Anyone have a friend who is perfectly nice but .......

[nailclippersandmince]

For some reason they do your tits in.

I'll probably get flamed but I need to get this off my chest a bit. This person, let's call her Charlotte, is nice, kind, funny and yes I do like spending time with her but I've come to realise when I have any contact or communication with her I'm a bit tense.

When I leave her company, I feel myself relax and find myself ranting about all the small things she's said or done that irk me. When I get a text or a WhatsApp from her I feel myself tense up.

I find her a bit all consuming and smothering I think.

In the words of Jim Carey...

goo.gl/images/RXmKoj

Oh ffs

How do I post a gif then?

Pahaaahahahhhaa

...

@ElizabethWoodville1 love it! 😂

The thing is, I have lots of friends who I love dearly but I couldn’t cope if they sent me multiple messages throughout the day. It’s rare to have a friendship that is so intense, particularly when you are an adult. In this case, the communication is so frequent it’s making the OP tense.

I know quite a few people who won’t have WhatsApp because they end up getting fed up with it. That is okay - I can text them if I need to communicate.

I do have an acquaintance who I feel this way about. She is not a frequent messenger but when she does message me, it’s usually long and confusing - it’s hard to work out what the point of the messages are and I have to read them a few times. I think in my case though, I have the impression that is angry about something and often wonder if she’s just made a subtle dig.

Wow! Thanks Elizabeth. I can assume you are Charlotte then. And clearly you have no idea of people’s boundaries or personal space.
Guess I am a crap friend for not being more obvious about it because I didn’t want to offend you in RL.

I thought Mumsnet was a place to vent anonymously so you don’t offend people in RL. But alas no, I’m just being a bitch and I’ve obviously touched a nerve with you.

I read a thread posted around this time last year which could have been written from Charlotte’s point of view. The OP was investing lots of time texting, phoning and giving gifts to her SIL that was not reciprocated and she’s was miffed. The upshot of the various posts was that the friendship was imbalanced. Why was the OP investing so much time in something that wasn’t giving her what she needed? Why was she so needy?

Your post has undoubtedly stung me Elizabeth. Life, it would appear, has to be lived according to Charlotte rules and I am wrong. I am wrong to not want to be besties with someone so obviously nice and kind. I don’t have a right to whom I pick and choose to let into my inner circle. I have to see Charlotte 2-3 times a week so I don’t get a chance to spend time with other friends. That I am an introvert isn’t allowed. That I like my own space and time to do just as I please isn’t allowed because I could be spending that time with Charlotte. What Charlotte says goes.

If Charlotte was a bloke would I get advice to run for the hills? If Charlotte posted on here stating how much time she was investing in a friendship that wasn’t reciprocated would she be told that she needs to back off because the friend isn’t interested? Would she be told that she is being needy and suffocating?

BTW, the ‘what are you doing on the 28th’ was someone else’s comment. Not mine.

Another20
'Are you free on the 28 th ?'
I always reply "Why?"

Ok, I am not Charlotte, quite the opposite actually. My concern with these kinds of posts is that there seems to be a tendency over the last 20 yrs for people to become more disposable- fuelled by social media. I actually have a Charlotte. She is a divorced alcoholic, never had kids, family all deceased and she also has mental health problems. She is generally shunned in our community. She tends to come into her own from 9pm, probably fuelled by alcohol, and starts to what's app me. It's not something I look forward to and sometimes her msgs are garbled. However, I would never forgive myself if I woke one morning to find out something terrible had happened to her and I had ignored msgs on my phone.

I feel I have a responsibility as a human being to be there for another human being. We all hear stories of people who do sad things and the response is 'oh if only they reached out to someone.' Well this is it, they did reach out and no one responded. I leant this lesson all to well 20 yrs ago when my best friend took her own life at 24 yrs of age. I was always so busy back then, basically enjoying myself, building a career, meeting new boyfriends. What time did I have for her? Not a day goes by when I don't wish I had had my priorities in a diff order.

I spent some time with my Charlotte on xmas day as she was totally alone, despite the fact it took me away form my own family for a time. Did I want to that, no not really Was it the kind and decent thing to do, yes.

If you were a male poster, yes you would be told that Charlotte is needy. However you would also be told to talk to her face to face and end it properly. I've seen lots of posts on here where men who phase women out are lambasted! Same with women who ghost their female friends.

I don't know anything about your Charlotte. Perhaps she is lonely and struggling and reaches out to you. Why, I don't know. All I'm saying is she is a human being and you have to think if it was your child how would you feel about them being the topic of a discussion on the internet. I personally would be heartbroken. Your Charlotte is somebody's child.

Thankfully I don't need to reach out people and that is more by the grace of god. Life has been good to me generally and I cope well with it's ups and downs. However, I do feel a responsibility to help others less happy. Sometimes I engage with my Charlotte over hours and others just once or twice. I make it clear If I am a bit pushed for time, on my way out etc. My point is I would never leave her without a reply as I could not live with my self if anything bad happened. We all have a responsibility to look out for each other and make time for people and be available, however briefly. This is what seems to missing these days. Community for want of a better word. If your Charlotte is doing your head in then yes, set boundaries. But talk to her, don't phase her out. It's cruel and you never know what the future holds. Wouldn't you like to think that if either you or a family member needed to reach out, that someone could spend 2 mins of their time to respond? If I was in need I would hate to think that I had to wait several hrs , until a more convenient time before reaching out. Peoples emotions don't work to a clock. That's all I'm saying. Be kind always because we none of us know what someone else is going trough. Maybe your Charlotte is lonely. It's looks like she may well be. Rejecting someone who reaches out could have devastating consequences. Do you really dislike her so much and are so busy that you can't spend 2 mins replying to a WhatsApp in a friendly manner.

If it's convenient for me or not I always reply to people at my earliest. Because it could be the world of difference to that person without me knowing.

If you want to reduce contact with your Charlotte do it in a kinder and more honest manner. But this brutal approach in my opinion is unkind and in all likelihood will cause your Charlotte upset if she wonders what she has done. If you really are so busy and she really is disruptive to your day, sit down with her and explain it. Is the least one person can do for another and just shows a basic level of respect from one human being to another.

nailclippers why don’t you give Elizabeth “Charlottes” number and she can pick it up from there.....

Thing is Elizabeth life is a two way street - “Charlotte” doesn’t seem to take the same care, consideration and compassion that you do about what might be going on in Nails life - looks like “Charlotte” is the one who needs to up her social skills and respect other peoples family time. Givers need to set boundaries because takers (“Charlottes”) never do. One could argue that you are enabling your alcoholic friend by taking her evening calls when she is drunk - maybe if you were only available when she was sober she might reach her rock bottom and start to address her issues. That’s what Al Alon would encourage you to do (detached love) to support your friend.

Elizabeth I hear what you are saying and, given the background, I can totally get why you are the person you are. That is commendable.
But you must understand that everyone has different capacities in their life. You sound like a saint and a very good, kind person but I cannot be like you. It is not in my genetic make up. That doesn’t make me the unkind, selfish horror you portrayed me as in your previous post. I’m just different from you.

My Charlotte is nothing like your Charlotte. She is married with family and a wide circle of friends. Perhaps she is reaching out to me for something more - but I do not have the capacity to give it to her. You said I should manage my life work balance because it’s hugely out of kilter if I cannot give a friend 2 minutes. I would always be there for a friend in need but I cannot be that person all of the time. I have other friends that actually need me more than Charlotte right now and I’m there for them.

Never at any point in my posts did I say I ignored her. Prior to this thread I have always felt an obligation to reply but then she replies more and then 20 minutes have gone by.

She calls or messages when I’m working so I cannot just reply immediately and she seems to forget which days I work.

I read a quote about introverted people (and yes I think I am one). It said that because introverts are typically good listeners and, at least, have the appearance of calmness, they are attractive to emotionally needy people. Introverts, gratified that other people are initiating with them, can easily get caught in these exhausting and unsatisfying relationships.

So yes I attract a lot of needy people because they like my sound advice and plain speaking. But I don’t have unlimited resources. If Charlotte is indeed needy to the point that I have reached the end of my tether, I’m sorry I just have no more to give. Remember Charlotte was able to exist before she upped the level of our friendship. I don’t want to just ditch her or ignore her completely - as I said upthread and she is basically a nice person. I just want to get it back to the level it was at before that is mutually beneficial to both of us.

What hurt me most about your first post is that you seem to have based it almost entirely around the ‘something on the 28th’ comment. That was something said by someone else as an example of their experience with Charlottes. If you’d read my other posts you’d realise that I always respond with a straight answer. Your entire post was very hurtful, and judging by the length of it, and that you registered specially to respond to me I would kindly suggest that you are a tad resentful of the time you put in with your Charlotte and that goes unrecognised. I would also kindly suggest that, after all these years, you are still feeling guilty over the tragic death of your best friend. You directed all that at me and I think it was unwarranted.

One of the other friend’s whom I’m there for at the moment, is dealing with the fallout and grief of a recent suicide. He is wracked with guilt despite there being absolutely nothing he could have done to prevent it.

I will continue to see Charlotte, but on my terms. I hope that she picks up the signals I’ve been giving out. I won’t be horrible to her but if I have to I will explain as kindly as possible.

Elizabeth I hope you find peace and solace in your life.

It's just the platonic female friendship version of 'He's Just Not That Into You.'

I've been a Charlotte but I pick up on hints fast so now I never text people who don't text back for days or at all. I also have a Charlotte but she's a difficult, moany, often self-centred person! I'm sadly letting her drift away but by gum, is she persistent! Gives me a bad feeling. It's not fair to impose yourself on someone.

What Elizabeth didn't seem to grasp is that Charlotte has a family yet still has time to send up to 16 messages to the OP. I can cope with a couple of memes, but 16 cute cat pictures or whatever she's sending would drive me nuts. One time, I sent some friends a picture of the dog in the park. Their total lack of response made me decide to never send another picture again. They just don't care and that's fine, we don't need to share everything.

I too have a Charlotte. I've known her for decades but she has never got married so still thinks we can act like young free single people. She often wants to meet up in London: I am way too knackered to do this after working full time, dealing with horse, dogs, family. It drives me a bit nuts that she hasn't moved on from when we were 16 and free to do anything we fancied. I've semi-ghosted her because whilst I appreciate her, I simply don't have the time she wants from me. I think that's fine, life moves on.

I see Elizabeth's point of view. This Charlotte clearly sees a friend in you, a true friend who she wants to share not just the big things in her life but the small, mundane and boring bits. She cares for you, she's thinking of you often even when she's busy and she includes you in her plans. In turn, you are annoyed by her care, trying to think of ways to avoid telling her what you feel and bitching about her online. I feel for the girl and I could use a friend like her to be honest. I wish my biggest problem was a friend who wanted to see and talk to me a lot. Mine is the opposite problem! So maybe this has just hit a nerve with me, as maybe I'm a Charlotte. Just be honest with her, she can put her energy into somebody who appreciates her then.

I have a Charlotte too, I love her but she also hasn't moved on from about age 16 and seems stuck there mentally, emotionally and in terms of how she lives and structures her life. She doesn't understand the demands of a family and that makes it hard to relate to her yet she has previously been bombarding me with messages even though I don't reply to them all. She has improved with time and won't repeatedly message if I don't reply to one text and will wait to hear from me so there is hope.

I'm convinced everyone has a friend like this, and everyone IS that person to someone else. It's just the way people are. I have one friend who replies to me after ages but they are going through a shit time right now and have said they do want to be friends but are just having the worst time ever. I guess it's a balance of knowing when someone does like you vs when they are freezing you out, and how to be a caring friend while also having boundaries and not getting over invested in friendships which are not reciprocal.

What Elizabeth didn't seem to grasp is that Charlotte has a family yet still has time to send up to 16 messages to the OP.

I think this sums up perfectly what I have been trying to say. Charlotte has a family and not so much 'has' time and more ' makes' time. There is a difference.

Some of you have made a connection that I am the way I am now because my friend died and I feel quilt. Not true, I do not feel any personal responsibility for that. However, what it did do is make me realise that I needed to focus less on myself and more on others. I was a selfish me me me when I was younger and I don't find it a very attractive quality in a person. I didn't want to be that person anymore because for me to be that person meant I rode rough shod over others so I had exactly what I needed. I saw first hand what happens to some people when those around them are too busy, too selfish to take a minute. My friends death allowed a growth in me,early in my life that probably would have otherwise taken years. Now I look at what I can give and offer people rather than what they can offer me. Subtle difference. I have dear friends and I also have the Charlottes and of course the obligatory one who always phones when her throat is sore. Not forgetting the one who lurches from one disaster after the other and never learns from her mistake. I treat them all the same. I don't treat one any better because I prefer her more or because she brings more to my life. Some of my friends do bring more to my life but if you sat them all down you would have a job asking them which one thinks I treat them better than the other.

One poster earlier in thread said I should back away from my Charlotte and referenced AA practices. Well I won't. because apart from being an alcoholic she also has depression and no family or friends at all. Partly because they are passed away and yes partly because of her own actions.I will not walk away, while others have and left her as it won't help her at all. I don't think she would ever make the connections about her situation and interactions with others and me walking away would just send her further into a spiral. Why would I do such a nasty thing? Why would I do that when I can just spend a few mins with her here and there. What trouble is that to me really in the grand scheme? She is actually very intelligent and I have grown as a person and learnt new things by having her in my life. The rough with the smooth if you like.

I will continue to make time in my life for her and others like her. Because if we all took the approach to 'friendships' as seen on this thread the world would be a very selfish , me me me place.

What I have seen on this thread is I don't have time for this... she does my head in, I'm too busy etc. I would ask you all to think about flipping that on it's head. Perhaps think less on what that person does not bring to your life but more what could you bring to theirs? Just a thought for the start of a new week.

Most posters on this thread are all saying variations on a theme. Basically I'm too busy and she cannot see that but reading between the lines you actually really don't like them very much and that's why they bother you so. As some posters have said if you have a friend that you do not wish to make any time for in your life then the kindest thing to do is to tell them. That's ok and In some respects the kinder thing to do. Let them know that when you don't reply to them it's because you really don't want to and don't want to allocate your time for them specifically. At least they won't be sitting there wondering what they have done. That then frees you and them. That's all I'm saying. If you don't have that conversation then things will continue as they are and for some of you that's clearly causing you issues.

thighofrelief101 I agree. Sadly some can't police themselves. People with mental health issues or with Aspergers or Autism. Or some because of abuse in childhood. Sometimes people behave in a certain way because they see people and the world in their way and interact with it differently to others. It is frustrating for them too.

No Elizabeth you have mis-quoted me - I did not say you should back away from you alcoholic Charlotte - I said:

”One could argue that you are enabling your alcoholic friend by taking her evening calls when she is drunk - maybe if you were only available when she was sober she might reach her rock bottom and start to address her issues. That’s what Al Alon would encourage you to do (detached love) to support your friend.”

Quite the opposite in fact - take the advice of the professionals and embrace your friendship effectively rather than enabling her alcoholism.

Yes again agree. My eldest son ( adult now) is autistic and when some people meet him for the first time i see a look in their faces. He does act occasionally in what others may deem a peculiar way. He is exceptionally bright and forging a good career but is obsessed with music and it's all he talks about. Lyrics, how a song is constructed. Listen to this bridge mum, see how this artist linked these verses together... etc! He WhatsApp's me constantly with song clips- from grime artists which is not my bag at all. His music is another ones unicorn meme! Now if we transfer this out of my family dynamic and my son was msging you as his friend the same. Yes, you would get cheesed off. I do get that. But from his perspective he thinks you will share his enjoyment and as he would love you , as his friend, he wants you to share that. ( I do spk to him btw to help him form equal friendships).

At the end of the day he is my son and he is a good kind and decent person and I would be appalled if he was the subject of this thread. If people were raising their eyebrows at his msgs. It's all about perceptions. All I'm asking here is don't dismiss him or people because he/they don't conform to what you want or your life. I would prefer it in that case if his 'friends' told him it wasn't their bag rather than sit here & watch him be rejected, waiting for replies, likes etc. Luckily my son has a great crowd of friends as they have grown up together and he always gets chosen for the pub quiz team because he knows so much about music.

I don't know where mental health begins and selfishness ends. Really lots of us would struggle to find that line. That's why I err on the side of caution and be kind always. That way I have all bases covered.

I know some posters here have referred to me as selfless and saintly but I have a sneaking suspicion it was not meant in a good way. That's ok because I have clearly caused some to look at themselves. It's easier to attack me I get that. I don't mean that in a goady way I honestly do not.

This thread has shown me that human nature is what is is. For my part I always treat people how I expect to be treated my self. I am however a very small cog. It does mean that I have to organise and prioritise and sometimes put on hold what I want for myself to enable me to be there for others. Not everyone's bag I see that.

I have to go to work now for the week as I am a single parent to 2 & mortgage has to be paid! I have full time demands on my time like many of you and a 73 yr old mother who is going blind. She is not finding it easy to adapt to that so she can be hard work and lash out at me on occasion. So I really really do understand the pressure of modern life. I suspect some of you thought that I sit here in a twin set and pearls all day bashing my bible and being a saintly person! Sadly not.

I have found this a most interesting thread.

I hope you all find a happy balance in your relationships with your Charlottes and wish all posters a happy healthy and prosperous 2019.