When to tell toxic PIL they aren't welcome at the hospital

[Soon2BeMumof3]

After advice about a ‘grey rock’ way to let PIL know they aren’t going to see our newborn right away.

I’m LC and grey rock with my PIL who are verbally and emotionally abusive to myself and DH. DH wants to keep some kind of relationship with them as a means of buying time for them to realise how harmful their behaviour is and change. I am less optimistic but trying to support DH.

I am due to give birth soon. DH told PIL I am pregnant but gave a false due date.

I don’t want them in the hospital, or around me in the first few weeks. They have form for ruining special occasions by throwing big tantrums and making outlandish threats. I don’t want DH distracted and upset by their hurtful behaviour when we should be recovering and welcoming our new baby.

DH thinks we have to call them on the day of the birth to tell them. I know this will result in them demanding to see the baby immediately. They live 10 minutes away. We will then get to choose between suffering a scene in the hospital or a huge tantrum about them being shut out.

I think it would be better to tell them ahead of time that we won’t be having them to visit. This way they can get their tantrum out of the way now, rather than when the baby is born and emotions are heightened all around.

I am planning to email PIL explaining that unfortunately I wont feel comfortable having them to visit during the early days and that we will let them know when we are ready to introduce them to the new baby.

DH thinks that this email will be incredibly insulting and inflammatory to them. He wants to leave it until the baby is born and then just say the baby is early and deal with whatever they choose to do then.

I realise this would be an upsetting email for them to receive, they are very sensitive to anything they perceive as an insult or rejection (and this is actual rejection, as opposed to the imagined insults and rejections they are usually upset about). I am also struggling to choose the words that communicate this upsetting information while maintaining my bland, neutral grey rock approach which has been a sanity saver for me.

I’ve name changed for this but have received great advice from this forum before. Any advice, ideas, suggestions about suggested wording or how to manage toxic people in general would be amazing.

If you let them know in advance then they will just turn up unannounced and create a scene to try and work their way in. Tell them nothing in advance. Inform them the day after the birth, say you went in to labour/were induced out of the blue. That way they won't know and therefore won't turn up and ruin things.

An email would definitely be insulting and inflammatory, for sure. It would surely be better to tell them about the birth several days later and then deal with THAT fallout.

But what’s worse is that your PILs outbursts are so severe you have this in place:

We currently see them about every two months, only in public, with a third party such as one of DH's cousins present. If all they do is silk and scowl at us we consider the visit a success.

Why do you put up with that toxic shit? Why force your children to endure it? It’s madness and not sustainable.

Your DH needs to wise up I’m afraid.

@Nottrueatall yes, DH added 3-4 weeks to the due date so as far as they're concerned the baby will be 'early' no matter what.

It has bought us some time to work with.

Firstly, congratulations and good luck with the birth.

Next, I'm in agreement with the other posters.
1 - Don't send the email.
2 - Don't phone them on the day of the birth. Go grey rock then too. If they behave in a normal fashion, they would be treated in a normal fashion (i.e. be told on the day). They don't so you won't. It's that simple.
When you get home after a few days and if you feel up to it, you may phone them to let them know that they have a new grandchild.

There is no rule or law that says that as soon as a baby is born it must be seen by as many relatives as possible, including relatives that you may not be getting along with.

I'm guessing that the false expected date is more than a few days out from the one you hope will be your actual delivery date? If it is, then you have a few days to play around with. Have your baby, relax in the hospital and then home again and when you get home, then you can tell PIL. They will think that you've either had an early delivery and you're only home or that they are one of the first to see the new addition to the family. Use that fake date to your advantage.

I would tell them a week or so after the baby is born and I wouldn't send any emails.

No matter what you do they will cause a scene, so have the scene when you and the baby are safely home and rested.

I hope your husband continues with the counselling because he's going to need all the help he can get.

Seeing as though the baby will be "early" I'd tell them after the baby has arrived.

When to put up with them visiting...

Tbh them popping in to the hospital may be preferable as they will likely behave better in "public". You can the exclude them from visiting you at home as they will have met the baby....

Another outburst at the hospital may help DH see the light tbh!

Why should your parents in law be at the hospital anyway. Fair enough your own parents but I would tell pil they had to wait until I was feeling physically stronger. Certainly not for a few days after birth anyway.

I think you gave a dh problem too. It isn't his choice, its yours and if you don't want them there you don't want them there. Advise the medical staff they are not to be let in. Advise your partner this will be the case and if he doesn't like it, he won't be coming in either.

I would not email. Just wait until you are home after the birth to tell them. And give them a day and time to come. Also it might be worth having and end time plan... For example. Tell them to come at 2pm and have a doctor appointment /midwife check up etc at 4 😉

Then I would take the first 2 or so weeks for it to be just your immediate family (ie, dh and dc) ans then announce the birth to PIL one you've had time to get over the birth and bond as family unit.

*and then

@Haworthia

I've been feeling well this pregnancy and I would rather deal with their crap now than once the baby is here.

I had PNA with my previous child (their behaviour was a big part of this) and I am fearful of having to deal with them after the birth when I don't know what kind of headspace I'll be in. I'm considered high risk for another episode of PNA.

I suppose that's why I'm trying to move their outburst up to now, because I can deal with it now.

I agree with you, their behaviour is bloody awful. DH agrees as well. But cutting off your own parents is easier said than done.

That way it's a done deal, and although I'm sure they'll still tantrum, at least they won't have ruined the 1st few precious weeks when you're likely to be more vulnerable/tired.

To be honest, if you're a risk of PNA again that should be more than enough for your H to block any shit from his parents.

I'm high risk for PN Psychosis again, and any form of stress (prior to or after birth) will more than likely trigger an episode. It's not worth it.

He seriously needs to tell them to fuck off at the first sign of trouble. Your health is more important.

Don't say a word until after the baby is born and tell hospital staff that you don't want any visitors - from either side of the family. Get home and then decide who comes in. Be firm with your Dh in telling him that you will not accept visitors in the hospital so there's no point him texting his parents that day. So what if they're pissed off. They've created this situation so they need to accept the consequences.

I don't know whether to tell them now, months before, and give them time to wear me down, or tell them nearer the time when they've potentially booked time off and hotels etc

NC sister - is that no contact? If so why would you even consider telling her anything. Either way, say nothing and when the time comes you just don't let her into your home. You say no. So what if they've booked time off, you are not responsible for their stupidity.

OP are these the PIL who throw themselves on the floor if things don’t go their way ? Apologies if I have the wrong person .

DH is supportive of my decision not to have them in the hospital.

I've discussed it with my midwife and been told that I can have a restricted visitor list in hospital. We also haven't told anyone on DH's side which hospital we are going to. I am hoping that enough to stop them literally charging in.

It's more that they will be doing everything they can to make DH feel guilty and miserable when I want him to be emotionally present for me. They will be calling, texting, getting other family to call and text.

I've already looked up how to block them from my phone and email, so I won't hear from them. But DH would never block them. He's not there yet.

I think maybe you need to get your dh to acknowledge the amount you do, and that unless he can give you this one thing....then you are going full nc and withdrawing all support from him in regards to his somewhat self inflicted parental drama.

It's his choice to cling onto his toxic relatives, make it crystal clear that any and all fallout from them will only be allowed to affect him negatively.
He sounds like a coward, tbh.

I think you need to find a way to get through to your husband the potential risk to your mental health if his parents get to see the baby before you are ready.

I can't even imagine the frustration of having a husband who cannot accept the toxic affect their parents have on their life. It's great that he is having counselling for that but he must put your needs first.

I suppose that's why I'm trying to move their outburst up to now, because I can deal with it now.

But it's not going to be 'instead of, is it? They're going to lose their shit now AND they're going to lose it again when the baby arrives.
Why would you double the grief?

It's as though you think they only have one outburst in them. Surely you know better than that?

Do not send any email to them and do not phone them on the day of the birth. You should have no contact with them.

I would keep his parents well away from you all in any event given how abusive they are. Your DH is still well mired in fear, obligation and guilt re his abusive parents and his inertia too when it comes to them (all his appeasing of them is a further example) only hurts him as well as you. His boundaries are far too low/non existent because they have encouraged him not to have any hence all this from him about telling his parents. He is and remains far more afraid of them than he ever would be of you as his wife. He needs to continue counselling and its going to be a long and hard road for him particularly when he fully realises how abusive they have been towards him and in turn you people as his own family.

He may well want to continue to try with his parents but that does not mean that you and your children have to do so. He is not able to protect his own self properly let alone you and your kids so you're going to have to do that.

Lower the current level of contact with them to a point of zero. You would not have tolerated this from a friend, they are really no different.

Re your comment:-
"DH and I agree that PIL can no longer see DC unless I am present.
This is because PIL have had intense emotional outbursts in front of DC before".

Its a mistake you being there with your children at all. All that then happens is that their abuse of them and in turn you as their parents happens right in front of your very eyes. It would not surprise me either if they use a scapegoat/golden child dynamic on your children either or use them to get back at you in some ways.

NONE of you as a family should be seeing these people under any circumstances. If his parents are too toxic/difficult/batshit for you to deal with its the same deal for your kids too. And again look at what a lifetime of such conditioning at their hands has done to you DH. its turned him into a wreak of a man who perhaps on some level dearly would like you all to get along so that he does not have to get involved, and is mired in FOG.

I'd wait til after the baby is born. Once you're feeling better and settled at home, maybe DH could take the baby round to their house for half an hour without you or the other children?

Do you trust your DH that he could do that and bring the baby back to you within an hour?

Then they can have their tantrum or scene with just your DH to witness, he can keep it to himself, and you don't have to stress about seeing them.

Your dh needs to be told straight the birth is about your feelings not theirs.
In your shoes the 6 week pp check up sounds about the right time.
With a hv present.

She can assist in the booting out.
Them or your dh if he hasn't grown a pair by then.
You subjecting your dc to these people is a puzzle imo.

I think you need to separate the PIL issue and the DH issue.

You can agree that your DH can tell them when he likes, as long as he is firm in holding the line that you have both agreed about visiting. You don’t need to know anything about their reactions and you can block them on all communication channels.

Your DH being distracted and emotionally unavailable is the main issue. So he needs to commit to being present with you and your own family and not worrying about his parents. He needs to not tell you of their reactions, bear the burden alone if he chooses to remain in contact and be resolute in not pushing his emotions about it on to you.

Does he have any siblings to support him?

Either way, your conversations should ALL be with your DH about how he supports you, not about how you support him or manage his decisions with regard to his parents.

I can't see how telling them in advance will mean getting their tantrum out of the way. All that will happen is that they will have a major tantrum when you tell them, and another one when the baby is born.

If you don't tell them till a few days later, will they actually find out? It may be simplest to let them think that you phoned them the second you got home. I wouldn't have any conscience about lying to people like this.

Ah, you're right @saraclara

But it's not going to be 'instead of, is it? They're going to lose their shit now AND they're going to lose it again when the baby arrives.
Why would you double the grief?