We had a HUGE row last night.

[Flossam]

OK in two minds whether to post this or not but here goes...
Me and DP had a huge row last night when he got in from work. He is an obsessional Virgo (!) and likes to come home to a spotless house. The house wasn't particularly messy, at least in my book, just a card to post to my mum on the table and something he had asked me to get him. There were a few things on the sofa next to me, and the kitchen spray was still on the kitchen side rather than the windowsill. Anyway he comes home and starts going off on one about the state of the house, how I have had some days off and why haven't I done the cleaning? Started doing his usual 'What is this doing here? Why is that there? Does this need to be here?' all shouted at me.

To cut a long story short I rose to it and ended up going nuts at him, tried to go away to the bedroom to calm down, where he came in and started at me again, cue more shouting etc. It it the worst row we have had for a long time.

He has gone out today and now I won't see him at all for the weekend as I am working and he has friends down. I think this was partly why he wanted the house to be sorted, but these are his friends, his arrangements why should I tidy up every time? He never does any cleaning, any of the washing (then complains he never has anything to wear), or cooking and I have to do pretty much all of the maintenance type things around the house because he just wouldn't ever bother to do it. I don't want to be the little woman at home who is responsible for all the household chores, at least when I am working full time as well as him.

My plan was that we could sort out the house together today. I've been off work sick and have hardly been feeling up to doing much. I'm six and a half months pregnant and I have to say this whole pregnancy malarky has knocked me for six. I'm always knackered and still trying to work full time doing 12 and a half hour shifts (nights as well) in a very physical and mentally demanding job. I also worry about the baby, rows and stress can't be good for him in there, after all that last night he stopped moving for quite a while, I told DP (as I was worried) and he told me I had probably scared him to death with all my shouting . He hasn't bothered to find out if things are ok with him today (which they are)

I have a fair idea that this argument is to do with all the stress we are starting to feel (well I know I am anyway) about trying to move house next month and the iminent arrival of our baby. When life gets a bit tougher we always seem to take it out on the other which is a shame really. What I would really like to know is would you apologise? I know I acted unreasonably but this behaviour on his part is not acceptable to me and by apologising I am letting it pass IYSWIM? It is always normally me who apologises, just because he is incredibly stubborn and I don't like to live my life this way. But I can't help feeling that it is a shame that this is the only day off we could of had together all week and he's taken himself away somewhere rather than try to resolve things.

Oh well, I feel a bit better having had a good moan. Sorry!

omg he sounds like a nightmare, how on earth do you put up with that?!!! I don't blame you AT ALL for flying off the handle. You are working full time AND 6 months pg AND expected to do everything around the house? Makes my blood boil on your behalf flossam, it really does

I think he is being a pig Flossam and I think you are being really reasonable trying to see things from his point of view. Which I can't. Let me get this straight, you are pregnant, you are unwell and you work outside the home too. He is not pregnant, not unwell and does none of the domestic chores
Would I apologise to him? Yes, course I would. When hell freezes over.

Flossam, why do you do all the house cleaning and maintenance if you both work full time?

Actually, I think I would continue the row. If my DH had done anything remotely like that, I think I would have told him he was a lazy, thoughtless git and either get his act together or to get the f**k out and stay out

God, I'm cross

oh dear flossam. if he wants things put away, he should do it himself and not expect you to do every little thing. i dont blame you at all for having a go at him, as I would have done the same thing. he sounds like a big kid (sorry!) you shouldnt have to apologise as he has to understand he has to pull his finger out, and help you out especially since you're a full time working pregnant woman tidying up after him. you're not his mum, Im sure he can look after himself. sorry if I seem a bit harsh, but my exp was like that and it really drove me up the wall. the only thing i can suggest is trying to talk to him and explaining how you're feeling, and how you would appreciate his help especially at times when you're ill, but not just then, at all times. if he doesnt listen, then i wouldnt bother doing his washing or cooking etc. but thats just me! sorry if i havent been any help

Flossam, agree with the other posters. He sounds downright lazy and inconsiderate, to put it mildly. If he likes to come home to a spotless house, he can arrange that himself. I don't think you should apologise, but can see how tempting it would be for you to try and clear the air. What concerns me about this set up is that if you are six months PG and working full time and he expects you to keep the house pristine, what sort of expectations will he have when you are at home with a baby in the house. If you feel obliged to keep the house pristine you will become absolutely utterly exhausted. I think you need to get him to realise now that 1)looking after a newborn is a full time job in itself 2)you shouldn't be expected to do much by way of chores/cooking for several weeks after birth and 3)children are messy!

From your account, you have absolutely nothing to apologise for at all! In the first place, you had done nothing 'wrong', and i thesecond, even if the house had been a tip (which it wasn't - not by a long chalk), it would be your joint responsibility, not yours. In what way were you unreasonable? I can't spot it.

Is Dp 'speaking' today or is he blithely carrying on as if nothing has happened? It sounds as if it is the [pattern that you take the initiative after a row, so he is probably waiting - or like many men, just moves on to the next thing without a backward look.

I think i would start the conversation, but not as an apology - maybe 'it was horrible to have such a row last night, can we talk about it?'.

Flossom, I would understand if you were at home full time, but you are not! I'm a sahm and as a result I do everything around the house. When I used to work we shared the housework. I am appalled that he expects you to do it all. What a lazy git! Don't apologize, because it will come up again as you have obviously been unhappy about it for a long time and he needs to see that it is affecting you. So what if he is stubborn! That doesn't give him a ticket to do everything the way he likes! If you apologize it will make him think that he is right when he so obviously isn't. Stick to your guns.

Message withdrawn

If he likes his home perfect, he's going to get a big suprise when the baby comes.You should start getting him trained up ready,TELL him he has to start pulling his weight, because you'll be too busy looking after the baby.

Hi Sam, you poor thing . Firstly, I think you're doing far more than your fair share around the house as it is, especially with such a demanding job. And you're pg as well. As you know, I'm finding this pg thing pretty hard work as well and I know I wouldn't be coping at all without a lot of help and extra tolerance from dh. I don't know if this would work for your dp, but how about trying to sit him down with you sometime, and trying to explain just how difficult being pg is and that you need his help around the house right now (before I was pg with ds I had no idea how awful it was going to be, and if you've never been pg how can you know?). Maybe show him some of the threads on here. I think you also need to make it clear that once this baby arrives you'll still need extra help. If I were you I'd be inclined to go on strike and stop doing, for e.g., his washing and ironing, if he doesn't buck his ideas up a bit.

Grrrrr on your behalf!

Flossam you should not be treated this way - and he has no right to demand and shout. Best that you not shout either as you need to rest. Tell you are not interested in his aggression and to be realistic that you are not a wind up doll that can be controlled and you work very long shifts which must be exhausting. then basically ignore bad attitude like that until he wises up to treating you better. If he will not apologise give him a list, actually just give him a list wiht the jobs he has to do or say to him you expect him to clean just like he expects of you. my dh does housework by his own fruition - give your a little reminder in the right direction towards equality!

he reminds me of that Julia Roberts film and she was married to this guy who was obsessed with cleaning.

Flossam, god if he thinks it's bad now wait until the little one comes along. Oh dear poor you If my ds came home to a tidy house I think he'd think he was in the wrong house.

I learnt early on to not do the Ironing! Now he thinks he's better at it than me so he carries on! We do sometimes tackle the housework together. What upsets me is that he will have 4/5 days off in a row and won't do any actual cleaning IYSWIM.He just likes things to be tidy, where as I would prefer things to be clean.

As for things with the baby I do think he is going to be in for such a huge shock. I know he is going to expect all the housework to be done, I have already said to him that this worries me as I don't know that I will be able to. I don't think he as any idea of what having a newborn entails, I think he thinks we will be having a six month old baby straight away!

His expectations of how much I will be able to work also worry me. We were trying to work out our finances yesterday which aren't great as he has got himself into a lot of debt. I already plan to go back to work at 2/3rds time, which is more than I would really like. He then started budgeting me for an extra £200 a month in extra shifts so we can try and pay off our (mostly his by a big majority) debts quicker. I know that by having this baby we have to try and sort out our finance together, but not at the expence of time with our family. Again, this is a one sided account of everything so I don't want everyone to think I have a complete ar*ehole of a DP, I don't really. I'm very good a focusing on the negatives but really wanted to have a good moan about everything!

I disagree with everyone who says you need his help around the house. You don't need his help, you need him to clean up his own bloody house his own bloody self, because you are not his skivvy, and the fact that you have a womb and not a penis, does not mean that you are responsible for cleaning up any more than he is. The womb is not a f***g tidying up device. Don't put it in terms of "help" - that makes it your responsibility, which he can kindly help you with out of the goodness of his heart. It's not, it's both of your responsibility. Or have I had some kind of time travel, here, have I been transported back to 1952 only with an internet? Did feminism never happen?

Have a look through the local newspaper, and find out how much a cleaner costs. Perhaps a reminder of the value of your work might remind him of your value as a person. Or suggest that if he wants a perfect house and you to achieve that, you give up work immediately and never go back again. Just like 1952. What a wanker, tbh.

Oh, and Sleeping with the Enemy (the Julia Roberts film) sprang to my mind too!

I hope he is going to take paternity leave. And I'd advise you in the first month, to leave the baby with him alone, for one whole day, so he gets the gist.

Flossam -

first - he's a git.

dp and I used to have arguments like this (I'm the virgo, but he does the same "what's this doing here?" thing). I now deal with it by just laughing and saying something like "it was getting lonely on the shelf" - he knows not to push it.

However, we used to have those rows when I was working part time and he full time. When we're both working he knows that it's easier to just tidy up himself than argue about it - I think your dp is being incredibly unreasonable and you need to put your foot down now, before the baby comes. If it was me, I'd go on housework strike and not do any cleaning for a few weeks. You also need to find a way of not letting his comments rile you (like I say, laughing works for me, or maybe you could just go out when he starts).

Don't apologise: you may have over-reacted, but he started it. Only apologise for the over-reacting if he apologises for being such an anally retentive, stubborn, misogynist (? sounds like it to me),lazy git.

I was typing that when you posted your message.

Don't work more than you need to (to pay the debts off slowly). If he wants them paid off quicker, he can do the extra shifts.

On the plus side, I found that even as a SAHM I was able to budget much more effectively (after the first month or so anyway) so I needed less money. Things like doing the shopping every couple of days rather than weekly (makes a nice outing with the pram), having time to cook, and not bothering to buy cleaning stuff as there was no time to clean anyway!

I do laugh at it and/or try and ignore it usually. But neither have really seemed to work. He does tend to do it when he is stressed from experience, so he is just taking things out on me.

His mum does everything in their house, but dosen't even really work part time. He is having paternity leave, he's arranged that he has a over a month off with us, which I'm really pleased about. So hopefully he'll be making so pretty big realisations then!

Taking things out on you is bullying.

he's grown up now, so should be able to think for himself, not follow his mummy's example!

Good luck, Flossam.

Oh Flossam, I don't think your partner sees the bigger picture at the moment. Once the move is out of the way you will both feel calmer and there will be new household routines to establish so just make sure he is part of them.

Babies take up a ton of time, DS still does at 4 months (as you well know from my lack of e-mails). Hopefully your DP will see this when you are both off together for that month or so.

You need to walk away at times as you need to take care of yourself and baby, is there much chance that his mum could give him a well meaning kick up the bum? if not I am sure DP will sit him down and tell it like it is! Take care toots. xxx

Thank you! I shall just leave him well alone today, let him have his weekend with his mates and hope he stays at home on Sunday night when I get home from work. Maybe we can talk then. Thanks for all your advice

Flossam, I have to agree with everyone else. I am sure you have tactfully explained that you don't feel that you will be able to keep the house clean and tidy after having the baby, well IT IS NOT UP TO YOU TO DO SO!!!! Seriously I would try to talk to him about your worries. There seems to be two big concerns here, firstly day to day tidyness/housework, and secondly finances.

On the finances front I would explain to him they are HIS depbt and HE should be working overtime to pay them off. Can some of it go onto intrest free credit cards, so you can pay off the capital rather than just the interest. Try to make sure that the debts are managed in the best way possible. If this means you are in debt for longer, but no killing yourself with work, then SO WHAT. Your baby will be only a baby for such a short time. It is only money.

Secondly I would go on complete stike, in fact I would almost go so far as to visit my GP/Midwife burst into tears and say you cannot cope. Do this together and you are bound to get signed off for at least a week. The GP or midwife will tell you to rest and then anytime he dares confront you with a bottle of kitchen cleaner, whilst your feet are up, he can have it thrown in his face.

Personally I wouldn't even DREAM of apoligising, I would demand one off him.

No his mum still ain't too keen on me I don't think... Not sure she wouldn't think I should do everything for him anyway! She was a SAHM so very different view point, and she is awful for only seeing things from her son's point of view! Thanks Libb. x

no I bldy well wouldn't . He should and bring you home flowers & chocs to apologise