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Relationships

Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

Kind husband , but troubles are huge .

108 replies

Ursula555 · 17/10/2019 22:30

Have been married 30 years . When we met I was attracted to him as he was kind , loyal and adventurous . We travelled a lot together and had good careers , then became parents . We had got used to being just us and some deepish issues arose .
For example , I didn’t realise that once I had dc I wanted to be a stay at home mum . He resented this . He wanted an ‘ equal ‘ partnering terms of work outside the home , and wanted to each work part time and did not want to be the bread winner . On my part , having been brought up by relatives not my parents , I didn’t realise until after I had our first dc that I would feel I strongly wanted to stay at home . We went to counselling and appeared to sort things . I was still at the tail end of breastfeeding dc 1 and got pregnant with dc two. Dh did not tell me at the time , but he felt upset and angry because he felt “ totally fucked “ and would still have to be the breadwinner as we would have a toddler and a baby . He became withdrawn , quiet and I sensed anger but he said things were fine when asked . He , years later told me that he was in fact depressed at this prospect and felt angry and helpless but couldn’t tell “ a pregnant woman that “ .
So on we go .. after dc2 was born I stayed at home and he got promoted .
He said , again retrospectively , that he felt very apart from me at this time . He looked at a porn mag and I must admit I was so upset . I know a lot of people would say this is fine but as a mother with two tiny dc I felt humiliated . I have ( this so difficult to say ) a history of being sexually abused by a family member which made me feel a female used as an object and the porn use left me feeling that my dh used another female for gratification on a similar continuum .
I know my feelings may not be ‘ normal ‘. I said that I couldn’t cope with it .. it was k bottom line . He said he used it was he felt away from me .- which I utterly don’t understand .
I said of course he had the choice to use it but it wasn’t ok with me , bottom line . He said he decided not to use it again . I said if he did wish to then tell me but I had to be honest that it would be the end for me if he did .
A couple of years later I find a mag ( just a normal one ,) with a pic of a bare breasted woman in - my magazine in fact . .. some tissues next to it above the loo. Open and left there .
I know it wasn’t porn but I felt lied to as it felt similar .
It has affected my trust in him
.
I feel I should in some ways have left him
But I didn’t as two small dc and no job .
It’s harmed our relationship as I feel so fragile about it and that he would risk our relationship for that - I tried and tried to rationalise it and we also had counselling .
Since then it’s like the elephant in the room in our relationship . He says he genuinely didn’t consider it as porn .
I feel so terrible because the effects of the abuse is probably affecting and distorting something that other women would not see as a problem . Yes , we and I had counselling . It feels like a wound still . He has withdrawn as he used to and seems to have lost confidence . We have tried and tried . He says he loves me and wants us to be happy yet he won’t cuddle me or anything as he feels anxious now .
We are like flat mates.
I know we are both decent people who used to have fun and share things . We both feel sad .
We don’t know wether to split up or to try , somehow to improve things . We are not going to counselling again .

OP posts:
gwackywacky · 18/10/2019 05:55

Sorry, but how dare you? He told you he wanted to split childcare and work evenly between you and you completely ignored him and you wanted to stay at home. I would feel betrayed in his situation. You didnt compromise. You had your babies and left him to just take on more financial pressure instead of going out and getting a job like millions of other women.

As a result his love for you dwindled, he started feeling disconnceted from you and looked at some porn mags.

Seriously get over yourself here.

gwackywacky · 18/10/2019 05:56

You basically used your DP to have children and be able to stay at home with absolutely zero consideration for his vision of life.

Windygate · 18/10/2019 06:17

It's all about you and your wants. I'm sorry you were a victim of sexual abuse as a child.
You come over as abusive and controlling. Your H has detached because you have continually rejected him and rode roughshod over his opinions, needs and the deals you made together.

Scott72 · 18/10/2019 06:20

You are making each other miserable. You should probably separate. And if the thought of your husband very occasionally masturbating to soft core magazines causes you such profound and lasting distress, then, well, I don't know what to say.

blackcat86 · 18/10/2019 06:24

I'm really you were a victim of SA. That is horrible. However, I just dont see a way forward if you're still holding on to an incident with a porno 20 years ago and holding a sort of moral high ground because he finds porn arousing and you dislike it. Without further counselling you may be better off going separate ways as the resentment you hold will eat away at anything good. I mean 20 years, he'd honestly get a less for murder.

Sleephead1 · 18/10/2019 06:29

I'm sorry for the abuse you suffered but I think you need to be honest. Have you told your husband that you dont want to have sex with him again ( are you saying you havnt for 20 years ?) If you dont want to have sex that is of course your right but unless that is agreed with both parties in the marriage I dont think many people would be happy to never have sex again. When you are saying lie with him and cuddle him what do you want to happen? He probably will become aroused , what would you do if he did , or he initiated sex ? It seems like you want intimacy, hugs ect but not sex is that right ? I do understand your issues but if you think about it like this you dont want sex with him ,I'm assuming your not happy for him to look outside of the marriage,? you told him you would split up with him if he looked at porn/magazines.All of this Is your right but he cant have sex , he cant please himself how he wants too and it seems like hes held on to all this guilt for 20 years honestly no wonder he is sad you have made all these decisions and if he doesn't go along with it you will leave. I think you need to tell him the truth and be prepared that he may not want to spend the rest of his life like this.

FuriousVexation · 18/10/2019 06:36

So it's been 20 years and he's never been caught looking at titillating images since?

OP I mean this very kindly, as a fellow survivor of sexual abuse, but you need a much more effective therapy than you have so far received, in order to "reset" your thought processes and neural pathways and allow you to make fear-free emotional and sexual connections.

If you cannot/will not do this, then I think you have to set him free by splitting up, or at least be honest that the "marriage" is a companianate/convenient one and he's free to get his sexual needs met elsewhere (as are you, of course.)

Your other option is to make nice for the next few years and use family funds for you to re-train in something, because I'd imagine once the DC are adults, he'll be off, and you'll be left with a part time job and few choices.

Scott72 · 18/10/2019 07:02

"Have you told your husband that you dont want to have sex with him again ( are you saying you havnt for 20 years ?)"

Rereading OP's post, they have been married for 30 years, had 2 kids about 20 years ago. And I get the impression they haven't had sex since the conception of the 2nd one. Is it possible she had just permanently lost interest in sex with him well before then, and her subconscious seized on these dirty magazine incidents as a way to justify this?

I'm sure she watches his internet browsing history like a hawk, so he probably isn't some internet porn fiend. Possibly he's largely manage to suppress his libido.

boredboredboredboredbored · 18/10/2019 07:07

I'm only surprised you're still married. 20 years of resentment would be enough to finish a good relationship off yet alone the poor one you had.

gwackywacky · 18/10/2019 07:09

Holy shit I missed the not having sex part.

So you used your DP to have children and support you financially but deny him a sex life and guilt and blackmail him when he looks ar a fucking magazine. Jesus.

So hes not allowed a home life, not allowed a sex life. You use him for money and comfort. Thats literally all.

Past abuse explains things it doesn't excuse them. Stop hiding behind your abuse to justify what is, quite frankly, in my eyes also abuse.

Itallt0omuch · 18/10/2019 07:23

I'm afraid I agree with those feeling sorry for your husband. Why did you think it was ok to unilaterally decide you would be a SAHM and totally disregard his feelings about it? You forced him into the role of breadwinner when he wanted to play an active role in his children's lives. No wonder he's resentful.

Troilusworks · 18/10/2019 07:24

I agree with PPs in that I feel really sorry for your husband and I think that you should do him a favour and let him go so he can find a mutually loving, sexual and equal relationship, unless you are willing to work on yourself to change this unhealthy dynamic. I understand that your trauma has deeply affected you, but only you can work to resolve this, your husband can do nothing if you don't meet him halfway.

That means more individual therapy, contact NAPAC for more information about how to access properly trained and experienced therapists. Previous therapy may not have been suitable, even through the NHS, and therapies have moved on in the last twenty years. Also, you need to learn to trust your husband. You say you can't trust him if he doesn't share his deepest feelings and thoughts but how can he trust his deepest thoughts with someone who a) appears very judgemental when he 'transgresses' and b) doesn't trust him and makes that very clear.

I understand why you may feel the need to control relationships because of your past experiences to make yourself feel safe but this need has been terribly painful for your husband. Controlling partners affect self esteem, and can result in depression and anxiety, which your husband displays evidence of.

If you cannot work through your own feelings and change how you relate to him, the kindest thing would be to let him go. It's unkind to keep him in this straitjacket of a relationship out of guilt (his) so you can have a situation all on your terms.

dottiedodah · 18/10/2019 07:33

You say you have nice days together now ,can you build on this at all?.Maybe go away for the weekend ?(Not for sex but just to get closer which may lead to more may not). I think many couples are in a similar situation and sometimes "lose the habit "of sex.On a separate note you made a decision to be a SAHM many years ago ,this was not unreasonable IMO ,but he probably felt cornered and under pressure to provide .this has made him resentful I think, and he probably left the magazine out on purpose for you to find and see how he may be feeling .I appreciate your CA may have some bearing on females being used as sexual gratification.but there is a world of difference between hard porn sites and a top shelf magazine with naked ladies (similar can be seen topless on a beach on holiday )! I think this may have been overblown by you as a reason not to have sex ,as he was obviously reluctant to be the sole B/W .Maybe you felt resentful about that ?.I know you have tried Counselling but sometimes you need 2 or 3 goes (and sometimes a different approach ) to be able to get the most out of it .I think unless this is addressed properly it will only get worse as you get older .

Benes · 18/10/2019 07:35

I agree with everything prawn and other posters have said.
I'm very sorry you suffered SA as a child but this seems to have impacted on your views of sex ( understandably). Sex is a normal part of a relationship and masturbation is also completely normal. Your husband shouldn't be punished for that.

As for you choosing to be a SAHP. You were completely out of order. That should be a joint decision.

SunshineCake · 18/10/2019 07:39

It doesn't matter if other women wouldn't mind their husbands using or on, it matters that it bothered you and he did it anyway. I suspect it is not the only time he has put himself before you.

I suggest some specialist counselling if he genuinely feels anxious at the thought of laying next to his wife. It does sound rather odd.

ChickenyChick · 18/10/2019 07:40

I feel a bit sorry for your husband that you linked his porno use to sexual abuse, sorry but what tge heck?!

No wonder he is sad.

Wanking is normal, outside MN (!) lots of men and women do it. Good people also wank.

It sounds like you have been generally really unfair on him, yet he still sticks with you. I say if you can’t apologise and move on it would be ve kinder for you to leave him

Lex234 · 18/10/2019 07:42

OP, I am really sorry for what you experienced as a child. I think you need to seek some more therapy as it is clear from your post and the situation you have not worked through the trauma fully.

Seperately, your DH. I am sorry OP but I think you have been and are being hugely unreasonable. I understand that control over the relationship may help you feel safe, (and the behaviour you have described is controlling), but at what cost to your DP?

Surely his looking at 2 semi naked pictures of women has not triggered a 20 year withdrawal from a sexual relationship? You have entirely the right to decide you do not want to have sex. That is your choice. You do not have the right to decide your husband cannot have ANY sexual activities whatsoever, not even masturbation. He is allowed to want to have sex and it sounds to me as he has been fairly respectful of your wish not to. He has withdrawn all physical intimacy from you for fear of it being misinterpreted as a breach of your boundaries (has this happened, I wonder, when you have kissed/cuddled and he has wanted more?)

I dont think this is salvageable OP. It would be unreasonable to expect DH to bend any further and I think you need to be on your own to work through your own experiences properly.

Lweji · 18/10/2019 07:49

I have to agree with everyone else.
You had a partner who wanted to share the part of child caring and prevented him from doing so. Then were too tired and grumpy for sex? And went off because of a couple of magazines?
More than couples counselling you and him need separate counselling. Him probably to feel allowed to let you go. He doesn't need your permission, but he seems a good guy who for some reason doesn't want to let go of you or his family.
Not sure how to move on, but you should be looking into therapy that helps you getting back to having sex and general intimacy or to let go of him.

Scott72 · 18/10/2019 07:54

"Wanking is normal, outside MN (!) lots of men and women do it. Good people also wank."
What MN has an issue with is wanking to porn, but OP's husband porn use of very occasionally wanking to softcore magazines is quite different to frequent wanking to hardcore porn sites (although I'm sure some posters would disagree).

SunshineCake, "I suspect it is not the only time he has put himself before you", interesting use of words. Yes considering she apparently lost all sexual interest in him before their first child and they haven't had sex in about 20 years, I'm sure he has "put himself before her" a few times.

IdiotInDisguise · 18/10/2019 07:57

Op, you are looking at this relationship as something that can be fixed again and again. It is my view that all his sadness is because he knows he wants out but doesn’t want to hurt you.

It seems to me, from what you say in your posts, that you have made this relationship fit what you considered was good for you and your background without considering what he wanted at all. That is not only selfish but abusive as well.

Take a look at yourself and see what you (you, yourself) can change to save this relationship, he has had 20 years of adapting to your needs, wants and views. It is your turn.

Herocomplex · 18/10/2019 07:59

You’ve reached an impasse. If both of you have withdrawn from the other and feel the other partner is the cause of pain then you will not move forward without mediation.
I can’t see how it’s going to happen.

Is it just the two of you now? The fact that many of these events happened such a long time ago and are still unresolved issues is problematic.

Are you working with a therapist by yourself? Might you try that?

Mermaidsinthesand · 18/10/2019 08:00

You been very selfish OP

You wanted to stay at home, then he had built up issues yet you seemed to ignore this then you expect him to go without sex for some periods not doing anything about it.

He had a few wanks over another woman, this wasnt extreme trafficked women it was just a photo of a woman in a magazine. Then you made him go therapy to explain himself. It's your issue not his, why dont you go get help for how you feel about past abuse

Your being way to hard on a man who did nothing but put you and DC first.

crazychemist · 18/10/2019 08:02

OP - I think you need to be clear with yourself about exactly what you want to happen here.

You want things to be “better”. What does “better” look like to you? And what compromises are you prepared to make?

You don’t have to have sex if you don’t want to. But maybe your DH does, or if not sex he may want to have less pressure not to masturbate. Of course he’s sad if he feels his needs always come second at home.

Sorry that this is difficult for you. Seconding all the other posted that have said you could do with some more therapy, you obviously can’t get past your previous trauma.

Iggly · 18/10/2019 08:02

Being a victim doesn’t give you trump rights over somebody else’s legitimate needs, it really doesn’t.

It means you need to take responsibility for yourself and get counselling for yourself. But the whole SAHM is pretty underhand, I have to say.

MonsteraCheeseplant · 18/10/2019 08:09

Hi OP, what has made you post about this now? What do you want? If it’s to salvage this relationship minus the sex for the rest of your life...is that a decision based out of love? Or fear?