To be very concerned that this woman has children (trigger C.S.Abuse)

[Thechangednameoftheday]

Name changed for this for obvious reasons.

When I was twelve years old I made a friend, through a mutual friend, who was sixteen coming on 17 at the time.

No obvious problems at home and she came from a good family, supportive parents etc. Relatively nice life. I mention this incase anybody wonders whether she was vulnerable.

I however came from a single parent family, absent father and poor motherly parenting provisions. I was a bit of a lost soul. Damaged if you will.

The 16 year old (I'll call her J) would often go around with older guys (20-30) and would encourage me to tag along, drink and take drugs. It was commonplace for her to sleep with the men, often at her initiation. I firmly believe there was no grooming involved, she knew what she was doing and didn't receive payment or any incentive to go these things. She pursued these people for a 'good time' and enjoyed the lifestyle.

I looked up to her and began imitating her behaviour, drugs, drinking and having sex with older males. J encouraged this.

J would tell some of the men I was older (15) and tell me to do the same, but for the most part they knew how old I was.

As I got older I distanced myself from J because I felt increasingly extremely uncomfortable about the lifestyle, still just a child myself I was aware enough to know it was wrong. I developed other, healthier friendships.

I was friends with J from 12 years until almost 15 years old.

Now as an adult I reflect on this period of my life with sadness, shame and disgust. I stumbled across J on social media today by accident, she came up in our mutual friends, and I'm left with alot of conflicting emotions including anger toward her and confusion as to why she would have encouraged those things when I was just a little girl.

I couldn't fathom replicating her behaviour, when i was 16 I looked at a 12 year old as a young child and despite my own past would have reported anything of the sort to the police, not encouraged it.

My DM knew about some of this, useless as she is she didn't encourage me to report it. She is what people would call 'slow' and just didn't seem to get that you need to protect your daughter from things like this. I think she thought it was all my choice, which it was, but I was caving to peer pressure and at such a young age don't have the capacity to give righteous consent in the first place.

J now has children of her own, as do i. I feel uncomfortable about somebody with her attitude toward underage sex (which I now acknowledge as child abuse) having children.

I feel it's too late to do anything about all of this, it was years ago and I have no proof but I'm left with scars that pop up every now and then like today.

AIBU to feel this way towards her? At 16-17 can she be excused as just knowing no better? Is my anger misplaced? fwiw I am angry at the males too, but she was my friend.

I'm still here, still reading.

I want to point out that as upset as I am and how I feel toward J, I'm not looking for revenge and I don't wish her harm.

I wouldn't be able to bring myself to pursue any of the men with the police even though I know who a fair few of them are, so I certainly don't have the strength or inclination to go after J.

Like I said, it's just feelings that's all

Monkeyseesmonkeydoes
Your feelings are valid OP, talking to a counsellor to work through this would certainly help. Sounds as if this older girl was a lost soul herself, almost certainly groomed, and leading a chaotic life.
.........
I agree with what Monkeysees said.

I'm sure counselling would help you.

@EC22 seriously? I woman posts on here about being raped when she was 12, and you say that we all do things in our teens that we aren’t proud of?!

The OP didn’t “do” something. Something was done “to” her. Rape.

She wasn’t even a teen, when it started, if that makes a difference to you

Your attitude is breathtaking.

I am genuinely sorry, OP, if you are upset by what I personally posted. I can't be the only one who has had things triggered by what you have written and disagree with your appeared opinion. Strong subjects mean strong opinions, as does pain.

What a horrible horrible thread. Sorry OP, what happened to you is absolutely terrible, a 12 year old is a child, most of the times hasn't even had a period yet.

Calling the OP ignorant and ridiculous is appalling. And saying that it was her choice??

I hope you can get help OP, you need to start elaborating the abuse you went through.

@EC22. You are hideous.

This is a horrific thread. Some of you should be ashamed of yourself. The OP is also a victim.

OP I hope you are able to talk these feelings through.

What happened to you was wrong.

Whether it was legally and morally wrong of J - well, that’s why we need courts, because the details matter. Morally - maybe she was a nasty bit of work. Or maybe she was immature and wanted a friend along for the ride, was never groomed and didn’t see that 12 was too young to join in that ride. Or maybe she was groomed. The latter two explanations to me personally are morally more forgiveable - but that doesn’t mean you have to forgive her.

But whatever was going on with J, what she put you through and encouraged you into was wrong. It’s OK to be angry with her. Even if it turned out that she was abused and then groomed herself - you’re still allowed to be angry with her.

And you’re definitely allowed to be angry with the men.

I do think you're misdirecting the blame though, adult men supplying and having sex with young teenage girls and children are the ones to blame. One hundred percent them.

This. The men knew what they were doing. You said they knew what age you were. They are the ones at fault. You were both very young. She was 15/16. She saw you as her 'friend'. She expected you to be like her. You went along with it to be like her. Friends encourage each other to do things. I doubt she thought much about your age and treated you as an equal.

I am just opening your mind up to another perspective. I think you both were abused by these men. I think the men were 100% to blame.

By the time you distanced yourself from her she was an adult yet she encouraged you to have underage sex and take drink and drugs so yes SS need to be told. Was she making money from you ?

neveradullmoment J was 16 almost 17 not 15. There is a world of difference between an almost 17 year old and a 12 year old.

The way that you describe J it sounds very much like she was groomed.

I agree with MrsMaisel. This sort of self-destructive, promiscuous behaviour is typical of children who are groomed. As is "palling up" with younger children.

Just because you didn't witness or recognise any "grooming" activities doesn't mean they didn't happen. She may have been raped when she was much younger than you.

She never received a penny. I think I would have clocked on if she had, so I don't believe she received payment.

Yes she was still the same when I was 15 and she was 18, so whilst being naive and impressionable at 16 I can almost get - I don't think at 18 the same can be said.

The older I got the more vile she was to me until the point it became blatantly obvious she didn't see me as a friend at all.

I'm sorry for what you had to go through OP

Like others I agree she could have been groomed, or as you've said she may have pursued a hedonistic/rebellious/carefree lifestyle. (Most people on here just want to assume 100% it was the former.)

Thechangednameoftheday

I think you;ve been given some very bad answers and I dont think your concerns are misplaced.
J may well have been groomed; in that case she shouldn't be responsible for children unless she has taken steps to overcome the training she received.

Its never too late to make a report about what was done to you.

I agree that your anger is misplaced. She was a child herself. Also, coming from a ‘good family’ doesn’t really mean anything - she could have been emotionally, physically or sexually abused, she could have suffered from mental health problems. I think it’s unnecessary to worry that she has children - if you worried about everyone who had underage sex/had an underage friend who had sex, you would be worrying about an awful lot of people. Although you were young, she was young too. I think you should maybe look into some counseling to come to terms with this.

Well even if she was older, still sounds as if both were groomed. She probably gave little though to her friend being 12 and treated her much like she was on a par, especially years ago. It was completely different to the awareness people have now. I doubt the word grooming was even used!

Have reported EC22.
In cases that have come before the courts, including Rotherham etc, sometimes the groomed are also groomed into becoming procurers of 'fresh targets'. J has a proportion of blame, for sure.
A 'Naice' family really is NO protection against abuse, they just get away with it more often without legal repercussions, IMO and experience.

A 12 year old can not have underage sex it is rape.

whilst being naive and impressionable at 16 I can almost get - I don't think at 18 the same can be said.

Being in a self-destructive and self-loathing cycle can last many, many years - some abused children never get out of it - all through their adulthood they allow themselves to be treated badly because a) they don't know any other and b) they think that's all they are worth - abuse.

Don't judge your friend - or yourself. You were both raped and abused by vile adult men who took advantage of you.

You were fortunate in that you found it easier to break the cycle than your friend did, but that doesn't mean she's a bad person.

J may well have been groomed; in that case she shouldn't be responsible for children unless she has taken steps to overcome the training she received.

OMG. Reporting her? She was groomed ffs too. How could this be helpful to her or even to the OP?

You have moved on, as you should given the circumstances. For all you know, she is not the same person she was either, and bringing the subject up with her, could cause as much anxiety with her as it did you. Both of you were vulnerable at that age. Social media has good and bad points, I often read about the exploits of a braggart, with whom I had dealings in the past and choose to no longer read the posts, deleting them immediately. I know what you are thinking what if she is actively grooming/ perverting others, well you dont know do you?

Bad advice.
OP you should seek counselling.

I think you need to focus on you and your feelings. You were abused and J played a significant part in that. She was also being abused herself, by adults who were willing to ply a 16 year old child with drink/drugs and have sex with her, even if she was on the face of it an enthusiastic participant.

Of course she holds blame for what she did. She was 16 and old enough to know better, though possibly not emotionally mature enough. What we do not know is what had gone on in her life that had lead her to that behaviour. Bear in mind she didn't just turn 16 and flip a switch in her head - she almost certainly started the journey some time previously. Had she been a victim of sexual abuse earlier in life? We don't know. Had she been a victim of emotional abuse or neglect and was turning to partying with older men to find some validation? We don't know. Is she the same person now that she was back then? We don't know.

What we do know is that you are still suffering from your abuse. You have nothing whatsoever to feel any shame about, yet you do. You need to address that, probably with professional counselling.

I meant bad advice to @Inebriati not the poster above!! sorry!