Divorce solicitor advice please?

[Onedaysoon]

Hi, this is just a request for info from one of the solicitors on MN, a quickie question really. I have filed for divorce and H says he won't engage a solicitor under any circumstances. He refuses to pay for one, as he is still paying off the legal fees from his first divorce. How does that affect the proceedings? Will it hold things up? We are still living under the same roof and it's intolerable for me and the kids and the thought that this could drag it on and on fills me with horror.

sounds drastic but everytime he is threatening towards your son call the police and report it, that will be much harder for the council to ignore and make it easier for them to end the tenancy agreement?

Sorry to hear that your social services are being so crap about this. 'Fanning the flames,' what a load of sh*t! In other words dh is not responsible for his own behaviour.

Sparks...every single thing social services did took the blame off him. They said that he needed to go for parenting classes, and that I should go too. I went mad and asked what exactly about my parenting was under scrutiny and they said 'well nothing, we have no concerns about you but it's not really fair to ask him to go alone'....so that gave him so much amunition then...'well it's obviously not all my fault if they want you to go blah blah...' it just played right into his hands. Then they said that their involvement was probably making him worse so they closed the file and passed the buck to the family centre, who never bothered to even contact him.

You sound as though you're having a wretched time. It's soo bloody awful when the people who may be able to do something categorically fail, then they butt in when they are not wanted. Have you spoken to anyone at Womens Aid? I cannot think that there is no-one willing or able to help you. It's bitterly disappointing when people let you down when you most need help. It really sounds as though you are doing all you can. (((((big hugs))))

Am and so for you onedaysoon. I think when you feel up to it reporting this to the highest authority in SS would be a good idea. Up to you though.

this is appalling

Cargirl...the police were involved before, and the council were made aware of it. The police actually had to escort him from the house but still the council weren't willing to implement the procedures necessary. It's the second time the police have been involved; the first time was the military police in germany (he was in the forces then) and it's all down on record.

Ulysees...what makes it even more unacceptable is that he has a history of mental illness which involved a lengthy period of hospitalisation (psychiatric) for suicide attempts and also threats of revenge against his then girlfriend who had ended the relationship. This was all made known to SS. And this wasn't in the dim and distant past either - it was only about 5 years ago.

oh no hun, you need rid of him somehow? I can't understand why you're having such trouble

Me neither! But I've tried everything. i told all agencies concerned that it would be a living hell if I divorce him whilst he was still living here and that the abuse would escalate (he hasn't received the papers yet so the worse is yet to come). I've told them how unstable he is, and that he regularly threatens suicide, sometimes in front of the kids. I've told them what a control freak he is, and that when he is confronted or affronted he goes apeshit...but no. Nothing. Nada. Zip. So it came down to a 50/50 choice...either I put up and shut up or I forge ahead, divorce him whilst he is still here and hope we can weather the storm.

Have you tried ringing all the time until they're pissed off? Or asking who's in charge?

Ulysees...I tried til I was blue in the face until I came to the conclusion that I was on my own and if I wanted things to change I had to do it by myself, hence the awful situation I'm in now. I would have loved to have avoided divorce proceedings until he was out of the picture but just couldn't get the help.
He's driving me bloody mad. Bearing in mind that HE withdrew financial support and forced me to claim benefits he waltzed into the kitchen last night where me and the kids were watching telly (he lays on the settee with the 42 inch one in comfort whilst me and the kids have to watch a fuzzy portable in the kitchen sitting around the table) and took MY box of biscuits from the cupboard and took them into the living room and proceeded to stuff his face with them!!! Then to add insult to injury he has left the box on the settee (where he sleeps) complete with crumbs everywhere for me to pick up! He won't give me money for food but eats my stuff???? I wouldn't bother cleaning it up but for the fact that the kids use this room during the day.
His dirty clothes are strewn all over the computer desk/chair/floor...it stinks in the morning as he sleeps with the window closed all night and isn't the most fastidious of men when it comes to personal hygiene (at one point he was going 9 days between showers).
I'm sick of this. But I really really don't want to leave this house. If I stay here I will have a chance a few years down the line of buying the house -it's almost impossible to get a council house and it's in a beautiful village, where the kids are surrounded by farms and paddocks and we get foxes and deer and badgers in the garden! If we leave he'll have to give the house up anyway, and why should the kids have to give all this up because he's being a wa**er? And it gives us security. In a private let there's a good chance the owner will sell up at some point, but here we can stay as long as we choose to, so no more moving about for the kids (they've been to 5 schools in 4 years thanks to him) and are due to start a new school in September.

No you do right, stay put. Do you have the right to change the locks?
Keep banging on at the council, SS anyone and maybe they'll give in? Hope so hun

Hi, no I'm not allowed to change the locks as the house is in joint names, despite the fact that he changed the locks when me and the children went into the refuge. I told the council but they did nothing. I went back to the house to collect some stuff with a police escort and when I discovered he'd changed the locks the police warned me that if I tried to 'break in' to my own home I would be arrested for criminal damage or breaking and entering!!!! Actually, you gotta laugh!

Hi. Yesterday he called me from work to ask what was for tea!!! This man is unreal, I mean what is going on with him? Is he playing mind games? Does he genuinley not think I am going through with this? And then he came home with presents in his arms...a lamp and radio for DD1, some jigsaws for DD2, some toys for the dog...and 'Sorry mate, they didn't have anything for you' for DS. How cruel can you get? If he couldn't find anything for DS, then he should have held back giving the kids anything until he did, or given DS the money or something but not just blatantly exclude him. I don't even know why he's buying presents anyway; he's never done it before so why now?
On a brighter note; I heard back from the benefits people yesterday afternoon...they are giving me housing and council tax benefit despite not getting IS and H still living in the house. He pays his half and I can claim my half from them which is a massive load off my mind. Now I know me and the kids can manage when he eventually goes. It's another step towards complete independence from him - he has nothing to threaten me with now, such as 'You're going to be thrown out if you don't pay your half of the rent' knowing full well I couldn't pay it as I don't earn.

At least hes making it easy for you to leave him. I know the feeling of feeling sorry for someone, even though they are an abuser. Its misplaced pity and these people dont deserve it. The fact that he has been doing this to your poor son is just cementing your decision and making it clear that you are doing the right thing. Hes an idiot for not realising what hes got. Hes a narcissist. EVerything youve written about him makes him fit this description, including the lack of sex. If you look at this website if you want to know more about how he thinks and how to deal with him.

You could put locks on some of the cupboard doors and your bedroom door??? Stop him taking stuff you have paid for?

Sakura...yes I am well acquanted with Dr Sam Vaknin ...someone else pointed me in his direction and it frightened the life out of me the similarities. I have no doubt he is a narcissist and yes, when I read about the lack of sex it astounded me! It helps to realise that it is something 'real' and also to learn that a narcissist won't change; it saves a lot of effort in sticking around and trying to give it another shot! Any effort will be for nothing and only feeds his needs.
Cargirl...yes I think seperate cupboards etc is the next step although I hate to do it, not because of him but because it seems such a petty (although in my case necessary) thing to have to do; he's 42 FGS...he should know the rules and stick to them, especially given that he threw down the gauntlet in the first place by withdrawing financial support. Maybe when he sees the letter I received from the council today showing that I am now claiming HB and council tax benefit he'll realise this is for real.

OMGOMGOMG....he came home and I showed him the letter showing the council tax amendments, which listed payments already made, council tax benefit and the remainder (his 50%) still owing. he then decided....get this...that WE should split the remainder between us! the council are paying my half, but he wants me to pay half of HIS half too!!!!! What effing planet is he on?????? Then he queried the amount already paid, saying that HE paid that (before we separated) and so it didn't count towards what I owed! WTF?????

This is driving me insane...I mean I really feel like I'm going mad. he's just gone to Tesco's and taken MY car!!!! Is he trying to get me done for benefit fraud or something? I know exactly why he said he was withdrawing financial support...he's a massive control freak and it was just another way of him exerting his power. He knew I was in no position to pay my way, so by him not paying I would be 'forced' to stay with him! He didn't think for a minute I would have the balls to stand on my own 2 feet. I'm struggling with this mentally now.

Call the police and report your car stolen.

Seriously, you have to be straight with him and you need a witness. Can you have the police come out and explain to him the facts of life? You canbt keep living like this??!!

I feel so badly for you.

I can't call the police and report the car stolen because he has taken our 3 year old with him, and I wouldn't want her to see that, she's seen enough. No matter what anyone says or does he just can't (or won't) 'get it'. I feel like I'm banging my head against a brick wall. If I cancel the benefits he will back in the driving seat again, with me exactly where he wants me...in his control. I feel guilty for claiming, even though I have no choice and it is a genuine claim - but he is doing his damndest to land me in the s**t. No, you're right, I can't keep living like this, but I don't know what else to do. He won't move out, I can't remain married to him, he withdraws all financial support but then behaves in such a way as to make the claim 'seem' fraudulent - and I am one of the most law abiding people you could meet! I wouldn't have the stomach for benefit fraud. I can't believe I ended up with a man like him, how the hell did I get it so wrong?

Okay, I understand. You have a solicitors appt this week, right? Can you have the solictor write him a letter outlining the new rules?

He sees you as a victim - his victim - and he's running rampant all over you. You need a third party to intervene, I believe. Is there anywhere you could go for a week while he is served with papers? Or someone who could take the kids for a few days?

There just has to be someone who can help you. If the solicitor can't write the letter, can you not just go to the police and tell them you need some help? You need someone to come to the house and explain that he cannot touch your things, your car, etc. Perhaps, and this might be dangerous, you really should put locks on your things. It will piss him off but if he gets violent again, it will move your case forward? You have every right and in fact a duty to abide by the law with regard to your benefits, so this would not be unreasonable behavior on your part.

Otherwise, what happens if you just start to say No? NO you can't take my car or I will call the police. NO you can't have my biscuits, NO i'm not making you tea. NO NO NO I want a divorce and that is FINAL.

Is that too scary to contemplate?

Last, sweetheart, is there anyway he can find what you write about here? After seeing what just happened to MLS, I'm concerned for several of you.

Hi, well what a nightmare. This morning I laid it out again for him, how he had forced me into this situation and as I was claiming benefits as a lone parent he had no right to still be using my stuff etc etc...he flipped. Got really nasty. He has now taken to calling me names TO DD2, not just in front of her but TO her...'Isn't Mummy pathetic?' and stuff like this. I asked him later can he not please make this amicable, as it was of his own making and he could at least exercise some damage limitation. he told me to eff off, again in front of the kids. He's also using DD2 all the time...'I'm taking DD2 away next week and you can't stop me'...and 'I'm having her all day tomorrow' knowing full well I always take her swimming on a Sunday morning. he told me when I star 'being nice' to him again, then he will stop badmouthing me to her!!!!!
he has now put a bar on all outgoing calls, and won't get it activated again until I pay him half of the phone bill, which he paid TWO months ago!!! He expects me to back pay him all the bills paid since before we split!
I was so upset that I went to the local police station to speak to the DV officer. There wasn't one there but an officer did come and speak to me (at length actually poor man!) and I cried my eyes out, saying I couldn't cope with this, and that I had concerns about his conduct towards DD2 etc. I didn#'t expect them to do anything, I was just after advice really. Then the sergeant came in and was a bit less sympathetic. He called the local refuge (I didn't ask for this) but when I said that was a last resort he looked at me as if to say 'well it can't be that bad'. They have said that if H kicks off (whihc is looking likely) to call them immediately and then they can do something but I really needed to speak to my solicitor, which I am doing on Tuesday.
I am so scared for DD2, and what damage he may do to our relationship. He is truly poisonous. I am going to ask the solicitor about supervised contact...a while ago H quizzed DD2 about whether Mummy had had any men in her bed when he wasn't there etc! He will twist her little mind which is just as abusive. I am also going to speak to the social worker on Monday morning, as I have already voiced my concerns to him about this and he agreed wholeheartedly with me. That's another thing...H tells me that social services laughed with him about me, and said I was talking bulls**t when he was being investigated by them. I know deep down that isn't true but he is so convincing and vile it does make you doubt yourself.
I have an appt with my dr on Monday afternoon (for something unrelated) and the police said I should speak to him about H not taking his medication etc, and make them alert to the fact that it's a problem. I'm also struggling to cope emotionally although I don't want to go down the route of pills.
Anyway, I knew it would get worse but even I wasn't prepared for the ferocity of it all.

Oh ODS

I havent spoke to you but I really feel for you in this situation. I have no experience of this kind of thing -sorry. I do know it is so awful when you try everything with official channels/council etc but nothing happens for you.

The one thing that occurred to me is that you do everything on your own. Is there anyone you could bring in to the situation to support you? He is just behaving so badly because he can get away with it. I dont know how you are placed locally. Do you have anyone you could get involved? Do you have anyone you could get to come and stay to help you stand up to him and also witness what goes on - I know this sounds mad and you maybe dont want anyone there but it might improve things. You need a break from dealing with everything yourself. Maybe a Mumsnetter locally could help - stranger things have happened.

Just some thoughts but keep getting support from here!

Seriously i need of moral support here now. he's really going hell for leather - saying to DD2 'you don't want Daddy to leave do you?' etc. She's only 3. Yesterday I was supposed to be taking them swimming, as I do every Sunday morning. I got them up and was about to do breakfast when he said to DD2 'Are we going swimming today then?'. I asked him not to spoil it again, as I had already promised to take them and he told me if I wanted to go swimming there was nothing stopping me but HE was taking her so I told DD2 that Daddy was taking her swimming instead. She then told him (unprompted by me) that she wanted to stay at home with Mummy and the bigger ones. He got real mad at her, told her to shove it and then on his way out of the room he kicked the washing basket across the floor before slamming the door. I took them out for the day to the beach, and DD2 was asleep when we got home (I had to get myself and the kids out of the house). When she woke up he ignored her. Then later he came in the kitchen and despite her smiling at him he blanked her again. She went in to say goodnight to him and he asked for a cuddle. She said no, so he snapped at her 'fine then, shut the door' and she pulled a face at him - a normal 3 year old messing about face. he shouted at her and told her she was nasty! She's 3 FFS. She cried, and I had to calm her down before putting her to bed.
My initial (and ongoing) reaction has been to call the socialworker today to talk this through. I know he's going to kick off when he tells DD2 she has to go with him to grandma's house next weekend. yesterday she asked was I going and I said no, she was going with Daddy and she said 'well I don't want to go then. I want to stay with you'. He'll go mad, he's already accusing me of filling her head with s**t as he puts it, and trying to keep her away from him which I wasn't...however, given his recent temper displays and nastiness towards her I now feel I need to for her own sake.
But then the 'nice' part of me says 'if you speak to SS about this, and they get involved again, then he'll really kick off, and also is it fair to impose conditions on him over his daughter blah blah...'. I have always believed in keeping a parent-child relationship going, but not when the child is going to be emotionally abused. He did it to his 2 from his forst marriage, he did it to my 2 and I fear he will do it to her too. His own DD came to stay a couple of years ago when she had fallen out with her Mum. I had never met her preveiously and she left when he was ta work to go back to her Mum's saying 'Sorry, but I can't sit around here watching him do to your 2 what he did to me and my brother'. Says it all really.
What do I do? I guess I know what I have to do, and it's the right thing to do, but just want to hear some voices of reason.