How to deal with DHs drinking ?

[MeggyMeg]

I just need a different perspective on this and can't talk about it in RL.

My DH is a lovely man. We've been married for many years (almost 20), have two DCs aged 11 and 14. Not perfect, but generally happy.

But he binge drinks.

He goes out around twice a week and comes back behaving like an arse. He is loud and argumentative and I hate him being like that around the children.

He has always done this, and when he was younger it was far worse. It's one aspect of UK culture that I hate. It's in my view ridiculous for a 50 year old man to be staggering about like a 20 year old in magaluf.

The backstory is that two years ago he got far drunker than I've ever seen and ended up almost injuring my arm. The children were well aware of there being an incident but as it was done by him closing my arm in something (forcefully) I told them it was an accident, which was sort of truem. He didn't realise my arm was there , but he was having a strop and forced the door shut and then didn't release it when he should because he was so drunk. My arm was so bruised it took over a month to look ok. I considered leaving him then but he was remorseful and gave up drinking so I stayed.

Even reading that back makes me feel a fuckwit.

He started off as not drinking at all (and being very judgemental about everyone else drinking in the process which was bloody annoying), then drank moderately which was far better all round. But in the last 6 months or so, he's back to his old ways.

Last night was a good example. Myself and the youngest DC stayed up to watch a film. DH comes in clearly drunk and talking loudly. I had ordered him a take away which he starts moaning about, but in a 'jokey' way. My hackles rise at his behaviour in front of our 11 year old who is by now rolling his eyes and making drinking gestures to me about his dad.

DC was going to bed anyway, so I used that as an excuse to decamp upstairs. I am shite at hiding my feelings , so by now DH knows I'm not impressed. I take DS up to the bathroom to brush teeth and DH follows us up as he's now becoming argumentative. This is by far the biggest issue when he's drunk. I lock the bathroom door and he's then shouting through the door to DS saying mummy is the one with the drink problem . She's scared of ending up like her dad who is an alcoholic.

I remain calm as I've learnt that diffuses things far quicker. DS didn't really hear it all so we laughed it off with 'silly daddy' type comments. DS and I go to sleep in mine and DHs room and DH is in the spare room (he snores when drunk just to add to the delight).

The next bit is where I need different views:

Re: my dad. Yes hes a full blown alcoholic which I have only recently discovered. I have virtually NC for many years and the children don't know him.

I am not a big drinker at all, but never have been. I grew up with parents with drink issues and just don't like being around drunk people much. That said, I'm not tee-total. I've never consciously worried about being an alcoholic just because my parents have issues (both were heavy drinkers when I was young, but I wouldn't describe them as alcoholics at that time.) But I am cautious and moreso with age.

I want to know if you think I'm right to be so intolerant of DHs drinking ? I don't feel its anything to do with my dad as DH claims . For me, its because he badly hurt me once purely because he was so out of control and I feel let down that's he's drinking again. I could have left him for what he did two years ago , but now I feel as though I was a fool not too. When the children were younger it wasn't so bad as they would have been asleep when he got back bit that's not the case now and I hate them witnessing this. But given I've only found out about the extent of my dads problems in the two years since the arm incident, I'm just worried its colouring my view.

The bottom line for me is I don't want my children seeing their father drunk. Mostly because he's not a 'nice' drunk. It's become a viscous circle of him being drunk, me getting wound up by it and not playing along with him ( I don't say anything but my face probably says it all ), he then becomes very defensive and argumentative and I have to try and diffuse it all by the grey rock method mostly.

But this 'defence' he comes up with about my dad being an alcohol does make me question myself. Maybe I am now more uptight about drinking because of that.

Is it ever ok for parents to be drunk in front of their children on a regular basis ? Amni being uptight and if I just laughed at off it would be better ?

Sorry this is so long

I didn't mean to add the 'almost' injured my arm. He did injure it because he was drunk

I get the impression that you would have reacted in the same why whether you knew about your father or not. Objectively speaking your DH's behaviour is just plain unpleasant. I can see why you wouldn't want your children to witness this.

Film him when drunk then show him when fully sober. It's the only way to maybe make him realise what a tit he is.

What happens when you talk to him about his drinking the next day?

My DH is an alcoholic.

Your DH gets out of control drunk and picks fights a couple of times a week with you, he is an alcoholic just like your Father, alcoholism has more than one face.

My stepfather was an alcoholic it ultimately killed him, he was functioning and it was well hidden to the outside world. He would come home like this a couple of times a week. I can tell you I am totally intolerant of alcohol and would have broken up with anyone who did anything remotely like your DH, I think you have been far too tolerant.

It’s never ok for dc to be exposed to alcohol like this, it means they will think a man can get pissed and come home and be awful to his partner.

You DH isn’t lovely at all, he behaves like an arse, he has hurt you, he picks fights and also wastes a lot of money.

I see far too many LTB posts on MN but something like this is a clear cut case of game over.

He is attacking you in a way he knows will make you question yourself. But it's irrelevant. Even if your drinking is impacted by this fear that's not what is happening here. What is happening is your husband is going out twice a week and getting so wasted he is unpleasant and argumentative. He behaves badly in front of the dc. He picks fights with you that lead to you being badly hurt.

His drinking is impacting the way you behave - going to bed, trying to placate / calm him etc. You d9bt have to put up with that.

I can't tell you whether to leave him or not. But I can tell you that you have every right to find this drinking, and the resulting behaviour and the way it impacts you and dc, completely unacceptable. What you decide to do is up to you.

I couldn't stand it, op. It's way over the line. I know it would cause me anxiety and depression. It would affect my love for him and I'd find him ugly. It's regular and it's out of control. I just wouldn't want my life to look like that. What must the poor kids think? It must be costing a fortune too.

I'd be looking to separate. I would probably give him an ultimatum and would absolutely be prepared to act on it. It doesn't have to mean forever, but he does have to stop drinking. It would need to include him getting counselling too. If he wouldn't then I'd be off.

His abuse of you is unacceptable whatever fuels it.

This is a terrible relationship role model for your children. Your constant attempts to diffuse him have given you a false sense of security of protecting your children. Witnessing this behaviour normalises the unacceptable and that is very dangerous and that, ‘it’s not nice but it isn’t too bad’ mentally, has kept you in an abusive relationship for far too long.

I mean the separation doesn't have to be forever if he can prove he has changed.

My daughter showed me this about her dad - he doesn’t drink a lot but has low tolerance m.youtube.com/watch?v=XwdUXS94yNk

He's 50 and still binge drinking every week - I'd have left years ago. His default argument that " your father is an alcoholic" has absolutely nothing to do with anything - this is just his go- to comment which he knows will upset you. Don't put up with this any longer OP . You deserve far better than this.

You and your children do not need to live like this. He is choosing alcohol and injuring you and upsetting your children is not enough to make him stop.
My DF is alcoholic and I married a man with drink problems. It took me 12 years to get away from him but my life has been amazing since. There’s more to life than this

I do think he has a problem; I think twice a week is too often to be really drunk and the fact that he’s previously hurt you and is argumentative is probably causing you massive anxiety and making you feel threatened.
Past experiences like those with your dad can effect how you feel about alcohol use but I don’t think that the case for you. I had an ex who was abusive when drunk and when I first got with DH I was nervous when he drank but 6 years later he’s shown that while a bit irritating he’s never nasty while drunk and it no longer triggers that anxiety in me.
I guess what I’m saying is that if your DH got drunk but came home completely fine then maybe your past experiences would impact how you feel about it but not in this instance - it’s all your DHs behaviour.
Do you think he remembers what he’s like when drunk?
Drunk in front of children being silly is one thing, being argumentative and like your DH acts is quite different and likely to give your DC their own issues with alcohol

I think if you don't do something about this soon, the next person he accidentally (ish) injures whilst drunk could be one of the children. You gave him a second chance when he requested it last time and he's blown it. Drinking moderately does not appear to be possible for him (or he just doesn't care enough about having injured you so severely it took a month to heal). I don't see an option for a third chance as you can't trust him to mean it.

I don't think your dad has got anything to do with this. Anyone who wanted to protect their children would feel the same as you do. I think particularly now they're old enough to witness this cycle of behaviour (him angry and out of control, you appeasing) it is very damaging for them and what they are learning about adult relationships.

Perhaps a trial separation, whilst he examines his relationship to alcohol? I assume when he gave up last time he did so without any support or even admitting to anyone (including himself) he had a problem with alcohol? That's how the slippery slope works.

Honestly I think you're being far too tolerant of his drinking. His behaviour is completely unacceptable, he should have made the decision himself not to get drunk like that again when he realised that he injured you, (at the very least-actually it's sad that your kid has lost respect for him and is having to go to bed because of 'silly daddy's' drinking) but he hasn't. Those nights out mean more to him than you and his children do. I wouldn't be hiding away upstairs, going grey rock and walking on eggshells every couple of days.

Lovely people don't hurt or ridicule their partners or scare their children.
He has a lot of problems and needs to sort them out with professional help imo.
Your children are being damaged emotionally by his alcoholism. As are you
Can you talk to a close friend about this? Al anon also offer support
You're in a horrible position, I wish you luck sorting it out

This drinking is his problem. But, the fact he uses your father in an argument and to upset you is disgusting in my opinion. He is your husband. He knows you are wary around alcohol. He has past behaviour which is unacceptable. Yet he isn't owning this behaviour, instead projecting onto you in an emotionalally upsetting way.
Your children have already picked up on this. I remember what that felt like, perhaps you do too. I carry that feeling around as an adult. Please consider leaving. I think you sound reasonable and kind and desperate to fix things, but it isn't your job to fix. You all deserve the live away from the anxiety of his behaviour.

I think you know this behaviour isn't on. My dh has a similar problem and I'm building up the confidence to issue the ultimatum. Fed up of walking on egg-shells and the emotional abuse when drunk. The abuse was directed at my youngest the other day. That was my last straw. Funny, by seeing the impact on my ds I realise how much I have been impacted. Enough. I did drink but don't now, his drinking has put me off 😞

Thank you. I am taking it all on board. I'm a very practical person and can deal with it. I can't leave yet as I don't have a job at the moment and we have lots of financial issues to sort out. This will be a case of playing the long game but I have a plan.

I have one friend I could talk to but I don't think she'll get it so I'll leave it just for on here for now.

Your children will be picking up on this as I'm sure you know. You can't shield them from his drinking no matter how hard you try.

Have you spoken to him again about his drinking and explained how it makes you feel and the effect it has on the atmosphere at home?

I'm in a similar situation. He's never injured me when he's drunk but the list of scrapes he's got himself/us into is quite horrific when I list it all.

My main problem is that I've shielded my DD from it and she's also quite young so if I asked him to leave I worry about how it would affect her. I also think he'd make out I'm the bad guy by asking him to leave. I don't know what to do and I cry about it a lot. Not very helpful sorry!

I will speak to him when he's up. I spoke to him last time as I realised it was escalating back to the old days and he did exactly what he does when drunk. Denied it all and tried to turn it back by saying I've got an alcohol problem.

Logically I know what he's doing. I think your average year old could spot that attempt at reverse psychology.

But I think one effect from having grown up in a house where alcohol was an issue is I don't honestly know what's normal. For me , people being drunk was normal. To see my dad staggering about and driving us home was normal. To call my mum on a Saturday afternoon when at uni, and find my mum was drunk and unable to recall the conversation the following week was normal.

I just needed a reality check.

What do you get out of this relationship now?. Read up on codependency too with regards to alcoholism; are you codependent?

Your H's primary relationship is with drink; its not with you or your children. Unless he himself wants to properly address the reasons behind the drinking, there is nothing you can do to help him. You can only help your own self here. Attending Al-anon meetings also could help you no end as well. The 3cs are again prescient here; you did not cause it, you cannot control it and you cannot cure it.

Your own recovery from this will only properly start when you are away from him entirely. In the meantime the chaos continues because its never really stable and calm in your house. You're playing out the normal roles associated with such spouses to boot (enabler and provoker); they do not call alcoholism the "family disease" for nothing.

You can seek legal advice with a view to divorcing him, you do not have to act on this immediately but knowledge after all is power.

Not all that surprised unfortunately to read that your parents were themselves heavy drinkers, you grew up with it and regarded it as "normal". We learn about relationships first and foremost from our parents and you went onto marry someone who also has a drink problem. Your children could well go on to have issues in relationships because they could choose people with alcohol problems as you did.

It is really low of your H to cite your parents in arguments he starts with you and is classic deflecting of the issue on his part. He has managed to hurt your arm due to his own drunkenness.

Do not play the long game with someone like your H: by the time you are indeed ready to leave they could well have left home by then and sooner rather than later. Do not stay because of the children; they have seen and heard way too much already along with your reactions to same. Your own relationship with them as adults could well be affected because they could well accuse you of putting him before them. There are no guarantees either when it comes to alcoholism; he could well go onto lose everything and everyone around him and he could still choose to drink afterwards. If you do not want to continue your children seeing their dad drunk then you are going to have to put in plans to leave and sooner too rather than later. Your children are already 11 and 14 and they do not need to be seeing this and nor should you. Do NOT delay unduly or even worse wait until they are of age or off to university till you leave him.

What is your absolute red line in the sand here?. What you have written is quite disturbing actually and the effects to date on your children are incalculable.

I sound pathetic and downtrodden but I'm really not. I am generally very assertive and at 45 I don't suffer fools.

But I do see I'm vulnerable. Hes taking advantage of my background , my dads alcoholism (hes the classic alcoholic now with a liver as hard as nails to match). I don't have a job at the moment (we have a child with additional needs but the main issues are sorted out now. Long story), I don't have loads of friends (plenty of acquaintances) but I've never liked big groups and often find people hard to trust.

He on the other hand , has a large group of friends but they are fairly superficial friendships based on drinking. They are all professionals and well paid so the £ being wasted isn't a big concern to them. They've all been following the same pattern for the over 30 years now, meet in pub. Buy each other drinks in rounds so there's a feeling of having to drink at someone's else's pace. Conversations are pretty much the same. I don't get it.

meg

re your comment:-
"I will speak to him when he's up. I spoke to him last time as I realised it was escalating back to the old days and he did exactly what he does when drunk. Denied it all and tried to turn it back by saying I've got an alcohol problem"

I would not bother doing that again; talking to an alcoholic about their drinking is about as effective as peeing in the ocean. It does not work and doing the same in the hopes of achieving a different result will not be successful.

Make your own plans to leave this individual and put these in motion as soon as you are able.

Many now adults who grew up seeing drunkard parents go onto have relationships with alcoholics themselves. Look at what you learnt about relationships when you were growing up.

Something else you should bear in mind too is the facts that you cannot protect them fully from his alcoholism. You are not fully emotionally available to your kids either because some of your energies are still tied up in him and his inherent alcoholism; they see and hear all your reactions, both spoken and unspoken, to him.

Will you be willing to contact Al-anon?.