Do I get therapy, or do just get a fucking grip?

[AliciaWhiskers]

One for discussion, really.

I've had many, many forms of counselling over the years, and I'm not sure I'm any better for them, really.

Do I try again, and try and get past the same mistakes I keep on making, or do I just get a grip and get with life?

If you are capable of just getting a grip, i.e. self-sorting your own issues, then that's a much cheaper and easier option than going for therapy. Why not try out your grip plan and see how it goes?

What mistakes?

Can you avoid the areas where you tend to make mistakes? Sometimes you don't need to be fixed, you need to be better at picking options.

For example, no amount of therapy will make my relationship with my mother any easier. So I manage the situation. It isn't fixable.

Kinda depends what the problems are and what kinds of therapy you've tried or would seek out this time.

A more compassionate stance than telling yourself to get a grip might be a more helpful and constructive starting point, regardless.

I believe if you are self aware, able to reflect on the past & own responsibility of your behaviour/decisions then it’s totally possible to not need therapy.

Challenge your opinions of things, reframe how you think about past events. Look at things from other people’s perspectives. This is what therapy helps us do. Talking helps, so talking to yourself is actually helpful I have found!

The answer to your question is really predicated on what the mistakes are, and what therapy modality you've tried so far. There are at least 10 main types of therapy, for example. Some of them are only effective for certain types of people and/or problems. Some of them have absolutely no evidence of working, but they're still popular - perhaps those are the ones you've tried so far.

For many people, talk therapy doesn't have any effect. Something like art therapy, certain types of group therapy, community support, peer support, etc. is effective instead though.

In other cases, it's the therapist herself that is the magic part of the equation. The fact is that a subset of about 10% of therapists are wildly successful with helping clients change - the rest it seems not to have much effect.

It really depends on the person, their presenting problem, their actual problem, skill of therapist, etc. etc.

What keeps happening and what have you tried?

In short, historical issues include:

• emotional (and occasionally physical) abuse by my narcissistic mum, and a very emotionally detached dad
• eating disorders throughout my life
• history of self harming and self loathing
• history of abusive relationships, including an emotionally abusive, manipulating and liar of a husband, followed by 2 subsequent EA relationships
• finding communication very difficult - I find it almost impossible to make my needs known or raise issues with others (particularly in relationships)
• feeling scared of being hurt (emotionally) by others
• finding it very difficult to cope with uncertainty, finding decision making utter agony, and worrying excessively
• anxiety

I have had counselling with...erm...maybe 6 therapists (not including the 3 couple counsellors I saw with ExH). Most of them were "counsellors". One was a psychotherapist. Most were rather unboundaried - the psychotherapist sometimes used to ask to hug me at the end of sessions. My most recent counsellor was unable to be unbiased and often compared her own life with mine.

I guess the bits I'd like to try and get past are:

• why I keep entering into abusive relationships, and why I don't end them sooner
• why I have such a poor sense of self, low self esteem, and self loathing, and how do I get past them
• why I shut down during difficult conversations with people, and how I stop that happening
• why I find it so difficult to trust my own judgement about things and make my own decisions, and where the debilitating fear of making a mistake comes from

I just feel as though I go round in circles. Different people, different circumstances, same issues.

You need therapy, OP. I'm sorry that the counsellors and therapists you've had have been so horrendous. Not all of them are like that. Some are incredible. But I'd suggest you would definitely benefit from therapy to unpick the dynamics you refer to.

Did you go through the UKCP or BACP? Another one - perhaps better - is the SAP (Society for Analytical Psychology, whose training is rigorous and lengthy). I'd give someone from there a try.

Is it possible you really need assessing for a diagnosis op. Eg: borderline personality disorder.

Or just codependency...

I mean if there is something specific to target, you might be able to find a specific therapist to work with who uses targeted therapy for that issue/diagnosis.

@Pinkbonbon - I've been through the mental health services at times (mainly with eating disorders and self harming) and nobody has even mentioned BPD, so I don't know about that.

@AFistfulofDolores1 I think in the past I have been through BACP. Will take a look at SAP - thanks

I respectfully disagree with @Pinkbonbon: diagnoses frequently end in medication and perfunctory therapies only, whereas psychotherapy can get to the heart of all 'diagnoses', which are essentially just constellations of behaviours/feelings/thoughts that have been shaped by your upbringing, your key relationships, and your ongoing circumstances.

In our therapy training, diagnoses were discouraged. They're so tempting, because they appear to 'solve' someone, when all they do is pigeonhole them for the sake of expediency and certainty. Yes, they are useful signposts sometimes. But that's all they are: signposts. They do not in any way embody what they are pointing to.

@AFistfulofDolores1 - sadly no SAPs in the local area. Will have a look at BACP/UKCP. Do you have any idea what "type" of therapy to look for?

I had a look at the diagnosis criteria for BPD, and I can see why @Pinkbonbon mentioned it, because I can see how what I have written mirrors a lot of those signs. It doesn't seem to fit, though. And I understand what @AFistfulofDolores1 means that a diagnosis itself doesn't mean much. It probably wouldn't affect any "treatment"/therapy. And knowing the mental health services at the moment, it would take an eternity to get into the system anyway (and given I'm not a danger to myself or others, I doubt they would assess anyway).

I have had similar issues to you. The only things that have worked are Group Therapy, which I was adamant I wasn't going to do, but took a very long time; and CBT via Hypnotherapy, which I'm doing ATM and is amazing, but horribly expensive.

For me, talking therapies apart from the Group have always been raking over the past which solves nothing. You need to change your mindset and reactions instead. It sounds really daft but you start by thinking over what has gone well for you during the day/week, rather than concentrating on all the crap. I've really had to dig, especially this week, but it does focus your mind.

Have you done the Freedom Programme, OP? That would probably be very helpful, and is easy to find online. It would address your difficulties with abusive people.

What you need are some strategies to keep you safe.

I think you know the answers to a lot of the things on your list- like why you have low self esteem etc. You need to actually change it, though. That is about self care and self love- not easy with your background, but definitely doable!

My childhood background sounds a bit similar to yours and I have found Gestalt psychotherapy very useful

@RetreatingWeasels thanks for that - really helpful. I've never tried (nor been offered) group therapy - what was the purpose/context of you having that? Was it to discuss a particular issue? I have had CBT, with limited success. It was helpful to work through a few specific issues (anxiety, mainly), but I'm still left going round in circles with the other stuff. Never heard of CBT under hypnotherapy - sounds interesting!

@picklemepopcorn I have done the Freedom Programme online, but I didn't find it especially helpful. Mainly because the men I have met who have been abusive have been at a level that doesn't really get mentioned in the "types" of abuser. When I read those characteristics, I can see it's obvious that they are abusers. When its gaslighting and lying, I find it so much more difficult to see, and they don't seem to fit into those tick box categories. In my area they only do sessions in person during the day, which was no good as I work.

Yes, I have a reasonable insight into some of it. Change is the tricky bit though!

@EducatingArti thanks for that recommendation. What is the approach used with Gestalt?

It is a bit hard to explain but it is very different to CBT ( which didn't help me much either). It does talk about the past but uses the relational dynamic between the therapist and the client in the present moment as a tool for exploration and change. If you Google, I think you can find a better explanation though . For me it has been very slow gradual change but I feel immensely better for it.

Do you go weekly?

Could you have CPTSD?

There are quite a few fb groups on this you may find helpful.

Yes, I go weekly.

Sorry to hear you’ve had bad experiences with therapy, OP. Based on what you’ve outlined, I’d suggest finding a therapist who has experience of working with trauma. ‘Raking over the past’ does not always help, as you’ve found, but many therapists are trained to do just that - and it’s a great approach for many issues, not for others, particularly where there is a potential for talking about something to be re-traumatising.

Cognitive Analytical Therapy (CAT) might be helpful or schema therapy. I would go for a Clinical Psychologist if money is not an issue. HCPC is the regulating body

Start watching some Eckhart Tolle on YouTube, honestly he makes my brain work in a different way.
I've been in and out of therapy, etc etc...
Taking a bit of control and being nicer to myself and remembering to do this has helped me.