DH gets very angry. Looking for advice.

[Shouldbestrongerthanthis]

Regular but NC for this one as I think DH knows my username.

I'm in a bit of a mess, and increasingly upset re DH's anger. We've been together 15 years, married for eight of those.

He's always had angry tendencies, but they've become worse in recent years and I don't know how to cope with it. Now it's got to the point where he's regularly blazing at me in front of the children and I need some practical advice in how to tackle it.

Years ago, when he got in one of his rages, it would upset me. I'd cry and beg his forgiveness. He could hold a grudge for days, and it would be like walking on eggshells til he deigned to be kind again. Now, I'm not so soft. I tend to tell him he needs to calm down, and calmly walk away, but I feel shit inside. I'm also worried about the kids hearing their dad speak to me the way he does. He doesn't swear, much, but he calls me an "absolute idiot", a "moron", "idiotic", "stupid"...all that stuff. Says its my fault for driving him to it.

On holiday a couple of weeks ago, I slmost took the kids and drove home because it was so bad. I remembered that last year's holiday had been the same, and it made me so sad.

I love him. We have so much in common. He's a great dad. But he often treats me appallingly.

Tonight, the rage (full blown shouting, in a shop, in front of the kids, followed by 2 hrs of silent treatment) was brought on because I took us to collect an order from a shop but it wasn't ready. I'd been told it was, but he was furious with me for not double checking. When I told him not to be so angry and it wasn't such a big deal, he shouted that it was all my fault, I was turning it on him, etc etc.

Other recent examples of his full-blown rages include an occasion when we were playing sport together and I asked the time. That caused him to scream that I wasn't taking it seriously, and to end the session.

On holiday, DS (6) had an accident. He was ok, just cuts and bruises. DH screamed at me "this is all on you" - said I hadn't been watching him properly, didn't care for the kids, was a bad mum.

On another occasion recently he didn't speak to me for a full say because I was 10 minutes late home.

There are numerous examples. Every conversation is the same though. He rants, he raves, over minor things, but tells me it's all my fault for driving him to it.
I want things to get better, but I don't know how.

You're past counselling. He has told you how he feels. Never mind that it is bollocks, take him at his word. You are in a strong position. He is an inadequate loser. He says what he says because he knows that and can't face it. So petition for divorce, take your freedom , live a great life with your kids and let the bitter twisted piece of shit go his own way.

His anger is not your fault, it's his. He's the one who needs to own his mistakes, not you. Raging over using the wrong bowl?
You do need to plan a future without him. It's not easy, believe me I know, but it isn't going to improve because he doesn't think he's wrong. Where can you go from that?!

Op you do realise that his anger is very disproportionate to what's happened. If I booked my dd on an extra activity by accident my dh would laugh and me and brush it aside. Also being boring isn't an excuse to get angry. He sounds like a self obsessed knob. Life will be so much better without him

I lived like this for many years. Once our son was diagnosed I realised the exh was autistic. I was the main breadwinner and he left. Incredibly difficult to begin with but so much better now. You will get a life back. You will also realise that you lived in a fog of misery.
Just my experience but there is light once you separate.

Counselling isn’t a cure for abusive relationships. If he saw his anger as a problem and chose to seek counselling for that then things could be different. But he is choosing to behave like this and blame you.

Domestic abuse advisors actually say couples counselling is not recommended because they often twist things. Very much doubt he’s go to counselling on his own because he thinks you are the problem not him.
You are financial secure so ask him to leave. You have to be the strong one here I’m afraid.

So your off to chair a meeting?

Well chair this one! See a solicitor, change the locks, kick him tot he curb.

Everyday you are with him you are failing yourself and the children

Make a plan, execute the plan. Take charge. Be in control.

Hi OP: Your post really resonated with me, because I was you, 2 and a half years ago. Long term relationship, 2 kids, stayed out of fear , obligation and guilt way longer than I should have. My ex used to have daily rages, then nice as pie in between. Me and my boys were always on egg shells, nothing I did was EVER good enough or right. He found fault with everything. It became a miserable exsistance and I totally lost who I was and became quite unwell, both physically and mentally. We live abroad and at the time he was a stay at home dad (although I worked from home and did everything else!), and had isolated himself from everyone. Your husband sounds very similar to my ex.

It took me three years from the moment he told me to drop dead of cancer to actually pick the courage up to leave. The announcment when it finally came was dealt with with hysteria from him, and some tough times followed. I left the house as he had nowhere to go and quite frankly wouldnt have coped. He is still in the family home and we are trying to sell it (still!). I fretted a lot over him in the early months, how he would cope etc. I was way too kind to him in many ways.

Anyway, 2 1/2 years on I am in my own home (which for the first time in years actually feels like home), my boys are very happy (they still see their dad, and he still has some issues but he is 100% better with them than when I was there, the boys love him and their relationship has improved), i am in a new relationship with the most lovely person who treats me like I always dreamt I cwould be treated, and I am me again. Its been a long hard road for me, its been quite a journey but it was worth every second of peace.

He continued to try abuse me from a far (more manipulation, trying to guilt me etc) until I realised the power was in me to put a stop to it. We talk now only really about the kids and the house sale, and not much else. I loved him dearly, I wanted to be friends but it was impossible. Maybe in the future once he has moved on we can, because actually in the earlier days we were good friends with similar interests etc.

What I have learnt is:

You do not deserve to be treated like that in your own home. You are a person in your own right and you deserve to be happy.

That kids easily pick up on behaviour: do you want your kids modelling that in the future?

That my ex has serious issues with his own self esteem and that is where most of his anger came from. He felt shit, so took it out on me, felt more shit and the cycle continued. I was a verbal punch bag.

That splitting up is NOT a failure. I modelled behaviour from my own mum who stayed with my dad (much as I love them both) Waaaaaay too long. She only left him recently after 44 years of marraige and she is nearly 70. Very sad.

That break ups are very hard, the emotional shit that will come with it will be a real challenge. Focus on yourself and make sure you look after yourself physically and mentally: book a counsellor, go for walks, run, eat healthily. 2 years after the split I had what I can only really describe as a bit of a nervous breakdown. I was on autopilot for years, managin everything, but now I am much much better. So look out for yourself.

You might not think it but you will be alright (if not 100% better) without him in your daily life. It took me a long time to get rid of his shit from my head. Emotionally abuse is horrible. And if you let it continue it will only get worse.

Its hard, its emotionally draining, it took me 3 years to pick up the courage to say enough was enough. But it was the best decision I could have made for me and my boys. The kids have adapted really well, I am incredibly proid of them. And my ex is finally a bit better and getting on with his life. He was a mess after I left (still is on occasions), but he is getting there. We were I now realise co-dependent, I am a people pleasure and he probably has BPD (undiagnosed).

Ypu might also be suprised by peoples reactions, I feared what people would say, no one was suprised. Good luck OP> I suggest you start writing a list of pros and cons, start getting your financial shit in order, and start making plans. Then start the rest of your life.

I was also the sole earner and that is where things deteriorated, he really didn't want to be at home all the time but also is a lazy fuck and didnt want to work either. If he had been at home and happy in that role we wouldnt have had issues. His self worth dropped and he took it out on me. Started drinking more etc. That is where the problems really started for us but he wouldnt change and resented me.

I still did all the "wife work" and although he did most of the housework, the rest fell to me. I had no time, he even used to shout at me about going to the gym for 1 hours three times a week. The gym actually became my saviour as it gave me time to think free from his negative energy. I feel for him still because he is miserable, but I know it was and never was my fault.

Counselling for you alone without him yes

For him alone if he wants

Do not go together he will sabotage it for his ends

Counselling with an abusive man like him is a waste of time. He won't change or see the light during relationship counselling.

He's said he's not happy, now's your cue to end it. Tell him to leave.

He is using you as an emotional punching bag to work out any negative feelings he has. It gives him a zing of adrenaline when he kicks off and he feels super powerful for a bit. Then he waits a bit until he needs his next hit.
His behavior is totally unacceptable and in public, too, which humiliates you and the kids but makes him feel even more powerful.
You are funding him, and he is basically a parasite.
Please get help in real life as well as on here. Get a lawyer, get counseling, and for your kids sake, get rid of the parasite.
In my experience, this behavior never goes away, it might abate for a while so that it can be a sucker punch when you let your guard down.
What do your kids do during these interactions? They hear everything he says to you and they internalize it and experience the aggression as if it were to them. Your DS will have blamed himself for having an accident to cause the scene about that.
Your “D”H DESERVES to not have a place to go or any money.
He hasn’t earned his keep, and he has abused his family, breaking the law in that regard.
You have to find a way to push forward for the kids and put some distance between him and their mother and home, which are their sources of safety and security.

Sorry I didn't mean that to sound quite so much like I'm telling you what to do!

I did relationship counselling with my DP, and I really wanted to address his anger issues. The counsellor kept talking about us finding compromise but neither the counsellor or my DP had anything useful to day when I said, when it came to the DC and his angry outbursts, there was no compromise to be had, they needed to stop.

This wasn't explored.

Relationship counselling in my experience is about compromise on both sides - where one side being abusive there's nothing it can offer, It's the wrong format.

That made very sad. I don't usually say LTB but you'd be happier if you did. I couldn't stay with someone who had such a low opinion of me.

I'm wondering if the first step should be counselling

Absolutely not together.

Your first step is taking legal advice and ending this abusive relationship, please. Your children are under the same amount of stress and walking on eggshells as you; and that's a terrible childhood.

You have the power to change that. And only you.

Fabulous that you are the sole earner. Please do not tell him of your plans to leave (or boot him out) while you get everything lined up.

But you cannot continue to live like this.

You will never be good enough. He will never change. And you (and your children) deserve so much better. Please take your first step today and realise that this relationship is unhealthy, abusive and done.

You can do this.

He sounds a terrible father and husband. Why on earth isn’t he working? He doesn’t sound like he brings anything positive to the family. OP, please do consider your next moves. He is abusing you, and the children are suffering too, even if it is not obvious. They are being damaged by this situation.

He’s a controlling freak. I’m sorry you’re going through this OP.

@GreenFingersWouldBeHandy spot on about the counselling, normal rules definitely do not apply in a relationship like this; 'playing fair' will only be used against the OP. I just wanted to add that if OP is seriously considering calling time then this is considered a dangerous time in this kind of relationship relationship, even one where there's never been any physical violence. I'm not saying this is something that's likely to happen, but just that its something to bear in mind in your planning; there's lots of literature out there on this, so please do make sure you're informed.

safespaceworkplace.com/leaving-abusive-relationship-dangerous-time/

OP if you can manage to get some counselling on your own with someone who specialises in coercive control I think it would be fantastically useful in equipping with some strategies (perhaps when he thinks you're at work? Perhaps with someone who works via FaceTime sessions?) Good luck, we're all rooting for you

Just echoing other people, counciling doesn't stop abusers being abusive. Think about it this way, can you imagine any possible circumstance where you would say to anyone all the horrible things he has said to you? (Let alone someone you care about). Of course not! Because it just isn't normal human behaviour.

Those vile cruel insults are the product of a nasty, odious creature that doesn't respect you, let alone care about you. There are no excuses for it and he can't be fixed because it is quite simply, who he is. You can't teach someone empathy or to respect you. Its there or it isn't.

He's a vile bully op. Get yourself and the kids out of there. I promise after a while apart what's left of the fog will lift and you'll wish you'd got away sooner.

You cannot go into counselling with an abuser. This is a known known.

At some point you will need counselling yourself in order to come to terms with what has happened to you. Do please look into the freedom programme here freedomprogramme.co.uk

Do please go and see a solicitor and make sure that he has no access to your money. There is no saving this marriage. I think you know that. You need to save yourself and your children.

Do you think his anger could spill over into violence? This is a very serious consideration and you have to keep yourself and the children safe.

This made me sad to read because in parts it was like I'd written it myself. I can totally understand the feeling of not knowing what to do - even though for others, they would think it's simple. Sitting here reading this though, you do not deserve this treatment, you do not deserve to feel on eggshells and to live in fear of another outburst. Do you fear he would ever hurt you if it got out of hand?

Again, I understand that it is not black and white and that I am sure your partner is not all bad, which is why you are finding yourself in such a hard position. Life is too short and you should be fully happy. Now I wish I could take on my own advice.

Are you in a position where leaving him is possible?

If you are the sole earner then that is GREAT NEWS.

If someone was treating your child this way, (calling them boring, shouting, raging and embarassing them) how would you feel?

YOU are someone's child.

Ok, firstly I don’t profess to have any kind of counselling experience whatsoever.

I’m purely going off the myriad of stuff I’ve read through when I had an abusive relationship.

Firstly - he has disproportionate anger. His anger is more excessive than the given scenario requires. Honestly, this is something he needs to realise for himself and get counselling for. You can’t fix that.

He seems to like gaslighting you. Turning everything around to be your fault and not taking any accountability for his own actions. His continual blame pushing is pathetic and manipulative.

The silent treatment he gives you is in itself ABUSE. There’s a difference between needing some time to cool down and Purposely ignoring someone. If you’re mad you tell the other person you need time to cool off and you’ll pick up once you’ve calmed down, therefore re-assuring them that you’re not breaking the lines of communication and leaving them hanging.
By purposely cutting you off and ignoring you, that’s what he sees as a punishment. He’s ‘punishing’ you for what he sees as your perceived mistake.

He calls you names. This is Verbal Abuse.

Bottom line is he is an abusive twat with a major anger management problem. And this is not a good father figure as he’s teaching your children the wrong way to behave. And believe me they will pick up on it. My abusive partner had a dad who knocked his mother about and treated her like shit and he then behaved the same way towards me. The apple doesn’t fall far from the tree, especially if the tree has been growing long enough to plant big seeds.

He’s very crudely told you he basically doesn’t respect you nor care a great deal for you and his actions have shown this.
I would honestly consider getting away from this man. His children can still see him without you having to be in a relationship with him.

For your own sanity and your children’s sake I really think you should re-consider this relationship. At the very least get some support and further advice on any next steps you can take.

No amount of counselling will fix this situation OP...He is an abuser and utterly vile.
I can bet his behaviour towards the outside world is more civil and good humoured.
All his hatred is aimed at you.
Get to the GP for some low dose short term diazepam to help you cope then make plans to get rid of him.
Where he ends up is none of your concern. You are not responsible for this abusive vile man.
I have been where you are now and things got a damn sight worse once he found out I was planning on leaving.
I hope you don't own the house together because this obviously makes it financially complicated.
Do you have anyone who can help you with temporary accommodation?
Please ensure he does not have access to all the money or you could find the account empty.
You a re strong OP...if you can put up with his crap you can put up with anything.
I got out with just the clothes I had on my back and mattresses on the floor for me and DCs.
Within 6months I had completely turned my life around and never looked back. You can do it OP one small step at a time. Plan. Plan. Plan!

I am so sorry for all you have gone through. You have suffered too much for too long. I know that you know deep down in your heart that he is an abuser and is NEVER going to change. Don't keep fooling yourself and hoping for that. He is an abusive Narcissist.

Please look online and read everything you possibly can on Narcissistic personality disorder. These Narcissists were born with this defect and unable to change it. So hope for change and couple counselling is futile. A Narcissist will NEVER admit they are in the wrong. Reasoning with them is pointless. They have zero empathy and only care about themselves. They can flip from being the apparent Mr nice guy in a heartbeat over the tiniest perceived slight (as you know) and you will forever spend your life in this cycle. You will be blamed for absolutely everything and nothing is ever his fault in his eyes.

He cannot see the damage he does to you or your children. Staying with your abuser will only continue to break down your soul. Believe it or not this is worse for your children than it is for you. The damage can be lifelong emotionally and psychologically. Get out as soon as you can. You are lucky to be in a position of financial upper hand. So many are stuck because they are too dependent on them.

Protect yourself and your children, be careful and have a plan in place about leaving or making him leave the family home. Make sure you have the children out of reach being taken care of by someone you trust. Report the domestic abuse. And get a male family member or friend to be with you, ecall the police as soon as he kicks off at you when you tell him it is over. Contact women's aid or similar for practical advice. Do not give him warning that you are leaving him. He may turn even nastier than ever during the split.

You and your children no longer need to walk on eggshells. Your home can truly become a loving safe home again for all of you. Have you noticed he doesn't treat any other person in his life this way? They seem to contain their anger and nastiness just for you. That is not love. In fact the more you read about this personality disorder, you will see they are not capable of it.

The reason I know so well, is because I have been in a very long term relationship with my own Narc. As I read your story, it could literally have been written by me. I have read more advice online about recovering from being with one. So many women are living with the exact same abuse, word for word it could be the same guy. That's how specific their issues are.

Keep reaching out for support throughout your break up, and try to get yourself and children counselling. I have a feeling you are an empath, as I am. We often stay far longer than most because we love and feel sorry for them, and see the good sides in them too, and use that to try and justify things. Wanting to stay for the children's sake, and continuously try to and fix them, we try to do better and make changes on ourselves just to appease him. It never works. You could change everything he says that bothers and angers him, yet he would still never be happy as the same issues run deep inside him. It is not you.

I promise your children will be happier and safer away from this relationship, he may do better with them in the future not living with you all and having minimal contact. However you are also in the right if you decide not to let him have access. You can do this, dig deep and believe in yourself. Don't give in to many more years, it will be a waste Andy too much more irreversible damage will be done to you and your beautiful kids. Be strong for them if not for yourself. Soon you will be able to breathe again. You deserve so much better. Sending love and strength, Good luck.