . I know a lot of people would say this is fine but as a mother with two tiny dc I felt humiliated . I have ( this so difficult to say ) a history of being sexually abused by a family member which made me feel a female used as an object and the porn use left me feeling that my dh used another female for gratification on a similar continuum .
I know my feelings may not be ‘ normal ‘. I said that I couldn’t cope with it .. it was k bottom line . He said he used it was he felt away from me .- which I utterly don’t understand .
I said of course he had the choice to use it but it wasn’t ok with me , bottom line . He said he decided not to use it again . I said if he did wish to then tell me but I had to be honest that it would be the end for me if he did .
A couple of years later I find a mag ( just a normal one ,) with a pic of a bare breasted woman in - my magazine in fact . .. some tissues next to it above the loo. Open and left there .
I know it wasn’t porn but I felt lied to as it felt similar .
It has affected my trust in him
.
I feel I should in some ways have left him
But I didn’t as two small dc and no job .
It’s harmed our relationship as I feel so fragile about it and that he would risk our relationship for that - I tried and tried to rationalise it and we also had counselling .
Since then it’s like the elephant in the room in our relationship . He says he genuinely didn’t consider it as porn .
I feel so terrible because the effects of the abuse is probably affecting and distorting something that other women would not see as a problem . Yes , we and I had counselling . It feels like a wound still . He has withdrawn as he used to and seems to have lost confidence . We have tried and tried . He says he loves me and wants us to be happy yet he won’t cuddle me or anything as he feels anxious now .
We are like flat mates.
I know we are both decent people who used to have fun and share things . We both feel sad .
We don’t know wether to split up or to try , somehow to improve things . We are not going to counselling again .

OP posts:
Ohyesiam · 18/10/2019 08:16

I would say the only link to break the chain is you working further on yourself.
I understand how SA can make the victim controlling ( it certainly did with me), and yet you hate yourself for needing that control.
I had lots of therapy over the years and did lots of other things to explore myself( meditation, Buddhism) which I think probably had as much impact as the therapy.

I would probably have benefited from the current more perceptive approaches to trauma like Somatic Experiencing, which has amazing results for trauma recovery. These are avenues you can explore.

Ignore the haters up thread who are delighted to find a bit of exposed vulnerability to savage. It speaks volumes about them, and you really don’t have to take it on.

Good luck init all . The only way you can stay in stasis with this is to ignore further avenues to heal.

SouthernComforts · 18/10/2019 08:18

I'm a bit unsure of the timeline here - the porn magazine was 20 ish years ago, what has brought this issue to a head now? How have you got through the last 20 years if you are still stuck on something that happened so long ago?

Lowlandlucky · 18/10/2019 08:46

Your DHs life must be dull,grey, boring and totally loveless. If i was him i would have ran for the hills but he is obviously a very decent man. You are over reacting, you are happy enough to buy magazines that have a pictures of "bare breasted" women inside but dont think your DH should look at such photos ! Double standards not
I think you need help A.S.A.P

Scott72 · 18/10/2019 08:47

Ohyesiam the other posters aren't really savaging her, they are mostly coming to the defense of her husband. Yes, rereading her posts I see mere evidence of her husband masturbating to a picture of bare breasts caused her such distress she required hospitalization. That is serious trauma. She deserves full sympathy for that. Yet she doesn't seem to truly comprehend the pain she has caused her husband. He really didn't deserve anything more than a mild reprimand for the magazine. Not 20 years of borderline emotional abuse.

Geppili · 18/10/2019 09:05

Pm me if you are feeling terrible. X

Ursula555 · 18/10/2019 09:32

It is incorrect that we have not had sex for 20 years
We did until about three years ago
. The problem was I felt awful when I did it . Felt anxious and terrible . I tried .

As for the childcare issue we went not to make him
Accept my desire to stay at home but to talk it through and resolve it between us . That could have concluded in me going back but he seemed to resolve it and say he was happy in those sessions.
As for the mag
It was not just topless as some of you say it was exposed genitals . The second magazine which was mine was an article about relaxation , therapy of some sort , and was totally incidental
. I get that I may be punishing . Am ashamed and don’t want to be that person .

OP posts:
RantyAnty · 18/10/2019 09:32

The best thing would be to let your DH go so he can find love and happiness that you are unwilling to give him.

I imagine your DC are grown by now.
You've beat your DH with the abuse stick for 30 years and somehow he put up with it.

It's clear your issues remained unresolved. It's wrong and unfair to have punished and abused your DH all these years because of what happened to you before you even knew him.

He looked at a dirty magazine and a semi nude woman in a regular magazine. That is about as tame as you can get for porn. But you want to beat him over the head punishing him for having any sexual feelings. I can only imagine if you'd caught him watching something really hardcore online some violent fetish thing.

Let him go

harriethoyle · 18/10/2019 09:48

I'm so sorry for what you've been through but don't kid yourself that you gave him any choice about SAHP. You were totally ruthless in getting what you wanted regardless of his very clearly expressed views. I think you should let your husband move on and find more effective therapy to resolve your own issues. EMDR may be of assistance?

Scott72 · 18/10/2019 11:19

"that we have not had sex for 20 years
We did until about three years ago'

Sorry to have assumed wrong then. I know some of the criticism here might be considered a bit unfair. But issues of sex aside, your relationship doesn't seem very healthy. Your urge to control his behavior, holding onto petty resentments, his submitting to your needs.

Ursula555 · 18/10/2019 13:19

I have apologised
I have said I will work on myself
If I feel out of control I get very frightened and I think I need to both acknowledge that and work on that
.
I tried to discuss the sex issue in counselling
The councillor said , when I tried to explore my fear and control

  • “ what are you , the sex police “
Whilst this may have been to rightly challenge me , this was in the first session and I felt very judged and closed down whereas I shouldn’t have . This was specialist sexual counselling at relate . I didn’t go back . Under all this controlling behaviour I acknowledge it’s fear which I have allowed to dominate . I acknowledge I am wrong .
OP posts:
Ursula555 · 18/10/2019 13:22

Two things
The video about love someone kindly mentioned as really good .
Anything I could read or understand about sexual energy - something I really do not understand ( as it ruined my childhood )
And how it can not be disruptive , neutral or even good , I would appreciate .
All I feel when I experience it in myself or from my husband is fear , embarasment .

OP posts:
Ursula555 · 18/10/2019 13:24

I mean I can do the physical bit
But cannot own it as a good think
I could never say I want sex
I feel emotionally vulnerable
I want to try and heal and not hurt
.

OP posts:
DiscontinuedModelHusband · 18/10/2019 13:43

OP, as good as it is that you're starting to acknowledge your own part in the creation of this situation, you may need to also acknowledge that your DH may not be ready to move forwards.

after years of rejection (even if you haven't overtly rejected him, the fact that intimacy has been so repellent to you will have felt like rejection to him), and then severe judgement about him trying to meet his own needs, his self-esteem is probably in a million tiny pieces as well.

on top of this, it's extremely likely that your very strong feelings have also negatively affected how he views intimacy as well.

i wouldn't be surprised if he also needed some extensive therapy to unpick all this for his own benefit.

that is not to say you are to blame for all this - it sounds like he has been a very passive participant in this over the years, and has found it very easy to just bend towards your feelings (probably to his own benefit at times).

If it is at all possible, i would think the healthiest thing the pair of you could do is to have some time apart, to work through your own issues.

then if you both reach a place where you are comfortable with the thought of intimacy (either together, or with other people), then if you are both still committed to each other a reconciliation isn't necessarily out of the question.

Troilusworks · 18/10/2019 14:42

OP it sounds like you have some very deep wounds that need to be healed in individual therapy, not couples therapy. You need a very gentle therapist who is also experienced in dealing with sexual abuse in childhood. The main thing from your husband's point of view is for you to demonstrate that you are really serious in changing some of these issues.

I'm sure that you're right that underlying your difficulties is fear. Until you feel able to trust your husband and be vulnerable with him, it will be really difficult to resolve your sexual issues.

But what you can do right now is to be kind to your husband. Shaming him for having natural needs is as abusive as if he shamed you for your fears around sex.

Good luck OP, please contact NAPAC (National Association for People Abused in Childhood) I'm sure they'd be very kind to you and will hopefully be able to signpost you to someone appropriate.

Btw the therapist you saw behaved really inappropriately and I'm sorry that happened to you. Therapists can challenge obviously but they should do so carefully, after trust has been established and in a way that doesn't shame the clients. Not all therapists are like that. Good luck OP.

Wallywobbles · 18/10/2019 19:52

Finding a really good therapist is very complicated. And it's not a one size fits all. You need to book appointments with more than one at a guess and see how it feels. I have seen 2 excellent ones - both male psychiatrists. And 2 absolutely useless ones who both happened to be women.

I currently see a CBT therapist with my DH to help us raise our 4 kids. It's very interesting. I find the CBT a bit reductionist and probably not suitable for your issues.

Howyiz · 18/10/2019 20:24

Honestly, you sound like you are emotionally abusive to your husband. As others have pointed out it is all about you, what you want, what you decide and fuck him and what he wants. Then you have the absolute gall to chastise him because he doesn't like the abuse.
Seriously, split up and allow your husband to find someone who loves him, you say he is a good man. He deserves that.

Applesanbananas · 18/10/2019 20:30

He hasnt committed a heinous crime as you are making it out to be. It happened over 20years ago and you are still holding on to that? How awful for him. He also had to put up with you just deciding to stay at home whether he liked it or not. Your poor husband. It seems like he is the one that got the raw deal here.

Applesanbananas · 18/10/2019 20:32

He is a saint for putting up with this because everything is about you. For 2 magazines over 20 years ago you are punishing him? You are definitely emotionally abusive.

Interestedwoman · 18/10/2019 20:36

'Under all this controlling behaviour I acknowledge it’s fear which I have allowed to dominate . I acknowledge I am wrong .'

You are not 'wrong,' you've just been through some bad shit. Gentle hugs. xxxxx

P.S. That 'counsellor' who mocked/dissed your feelings in session 1 sounds awful.

Wakeupalready · 18/10/2019 20:59

I'm afraid I'm another one who , while feeling very sad that you have experienced earlier abuse, that you have clearly not dealt with, feels you are doing wrong by your husband.
Your marriage seems to have revolved entirely around you and your wishes.
You ignored him when he was clear he wanted for both of you to care for the children, and not carry the full weight of the financial burden of the home alone, and pilloried him for the odd porn magazine. When he has said , he felt distant and apart from you because you have completely ignored what he'd communicated to you re children and childcare, he spared you the full weight of his feelings, as you were pregnant, put his head down and trudged on the best way he could without upsetting you or hurting you.
He is still doing this. And that will have festered over 20 years.

Your reaction to a couple of magazines is disproportionate, and controlling and for me, suggests you need to address therapy for your earlier trauma. I'm not a fan of porn, but masturbation is not a gross betrayal, nor is using an explicit magazine to assist.
I feel greatly for you, but I do not see your husband is at fault.

Please seek therapy for your past trauma and I can't express how terrible I feel about what happened to you, but you have a good man here that you have never listened to about his needs or wants. I am not surprised you feel distant from each other, he will feel like a man walking though a minefield, never knowing where is a safe area to step.

I don't believe he needs therapy for himself or as a couple, as I don't feel he has done anything really wrong.
But I think you do, alone. And perhaps after you have managed to complete some counselling that addresses your abuse and how it has effected your behaviour and made you so , well, controlling ( which may be eminently understandable) - you might have a chance together.
I wish you the best and hope you can move forwards, if not together then as a stronger , better version of yourself.
Thanks

Mydogmylife · 18/10/2019 20:59

Oh gosh, I'm so sorry that you suffered sexual abuse, and you seem to me to truly need therapy to get over this.
Having said that I feel tremendously sorry for your husband who, if the genders were reversed, would almost certainly be being urged to leave you as being a controlling abusive partner.
It seems that you are almost 'punishing' him for what happened to you, even though you know it wasn't anything to do with him. You didn't seem to care that that you becoming a sahm with both your children wasn't what he wanted, it seemed to be presented as a fait accompli.
If you really want things to work out you must put in the work, get a good counsellor , listen to what they say, don't just shut down if they say things you don't like.
I don't mean to sound harsh, but a shift in attitude from both sides is essential if you're going to get anywhere - good luck

Scott72 · 18/10/2019 22:54

Judging by her comments, Ursula seems to find just the idea that anyone might be aroused by pornography or erotica incomprehensible and deeply disturbing. Of course almost all men are, and most women. Regardless of which man she had married, sooner or later she would have found him looking at something.

meds4care · 19/10/2019 11:21

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PaterPower · 19/10/2019 11:43

So he had 17 years of sex where you were completely not into it / going through the motions? That would have been VERY obvious to him and then lately, for the last three years no sex at all?

No wonder he’s all over the place emotionally. I genuinely don’t know how he’s managed to hang in there. It must be a deeply unsatisfying “relationship” - for you both.

Secondsight · 22/10/2019 20:26

He sounds like hard work to me. I think I would resent my DH going part time as that would mean you are still having to work do child care and have more pressure on you financially. Was he a good DP when at home doing a fair share of housework etc?

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